Generational Theory Forum: The Fourth Turning Forum: A message board discussing generations and the Strauss Howe generational theory

There were some good lines but it's hard for me to remember them because the speech wandered. One was when she said that the economy doesn't work as he should because our democracy doesn't work as it should. She zinged the Trumpster by saying he could start making America great again by making things in America again. America is great because America is good. I agree, good is a good mark. The "join us" series was effective. Three stars.

(07-28-2016, 11:30 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]There were some good lines but it's hard for me to remember them because the speech wandered. One was when she said that the economy doesn't work as he should because our democracy doesn't work as it should. She zinged the Trumpster by saying he could start making America great again by making things in America again. America is great because America is good. I agree, good is a good mark. The "join us" series was effective. Three stars.

What has Hillary made in America?

(07-28-2016, 11:49 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]

(07-28-2016, 11:30 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]There were some good lines but it's hard for me to remember them because the speech wandered. One was when she said that the economy doesn't work as he should because our democracy doesn't work as it should. She zinged the Trumpster by saying he could start making America great again by making things in America again. America is great because America is good. I agree, good is a good mark. The "join us" series was effective. Three stars.

What has Hillary made in America?

You think only someone who "makes things" should be the president? YOu think only a businessman can be president? NO, being in business does not qualify you; it's a different field. Being a rip-off artist like Trump DISqualifies him. Being a hypocrite like Trump DISqualifies him.

(07-26-2016, 11:34 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: [ -> ]A few days ago, I proposed that Bill Clinton could come out, start plagiarizing Michelle's 2008 speech, then have Michelle come out of the wings and call him on it.  They could then do a half comic half scathing exchange on the real distinction between Democratic and Republican values.  Seemed like a good idea.  Would have been fun.

What they did instead worked better, though.  'When they go low, we go high' is a better note.  They also did very well with Michelle and still have Bill in reserve for another speech a bit further down stream.

I think they are doing well so far.

When I heard Bill speak I was shocked by how OLD he sounded. I know he's 71 but it really didn't hit me until he started speaking.

(07-27-2016, 06:38 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: [ -> ]Bill Clinton for press secretary?

That was an impressive talk.  It is very rare that one can change an established public figure's image this late in a career.  The counter argument to using Bill a lot comes from FDR's time.  After the first fireside chat, lots of folks said it was so effective that he ought to do it a lot.  FDR decided it was so effective it should be used rarely, so it would remain fresh, the audience wouldn't get too used to it happening all the time.  Instead of going on radio frequently, FDR kept it fairly rare....  but encouraged his wife to go on quite quite a bit.

Presidential spouses can come in handy.  We'll see if Bill can give Eleanor a run for the money for her place in history as the number one first spouse.

Anyway, I think Hillary has got her convention bounce at the very least.

Favorite line?  The Arkansa legislator telling Bill after Hillary testified before a committee that he thought they'd elected the wrong Clinton.

Hillary is an introverted policy wonk and is not a natural orator, while Bill is as extroverted as one can be and is great with the public, he'll be really needed.

(07-27-2016, 11:18 AM)X_4AD_84 Wrote: [ -> ]Obama has wildly exceeded my expectations. In addition to the economic triage, he's done some remarkable geopolitical triage. I compare and contrast him with Bush 43. While Bush 43 did a number of right things after 9/11, he quickly lost the trail. Overall, Bush 43 frustrated me greatly on the geopolitical front. He failed to see beyond the WoT. In this new century, we not only faced a ramping up of terrorism, we also faced a rapid deterioration of the Post WW2 order, and its modification, the so called post-Cold War order. The time to strike was the early 00s. We lost a precious decade due to this. Obama was able to step in and if not stop, at least arrest the deterioration. Finally we are cranking up our strategic defensive and offensive stance, in response. Kudos to Obama!

If Obama could have run for a 3rd term I would being voting for him in a heartbeat. That convention speech he gave actually made me cry.

Philadelphia (CNN)The final night of the Democratic National Convention highlighted Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton's commitment to public service, as well as the sacrifice of American soldiers and immigrants.

Here are the night's most memorable lines:
Hillary Clinton on nomination
"And so my friends, it is with humility, determination and boundless confidence in America's promise that I accept your nomination for president of the United States."
Hillary Clinton on Bernie Sanders
"To all of your supporters here and around the country: I want you to know, I've heard you. Your cause is our cause. Our country needs your ideas, energy and passion."
Hillary Clinton on Donald Trump
"A man you can bait with a tweet is not a man we can trust with nuclear weapons."
Hillary Clinton on 'public service'
"Through all these years of public service, the 'service' part has always come easier to me than the 'public' part. I get it that some people just don't know what to make of me."
Hillary Clinton on policy
"I sweat the details."
Hillary Clinton on historic nomination
"When any barrier falls in America, it clears the way for everyone," she said of being the first female presidential nominee for a major party.
Hillary Clinton on who she represents
"I will be a president for Democrats, Republicans and independents. For the struggling, the striving and the successful. For those who vote for me and those who don't. For all Americans."
Hillary Clinton on financial regulation reform
I believe that Wall Street can never be allowed to wreck Main Street again.
Hillary Clinton on climate change
"I believe in science."
Hillary Clinton on America's moment
"America is once again at a moment of reckoning. Powerful forces are threatening to pull us apart. Bonds of trust and respect are fraying. And just as with our founders, there are no guarantees. It's truly is up to us."
Chelsea Clinton
"I never once doubted that my parents cared about my thoughts and my ideas, and I always, always knew how deeply they loved me. That feeling of being valued and loved -- that's what my mom works for for every child. It is the calling of her life."
Khizr Khan
"Donald Trump, you are asking Americans to trust you with our future. Let me ask you: Have you even read the US Constitution? I will gladly lend you my copy. In this document, look for the words 'liberty' and 'equal protection of law,' " said the father of a Muslim-American soldier killed in Iraq War.
Illinois Rep. Tammy Duckworth, veteran
"Donald Trump, I didn't put my life on the line to defend our democracy so you could invite Russia to interfere in it."
New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo
"Fifteen years ago on September 11th, we saw death and we saw destruction. And we saw unimaginable horror and cruelty. But we saw something else, my friends. We saw this nation come together like it has never come together before," he said. "We weren't black or white or brown. We were red and white and blue. And that is the only colors that matter in the United States of America!"
Former Michigan Gov. Jennifer Granholm
"Donald you're so vain. You probably think this speech is about you, don't you?"
'Republican Women for Hillary' co-founder Jennifer Lim
"In Donald Trump's America, it doesn't matter that I'm an accomplished attorney and a policy expert, it just matters how attractive I am on a scale of one to 10."
NBA Hall of Famer Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
"Hello everyone. I'm Michael Jordan and I'm here with Hillary. I said that because I know that Donald Trump couldn't tell the difference."
http://www.cnn.com/2016/07/28/politics/d...peditorial

I see convention bump for Hillary Clinton in the polls in the near future.

Seth Meyers finds almost as much to laugh at at the Democratic Convention as the other one:

The Democrats have solved more problems than have the Republicans. Republicans still have so0me loose ends to put back together -- and that is hard to do in an active campaign.

Here is a musical expression of the core fault of Donald Trump:





(Supposedly it was first about Warren Beatty... guess what other Boomer narcissist it fits!)

Carly Simon, "You're So Vain"

...and you think this song is about you, Donald Trump. It might as well be.

(07-29-2016, 04:00 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: [ -> ]Here is a musical expression of the core fault of Donald Trump:


(Supposedly it was first about Warren Beatty... guess what other Boomer narcissist it fits!)

Carly Simon, "You're So Vain"

...and you think this song is about you, Donald Trump. It might as well be.

Someone mentioned this song and said that at the convention. I'll find it..... oh it's just 3 posts above this one!
Former Michigan Gov. Jennifer Granholm
"Donald you're so vain. You probably think this speech is about you, don't you?"


Meanwhile you might need to post a different video of the song brower.....

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - A U.S. appeals court on Friday struck down a North Carolina law that required voters to show photo identification when casting ballots, ruling that it intentionally discriminated against African-American residents.

The ruling, a victory for rights advocates that will enable thousands of people to vote more easily, is also likely to be seen as a boost for Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton going into the election on Nov. 8.

The state is politically important as it does not lean heavily toward either Democrats or Republicans, and Clinton is heavily favored among black Americans over Republican nominee Donald Trump.

The court’s decision also canceled provisions of the law that scaled back early voting, prevented residents from registering and voting on the same day, and eliminated the ability of voters to vote outside their assigned precinct.
Critics argue that such provisions are designed to drive down turnout by minorities and poor people who rely more on flexible voting methods and are less likely to possess state-issued photo IDs. Proponents of such laws say they aim to eliminate voter fraud.

In its ruling, a three-judge panel at the U.S. Appeals Court for the Fourth Circuit said the state legislature targeted African-Americans “with almost surgical precision.”

“We cannot ignore the recent evidence that, because of race, the legislature enacted one of the largest restrictions of the franchise in modern North Carolina history,” Judge Diana Motz wrote.

U.S. Attorney General Loretta Lynch said the court’s ruling upheld Americans’ ability “to have a fair and free opportunity to help write the story of this nation,” in remarks she delivered on Friday in Baton Rouge, Louisiana.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/nort...8e8b5de534

Vote fraud is rare. Few people can impersonate other voters and get away with it. There's no personal gain and too much risk. People are more likely to commit insurance fraud, which offers gain, than commit vote fraud.

I am having trouble getting videos to stick.

A relevant rant I ran into on Reddit:

Quote:You know, I liked progress. I still remember, albeit vaguely, the day that gay marriage was ruled legal by the supreme court. I haven't watched coverage of Roe V Wade back when it was in the court, but I imagine if I had been around to see it, I would have been proud too.

And now, all I can think of is that in a trump pence presidency, all gay marriages might suddenly be nullified. All of them. All of that "love wins" stuff? Gone, worthless, destroyed. The whole struggle? Set back years, possibly 50-100. I don't know how many protections pence would remove, but if I would hazard a guess, I'd guess he'd put the idea of gay people being human into question, just so his right wing buddies could use those guns they love so much.

Roe V Wade? Gone. Hell, contraception would be gone! And don't think you could use porn to get off, that would be endangering public health, and they would make it illegal somehow. Women in the military? I wouldn't be surprised if pence launched a campaign that would oppose women getting jobs, thus freeing up their time to be "in their place", IE slaving over a hot stove and kids all day instead of ever having fulfilling careers.

It occurs to me that I'm probably venting right now. Fuck it. Religion? Everywhere. Your kid would be proselytized to without your consent in school, whether you be atheist, muslim, buddhist, or even christian.

Black Lives Matter protests would either be gunned down in the street or end up with all the protesters in jail for "disturbing the peace". Muslims would eventually end up in damn camps.

We could fight, but with a republican president and congress, it would be nearly hopeless.

And that's why I don't care how hardcore for bernie you still are, if jill stein doesn't provide anything close to adequate presidential competition, you have to vote hillary and democrats down tickets. You have to. And not just for your rights, not just for my rights, but for the rights of every minority and female american. This isn't just about you anymore. This is about every progressive movement in america. Even if hillary isn't amazing, at the very least you'll be electing democratic governors and senators and congresspeople down ticket so that countless human fucking rights are preserved, instead of smashed with a big trump hammer.

There we go. It's up to you, america. Although I'd honestly rather have denmark (#1 happiest nation in the world) picking our president right now. Clearly, we're drunk at the wheel.

(07-30-2016, 02:38 PM)Odin Wrote: [ -> ]A relevant rant I ran into on Reddit:

Quote:And that's why I don't care how hardcore for bernie you still are, if jill stein doesn't provide anything close to adequate presidential competition, you have to vote hillary and democrats down tickets. You have to. And not just for your rights, not just for my rights, but for the rights of every minority and female american. This isn't just about you anymore. This is about every progressive movement in america. Even if hillary isn't amazing, at the very least you'll be electing democratic governors and senators and congresspeople down ticket so that countless human fucking rights are preserved, instead of smashed with a big trump hammer.

There we go. It's up to you, america. Although I'd honestly rather have denmark (#1 happiest nation in the world) picking our president right now. Clearly, we're drunk at the wheel.

Nice rant.

The only nitpick would be the possibility that Hillary might be amazing, just not amazing at public relations and speech making.  She's a policy wonk.  So long as Bill, Barack and Michelle are willing to do the rounds of the talk shows for her, perhaps she doesn't need to be a first class public speaker.

We shall see...   I hope.

As of now I will be voting for Hillary Clinton.

http://thehill.com/policy/national-secur...te-clinton

No candidate who falls for such nonsense deserves my vote. This is on top of entertaining anti-vaxxer fanatics, and her policy of ignoring the need to support Syrian rebels.

There's a difference between presenting a better alternative, and smearing the only person who can beat the evil candidate with lies.

Says it all -

[img][/img]

I'm thinking right now that I will decline the offer, even in blue California.

Additional comment: I note that Bernie never stooped so low as Jill is doing. If I had been registered Democratic, I would have voted for Bernie in June in the CA primary. I still respect Jill, but she's taking the wrong approach.

Wow, this could put Utah back in play! A Mormon 3rd-party GOP candidate!

Third-Party Candidate With GOP Backing, Money Joining Race
By Sandy Fitzgerald | Monday, 08 Aug 2016 09:15 AM

A newcomer to elective politics is jumping into the White House race.

Evan McMullin, chief Republican policy director of the House Republican conference and an alumnus of the CIA, announced Monday that he is launching a third-party presidential campaign. He also brought a campaign website online.
https://www.evanmcmullin.com/

"In a year where Americans have lost faith in the candidates of both major parties, it's time for a generation of new leadership to step up," McMullin told ABC News.

"It's never too late to do the right thing, and America deserves much better than either Donald Trump or Hillary Clinton can offer us. I humbly offer myself as a leader who can give millions of disaffected Americans a conservative choice for President."

An anti-Trump group, Better for America, has been working for several months to put a third-party candidate on the ballot, but may face legal battles in states like Texas, where they could have to file suit to be included.

According to ABC, McMullin was born in Provo, Utah, and holds a bachelor's degree in international law and diplomacy from Brigham Young University and a Master's of Business Administration from The Wharton School at the University of Pennsylvania.

He also was a Mormon missionary in Amman, Jordan for the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees. He was in training at the CIA headquarters in Langley, Virginia, at the time of the Sept. 11 attacks, and after completing his training he volunteered to serve in the Middle East, North Africa and South Asia, where he worked with counterterrorism and intelligence operations in some of the most dangerous nations, Better for America reported.

After leaving the CIA in 2011, McMullin went to work at Goldman Sachs in San Francisco, and two years later become a senior national security advisor for the House Committee on Foreign Affairs, later becoming the chief policy director of the House Republican Conference.

MSNBC's Joe Scarborough reported McMullin's plans first on Monday morning.

Scarborough at first didn't name name either the sources or the potential candidate on air, except to say that he has heard the person is a young former CIA agent.

"I could be wrong at 7:04 [a.m.] but several good sources told me that people, er, Republicans, from let's just say, 'Never Trump land,' found somebody and they're going to put good money behind him," Scarborough said.

But off the show, Scarborough tweeted:

Scarborough later stated McMullin's name on air as well, praising him as "somebody Republicans could get behind," and saying he has "more credentials" to run for the presidency than Trump.

BuzzFeed News also on Monday reported McMullin plans to run and that veteran GOP strategist Rick Wilson, another outspoken Trump critic and media consultant, intends to be involved in the campaign.

Unnamed sources told BuzzFeed that Wilson met in Washington on Sunday with members of a prospective campaign for McMullin, including with Better for America, which has also been seeking an independent candidate.

BuzzFeed said its sources reported McMullin was planning to file paperwork at about noon.


Breaking News at Newsmax.com http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/third-pa...z4GmC4R2DM


Horoscope score 6-3. That's almost as good as Trump, but not a lot of energy there. Score subject to change because birth time unknown. He does have a few "energetic" aspects, actually, but they don't help him statistically according to my research. Steadiness and policy wonkishness are indicated, plus a bit of a nervous, restless or overly-intellectual disposition.

(08-22-2016, 07:47 PM)X_4AD_84 Wrote: [ -> ]Having abandoned the State Dept email "scandal" the Drumpfsters have shifted gears. Now they are trying to impugn Clinton insinuating that the Clinton Foundation is a portal of corruption. No doubt like all such things started by politicians there is a degree of quid quo pro going on. We'll see how far the Drumpfsters can go with this one.

Looks to me like if not a Hail Mary play certainly a 4th quarter gamble.

Or perhaps the kitchen sink is next.  They're just throwing everything they've got.