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(10-10-2020, 03:11 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 12:24 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: [ -> ]Playing by the rules accepts that the rules are valid. So it is with sporting events, and so it is with criminal law. Of course when government makes or bends the rules on the side of repression we have a problem.

Playing by the rules accepts there are/will be consequences for breaking them and knowing whether the rules seem valid or not doesn't/isn't going to  matter. Are you repressed? Are they really repressed? Was Kamala repressed? Was Obama repressed? Are the thousands that we've seen peaceful protesting or rioting or looting and burning down buildings repressed? Are the ones we see spouting their mouths from their plush looking rooms in their homes on Fox repressed? Give me a break. I'm telling you dude, there's a reason why Fox News Channel is quickly becoming America's news channel. I've heard that their ratings have hit an all time high and surpassed the national news outlets.

You should well know what I dread in a second term of Donald Trump. What was objectionable to anyone not on the Hard Right becomes more intense. That horrible man sees anyone who disagrees with him as an enemy to be at best rendered ineffective. I have seen that in history books among a large number of political leaders, but never in a President of the United States until Donald Trump.

The Constitution greatly limits the powers of the Presidency, and without the consent of Congress the President is very weak. Major, popular reforms? Congress might just go along. A Crisis war? So it was with Lincoln and FDR. Getting to imitate Nero, Caligula, or Commodus? One hopes... absolutely not. 

The tendency over forty years has been toward the intensification of economic inequality due to monopolization, vertical integration in business, the decline of small business (related to vertical integration), weakening of unions, increasing promotion of debt as opposed to government aid for education, and the imposition of low, rigid ceilings of advancement in Big Business and even non-profit entities. 

I expect people who loot and riot during what is intended to be a peaceful protest to receive the appropriate repression that the police, the courts, and the penal system offer to the garden variety of criminals. I also expect much the same with the people involved in an absurd plot to kidnap the Governor of Michigan.   

I have my test on how prosperous a country is: how well do people with comparable occupations (let us say barbers, schoolteachers, bus drivers, and nurses) live? If they are destitute, then per capita income is irrelevant.

...as for FoX Newspeak Channel... it is highly manipulative. It has its signals to get people angry. You might note that many people now block it.
(10-10-2020, 03:11 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 12:24 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: [ -> ]Playing by the rules accepts that the rules are valid. So it is with sporting events, and so it is with criminal law. Of course when government makes or bends the rules on the side of repression we have a problem.

Playing by the rules accepts there are/will be consequences for breaking them and knowing whether the rules seem valid or not doesn't/isn't going to  matter. Are you repressed? Are they really repressed? Was Kamala repressed? Was Obama repressed? Are the thousands that we've seen peaceful protesting or rioting or looting and burning down buildings repressed? Are the ones we see spouting their mouths from their plush looking rooms in their homes on Fox repressed? Give me a break. I'm telling you dude, there's a reason why Fox News Channel is quickly becoming America's news channel. I've heard that their ratings have hit an all time high and surpassed the national news outlets.

If you get your way, repression will skyrocket.
Polling averages on 270towin:
Oct.10

National: Biden +9.7
https://www.270towin.com/2020-polls-biden-trump/

https://www.270towin.com/content/2020-pr...te-polling
Alaska Trump +6
Arizona Biden +3
Florida Biden +4.6
Georgia Biden +0.7
Iowa Biden +1
Michigan Biden +8.6
Minnesota Biden +9
Montana Trump +10
Nevada Biden +7.4
New Hampshire Biden +9.2
North Carolina Biden +3
Ohio Biden +0.6
Pennsylvania Biden +8.2
South Carolina Trump +5.7
Texas Trump +4
Virginia Biden +9.5
Wisconsin Biden +6.2

Poll averages from fivethirtyeight Oct.11, 3 PM EDT
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/pol.../national/

National Biden +10.4

Alaska Trump +4.4
Arizona Biden +3.9
Colorado Biden +12
Florida Biden +4.5
Georgia Biden +0.9
Iowa Biden +1.0
Kansas Trump +6.7
Maine CD-2 Biden +1.2
Michigan Biden +8.0
Minnesota Biden +9.2
Missouri Trump +5.5
Montana Trump +8.6
Nevada Biden +6.8
New Hampshire Biden +10.8
North Carolina Biden +2.9
Ohio Biden +0.7
Pennsylvania Biden +7.3
South Carolina Trump +5.3
Texas Trump +1.5
Virginia Biden +12.7
Wisconsin Biden +7.2

[Image: Qp62J]

fivethirtyeight poll averages using 270towin interactive map
gray = tossup +-3%, red = Republican, blue = Democratic: 3-9% leaning, 9-15% likely, 15+% solid (light to dark colors)

Over 6 million people have already voted.
When the arrow is pointing at the middle blue, am I allowed to relax a little bit?
(10-12-2020, 01:50 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: [ -> ]When the arrow is pointing at the middle blue, am I allowed to relax a little bit?

No! Stay tense and stay worried! Or whatever you want to be Smile

Things are still moving slowly further our way, it appears.

Poll averages from fivethirtyeight Oct.12, 8 PM EDT
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/national/

National Biden +10.4

Alaska Trump +4.3
Arizona Biden +3.9
Colorado Biden +12
Florida Biden +4.5
Georgia Biden +0.9
Iowa Biden +1.1
Kansas Trump +6.6
Maine CD-2 Biden +1.3
Michigan Biden +8.1
Minnesota Biden +9.2
Missouri Trump +5.4
Montana Trump +8.1
Nevada Biden +6.9
New Hampshire Biden +10.9
North Carolina Biden +2.9
Ohio Biden +0.7
Pennsylvania Biden +7.3
South Carolina Trump +5.3
Texas Trump +1.5
Virginia Biden +12.7
Wisconsin Biden +7.7

Real Clear Politics
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/elections/2020/
General Election: Trump vs. Biden
Biden51.8
Trump41.6
Biden +10.2

The Democrats have still not shut down the Senate. Graham has gaveled to order their shit show so they can keep the USA on the road to injustice, climate disaster, banana republic status, money dominated politics, and reversal of voting rights and other rights for all races and genders, for the next 40 years. It will not matter if Biden wins and the Democrats win the Senate if in 2021 they do not abolish the filibuster and pack the Court. And nominate someone other than Kamala Harris for president in the future. Biden's victory alone will not move things forward much; just return us to a modicum of presidential competence.

Some Senate polls from fivethirtyeight
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/senate/
latest poll first, October only

Alabama: Tuberville (Rep) +12
Alaska: Sullivan (Rep) +4
Arizona: Kelly (Dem) +2, +5, +10, +6, +8, +11
Colorado: Hickenlooper (Dem) +9
Georgia (two seats up): Ossoff (Dem) +1, +5; Democrats 44-Republicans 46
Iowa: Greenfield (Dem) +4, +3, +5, +2, +1, +12
Kansas: Bollier (Dem) +4
Maine: Gideon (Dem) +1, +8, +5
Michigan: Peters (Dem) +1, +3, +6, +2, +8, +7
Montana: even, Daines (Rep) +9, Bullock (Dem) +4
North Carolina: Cunningham (Dem) +9, +4, +5, +12
South Carolina: Harrison (Dem) +1, Graham (Rep) +1
Texas: Cornyn (Rep) +8, +1, +3
(10-12-2020, 01:56 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-12-2020, 01:50 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: [ -> ]When the arrow is pointing at the middle blue, am I allowed to relax a little bit?

No! Stay tense and stay worried! Or whatever you want to be Smile

Things are still moving slowly further our way, it appears...

I agree with Eric. It's wise to stay frosty and focused.  For me, the voting is over and my ballot is approved (though not evaluated at this point).  I've encouraged others of like mind to vote by mail early and many have  -- most of them without my prompting.  I wrote a commentary for the local paper that may have had some effect as well.  In this very Red county, I'm about out of bullets, but I hope I swayed at least a few.
(10-10-2020, 06:10 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 03:11 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 12:24 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: [ -> ]Playing by the rules accepts that the rules are valid. So it is with sporting events, and so it is with criminal law. Of course when government makes or bends the rules on the side of repression we have a problem.

Playing by the rules accepts there are/will be consequences for breaking them and knowing whether the rules seem valid or not doesn't/isn't going to  matter. Are you repressed? Are they really repressed? Was Kamala repressed? Was Obama repressed? Are the thousands that we've seen peaceful protesting or rioting or looting and burning down buildings repressed? Are the ones we see spouting their mouths from their plush looking rooms in their homes on Fox repressed? Give me a break. I'm telling you dude, there's a reason why Fox News Channel is quickly becoming America's news channel. I've heard that their ratings have hit an all time high and surpassed the national news outlets.

If you get your way, repression will skyrocket.
So, which group controls the amount of repression that takes place in your areas? Is it Black Lives Matter or Antifa or the Liberal Woke's and their corporate allies and their ties to Liberal courts or the Greens or the Democrats these days? You do realize that the current issue over American sovereignty is going to be settled one way or another within our lifetime.
(10-13-2020, 12:21 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 06:10 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 03:11 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 12:24 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: [ -> ]Playing by the rules accepts that the rules are valid. So it is with sporting events, and so it is with criminal law. Of course when government makes or bends the rules on the side of repression we have a problem.

Playing by the rules accepts there are/will be consequences for breaking them and knowing whether the rules seem valid or not doesn't/isn't going to  matter. Are you repressed? Are they really repressed? Was Kamala repressed? Was Obama repressed? Are the thousands that we've seen peaceful protesting or rioting or looting and burning down buildings repressed? Are the ones we see spouting their mouths from their plush looking rooms in their homes on Fox repressed? Give me a break. I'm telling you dude, there's a reason why Fox News Channel is quickly becoming America's news channel. I've heard that their ratings have hit an all time high and surpassed the national news outlets.

If you get your way, repression will skyrocket.
So, which group controls the amount of repression that takes place in your areas? Is it Black Lives Matter or Antifa or the Liberal Woke's and their corporate allies and their ties to Liberal courts or the Greens or the Democrats these days? You do realize that the current issue over American sovereignty is going to be settled one way or another within our lifetime.

Repression in our area and all areas is done by your Party.
Poll averages from fivethirtyeight Oct.14, 4 AM EDT
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/national/

National Biden +10.5

Alaska Trump +4.8
Arizona Biden +3.9
Colorado Biden +12.9
Florida Biden +4.5
Georgia Biden +0.7
Iowa Biden +1.3
Kansas Trump +7.1
Maine CD-2 Biden +1.3
Michigan Biden +8.0
Minnesota Biden +9.1
Missouri Trump +6
Montana Trump +8.3
Nevada Biden +6.4
New Hampshire Biden +11.4
North Carolina Biden +3.3
Ohio Biden +0.1
Pennsylvania Biden +7.2
South Carolina Trump +7.1
Texas Trump +1.4
Virginia Biden +12.7
Wisconsin Biden +7.9

[Image: 6zkoE]

fivethirtyeight poll averages using 270towin interactive map
gray = tossup +-3%, red = Republican, blue = Democratic: 3-9% leaning, 9-15% likely, 15+% solid (light to dark colors)

Over 11 million people have already voted.

Likely and solid red states are getting less red, and blue states are getting more blue, but most of the leaning red states are leaning further. Toss-ups are, well, toss-ups!
(10-10-2020, 06:36 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]Polling averages on 270towin:
Oct.10

National: Biden +9.7
https://www.270towin.com/2020-polls-biden-trump/

https://www.270towin.com/content/2020-pr...te-polling
Alaska Trump +6
Arizona Biden +3
Florida Biden +4.6
Georgia Biden +0.7
Iowa Biden +1
Michigan Biden +8.6
Minnesota Biden +9
Montana Trump +10
Nevada Biden +7.4
New Hampshire Biden +9.2
North Carolina Biden +3
Ohio Biden +0.6
Pennsylvania Biden +8.2
South Carolina Trump +5.7
Texas Trump +4
Virginia Biden +9.5
Wisconsin Biden +6.2

Poll averages from fivethirtyeight Oct.11, 3 PM EDT
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/pol.../national/

National Biden +10.4

Alaska Trump +4.4
Arizona Biden +3.9
Colorado Biden +12
Florida Biden +4.5
Georgia Biden +0.9
Iowa Biden +1.0
Kansas Trump +6.7
Maine CD-2 Biden +1.2
Michigan Biden +8.0
Minnesota Biden +9.2
Missouri Trump +5.5
Montana Trump +8.6
Nevada Biden +6.8
New Hampshire Biden +10.8
North Carolina Biden +2.9
Ohio Biden +0.7
Pennsylvania Biden +7.3
South Carolina Trump +5.3
Texas Trump +1.5
Virginia Biden +12.7
Wisconsin Biden +7.2

[Image: Qp62J]

fivethirtyeight poll averages using 270towin interactive map
gray = tossup +-3%, red = Republican, blue = Democratic: 3-9% leaning, 9-15% likely, 15+% solid (light to dark colors)

Over 6 million people have already voted.
Yep. 6 million people who are mainly Democrats have already voted as we are all waiting to vote on election day.
(10-13-2020, 04:10 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-13-2020, 12:21 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 06:10 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 03:11 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 12:24 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: [ -> ]Playing by the rules accepts that the rules are valid. So it is with sporting events, and so it is with criminal law. Of course when government makes or bends the rules on the side of repression we have a problem.

Playing by the rules accepts there are/will be consequences for breaking them and knowing whether the rules seem valid or not doesn't/isn't going to  matter. Are you repressed? Are they really repressed? Was Kamala repressed? Was Obama repressed? Are the thousands that we've seen peaceful protesting or rioting or looting and burning down buildings repressed? Are the ones we see spouting their mouths from their plush looking rooms in their homes on Fox repressed? Give me a break. I'm telling you dude, there's a reason why Fox News Channel is quickly becoming America's news channel. I've heard that their ratings have hit an all time high and surpassed the national news outlets.

If you get your way, repression will skyrocket.
So, which group controls the amount of repression that takes place in your areas? Is it Black Lives Matter or Antifa or the Liberal Woke's and their corporate allies and their ties to Liberal courts or the Greens or the Democrats these days? You do realize that the current issue over American sovereignty is going to be settled one way or another within our lifetime.

Repression in our area and all areas is done by your Party.
We aren't repressing anyone. The Democratic groups are doing it now and have been doing it all along but we're not doing it yet. We can and we will eventually but we have decided to remain idle and wait for the proof we need to see and respond with equal kind. You already dug your own holes we're just the bulldozers that fill them in.
(10-13-2020, 06:12 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-13-2020, 04:10 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-13-2020, 12:21 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 06:10 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: [ -> ]
(10-10-2020, 03:11 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]Playing by the rules accepts there are/will be consequences for breaking them and knowing whether the rules seem valid or not doesn't/isn't going to  matter. Are you repressed? Are they really repressed? Was Kamala repressed? Was Obama repressed? Are the thousands that we've seen peaceful protesting or rioting or looting and burning down buildings repressed? Are the ones we see spouting their mouths from their plush looking rooms in their homes on Fox repressed? Give me a break. I'm telling you dude, there's a reason why Fox News Channel is quickly becoming America's news channel. I've heard that their ratings have hit an all time high and surpassed the national news outlets.

If you get your way, repression will skyrocket.
So, which group controls the amount of repression that takes place in your areas? Is it Black Lives Matter or Antifa or the Liberal Woke's and their corporate allies and their ties to Liberal courts or the Greens or the Democrats these days? You do realize that the current issue over American sovereignty is going to be settled one way or another within our lifetime.

Repression in our area and all areas is done by your Party.
We aren't repressing anyone. The Democratic groups are doing it now and have been doing it all along but we're not doing it yet. We can and we will eventually but we have decided to remain idle and wait for the proof we need to see and respond with equal kind. You already dug your own holes we're just the bulldozers that fill them in.

you guys are the repressors
(10-13-2020, 06:12 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]We aren't repressing anyone. The Democratic groups are doing it now and have been doing it all along but we're not doing it yet. We can and we will eventually but we have decided to remain idle and wait for the proof we need to see and respond with equal kind. You already dug your own holes we're just the bulldozers that fill them in.

I readily believe you haven't done anything personally. It is your way to talk not act. Still, various red factions have repressed. The military, the secret police, the racist violent police, the voter repressers, the gerrymandering... Various people have reasons to feel repressed by the reds.

Pure Antifa don't repress. They wait for the opposition to attack and counterattack with enthusiasm. But, I don't trust the movement to be all that pure. Between the variants, the looters, and the Boogaloo Bois a red person could feel picked upon. The red have a few of the more violent militias such as the Proud Boys and the factions that tried to take the governor of Michigan attaching themselves to the red movement. I have learned not to trust those who are not trading on their home ground. At any rate, nobody is lily pure these days.
(10-13-2020, 05:56 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]Yep. 6 million people who are mainly Democrats have already voted as we are all  waiting to vote on election day.

Yup, because you Republicans don't care about your own health or anyone else's.
(10-13-2020, 05:56 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]Yep. 6 million people who are mainly Democrats have already voted as we are all  waiting to vote on election day.

Yes, and don't forget that Republicans vote on Wednesday November 4th. Big Grin
(10-13-2020, 06:12 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: [ -> ]We aren't repressing anyone. The Democratic groups are doing it now and have been doing it all along but we're not doing it yet. We can and we will eventually but we have decided to remain idle and wait for the proof we need to see and respond with equal kind. You already dug your own holes we're just the bulldozers that fill them in.

Let's take voter suppression.  If we set gerrymandering aside, 100% of all voter suppression in the country is GOP initiated and controlled. And gerrymandering is more GOP than Dem, but both sides do it when they can.  The GOP is unique in taking it far enough that courts have mandated redress.  This is all easily verifiable, btw.
Here is the potential for another form of voter rejection.  Imagine waiting hours in a voting line only to be turned away for wearing an item that is judged by a poll worker to promote a specific candidate?  It may be prudent to leave your political propaganda at home while voting, or at least limit yourself to stuff that can be easily covered up or removed.
Poll averages from fivethirtyeight Oct.14, 9:30 PM EDT, edited 3 PM Oct.15
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/pol.../national/

National Biden +10.5

Alaska Trump +4.5
Arizona Biden +3.8
Colorado Biden +13.1
Florida Biden +4.2
Georgia Biden +1.2
Indiana Trump +9.9
Iowa Biden +0.2
Kansas Trump +6.9
Maine CD-2 Biden +2.4
Michigan Biden +7.8
Minnesota Biden +9.1
Missouri Trump +6.1
Montana Trump +8.2
Nevada Biden +6.5
New Hampshire Biden +11.4
North Carolina Biden +3.3
Ohio Biden 0.1
Pennsylvania Biden +6.9
South Carolina Trump +7.3
Texas Trump +1.4
Virginia Biden +13.4
Wisconsin Biden +7.7
I'm a number cruncher at heart, so here goes with a complete fivethirtyeight list as of Oct.15, 4 PM EDT. edit 7:30 AM Oct.16
with electoral votes:

District of Columbia Biden +78, 3
Massachusetts Biden +38.2, 11
Vermont Biden +33.1, 3
Maryland Biden +32.5, 10
California Biden +31.1, 55
New York Biden +30.9, 29
Hawaii Biden +30.7, 4
Rhode Island Biden +30.2, 4
Delaware Biden +26.7, 3
Connecticut Biden +25.8, 7
Washington Biden +25.2, 12
Maine CD1 Biden +24.7, 1
New Jersey Biden +19.7, 14
Oregon Biden +19.5, 7
Illinois Biden +18.4, 20
Maine Biden +15, 2, = solid Biden 185

New Mexico Biden +13.6, 5
Virginia Biden +13.4, 13
Colorado Biden +13.1, 9
New Hampshire Biden +11.4, 4

National Biden +10.6, 538

Minnesota Biden +9.1, 10, = likely Biden 41 = 226

Michigan Biden +7.8, 16
Wisconsin Biden +7.6, 10
Nebraska CD2 Biden +7.5, 1
Pennsylvania Biden +6.9, 20 = tipping point = 273

Nevada Biden +6.5, 6
Florida Biden +4.2, 29
Arizona Biden +3.8, 11
North Carolina Biden +3.1, 15 = leaning Biden 108 = 334

Maine CD2 Biden +2.4, 1
Georgia Biden +1.2, 16
Iowa Biden +0.3, 6
Ohio Biden +0.1, 18, = tilting Biden 41 = Biden 375

Texas Trump +1.4, 38 = tilting Trump 38 = 413

Alaska Trump +4.6, 3
Missouri Trump +6.1, 10
Kansas Trump +6.9, 6
Nebraska Trump +7.3, 2
Nebraska CD1 Trump +7.3, 1
South Carolina Trump +7.4, 9
Montana Trump +8.2, 3, = leaning Trump 34 =447

Indiana Trump +9.9, 11
Utah Trump +11.6, 6
Tennessee Trump +13.1, 11
Mississippi Trump +13.8, 6
Arkansas Trump +14.3, 6
South Dakota Trump +14.4, 3
Louisiana Trump +14.7, 8, = likely Trump 51 =498

Nebraska CD3 Trump +?, 1
Alabama Trump +17.7, 9
Kentucky Trump +17.8, 8
North Dakota Trump +20.3, 3
Idaho Trump +20.7, 4
Oklahoma Trump +21.5, 7
West Virginia Trump +23, 5
Wyoming Trump +33.8, 3, = solid Trump 40 = Trump 163 = 538
(10-14-2020, 09:50 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: [ -> ]Here is the potential for another form of voter rejection.  Imagine waiting hours in a voting line only to be turned away for wearing an item that is judged by a poll worker to promote a specific candidate?  It may be prudent to leave your political propaganda at home while voting, or at least limit yourself to stuff that can be easily covered up or removed.

They must be neutral. Some political attire might be offensive, as anything containing the word "F---" followed by a candidate's name.