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RE: Generational Dynamics World View - John J. Xenakis - 09-05-2020
** 03-Sep-2020 World View: Mental illness
John, you said,
Quote:> This man is certifiably crazy, and I really mean
> that. He's like a man who gets pleasure in beating the crap out of
> his own wife. The more destructive he is, the more satisfied he
> is. This isn't an "ideology." This is a severe mental
> illness.
Cool Breeze" Wrote:> You should know from the Orthodox faith that what they suffer from
> is spiritual delusion and sickness of the highest magnitude. You
> need only see Mr. de Blasio (Warren Wilhelm Jr - his real name)
> family and his children to see just how sick his internal life is
> even ... and how that shows on the outside of his destructive and
> chaotic fascinations (demonic).
> He is not crazy. That absolves him. It is not the material that is
> his problem. It is the path he chose and the rejection of God that
> makes him and anything around him go even crazier.
The point I'm trying to make is that this has nothing to do with
ideology or religion.
Religion is about whether you go to church on Sunday. Ideology is
about whether you support a 22 or 28 percent tax rate. So when you
blame something on a man's ideology or religion, you're absolving him.
Everyone's entitled to their own ideology, so you can't blame him for
his ideology. Same with religion. Or, if the person's religion is
some "enemy" religion, whether Christianity or Islam, then you can
blame the actual religion, rather then the person. So the man is
absolved either way.
There is no ideology or religion that supports a man beating up his
wife, or lynching a black, or destroying a city, or destroying a
country, or committing genocide (unless you're at war). So these
crimes have nothing to do with either ideology or religion.
Every day I see the worst of human behavior. I don't write about it
every day, but I see it every day. A politician destroying a city,
country or population, or torturing someone for saying the wrong
thing, or killing someone for no reason, and then defending it with
the usual crap that comes out of the mouths of politicians. I've
developed very strong negative feelings about the mental sickness of
humans, to the extent that I sometimes question my own sanity. This
is in the DNA, and is irrespective of religion or ideology.
I do not agree that mental illness absolves someone of a crime. It's
true that "insanity" is a defense for some crimes, but that just means
that he's locked up in a mental institution instead of prison.
So when the Nazis kill the Jews or when Maduro destroys Venezuela or
when Lori Lightfoot destroys Chicao or Ted Wheeler destroys Portland,
I'm not willing to attach a religion or ideology in any way, because
every religion and ideology is the same. To me, it's a mental
illness.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - John J. Xenakis - 09-05-2020
** 05-Sep-2020 World View: King Solomon and Generational Dynamics
(09-03-2020, 09:40 PM)beechnut79 Wrote: > Most of the traditional conservative mindset will tell you that
> there’s a time to work and a time to play. This goes all the way
> back to biblical times and became the crux of a passage which in
> the 1960s was turned into a popular song.
Ah yes, Ecclesiastes, my favorite book of the Bible, and Turn, Turn,
Turn, one of my favorite songs.
King Solomon was the first Prophet to understand Generational
Dynamics, and he reflected that understanding in his writings. "There
is nothing new under the sun."
The Byrds apparently understood as well. "To everything (turn, turn,
turn) There is a season (turn, turn, turn) And a time to every
purpose, under heaven."
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - Bob Butler 54 - 09-05-2020
(09-05-2020, 08:54 AM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: So when the Nazis kill the Jews or when Maduro destroys Venezuela or when Lori Lightfoot destroys Chicao or Ted Wheeler destroys Portland, I'm not willing to attach a religion or ideology in any way, because every religion and ideology is the same. To me, it's a mental
illness.
From my perspective, an ideology is a more formalized version of values. Humans in their youth often create a shortcut way of understanding the world and pursuing particular goals. These are world views and values. Some of them have been formalized. If you call yourself a Republican or a Christian this should in theory be a suggestion as to how you understand things and what goals you pursue. Of course this is an approximation. There are often personal quirks or hidden goals. Everyone is different. But hopefully there is some correlation between a chosen ideology and how you perceive and solve problems.
My own system which has been labeled here as ‘whig’ values democracy, equality, human rights and justice. In a given fourth turning, the side aligned with these whig values tends to triumph, and the opposite faction has its values suppressed.
Man is a hunter gatherer. During the time he evolved, it was cost effective to suppress local tribes, to use violence to divide between us and them and suppress them to gain land and resources. It worked. In many ways in hunter gatherer, agricultural and even industrial times it was cost prudent. War is a racket. It was profitable to work oneself into xenophobia and with our without idealistic reasons justify sticking it to the other guy.
I would argue that in a day of insurgent proxy wars and nukes, this mode of thought is turning sour. This does not prevent some people and some ideologies from embracing it. It is part of what we are. It is not whig. In every crisis the major problems confronting a culture are removed. They have moved for some time in the whig direction.
Which makes the bad guy the one who is dividing people between us and them, oppressing them, and using violence and force to do this. Very human, but no longer cost effective.
Now if you call yourself a Christian, you are theoretically in tune with whiggish values. You are supposed to love your neighbor, and the point of the Good Samaritan parable is that everybody should be your neighbor. If you are American, you are supposedly a whig too. All men are created equal. One strives for democracy, equality, human rights and justice. If you are an S&H fan you are theoretically a whig too. In any recent crisis, the winning side transforms the culture in such a way to advance democracy, equality, human rights and justice.
But we are still humans. We are still fighting an urge to divide between us and them, favor us, suppress them, and use violence if necessary to do so.
So when I see non violent protesters being attacked it dovetails. Violent racist police and militia groups think the racial oppression should continue and are willing to instigate violence to achieve that end. I get a feeling for how this 4T is going to go.
I tend to agree that ideology does not absolve one. In a few cases it may make the difference between a prison and an asylum. That is not the problem here.
The problem is how ideologies are often used to mask motivations. I can make a case that the good guys are those that bring together. The bad guys are those that divide between us and them and respond to them violently. Ideologies are too often used to justify oppression. One can join the armed forces, nurture xenophobia, and go forth and kill them. One can call minorities or women excessively ambitious when they work to make the good jobs match the population, but somehow the white males who have traditionally held these jobs are not ambitious? One can work yourself up about how you need to separate us and them and oppress, and somehow consider yourself a good Christian, a good Republican, a good American, a good fan of turning theory.
Love thy neighbor. All men are created equal. The greatest problems confronting a culture are addressed in a 4T.
You can create bad propaganda strawmen about people like Lori Lightfoot or Ted Wheeler. You can try to justify remaining privilege over minorities and females. You can continue trying to find excuses for the prejudice, violence and oppression. Ideologies are good for that. Ideologues do that sort of thing all the time.
Love thy neighbor. All men are created equal. The greatest problems confronting a culture is addressed in a 4T.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - Warren Dew - 09-05-2020
(08-28-2020, 08:42 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: So if you have any evidence of any kind of fascist violence by the
Boogaloo Bois that comes anywhere close to the massive multi-city
fascist violence by antifa-blm, let me know. I'll take a look at it.
Don't hold your breath. That's just an excuse the leftists use to try to salve their conscience when "Antifa" engages in the same kinds of things the brown shirts did in the 1930s.
Nor is it just Fox News. The police are saying the Antifa murder in Portland was actually a targeted killing:
https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2020/09/arrest-warrant-against-michael-reinoehl-for-2nd-degree-murder-unlawful-use-of-a-firearm-unsealed.html
Quote:"Michael Forest Reinoehl, a self-described anti-fascist who provided security for Portland racial justice protests, appears to have targeted a participant in a pro-Trump rally, emerging from an alcove of a parking garage before firing two gunshots, one that hit the man’s bear spray can and the other that proved fatal, according to a police affidavit unsealed Friday."
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - Bob Butler 54 - 09-05-2020
(09-05-2020, 12:29 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: Don't hold your breath. That's just an excuse the leftists use to try to salve their conscience when "Antifa" engages in the same kinds of things the brown shirts did in the 1930s.
The brown shirts were anti fascists who would show up where fascists were apt to demonstrate to counter demonstrate and provide a opposition should the fascists prefer violence?
News to me.
But I guess ideologues will get original in their telling of history. This is a whopper.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - John J. Xenakis - 09-05-2020
*** 6-Sep-20 World View -- India scores tactical victory in Ladakh border conflict, causing fury in China
This morning's key headlines from GenerationalDynamics.com
- India scores tactical victory in Ladakh border conflict, causing fury in China
- Comments by Chinese analysts in the media
****
**** India scores tactical victory in Ladakh border conflict, causing fury in China
****
![[Image: g200905b.jpg]](http://Media.GenerationalDynamics.com/ww2010/g200905b.jpg)
Chinese cartoon blaming China-India conflict on incitement by the US (Global Times)
Readers may recall that in June hostilities broke out between Chinese
and Indian troops in Ladakh's Galwan Valley, along the Line of Actual
Control (LAC), the unmarked boundary between the two countries. On
June 15, Chinese forces ambushed Indian forces in Ladakh's Galwan
Valley, using barbaric weapons consisting of bayonets, poles studded
with steel nails, and wooden clubs wrapped with barbed wire, killing
20 unarmed Indian soldiers. ( "25-Jun-20 World View -- Both India and China reinforce armies in Ladakh, as China makes new claim"
)
Now, almost three months later, there are still many unanswered
questions about what happened on June 15, since neither side has
issued a statement providing a full narrative. The Indians have said
that 20 Indian soldiers were killed, but the Chinese have not even
revealed how many Chinese soldiers were killed, leading to some
speculation. Various reports indicate that 40-45 Chinese soldiers
were killed, even though the Chinese were armed and the Indians were
unarmed. Furthermore, according to some unconfirmed reports, the
reason that the Chinese needed weapons and lost anyway is because
Indian soldiers are taller and stronger than the Chinese soldiers, and
so India soldiers defeat Chinese soldiers in hand to hand combat. If
any of this is true, then it would be huge embarrassment for the
Chinese military to admit it, and could lead to popular unrest and a
desire for revenge in China, and so they won't even admit how many
soldiers were killed.
The Chinese and Indian military have been having peace talks, most
recently at the ministerial level on Friday on the sidelines of the
Shanghai Cooperation Organization (SCO) defense ministers’ meeting,
with the meeting lasting over two hours. The peace talks have
not gone well, and they belie what's actually happening on the
ground.
What's happening on the ground is that Indians apparently scored a
major tactical victory two days ago. Both China and India have been
building up troops. But India last week executed a stealth night-time
operation to claim strategic outposts. Thousands of soldiers climbed
up mountain peaks for about six hours during the night to claim the
vantage points along the south bank of Pangong Tso, a glacial lake
under dispute. According to the Indians, this tactical move gives
them the high ground and a clear view of enemy troop movements in
disputed territory.
According to Chinese state media: "India bears full responsibility for
the current China-India border tensions and China's military is fully
determined, capable and confident to safeguard China's sovereignty and
territorial integrity."
Hu Zhiyong, a research fellow at the Institute of International
Relations of the Shanghai Academy of Social Sciences, expects the
Indians to have to give up without a fight:
<QUOTE>"By the end of September, winter will have arrived in
the Ladakh region where temperatures could fall to minus 25
degrees, and India has deployed about 40,000 troops in the
region. This is far beyond its logistics capability, and if the
tension remained unresolved, the Indian military could see
non-combat casualties."<END QUOTE>
The conflict has spilled over into the economic area. India has
limited Chinese investments, is tightening scrutiny on vasas, is
blocking Huawei Technologies Co. out of 5G networks, and is
banning numerous Chinese mobile phone apps.
Some analysts are calling the current India-China relations in Ladakh
the most dangerous in decades. Both sides are massing troops, and if
it's really true that the Indian troops cannot tolerate the low winter
temperatures, then they'll have to either strike or retreat. The
winter months may bring a turning point.
****
**** Comments by Chinese analysts in the media
****
The Chinese communists have not admitted either their plans or
intentions in their mass military buildup in Ladakh. However, Antara
Ghosal Singh, a Chinese strategy expert at the Delhi Policy Group, has
done an analysis of commentary by the Chinese strategic community on
the situation. They all blame the Indians for the hostilities, and
give various reasons for they think that the Indians are doing this.
The following are some of the main points:
- The Indians want leverage in future negotiations over the
South China Sea.
- India is signalling that if a conflict occurs on the border, then
it may resort to retaliation against China at sea by targeting China's
oil and gas transport vessels, "thereby, urging the Chinese government
to take proper countermeasures to deal with the disturbances at the
sea."
- India is working at the behest of the United States, particularly
since there may be a US-China military showdown before the US
elections.
- More specifically, India and the Americans have reached a
behind-the-scenes deal that the latter will build up pressure on
China's eastern and southern fronts, India will activate the western
front, so as to force China to take action under unfavorable terms,
forced to fight on both sides.
- Since the Wuhan Coronavirus epidemic began, "India has decided to
stand with the United States in the great power
competition."
Many in China are fuming over India's tactical victory, and for its
"audacity" to wave a Tibetan "Snow Mountan Lion Flag" at the
confrontation site, the video of which went viral in the Chinese
social media. Chinese social media space has been buzzing with calls
for an "appropriate counterattack."
Sources:
- India / China’s PLA in race to reach the green line in Ladakh (Hindustan Times, 5-Sep-2020)
- 'Have No Doubt...': India Warns China Against 'Aggressive Behaviour' in First Political Meet After Border Flare-Up (News18, India, 5-Sep-2020)
- India / Rajnath Singh, China Defence Minister Meet In Moscow Amid Ladakh Tensions (New Delhi TV, 5-Sep-2020)
- New Delhi shows positive attitude, frontline Indian troops may remain over winter: expert (Global Times, Beijing, 5-Sep-2020)
- India / Chinese Chatter: What strategic experts from the other side think about Ladakh standoff (India Today, 5-Sep-2020)
- Captured Strategic Outposts in Stealth Move Against China (Bloomberg, 2-Sep-2020)
- India-China Dispute: Army chief reviews operational preparedness in Ladakh (Money Control, India, 3-Sep-2020)
- Indian and Chinese troops once again engaged in a confrontation on the south bank of Pangong Tso a few days ago. (PTI) (India Today, 2-Sep-2020)
- 1962-2020: How US Played a Role in Escalating Indo-China Conflict (The Quint, 18-Jun-2020)
- Nuclear / Why India and China haven’t used the ‘N’ word throughout the Ladakh conflict (The Print, India, 3-Aug-2020)
- India / China controls 1,000 sq. km of area in Ladakh (The Hindu, 1-Sep-2020)
- India-China Tensions Spike in the Himalayas (Diplomat, 5-Sep-2020)
- India steps up scrutiny of Chinese influence group amid Ladakh border conflict (Business Today, India, 4-Sep-2020)
Related Articles:
- Both India and China reinforce armies in Ladakh, as China makes new claim (25-Jun-2020)
- Nationwide protests in India demand revenge against China (19-Jun-2020)
- China and India mobilize thousands of troops along border in Ladakh (13-Jun-2020)
- Russia's Far East, Siberia and Vladivostok under threat from China (31-Mar-2018)
- China resumes military buildup in Bhutan's Doklam Plateau (19-Dec-2017)
- Analysts draw lessons from the China vs India Doklam border standoff (24-Sep-2017)
- India and China battle for strategic influence in the Indian Ocean (18-Mar-2015)
- Generational Theory: Is nuclear war with China inevitable? (17-May-2020)
KEYS: Generational Dynamics, China, India, Ladakh, Galwan Valley,
Line of Actual Control, LAC, Pangong Tso, Hu Zhiyong,
Antara Ghosal Singh
Permanent web link to this article
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RE: Generational Dynamics World View - John J. Xenakis - 09-06-2020
** 06-Sep-2020 World View: Brian Stelter and Fox News
(08-28-2020, 08:42 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: > So if you have any evidence of any kind of fascist violence by the
> Boogaloo Bois that comes anywhere close to the massive multi-city
> fascist violence by antifa-blm, let me know. I'll take a look at
> it.
(09-05-2020, 12:29 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: > Don't hold your breath. That's just an excuse the leftists use to
> try to salve their conscience when "Antifa" engages in the same
> kinds of things the brown shirts did in the 1930s.
I specifically asked Butler to provide evidence of his accusations
about the Boobaloo Bois, but he ignored that request. He provided no
evidence but repeated the unsupported accusations. This is the way
the left always works.
I vaguely recall that Butler once referred to Brian Stelter as an
"expert" at CNN. Stelter is a political hack. I used to watch him,
but stopped during the 2016 political campaign, when Stelter started
saying on his show that Trump was so bad that journalists had a duty
not to be fair and balanced, but actually were required to lie and
make things up, anything to get Trump defeated. This is what CNN and
the others do every day.
This was starkly obvious during the impeachment hearings. I've
mentioned that I heard all the hearings, since I was sitting at home,
working on my computer with the TV on. Every day, the witnesses would
make some claim about Trump, and then the Republicans would
cross-examine the witness, and the witness had to admit he had no
evidence whatsoever, but was just doing as told by Adam Schiff. The
worst was that it came out that one of the witnesses had been forced
to lie because the Democrats threatened his family with violence
unless he did as he was told. All this came out in the hearings under
Republican cross-examination. But at the end of every day, the news
report was that the witnesses gave "explosive testimony" that proved
Trump's guilt, when in fact the opposite was true. This was a stark
example of the mainstream media purposely lying, following Brian
Stelter's dictum.
My point is that the mainstream media has gone completely over to
Brian Stelter's advice -- lie and make things up -- anything to defeat
Donald Trump. It's an actual policy of lying, with Fox News being the
only honest news channel. And the other point is that Bob Butler is
also a Brian Stelter acolyte, and can't be trusted to say anything
except lies and Adam Schiff - Nanci Pelosi talking points.
(09-05-2020, 12:29 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: > Nor is it just Fox News. The police are saying the Antifa murder
> in Portland was actually a targeted killing:
> https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2020/09/arrest-warrant-against-michael-reinoehl-for-2nd-degree-murder-unlawful-use-of-a-firearm-unsealed.html
> "Michael Forest Reinoehl, a self-described anti-fascist who
> provided security for Portland racial justice protests, appears to
> have targeted a participant in a pro-Trump rally, emerging from an
> alcove of a parking garage before firing two gunshots, one that
> hit the man’s bear spray can and the other that proved fatal,
> according to a police affidavit unsealed Friday."
There's an interesting split going on. The mainstream media has been
suppressing all the violence by antifa-blm fascist thug mobs. The one
bright star of national news reporting is Fox News, which has been
showing videos of the antifa-blm violence from the beginning, and is
the only news channel where you can actually find out what's going on,
which is why it typically has better ratings than all the others put
together.
But the split has to do with local news reporting. If the fascist
antifa-blm thugs burn down a building or kill someone, then the local
media have no choice but to report it whether they want to or not. So
a media source like Oregon Live will really have to report on that the
killing was an antifa-blm targeted killing, even if the mainstream
national media will suppress those facts, following Stelter's policy.
The news suppression situation is becoming very bad. Google
particularly has gone totally over to the dark side. For example, if
you do a search, it's almost impossible for Breitbart or any
conservative voices to be displayed in the results.
In my recent article on Microsoft, I explained how Google does this.
They use AI algorithms based on rules written by their employees, and
all their employees are far left-wingers. So the rules are hidden
from the public, and the results can only be determined by data
analysis.
When Google was launched in 1998, its official slogan was "Don't be
evil." It was a corporate principle that "you can make money without
doing evil," and "Don't be evil" was part of the company's official
code of conduct until Trump became president. But in 2018, Google
mysteriously removed "Don't be evil" from its web site, and indeed the
company has become totally evil, using its monopoly power to influence
the election, to defeat the hated Tea Partiers and Trump supporters.
Twitter and Facebook have the same policies, but it's much more
difficult for them to implement. They'd like to take down all the
tweets and posts of Trump supporters, but there's no way to do without
it being noticed. Google's bias can be hidden, but Twitter and
Facebook can't hide their bias so easily.
As far as the broadcast media are concerned, they're all in lockstep,
filtering the news, according to Brian Stelter's policy. They don't
do any actual reporting, but just say whatever Adam Schiff and Nanci
Pelosi tell them to say.
This includes the BBC, which gets a great deal of money from the
Democrats for broadcasting on NPR. The BBC are far left anyway, but
even if they wanted to, they couldn't go against what Adam Schiff
tells them to say anyway.
The good news, for anyone who wants to know what's going on in the
world, is Fox News, which is wiping out the mainstream media
competition. People are increasingly sick and tired of the crap
coming out of the mouths of the Bob Butlers and Brian Stelters of the
world, and want to know what's really going on, which is why they're
watching Fox News in increasing numbers, especially the evening
lineup, with Tucker Carlson, Sean Hannity and Laura Ingraham focusing
on the news that the mainstream media are suppressing.
-- Boycotted. Criticized. But Fox News Leads the Pack in Prime Time.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/09/business/media/fox-news-ratings.html
(NY Times, 9-Aug-2020)
-- Fox News finishes August as most-watched primetime network,
'Hannity' has best month ever
https://www.foxnews.com/media/fox-news-august-ratings-most-watched-primetime
(Fox News, 6-Sep-2020)
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - Bob Butler 54 - 09-06-2020
(09-06-2020, 11:16 AM)John J. Xenakis Wrote:(08-28-2020, 08:42 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: So if you have any evidence of any kind of fascist violence by the Boogaloo Bois that comes anywhere close to the massive multi-city fascist violence by antifa-blm, let me know. I'll take a look at it.
I specifically asked Butler to provide evidence of his accusations about the Boobaloo Bois, but he ignored that request. He provided no evidence but repeated the unsupported accusations. This is the way the left always works.
I don't believe Boogaloo Bois are into fascist violence. Marxist violence, sort of. Both the BB and classic marxists believe the capitalistic democratic system is broken beyond repair by means short of violence and worked / work towards revolution / boogaloo. However, marxism has an elaborate ideology where I have seen no evidence of BB ideology beyond stating their beliefs.
Many people consider the Boogaloo Bois right wing, but I consider them akin to marxists and thus maybe properly left. However, they are outside the usual red / blue divide. While the left - right language works well enough within the limits established under the assumption the system has not yet broken down beyond repair, it breaks down if you go beyond that point. I'm not sure the BB should be properly described as left or right.
Classic fascists, on the other hand, were political parties which for a time competed in elections as a step towards power. They become the state, the establishment. There was a reason the Nazi and the Communists disliked each other. I don't blame them, really. I don't much care for Nazi or Communists either. But the two are quite different, as the BB are quite different.
I am not particular an expert on your redefinition of fascist. It seems that 'fascist violence' is any violence you don't care for. You use 'fascist' like another cuss word, a sign of something dirty you don't care for. No real political meaning at all.
That being said, you might look over this bit from the Department of Justice.
The DOJ Wrote:“This case can only be understood as a disturbing example of the old adage, ‘The enemy of your enemy is your friend,’” said Assistant Attorney General John C. Demers for the National Security Division. “As alleged in the complaint, these defendants sought to use violence against the police, other government officials and government property as part of their desire to overthrow the government. While planning these activities, the defendants met individuals whom they believed to be members of the foreign terrorist group Hamas. Thinking that they shared the same desire to harm the United States, they sought to join forces and provide support, including in the form of weapons accessories, to Hamas. They failed. No matter what witch’s brew of ideological motivations inspire those who seek to engage in terrorist activity and harm our country and our fellow citizens, the National Security Division is committed to identifying and holding them accountable. I want to thank the agents, analysts, and prosecutors who are responsible for this case and ensuring that these defendants could not carry out their deadly plans.”
“Michael Solomon and Benjamin Teeter proclaim themselves to be members of the Boogaloo Bois, a group that espouses a violent ideology and an objective to overthrow the government. The defendants believed their anti-U.S. government views aligned with those of Hamas, a foreign terrorist organization, and actively developed plans to carry out violence in Minnesota and elsewhere,” said U.S. Attorney Erica H. MacDonald. “Whenever extremist ideologies, regardless of their roots, move into the realm of violence, the FBI and its Joint Terrorism Task Force stands at the ready to prevent potentially deadly and destructive plots.”
"The FBI is committed to stopping acts of violence against law enforcement officers or anyone else in our communities. According to the criminal complaint, the defendants in this case were willing to work with Hamas, a foreign terrorist organization, in order to get money for potential acts of violence here in the U.S.," said Jill Sanborn, Assistant Director of the FBI's Counterterrorism Division. "The FBI's Minneapolis Field Office demonstrated that we will continue working with our law enforcement partners to detect and stop such activity and protect public safety."
This is quite consistent with my understanding of the Boogaloo Bois, willing to use violence to overthrow the government, a desire to start the boogaloo, a specific case where they worked with traditional foreign enemies to achieve that end.
To some extent both they and Antifa have reasons not to proclaim their motivations openly. Both use violence. Both have run afoul of common terms of use of social media. Both have reasons to try to hide their immediate plans from law enforcement. (The above DoJ quote clearly illustrates why. If you do not keep your plans to yourself, there is a good chance the plans will fall into the hands of a government informer.) What one believes is not necessarily what everyone believes within such organizations. Individual groups can vary widely.
For example, the above example shows two members of a militia movement got arrested as armed felons. They represent many Trump supporters traveling to black neighborhoods to provoke and commit violence. While they call themselves militia, and as they are adult males of military age they actually are part of the militia, their beliefs are not that of all others who call themselves militia. (Edit: Or maybe not. As felons unable to legally carry arms, they may not be welcome as members of the true militia as defined by the US Code.). This does not mean all Trump supporters or 'militia' members are members of the Boogaloo Bois. I would not expect a Trump supporter to want to start a boogaloo against Trump. Is the DoJ going to arrest all males of military age as a result of those two men? I kind of doubt it. You can't assume the motives and actions of one group applies to a wide groups of others.
(09-06-2020, 11:16 AM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: I vaguely recall that Butler once referred to Brian Stelter as an "expert" at CNN.
I haven't made a study of Brian Stelter in particular. I have no desire to review particular journalists. I will comment on the 'how they all think' extended to 'how they all act' characterization you use. That is common for an ideologue. Smear them wholesale. If you cannot deal well with their real and oft stated motivations, make something up that makes them look bad. Me, if their real and oft stated motivations are more believable than the ideologues lies, I'll go with the stated motivations, especially if they are consistent with their actions. You have proven yourself so poor at understanding motivations that I have no reason to take any motivation you claim seriously. No one who lives outside your bubble will. You are not taken seriously for a reason.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - pbrower2a - 09-07-2020
(09-05-2020, 08:54 AM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: ** 03-Sep-2020 World View: Mental illness
John, you said,
Quote:> This man is certifiably crazy, and I really mean
> that. He's like a man who gets pleasure in beating the crap out of
> his own wife. The more destructive he is, the more satisfied he
> is. This isn't an "ideology." This is a severe mental
> illness.
Cool Breeze Wrote:> You should know from the Orthodox faith that what they suffer from
> is spiritual delusion and sickness of the highest magnitude. You
> need only see Mr. de Blasio (Warren Wilhelm Jr - his real name)
> family and his children to see just how sick his internal life is
> even ... and how that shows on the outside of his destructive and
> chaotic fascinations (demonic).
> He is not crazy. That absolves him. It is not the material that is
> his problem. It is the path he chose and the rejection of God that
> makes him and anything around him go even crazier.
The point I'm trying to make is that this has nothing to do with
ideology or religion.
Religion is about whether you go to church on Sunday. Ideology is
about whether you support a 22 or 28 percent tax rate. So when you
blame something on a man's ideology or religion, you're absolving him.
Everyone's entitled to their own ideology, so you can't blame him for
his ideology. Same with religion. Or, if the person's religion is
some "enemy" religion, whether Christianity or Islam, then you can
blame the actual religion, rather then the person. So the man is
absolved either way.
There is no ideology or religion that supports a man beating up his
wife, or lynching a black, or destroying a city, or destroying a
country, or committing genocide (unless you're at war). So these
crimes have nothing to do with either ideology or religion.
In the last twenty years two former clergy have been executed in the United States due to crimes associated with their beliefs. Paul Jennings Hill, a former Presbyterian minister, murdered an abortion provider in the alleged defense of unborn children was executed in Florida. Another, Jeffrey Lundgren, a self-proclaimed Mormon pastor (the well-recognized Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints does not recognize splinter group and especially not him, was executed in Ohio for killing some dissidents in his weird cult
Action in accordance with an interpretation of one's religious beliefs is not excusable in American law, especially if it results in murder.Anyone who kills in the name of his religion violates the tenets of his religion. Before someone brings up the Israeli government executing Adolf Eichmann, Eichmann was executed for homicidal crimes against Humanity, and that is no different from the Soviet Union killing Nazi perpetrators of mass murder during World War II.
Quote:Every day I see the worst of human behavior. I don't write about it
every day, but I see it every day. A politician destroying a city,
country or population, or torturing someone for saying the wrong
thing, or killing someone for no reason, and then defending it with
the usual crap that comes out of the mouths of politicians. I've
developed very strong negative feelings about the mental sickness of
humans, to the extent that I sometimes question my own sanity. This
is in the DNA, and is irrespective of religion or ideology.
Normal politicians -- or tyrants? I am well aware of the absurd things that people say in defense of a sick cause. It is not enough to believe that one serves a noble end, like winning heretics to Jesus, 'building (Marxist-Leninist) socialism', or 'freeing' the world from the Jewish 'plague'. I am fully satisfied that the Nazis generally thought (at times after going through mental contortions to convince themselves) that by exterminating the Jews they were doing a great service to Humanity. I remember reading an article in a history magazine that made clear that slave-owning planters saw themselves as benefactors to "their people" (in a literally-possessive sense, as if the slaves were property in the sense that a wagon is).
Quote:I do not agree that mental illness absolves someone of a crime. It's
true that "insanity" is a defense for some crimes, but that just means
that he's locked up in a mental institution instead of prison.
In practice, insanity defenses rarely work. Mental insufficiency might work as a mitigating factor with someone certifiably below the standard suited for a determination of mental inadequacy. This said, political leaders rarely have IQ's below 80. Insanity as a defense typically implies that one has no ability to discern reality because one cannot conform to rational norms. Even though being drunk or on psycho-active drugs may create some form of psychosis... well, one chose to get drunk or stoned, so that takes away any exculpation. Irresistible urge? One must then get oneself away from the possibility of doing something horrible, as in getting away from the person against whom one has an irresistible urge to do great bodily harm.
This said, the world has had horrible leaders who showed serious signs of mental illness. Perhaps some of them become crazy while rulers. Maintaining sanity when being in charge of a political apparatus that includes law enforcement, the military, and foreign policy... and the dominant or exclusive Party as well might cause someone who might be kept from doing monstrous things if not wielding absolute power. It is arguable that democracy ordinarily does far better by weeding out abnormal people following any failure at any level of politics, including the failure to maintain a solid grip on reality. Erratic behavior in public office or while running for public office is one way to prove that one is unfit not only for the role that one has (let us say Senator Joseph R. McCarthy or Sarah Palin).
History has shown plenty of examples of people who did not rise through the ranks as a leader who subsequently showed themselves unfit for high office once they got there. Ideally one gets to be President or Prime Minister after starting as a city councilman or county commissioner, then perhaps small-town mayor or some elected official (let us say alderman) in a larger city, followed by State Representative, State Senator, US Representative, US Senator/big-city mayor/State governor before going for the Big One. Occasionally we get someone who short-circuits that career path and gets elected after being a superb general (Dwight Eisenhower) who shows little sign of a desire to shake things up, and we get away with it. Donald Trump won people over on his alleged expertise in running a business. Still he had no voting record and no record of public statements. We know him all too well, but perhaps too late.
Getting into high power by being born a price and being elevated King, Caesar, Tsar, or Sultan is no guarantee of competence or sanity. Thus Nero, Caligula, Commodus, Ivan the Terrible, Henry VIII, and Wilhelm II. (Almost as bad is being weak-willed enough to fall under the influence of others due to poor judgment, as with Henry Pu-Yi). We have seen plenty of cases in which one Royal waged war against another for some slight that mattered only to the Royal offended. See also the two emperors-in-all-but-name of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, a self-description of a monstrous regime misnamed terribly except for locating itself in at least a part of Korea. But Kim il-Sung fits in a different category.
Achieving power, even if nominally dictatorial, through connivance with a foreign power (most infamously the arch-traitor Vidkun Quisling) almost invariably ends badly.
I would be suspicious of any leader who created his reputation first as a sports hero, actor, physician, writer, or businessman without having ever showed himself as suitable for public office. That makes a huge difference between Ronald Reagan and Donald Trump. See also Silvio Berlusconi.
Then come those who seize power in a coup (they owe nothing to anyone and give only to the rich-and-powerful). Josip Broz Tito, Agosto Pinochet and Idi Amurderin' seized power much the same way if with very different results but having murderous secret police to enforce their will. The worst are often Party Bosses who are heads of a party that stages a coup or makes a sordid deal to get power: Lenin, Mussolini, Stalin, Rakosi, Bierut, Ho Chi Minh, Fidel Castro, and of course Kim il-Sung.
Quote:So when the Nazis kill the Jews or when Maduro destroys Venezuela or
when Lori Lightfoot destroys Chicago or Ted Wheeler destroys Portland,
I'm not willing to attach a religion or ideology in any way, because
every religion and ideology is the same. To me, it's a mental
illness.
I do not deny that Maduro is a nasty dictator, and I would welcome his departure from office in Venezuela so that the country could rediscover democracy.. As for Mayors Wheeler and Lightfoot, mayors in America are not subordinates of the President. There is no prerogative for the President of the United States to take over a city whose leadership runs afoul of him or his Party. We have a federal system, and that ensures that there will be safe havens for dissidents. That's federalism and it allows some local responsibility. If things go really bad for the local authorities, then they can turn to State and in turn Federal authorities to solve some problems that overwhelm the resources of the local pols, as after a hurricane, tornado, earthquake, or volcanic eruption. Oddly, we have not had a former big-city mayor become President for a very long time. They Mayor of Los Angeles is responsible to far more people than the Governor of a small State (Bill Clinton, Arkansas).
I need say little more about Donald Trump. You well know what I think of him.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - Bob Butler 54 - 09-07-2020
(09-05-2020, 08:54 AM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: So when the Nazis kill the Jews or when Maduro destroys Venezuela or when Lori Lightfoot destroys Chicao or Ted Wheeler destroys Portland I'm not willing to attach a religion or ideology in any way, because every religion and ideology is the same. To me, it's a mental
illness.
Where as I have every human having pretty unique set of worldview and values, while some such sets have been formalized into ideologies. You can call yourself Nazi, Christian, Republican or many other things. Often the ideology you proclaim does reflect what you see and what your goals are.
It may be that if you are a Nazi, you actually do want living space and to kill Jews. It may be you are truly Christian and will love others as yourself. It could be you are Republican and are for huge division of wealth and using violence against people who are different. You are correct, having an ideology does not make you immune from judgement. Some worldviews, values and ideologies are contemptible. You are wrong and fail to understand that many humans do have worldviews, values and ideologies. You are just closing your eyes to the way things are.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - John J. Xenakis - 09-07-2020
** 07-Sep-2020 World View: Violent outcomes
(09-07-2020, 03:38 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: > It may be that if you are a Nazi, you actually do want living
> space and to kill Jews.
My point is that they all want the violent outcomes. The Nazis want
to kill the hated Jews,and Lori Lightfoot and Ted Wheeler and Bill
deBlasio want to see the homes and businesses of the hated Tea
Partiers and Trump supporters destroyed. De Blasio, in particular,
appears to me to be certifiably insane.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - Bob Butler 54 - 09-08-2020
(09-07-2020, 09:58 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote:(09-07-2020, 03:38 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: It may be that if you are a Nazi, you actually do want living space and to kill Jews.
My point is that they all want the violent outcomes. The Nazis want to kill the hated Jews,and Lori Lightfoot and Ted Wheeler and Bill deBlasio want to see the homes and businesses of the hated Tea Partiers and Trump supporters destroyed. De Blasio, in particular, appears to me to be certifiably insane.
I wouldn't say all. At a high level, you can see the difference. You can see the old hunter gatherer approach. Divide us and them, vilify them, and use violence to keep them in their place. Then there is the Information Age approach. Unify, allow non violent expression of the will of the people, and use legislation to implement what the people want.
Some ideologies are using the divisive approach. Trump is using a divisive approach. Minorities are them. You send escalating troops into black controlled areas to instigate violence. Trump supporters go in and instigate violence. The Boogaloo Bois are also attempting to start provoking violence. The racist violent cops use violence to keep minorities oppressed. I see this as much akin the the Nazi of the last crisis. You use violence to acquire living space while oppressing or killing the Jew or the Slav. The level of violence is different, and it is the blacks and Latinos that are the oppressed minorities, but it is much the same. The difference is between gas chambers full of minorities as opposed to one minority at a time, face to the asphalt, and a knee to the neck.
Biden and most blues are attempting to resolve the differences using non violence. Biden has explicitly denounced the violence, as have most blues. Now, the ideological difference between reds and blues is not universal. There are individual variations. On the whole. though, the blues would prefer the demonstrate and legislate approach. the reds the divide and use violence approach. Continued violence, oppression, destruction.
Now I am not one to say the last crisis is just like this one. Hitler is not Trump or vice versa. It is not difficult to tell the difference between the Nazi of the last crisis and the Republicans of today. But on the bottom line, the bad guys, the Nazi and the Republicans, are provoking violence and advocating racism. I would include the Trump's federal secret police, the Trump 'militia' supporters going into neighborhoods with paint ball guns and real guns, and the racist cops murdering people on whim due to skin pigmentation. The Boogaloo Bois attempting to start their boogaloo also are bad guys seeking division and violence, but they are not acting out of similar motives. The two arrested men calling themselves both Boogaloo Bois and militia do not quite bring the two violent factions seeking a violent resolution together.
The good guys at least today are bringing together and seeking to resolve things through legislation. This step doesn't seem to be advancing pending control of the senate and White House. Most try to save violence as a last resort. I'm not sure four more years of Trump would encourage patience by those trying to avoid violence. Last resorts are known to become the remaining resort. But we'll wait on the November election and the Trump reaction before guessing what will happen. It is a little early to count chickens or to guess which of Trump's options he will take, though not too early to consider what steps might become necessary.
So, where do you stand on this? Do you support continued racist violence and division as the Nazi did? You seem to be coming down on the hunter gatherer rather than Information Age side and determined not to understand the motives of the good guys. I suppose that is necessary if you are going to be a bad guy determined to advocate division, racism, oppression, violence.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - John J. Xenakis - 09-08-2020
** 08-Sep-2020 World View: China's plans for war
DaKardii Wrote:> Two articles on China that are MUST-reads:
> "Is Nazi China emerging?"
> http://www.indiandefencereview.com/spotlights/is-nazi-china-emerging/
> "Six Wars China Is Sure to Fight In the Next 50 Years"
> http://www.indiandefencereview.com/news/six-wars-china-is-sure-to-fight-in-the-next-50-years/
These articles are several years old, and that's important because
they show low long China has been actively preparing for war.
Guest Wrote:> Gordon Chang said on a TV interview on FOX that China is planning
> for a war NOW.
It's certainly possible. In just the last 24 hours:
- Relations between China and Australia reached a new low with
the expulsion of journalists.
- Gunshots have been fired for the first time in decades in the
Ladakh region along the border between China and India.
- Trump has announced that the US will "decouple" its economy from
China's, though it's not clear what that entails.
This doesn't necessarily mean war next week, but it could mean
war next year.
China is known to favor Biden over Trump in the election, and so,
either way, the election may be some sort of trigger point for the
Chinese.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - pbrower2a - 09-08-2020
(09-08-2020, 03:07 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:(09-07-2020, 09:58 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote:(09-07-2020, 03:38 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: It may be that if you are a Nazi, you actually do want living space and to kill Jews.
My point is that they all want the violent outcomes. The Nazis want to kill the hated Jews,and Lori Lightfoot and Ted Wheeler and Bill deBlasio want to see the homes and businesses of the hated Tea Partiers and Trump supporters destroyed. De Blasio, in particular, appears to me to be certifiably insane.
I wouldn't say all. At a high level, you can see the difference. You can see the old hunter gatherer approach. Divide us and them, vilify them, and use violence to keep them in their place. Then there is the Information Age approach. Unify, allow non violent expression of the will of the people, and use legislation to implement what the people want.
There were some brilliant, wise figures in the Agricultural Age and the early industrial age who chose to tolerate non-violent expressions of dissent and allow the political system to bend without breaking. It is telling that the American system was founded a few decades before the Industrial Revolution took off in America. Cause and effect are not obvious.
Quote:Some ideologies are using the divisive approach. Trump is using a divisive approach. Minorities are them. You send escalating troops into black controlled areas to instigate violence. Trump supporters go in and instigate violence. The Boogaloo Bois are also attempting to start provoking violence. The racist violent cops use violence to keep minorities oppressed. I see this as much akin the the Nazi of the last crisis. You use violence to acquire living space while oppressing or killing the Jew or the Slav. The level of violence is different, and it is the blacks and Latinos that are the oppressed minorities, but it is much the same. The difference is between gas chambers full of minorities as opposed to one minority at a time, face to the asphalt, and a knee to the neck.
If there is one reliable lesson from totalitarian movements it is not so much the ideological content but instead the warning "You're next!" Any degradation of human rights for one set of pariahs is a warning to everyone else. Nobility, then people of faith, then kulaks, then people with subtle differences from Stalin on policy. Violent crime is where the demonization rightly stops.
I see nothing particularly avant-garde about America's successful minorities in values or culture except as contributions to the mainstream. No identifiable ethnic or religious group offers 'cultural Bolshevism'; they all have very different traditions that each consider equally valid.
Quote:Biden and most blues are attempting to resolve the differences using non violence. Biden has explicitly denounced the violence, as have most blues. Now, the ideological difference between reds and blues is not universal. There are individual variations. On the whole. though, the blues would prefer the demonstrate and legislate approach. the reds the divide and use violence approach. Continued violence, oppression, destruction.
...and the ultimate futility of violence and criminality. The only defense from the eyes of a camcorder from exposure for wrongdoing is to avoid wrongdoing.
Quote:Now I am not one to say the last crisis is just like this one. Hitler is not Trump or vice versa. It is not difficult to tell the difference between the Nazi of the last crisis and the Republicans of today. But on the bottom line, the bad guys, the Nazi and the Republicans, are provoking violence and advocating racism. I would include the Trump's federal secret police, the Trump 'militia' supporters going into neighborhoods with paint ball guns and real guns, and the racist cops murdering people on whim due to skin pigmentation. The Boogaloo Bois attempting to start their boogaloo also are bad guys seeking division and violence, but they are not acting out of similar motives. The two arrested men calling themselves both Boogaloo Bois and militia do not quite bring the two violent factions seeking a violent resolution together.
Hitler seized absolute power in Germany because of a terribly-flawed political system, one that created a vacuum in the absence of the Kaiser. In 1918 the Kaiser fled and the Weimar Republic formed without any change in structure except to declare that there was no longer a Kaiser. Germany had been a federation of kingdoms. Maybe had it not been for the vindictive treatment of the German Republic (hey, democrats everywhere -- the Weimar Republic was no more militaristic than your victorious societies!) but everyone kissing up to the Antichrist incarnate once he asserted an aggressive nationalism there might have been no rise of Hitler. Maybe had the strong right-wing German Nationalist Party morphed into a responsible conservative party instead of becoming fascism-lite there might have been solutions other than to give some slimeball the power that the Kaiser had and then some.
America is not Weimar Germany, but I see the Republican Party acting irresponsibly, perhaps with a dissident wing recognizing that Donald Trump is an unmitigated disaster as a leader as well as a person. Note well, though, that Donald Trump exploited the irresponsible tendencies in the Right that many of us thought entirely of the past, like racism and religious bigotry and the tendency (not exclusive to the Right) to hold that rational thought is something to abandon should rationality become inconvenient.
Quote:The good guys at least today are bringing together and seeking to resolve things through legislation. This step doesn't seem to be advancing pending control of the senate and White House. Most try to save violence as a last resort. I'm not sure four more years of Trump would encourage patience by those trying to avoid violence. Last resorts are known to become the remaining resort. But we'll wait on the November election and the Trump reaction before guessing what will happen. It is a little early to count chickens or to guess which of Trump's options he will take, though not too early to consider what steps might become necessary.[/quote]
And such is essential for a successful resolution of much that has careened into a fraudulent dichotomy of anarchy and despotism. Trump gave us the whirlwind. We must divest ourselves of him the old-fashioned way, which means in a free election.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - John J. Xenakis - 09-08-2020
** 08-Sep-2020 World View: Excusing violence
(09-08-2020, 03:07 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: > So, where do you stand on this? Do you support continued racist
> violence and division as the Nazi did?
What are you talking about? If you think that I support racist
violence and division, then you are really screwed up.
You support and condone fascist antifa-blm thug violence, and you
seem to have applied some screwed up logic to conclude that therefore
I support and condone violence.
No, I do not support racist violence and division, and neither does
Donald Trump or William Barr or any Republican that I've heard. I
"stand against" such violence. Period.
You still haven't found any reports of violence by the Boogaloo Bois,
but if you did, then I would condemn it thoroughly, and the DOJ would
have the perpetrators in jail right away. In fact, I believe that the
DOJ has arrested hundreds of antifa-blm thugs in the last couple of
weeks for committing federal crimes.
All you've done with the Boogaloo Bois is point to a report that
they're advocating violent overthrow of the government. "Advocating"
is not the same as violence. Nutjobs like AOC, Bernie Sanders and
Kamala Harris are all advocating revolutionary violence. According to
your criteria, then all these Democrats are all terrorists, white
supremacists, black supremacists, fascists, and so forth.
There's a very good reason why all the violence is occurring in cities
run by Democrats. It's because Democrats are encouraging and excusing
it. It's because Democrats are saying: commit any crime you want, and
you won't be prosecuted. Commit any crime you want, and we'll call it
a summer of love. And if you do get arrested, we'll make sure you're
out on the street right away. So go ahead and burn down some
buildings, or have fun and rape some girls, or kill someone you don't
like. Boys will be boys.
But that kind of stuff doesn't happen in cities run by Republicans
(and, indeed, in most cities run by Democrats). That's because people
committing crimes in those cities are thrown in jail.
So you approve of, forgive, excuse and condone widespread violence by
fascist antifa-blm thugs. That does not mean that I approve of,
forgive, excuse or condone violence by any right-wing groups. Nor
does it mean that Donald Trump or William Barr approve, forgive,
excuse or condone violence by any right-wing groups. If you believe
otherwise, then you're totally delusional.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - Bob Butler 54 - 09-09-2020
(09-08-2020, 10:31 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote:(09-08-2020, 03:07 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: So, where do you stand on this? Do you support continued racist violence and division as the Nazi did?
What are you talking about? If you think that I support racist violence and division, then you are really screwed up.
In the last week or so, the great revelation among many media has been how Trump lacks military values. Roughy, these are honor, duty, sacrifice and loyalty to the country. They are not just weak in Trump, they are missing. He cannot understand or value an argument based on these values. They elude him. They seem stupid. Trump assumes those holding military values are idiots.
To some degree values are taught. If you believe Mary Trump, Trump's father just did not have these values, and thus did not teach them to the Donald. Trump could fake them. He could visit cemeteries a lot, salute snappily when leaving Marine One, etc…. But it is a little late for him to really absorb them. His spine will not automatically straighten at the sight of the flag. His hair will not stand on end when he sees a disabled veteran who has made a visible sacrifice. There is just a hole where the military values should be. They simply do not exist.
This is a flaw in a Republican politician. Oh, Democrats too. While it is a point of honor not to show too much partisanship in uniform, and while the Republicans since Mao won have been the strong on defense party, there are people both red and blue that consider the military values important to have.
But if they are not taught in your youth, they can be missing. If your family does not have a strong tradition of service, these values may be weaker, still there, but not as strong as among, say, the McCain family.
Now I have been into what I call the arrow of progress. This centers on another set of values: democracy, human rights, equality and justice. I associate these with the enlightenment. I will note that since the enlightenment the new values will generally triumph come the 4T heart.
But like the military values, they have to be taught. They can be missing. Many consider them necessary and appropriate, especially among the New England roundhead culture, those that live in the City on a Hill. If these values are missing, the person who has a hole where the values ought to be might be considered flawed. The family that doesn’t teach them to one’s children lacks something critical.
What happens if you try to turn them around? What is the arrow of stagnation? If the roundhead culture triumphs in the 4T, how would one follow an arrow pointing to the failed culture which is abandoned in the crisis and stomped on in the high?
Well, the opposite of favoring democracy is leaning towards autocracy. If you have a bunch of autocratic friends, want to become dictator for life too, and try to bypass the constitution’s checks and balances, that would be a clue.
The opposites of the other three - human rights, equality, and justice - seem to have a shared opposite in racism. People of a different skin pigmentation are not valued as highly. There is a separate justice system which oppresses minorities. Minorities endure violence and harsh treatment. Wealth is steered to a handful of people. Women are marginalized, treated as objects.
Authoritarianism and racism are values too. Like the military values, you have to be carefully taught* the cavalier values. You can be taught that America has always been for a white protestants. Boys will always be boys. The violence is always going to happen. Racism and elitism can be taught as values to the exclusion of democracy, human rights, equality and justice. The way things have always been is the way they will always be.
If you are a true Christian, and love thy neighbor, and you understand that the parable of the good Samaritan indicates everyone equally is your neighbor, your values are likely compatible with the arrow of progress. If you are an American, and your spine goes straight when you hear the words ‘all men are created equal’, and you understand all men should include minorities and women too, your values are apt to line up with the arrow of progress.
And I seem to be facing the opposite here. I am attempting to debate someone who just cannot comprehend the arrow of progress values. There is nothing there. Any argument that relies on those values will not only be disregarded. There is a hole were they ought to be. There will be a total inability to comprehend what I am talking about. If I hold highly these values I am considered stupid, an idiot. If you are ideologically blind, if you have ideological lack of certain values, you become unable to comprehend someone who holds these values.
On Earth Two, America was created of, by and for white protestants. The other races and religions are not equal. Things being otherwise is incomprehensible. Any argument that involves the arrow of progress values puts an intolerable stress on the Earth Two brain. The holder is unable to comprehend an argument based on those values.
I will address the various groups advocating violence in a separate post, but there seems to be enough ground covered for the moment.
* Gee. And I have already invoked Happy Talk from the same musical.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - Warren Dew - 09-10-2020
(09-09-2020, 12:38 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: In the last week or so, the great revelation among many media has been how Trump lacks military values.
It's hilarious that journalists that have no clue about anything military have managed to come up with a theory about it. Naturally, they have come up with a truly hare brained theory.
Here's a excellent article about Trump and military values, written by an actual veteran rather than a clueless journalist:
https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-came-dover-after-my-wife-was-killed-fighting-isis-ncna1239425
Contrast that with Obama's willingness to throw away military lives for policies driven by political correctness.
I'm sure you'll manage to be in denial about the whole thing, though. You probably won't even bother to read the link.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - Bob Butler 54 - 09-10-2020
(09-10-2020, 02:16 PM)Warren Dew Wrote:(09-09-2020, 12:38 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: In the last week or so, the great revelation among many media has been how Trump lacks military values.
It's hilarious that journalists that have no clue about anything military have managed to come up with a theory about it. Naturally, they have come up with a truly hare brained theory.
Here's a excellent article about Trump and military values, written by an actual veteran rather than a clueless journalist:
https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/trump-came-dover-after-my-wife-was-killed-fighting-isis-ncna1239425
Contrast that with Obama's willingness to throw away military lives for policies driven by political correctness.
I'm sure you'll manage to be in denial about the whole thing, though. You probably won't even bother to read the link.
It is one family member's opinion of a single incident. You can't call the opinion unanimous. You have found one dissenter. You have hardly swung the general reporting.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - John J. Xenakis - 09-10-2020
** 10-Sep-2020 World View: Vietnam book
Tom Mazanec" Wrote:> Why did you pick Vietnam? I would be interested in nations that
> might be important in America’s future. S&H did America itself,
> and you did Iran (where I suspect we could have a war) and China
> (our top adversary). But I see no war soon with Vietnam. Russia is
> a superpower and will be important, why not do them?
As I've mentioned in the past, there is a company that's interested in
investing in Vietnam and who are giving me a small amount of money to
write this book. It's a book on Vietnam in the same style as my books
on Iran and China. Assuming that I have time to finish, it will be
very, very nice to add one more book to my "Generational Theory Book
Series."
Vietnam is much harder to figure out and write about than either Iran
or China because there's no unique Vietnamese culture. Instead,
Vietnam is an amalgam of various warring cultures originating from
China and India. One example of how crazymaking it is to write about
Vietnam is the number of names that historians have for the country:
Van Lang, Au Lac, Nam Viet, Giao-Chi, Giao-Chau, Van Xuan, Dai Co
Viet, Dai Viet, Annam, Tonkin, Cochinchina, Viet Nam, Vietnam, and
others. I'm working from about 250 sources that I've collected, many
of them entire books, and you wouldn't recognize the same country from
one source to the next. They all use different names for Vietnam.
Like many countries in southeast Asia, Vietnam is totally unable to
govern itself. Its population has 54 ethnic groups that mostly hate
each other, many of whom would be only too happy to see some or all of
the others exterminated, if that were possible.
You say that Vietnam isn't important, but the opposite is true.
Because of its powerful geographic position, Vietnam is the guardian
of the South China Sea, and has been for millennia. Vietnam is
China's enemy, and is allied with India and Russia. It's quite
possible that there will soon be a "Naval Battle of the South China
Sea," and Vietnam will play a very important part in that. So we may
not be expecting a war with Vietnam as an enemy, but we may be in a
war with Vietnam as a very important ally.
There's also a very interesting bit of history relevant to today. In
the late 1700s, a group of rebels engineered a coup and set up a
Marxist Socialist society -- decades before Marx was born. Every
attempt at Socialism is always an economic disaster, and this was no
exception. They stole from the landowners and soon ran out of other
people's money, so they linked up with Chinese pirates who attacked
Chinese commercial vessels. They gave the pirates safe harbor in
Vietnamese ports, and markets to sell their booty. In short, for 30
years, they constructed a plunder-based political economy that relied
largely on Chinese pirates for military and financial support.
That's similar to what Bernie Sanders et al want to do today.
RE: Generational Dynamics World View - John J. Xenakis - 09-10-2020
** 10-Sep-2020 World View: China and Taiwan
Guest Wrote:> Chinese fighter jets buzz Taiwan for a second day as tensions rise
> https://www.reuters.com/article/us-taiwan-china-security/chinese-fighter-jets-buzz-taiwan-for-a-second-day-as-tensions-rise-idUSKBN2610HG
It was not so long ago that the official CCP position was that the
status quo should be maintained, and sooner or later the Taiwan
people would want to become part of China, because China is so
wonderful. The model, according to this fantasy, was Hong Kong and
the "one nation, two systems" arrangement.
That's now completely out the window. No one seriously believes that
the Taiwanese people will ever voluntary accept union with China.
For the CCP, that means that there's no choice: It will be necessary
to annex Taiwan through war. At this point, they may even have a day
already planned. And with China becoming visibly more belligerent and
nationalistic every day, that day may not be far off.
So Chinese jets buzzing Taiwan may just be to annoy the Taiwanese, or
it may be testing Taiwan's defenses in preparation for an imminent
war.