ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Printable Version +- Generational Theory Forum: The Fourth Turning Forum: A message board discussing generations and the Strauss Howe generational theory (http://generational-theory.com/forum) +-- Forum: Fourth Turning Forums (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-1.html) +--- Forum: Current Events (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-34.html) +---- Forum: General Political Discussion (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-15.html) +---- Thread: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma (/thread-637.html) |
RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Kinser79 - 03-15-2017 (03-15-2017, 01:16 PM)SomeGuy Wrote:Quote:Usually it is excuse making, but sometimes it isn't. Rape may not be funny, but watching leftists twist and turn over Islam is. Yeah I saw that. I thought "are these people stupid?" then I realized they were at a university and concluded "of course they are". What do you mean got dark? You trying to say something? *note: the last part is tongue in cheek. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - SomeGuy - 03-15-2017 Quote:What do you mean got dark? You trying to say something? Yes. I was trying to say that things got dark. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Kinser79 - 03-15-2017 Yeah happens. Its been warming up so I've been spending more time generating in the sun. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Mikebert - 03-15-2017 (03-15-2017, 01:16 PM)SomeGuy Wrote:Quote:Usually it is excuse making, but sometimes it isn't. Well that's what you were implying. Kinser was just going with the flow. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - SomeGuy - 03-15-2017 *whoosh* That's the sound of that exchange going right over your head. I have a response for you in the aggressive withdrawal thread. Are you done with that particular conversation, or have you just not noticed it? RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Ragnarök_62 - 03-15-2017 (03-15-2017, 04:19 AM)Galen Wrote: I remember the seventies and that was a decade I could have just as soon done without. The only thing Eric the Obtuse remembers about the sixties and seventies is that he had a good time but he is lacking the details due to all of the recreational pharmaceuticals. I rather liked the eighties and the nineties weren't too bad but you got the twenty-first century right. Galen, geeze I suppose you're not a Jonser then. Fuck , man. I'm a 1962 cohort who enjoyed the fuck out of recreational pharmaceuticals. So here's Rag's attitudes wrt decades. 1960's : Awesome, grade school Rags wore clover jewelry, like his peers. 1970's : Do Drugs. That was the message and yeah, it was really fun. 1980's : Do Career. : Do shit to make lots of $$$$$. Job/poker/ride the stock market escalator to the top: Yeah, I don't give a fuck the "Jefferson's were of "color", hell, I was movin' to the top in the 1980's/1990's. "nuf said, man. *Rags is of assorted races, so, fuck man. I guess I'm "of color" as well. 2000's: Fucking outsourcing fad started. You know, Galen, I'd love to fuck over the CEOL's and outsourcers. Taxes, burn at the stake, shoot with gun, etc. I hate CEO's and outsourcers with a pasion. 2010's. Fucking sucking green donkey dicks decade of shit/corporate Lords/CEO's need some lead. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Galen - 03-16-2017 (03-15-2017, 05:53 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:(03-15-2017, 04:19 AM)Galen Wrote: I remember the seventies and that was a decade I could have just as soon done without. The only thing Eric the Obtuse remembers about the sixties and seventies is that he had a good time but he is lacking the details due to all of the recreational pharmaceuticals. I rather liked the eighties and the nineties weren't too bad but you got the twenty-first century right. No, I am not since being 1965 vintage. By the time my contemporaries started using weed the seventies were winding down. My teenage years started while Carter was still president which was a real downer. I expect by that time you were zoned out like the Boomers so you may have missed that. Life was one big exercise in damage control around the nominal adults at the time. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Ragnarök_62 - 03-16-2017 (03-16-2017, 03:04 AM)Galen Wrote:(03-15-2017, 05:53 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:(03-15-2017, 04:19 AM)Galen Wrote: I remember the seventies and that was a decade I could have just as soon done without. The only thing Eric the Obtuse remembers about the sixties and seventies is that he had a good time but he is lacking the details due to all of the recreational pharmaceuticals. I rather liked the eighties and the nineties weren't too bad but you got the twenty-first century right. Well, that sux. Off by 1 year and all. But you are correct, I was zoned out period of time. A sound and all of that. So here's to the 1970's., man. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - The Wonkette - 03-16-2017 (03-15-2017, 12:45 PM)Kinser79 Wrote:Absolutely. I was just responding to the quote that I just bolded.(03-15-2017, 12:33 PM)The Wonkette Wrote:(03-11-2017, 09:39 AM)Galen Wrote: If people are not allowed to experience the consequences of their decisions then they will have no clue as to what is right or wrong.Yeah, but sometimes sh*t happens to people that they had no choice in and they still pay. Your employer goes bankrupt and there goes your job, you are healthy and eat nutritional food and exercise and figure you can ride it out without health insurance until you get a new job, but then you find that lump... RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Ragnarök_62 - 03-17-2017 (03-16-2017, 11:03 AM)X_4AD_84 Wrote:(03-15-2017, 05:53 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote: Galen, geeze I suppose you're not a Jonser then. Fuck , man. I'm a 1962 cohort who enjoyed the fuck out of recreational pharmaceuticals. So here's Rag's attitudes wrt decades. 1, Grade school: We did have some ciggie puffers out at recess. Yeah, I know that probably doesn't count, but there you have it. 2. Jr. High. Yeah, there were some folks who smelled like weed while boarding the bus to Jr. high. So yeah, burnouts or "heads" as we called them existed. The ciggie puffers were pretty common. There's a tunnel under the main drag between the 2 Jr. high buildings. Lot's of ciggie puffers there. 3. We're both talking about, as it pertains to substances, folks our age doing those, yes, in the 1970's. That's why I put it down. So, you're right, that's the mid to late 70's, which , again is why I put that decade down as "fun". 4. I'm pretty sure the clover and stuff got there due to my class mates having older siblings. That was quite common as well. 5. The 1960's. So, did you enjoy the 1960's ? I think most folks like being young kids. Young kids do tend to mimic assorted things in their environment. I'm sure there's stuff I picked up from my paternal cousins, who are all ... Boomers 6. There is Xer stuff as well. I left that out 'cause it's supposed to be self evident. Like I told Eric, I'm pretty pecuniary. You know anything to make a buck. That's not Boom, nor is what should be evident here is my distrust of authority. That came from Tricky Dick, you know. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Eric the Green - 03-17-2017 I'd say distrust of authority is also characteristic of Boomers; at any rate when they were younger. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Ragnarök_62 - 03-17-2017 (03-17-2017, 04:21 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: I'd say distrust of authority is also characteristic of Boomers; at any rate when they were younger. You're not helping my cause there. I guess a yen for noisy music may work? RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Eric the Green - 03-18-2017 (03-17-2017, 04:51 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:(03-17-2017, 04:21 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: I'd say distrust of authority is also characteristic of Boomers; at any rate when they were younger. Not sure what you mean. Now I'm opposing Trump. Anti-authority as you can get. Voted for Hill. Also anti-authority, because anti-Trump. Anti-authority is to go for quiet music. YMMV Eric RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Kinser79 - 03-18-2017 So voting for the moat status quo/business as usual presidential candidate in the last 50 years is now "anti-authority". The TDS is strong with Eric. So strong I may need a booster shot. But it does prove one thing conclusively, he has no idea who is and who is not the the Establishment. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Galen - 03-18-2017 (03-16-2017, 11:03 AM)X_4AD_84 Wrote:(03-15-2017, 05:53 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:(03-15-2017, 04:19 AM)Galen Wrote: I remember the seventies and that was a decade I could have just as soon done without. The only thing Eric the Obtuse remembers about the sixties and seventies is that he had a good time but he is lacking the details due to all of the recreational pharmaceuticals. I rather liked the eighties and the nineties weren't too bad but you got the twenty-first century right. I am not really surprised by this. Unlike most of Generation X he gets to participate in the tail end of the fun part but then gets to spend the rest of his life in the shitty parts the Boomers left behind. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Ragnarök_62 - 03-18-2017 (03-18-2017, 04:22 AM)Galen Wrote:(03-16-2017, 11:03 AM)X_4AD_84 Wrote:(03-15-2017, 05:53 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:(03-15-2017, 04:19 AM)Galen Wrote: I remember the seventies and that was a decade I could have just as soon done without. The only thing Eric the Obtuse remembers about the sixties and seventies is that he had a good time but he is lacking the details due to all of the recreational pharmaceuticals. I rather liked the eighties and the nineties weren't too bad but you got the twenty-first century right. ? Why would the 1980's/1990's be shitty. Like I said, those were the $/party/poker junket years. Can't complains. The only shitty stuff is the 4T. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Ragnarök_62 - 03-18-2017 (03-18-2017, 12:25 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:(03-17-2017, 04:51 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:(03-17-2017, 04:21 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: I'd say distrust of authority is also characteristic of Boomers; at any rate when they were younger. You stepped on my feeble attempt to get some X-cred, man. I suppose noisy music could be a domain for X? RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Galen - 03-19-2017 (03-18-2017, 06:24 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:(03-18-2017, 04:22 AM)Galen Wrote: I am not really surprised by this. Unlike most of Generation X he gets to participate in the tail end of the fun part but then gets to spend the rest of his life in the shitty parts the Boomers left behind. I had to try to make a living in those two decades and it wasn't all that easy for Xers of my vintage. Still, it beat the stagflation of thanks to the likes of Johnson and Nixon. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Bob Butler 54 - 03-19-2017 (03-18-2017, 04:22 AM)Galen Wrote: I am not really surprised by this. Unlike most of Generation X he gets to participate in the tail end of the fun part but then gets to spend the rest of his life in the shitty parts the Boomers left behind. Still not sure why everyone wants to blame the Boomers. There was a high to unravelling shift. We went from ideals and working together from the common good to a time of selfishness. We went from the government aggressively attempting to solve problems to regarding the government as the problem. The National Malaise hit all generations. Even the GIs, who were as gung ho a bunch as we've ever had, willing to bear any burden, pay any price, shifted into neutral. Yes, the Blue Boomers, after pushing for transforming changes in their youth, got disgusted by the politics of Nixon, Ford and Carter, and abandoned street protests for disco. The Xers? They didn't lose the fire, the drive. They never had it. The whole country shifted gears when the Unravelling started to unravel. It wasn't just one generation. RE: ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma - Bob Butler 54 - 03-19-2017 (03-18-2017, 02:02 AM)Kinser79 Wrote: So voting for the moat status quo/business as usual presidential candidate in the last 50 years is now "anti-authority". In the days and years following the September 11th attacks, conservatives on the old forum were pushing Bush 43 as the Grey Champion and suggesting that the regeneracy was well underway. He was pushing different values and foreign policy... Invading the Middle East was considered a good idea. I called it preemptive, unilateral, serial nation building. We built huge military and embassy complexes in our new puppet state of Iraq. There was a question of whether Syria or Iran was our next target. We used every boot on the ground we had, turning around National Guard forces as fast as we could refurbish and retrain. I have called this a false regeneracy. Since the Bush 43 era, we have come to see meddling in the Middle East as expensive and not constructive. We had a Pearl Harbor sort of trigger event that put the country in a militant mood. The government shifted policies to go with the shifted values. What they tried didn't work. We had for a time a united people willing to try new ideas, but the new ideas didn't work. From my perspective, we had a sorta half hearted crisis period, but the new values and policies flopped. We ended up stepping back into a 3T mood of stagnation and stalemate. So. Is Trump triggering a regeneracy? Have we a united people trying out new values, ideas, concepts that will transform the country?
A central abstract problem is that the unravelling values are unravelling values. Come a crisis, one is supposed to solve the most drastic problems facing the country. If one of the central memes of the unraveling values is that governments shouldn't solve problems, that one should cut taxes and cripple domestic problem solving efforts, you can't make the unraveling values stronger and end up with crisis values. Trump is pushing hard, but in a direction that simply can't result in a successful crisis resolution. |