(02-17-2021, 11:31 AM)beechnut79 Wrote:

(02-17-2021, 11:26 AM)David Horn Wrote: "You get what you pay for" is just as true today as ever.

Not in all cases. You can get a cut of steak for, say, $17 at a modest restaurant while that very same cut at a trendy location can set you back $30 or more.

(02-17-2021, 12:30 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: I think in many cases, people charge what they can get away with.

(02-19-2021, 05:51 PM)Einzige Wrote: And what you endorse is the slow death of the proletariat via class compromise and Keynesian masturbatory cope. You want "a bourgeoisie without a proletariat".

Voting for the Democratic Party is absolutely useless. There is a whole hidden history of anti-labor fuckery even from "progressive" Democrats - FDR, for example, deliberately placed all those Army bases constructed in the mid 30s in the South, the least labor friendly region of the country.

Quote:He also borrowed the rationale for Social Security from the Townsend Plan - that contented seniors would be unlikely to overturn the social order. Truman threatened to draft striking railroad workers. LBJ and the capitalist unions of the AFL-CIO supported 'Nam.

Quote:American liberals are garbage, not so much because they are compromises- they are not radical at all - but because their endorsed form of capitalism is more nefarious.You are useless to the working class. And in the event of revolution you and Classic X would set your differences aside and rally to the standard of the owning class.

(02-19-2021, 05:18 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: I have some heated arguments with "COVID-32" (get it?) and Einzige. Classic X'er endorses a plutocratic hierarchy having sharp tinges of racism and religious bigotry in which "useless" people by his criteria are cast out to suffer from exposure (freezing in an American winter in most of the country, heatstroke in the summer), and either street crime, drugs, or outright hunger at all times. The rest of American humanity, which one can presume is largely white, gets to enjoy either ostentatious indulgence if part of the economic elite or bare survival while being treated like livestock but knowing well enough to accept the abuse and degradation as charity. Because the elites metaphorically crack the whip people work hard enough and long enough with complete obedience to avoid starvation and homelessness. Food may be unpalatable and sparse; housing may be crowded slums ("twelve in  one room in A-may-REE-caw!"  But there is hope, if not for the juvenile delinquents unless they clean up their acts.   

Classic X'er is an economic sadist like the late Rush Limbaugh. Einzige is a Marxist fool.

(02-19-2021, 07:18 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Classic X'er sounds like the sort who would gladly take up a machine gun to mow down people that a fascist clique orders him to mow down.

(02-19-2021, 07:55 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: I won't be taking orders from a fascist clique like the Wokes.

(02-19-2021, 07:55 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-19-2021, 07:18 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Classic X'er sounds like the sort who would gladly take up a machine gun to mow down people that a fascist clique orders him to mow down.

I won't be taking orders from a fascist clique like the Wokes.

(02-19-2021, 08:45 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(02-19-2021, 07:55 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: I won't be taking orders from a fascist clique like the Wokes.

I spent a bit looking up a definition of 'woke' and came up with "alert to injustice in society, especially racism".  This is about as opposite as one can come to a 'racist clique', as fascists are generally in favor of racism and violence favoring their own supposedly superior group.  I guess this is typical.  You redefine words like 'American' and 'racist' to mean whatever you want them to mean. indicating by that very use or the common words in ways incompatible with how most people use them that you don't think like most people.  You worldview is badly skewed.

Why not redefine your usage of words like 'fascist' and 'woke' too?  Just make it more flagrant that you are out of touch?

(02-19-2021, 05:51 PM)Einzige Wrote: And what you endorse is the slow death of the proletariat via class compromise and Keynesian masturbatory cope. You want "a bourgeoisie without a proletariat".

Voting for the Democratic Party is absolutely useless. There is a whole hidden history of anti-labor fuckery even from "progressive" Democrats - FDR, for example, deliberately placed all those Army bases constructed in the mid 30s in the South, the least labor friendly region of the country. He also borrowed the rationale for Social Security from the Townsend Plan - that contented seniors would be unlikely to overturn the social order. Truman threatened to draft striking railroad workers. LBJ and the capitalist unions of the AFL-CIO supported 'Nam. American liberals are garbage, not so much because they are compromises- they are not radical at all - but because their endorsed form of capitalism is more nefarious.

You are useless to the working class. And in the event of revolution you and Classic X would set your differences aside and rally to the standard of the owning class.

(02-20-2021, 02:24 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-19-2021, 05:51 PM)Einzige Wrote: And what you endorse is the slow death of the proletariat via class compromise and Keynesian masturbatory cope. You want "a bourgeoisie without a proletariat".

Voting for the Democratic Party is absolutely useless. There is a whole hidden history of anti-labor fuckery even from "progressive" Democrats - FDR, for example, deliberately placed all those Army bases constructed in the mid 30s in the South, the least labor friendly region of the country. He also borrowed the rationale for Social Security from the Townsend Plan - that contented seniors would be unlikely to overturn the social order. Truman threatened to draft striking railroad workers. LBJ and the capitalist unions of the AFL-CIO supported 'Nam. American liberals are garbage, not so much because they are compromises- they are not radical at all - but because their endorsed form of capitalism is more nefarious.

You are useless to the working class. And in the event of revolution you and Classic X would set your differences aside and rally to the standard of the owning class.

Dude, I employed working class people for several years. Here's your problem, you have this silly notion in your head that this country is owned by a few when it's actually owned by millions of people these days. Right now, the Left is trying to flip the script and the America Right is well aware of of it. I hate to say it but 90% of what the Left is selling is bullshit that easily sold to half wits and idiots. The whole Yankee Republican vs Confederate Democrats ended around 160 years ago and the Democrats are still fighting it and trying to win. You and I see the same problem with the Democrats a long with everyone else who isn't a Democratic voter or a Biden voter these days. I wonder what the snowbirds who voted him think about all the new COVID problems that Biden's policies are creating for them now.

(02-20-2021, 02:24 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: Dude, I employed working class people for several years. Here's your problem, you have this silly notion in your head that this country is owned by a few when it's actually owned by millions of people these days. Right now, the Left is trying to flip the script and the America Right is well aware of of it. I hate to say it but 90% of what the Left is selling is bullshit that easily sold to half wits and idiots. The whole Yankee Republican vs Confederate Democrats ended around 160 years ago and the Democrats are still fighting it and trying to win. You and I see the same problem with the Democrats a long with everyone else who isn't a Democratic voter or a Biden voter these days. I wonder what the snowbirds who voted him think about all the new COVID problems that Biden's policies are creating for them now.

(02-20-2021, 05:01 AM)Einzige Wrote: The Democrats aren't eager to do shit except to continue to extend the rule of Capital - not "the rich" but Capital, which is a system ordering and governing all human capacity on Earth today.

(02-20-2021, 05:16 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(02-20-2021, 05:01 AM)Einzige Wrote: The Democrats aren't eager to do shit except to continue to extend the rule of Capital - not "the rich" but Capital, which is a system ordering and governing all human capacity on Earth today.

Is it telling that most people don't see the division of wealth as one of the crisis problems?  The economy is, and the division of wealth is part of it, but the key problem Marx saw is not considered that important now and the tool he saw as solving it is not seen as necessary.  The most severe problems faced by the culture are addressed in the crisis, and capitol is not among them.

I can see the division of wealth as being addressed in a future awakening or crisis, though likely through non violent means.  It is just that with the productivity increase, there isn't that much focus on it.

(02-20-2021, 05:21 AM)Einzige Wrote: Capital is the crisis.

Example: the Nazi regime was empowered to defend the capital interests of German industry from domestic revolution. Everything else flowed from this.  

All these little problems are compounds of this single much larger issue. And again, this isn't as vulgar as "spread the wealth" in the sense of seizing bank accounts. It is about eliminating generalized production for exchange altogether.