Presidential election, 2016 - Printable Version +- Generational Theory Forum: The Fourth Turning Forum: A message board discussing generations and the Strauss Howe generational theory (http://generational-theory.com/forum) +-- Forum: Fourth Turning Forums (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-1.html) +--- Forum: Current Events (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-34.html) +---- Forum: General Political Discussion (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-15.html) +---- Thread: Presidential election, 2016 (/thread-24.html) |
RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Warren Dew - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 06:06 AM)Galen Wrote:(11-12-2016, 04:05 AM)taramarie Wrote: My own thoughts I just want to add on to the last part. Once we are self aware of how we treat others negatively and our bias we can control it and choose a wiser tactic to approach those we are in disagreement with. And yet the police are never called in, because libertarians don't behave that way. Nonaggression principle and all that. Even the Westboro folks, while deplorable by almost anyone's definition, are nonviolent. Imagine if both sides protested nonviolently and cleaned up after themselves! RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Eric the Green - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 06:06 AM)Galen Wrote:(11-12-2016, 04:05 AM)taramarie Wrote: My own thoughts I just want to add on to the last part. Once we are self aware of how we treat others negatively and our bias we can control it and choose a wiser tactic to approach those we are in disagreement with. Ha ha. The police just shoot the blacks with impunity and ask questions later. Now that Trump is in office, you'll have your repression. He promised you guys that. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Kinser79 - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 02:45 PM)taramarie Wrote:(11-12-2016, 10:01 AM)Odin Wrote:(11-11-2016, 10:21 PM)taramarie Wrote: All you have to do in some cases is just show any sign you are not totally with the group and bam SEXIST RACIST DEPLORABLE! That is why I have mentioned there is some tribalism going on. Well it seem that the left has finally bit Odin in the ass. I suppose his autism doesn't trump his white maleness. That said, they may be a minority but they are a vocal minority and is separating the traditional base from the left. As for cultural right wingers pushing their religion onto others, that is largely a boomer phenomenon and is dying out. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Eric the Green - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 10:01 AM)Odin Wrote:(11-11-2016, 10:21 PM)taramarie Wrote: All you have to do in some cases is just show any sign you are not totally with the group and bam SEXIST RACIST DEPLORABLE! That is why I have mentioned there is some tribalism going on. Under Trump, look for more and more SJW types to get more militant, and repression in response. Personally I don't see why these racists should not have been expelled, but I am not close to what happened so I don't know. Being banned from boards for expressing opinions is just more authoritarian nonsense; but look for this to increase under Trump. What those racist students did was far beyond expressing opinions. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Kinser79 - 11-12-2016 I garuntee that if a black woman was locking out a white male room mate and posted about it on line no one would have said anything about racism. The simple fact of the matter is that all the authoritarianism is coming from one side of the divide these days. I've said before that the SJWs are the neo-puritans. That is exactly what they act like. This of course leaves the right free to scoop up all the cultural libertarians, which is the norm for Americans. As for more militancy from the SJW types, I hope they increase it. Their protests, rioting and tantrum throwing are proving to one and all that voting in Trump was the right course of action. As for Eric-the-ignoramus' predictions, he has a habit of being consistently wrong (probably because he's clueless) so take what he says, assume the opposite happens and you'll be safe 90% of the time. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - playwrite - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 03:44 PM)Kinser79 Wrote: I garuntee that if a black woman was locking out a white male room mate and posted about it on line no one would have said anything about racism. The simple fact of the matter is that all the authoritarianism is coming from one side of the divide these days. I've said before that the SJWs are the neo-puritans. That is exactly what they act like. This of course leaves the right free to scoop up all the cultural libertarians, which is the norm for Americans. The militancy? What, did they take over a federal bird scantury somewhere? Did they march into a local Starbucks or Homedepot with their A15s locked and loaded? Did they stand outside polling areas with loaded pistols on their hip harrassing voters as to who they planned to vote for? Militancy? As to predictions; even Ann Coulter. has it almost figured out - Last time the GOP held the White House and both Houses of Congress was in 1928 (Ann got that) and 2003-08 (Ann missed that). With one, we got the Great Depression; and the other, we got the Great Recession. You see a pattern? I at least thought you were as intelligent as Coulter. Dissappointing. Dont' fear though; if we can muddle through, the pattern has the Dems coming in and saving the day. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - playwrite - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 03:26 PM)taramarie Wrote:(11-12-2016, 03:19 PM)Kinser79 Wrote:(11-12-2016, 02:45 PM)taramarie Wrote:(11-12-2016, 10:01 AM)Odin Wrote:(11-11-2016, 10:21 PM)taramarie Wrote: All you have to do in some cases is just show any sign you are not totally with the group and bam SEXIST RACIST DEPLORABLE! That is why I have mentioned there is some tribalism going on. Wonderful, more scantimonious drivel from the otherside of the planet from someone who wears their progressivism on their sleeve. Lecturing people in other countries over the Internet while not lifting a finger to do anything in their own backyard - it must be exhausting. Good to see you're back at it, must of been the crumbcakes and spot of tea. Maybe don't sit so long next time; its been shown to make not only one's ass a bit fluffy but a tad self-indulgent on their confessed saintliness. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Webmaster - 11-12-2016 Just a reminder everyone is welcome to post here regardless of where they live people who aren't Americans have a right to comment on American policies. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Bob Butler 54 - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 04:31 PM)taramarie Wrote: It does amaze me that the older folk on this forum are the ones who are acting like children. The older folk! Hmm... Would it be childish to step in at this point and ask how your policy of being nice is doing? RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Kinser79 - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 04:05 PM)playwrite Wrote: The militancy? What, did they take over a federal bird scantury somewhere? Did they march into a local Starbucks or Homedepot with their A15s locked and loaded? Did they stand outside polling areas with loaded pistols on their hip harrassing voters as to who they planned to vote for? It seems that the News is not approved DNC propaganda or have you missed the rioting across the country in Blue Cities. The Dems have had 8 years to fix the Great Recession it is still going on....perhaps if the DNC had allowed the other GC to run they would have won. But we'll never know now. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Classic-Xer - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 11:14 AM)playwrite Wrote:You got your butts kicked because you didn't listen to him or take him serious. I would expect a Manhattan millionaire to have a better feel and more intelligence than the lowly businessman who predicted a landslide victory. Do you want to know when I knew she was done? I didn't see many stupid college kids. I saw lots of grubby workers with dirty hands who took time out to vote for their candidate. You think they're deplorable. Me, I have respect for them. If the zombie apocalypse comes, I hope your peasants don't break out the guillotines like the French revolution.(11-12-2016, 12:38 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(11-11-2016, 10:49 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:(11-11-2016, 10:24 PM)taramarie Wrote:(11-11-2016, 09:56 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: I'd agree with Odin. It's only the racisst and sexists that are being called racist and sexist. However, the racists and sexists seem to be seeing things in "you are with us or against us" mode. If one calls a racist a racist, they somehow perceive this as all whites being called racists. This is just an illustration of how an extreme partisan world view can carry one entirely clear of reality.That would also apply to some of those folk who label too. Depends if the person really is sexist etc but as i have said it is not productive to call them that. Does not fix the issue. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Odin - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 04:31 PM)taramarie Wrote: It does amaze me that the older folk on this forum are the ones who are acting like children. The older folk! The lunatics (Boomers and Xers) are running the asylum... RE: Presidential election, 2016 - pbrower2a - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 08:06 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(11-12-2016, 11:14 AM)playwrite Wrote:You got your butts kicked because you didn't listen to him or take him serious. I would expect a Manhattan millionaire to have a better feel and more intelligence than the lowly businessman who predicted a landslide victory. Do you want to know when I knew she was done? I didn't see many stupid college kids. I saw lots of grubby workers with dirty hands who took time out to vote for their candidate. You think they're deplorable. Me, I have respect for them. If the zombie apocalypse comes, I hope your peasants don't break out the guillotines like the French revolution.(11-12-2016, 12:38 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(11-11-2016, 10:49 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:(11-11-2016, 10:24 PM)taramarie Wrote: That would also apply to some of those folk who label too. Depends if the person really is sexist etc but as i have said it is not productive to call them that. Does not fix the issue. Many of us found him impossible to listen to. Now we will hear his lying mouth all the time, ordering us to suffer on behalf of people who believe that the common man exists only too serve those elites. Oh, yes, America will be great -- in palaces and castles for economic elites who might, at the end of this nightmare, be haled before firing squads of revolutionary justice as in Russia in 1918 and 1919. Having made liberals politically irrelevant, Donald Trump and his buddies have practically assured that the opposition will become increasingly radicalized and violent. But don't worry; they're taking names and you must might be seen as a quisling to the working class for your posts here. The Republic established in 1766 is now dead. The Evil Empire is born. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Odin - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 03:44 PM)Kinser79 Wrote: I garuntee that if a black woman was locking out a white male room mate and posted about it on line no one would have said anything about racism. The simple fact of the matter is that all the authoritarianism is coming from one side of the divide these days. I've said before that the SJWs are the neo-puritans. That is exactly what they act like. This of course leaves the right free to scoop up all the cultural libertarians, which is the norm for Americans. I know a bunch of working class Trump supporters and not a single one is angry about "SJWs", and I doubt any of them have even heard of the term. You Alt-Righters are the mirror image of the "SJWs", obsessed with identity issues that are mostly meaningless to blue collar heartland folk whose main concern is jobs. They voted for Trump because they are desperate and Trump promised them their jobs back. It's all BS of course, automation means that those jobs aren't coming back, but desperate people are easy prey for demagogues. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Bob Butler 54 - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 07:49 PM)taramarie Wrote:(11-12-2016, 07:40 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:(11-12-2016, 04:31 PM)taramarie Wrote: It does amaze me that the older folk on this forum are the ones who are acting like children. The older folk! Idealism might not be the ideal weapon. If your values conflict with their values, if their way of thinking suggests that anyone with values that conflict with theirs is stupid, evil, insane or otherwise mentally incapable, using values and idealism as your weapon will only make you seem stupid, evil, insane or otherwise mentally incapable in their eyes. Logic and fact might be a better approach, but extreme partisans are often immune to logic and fact. You have to be very clear, firm, persistent and even then not expect them to see or hear what they don't feel like seeing or hearing. Of late, I have been attacking the stereotypes. If I'm accused of hating vegetables, I'll have to insist that I'm not against all vegetables, but I don't care for asparagus or broccoli, with a caveat that for some people asparagus and broccoli are fine and that I respect asparagus and broccoli eaters. Extreme partisans often think in stereotypes. They have simple and vile notions of how people who don't agree with them think. When they go into childish attack mode, they often haven't really listened to or comprehended the point that you might have been making. In their minds, they will have morphed you into one of their vile stereotypes and will be attacking the vile stereotype rather than you. If they are misrepresenting your values -- and they often will be, they see their stereotype of you, not you -- you might make your values clearer. "I do not hate white people. I hate bigots and advocate equality and respect." Don't expect them to listen the first few hundred times you clarify your values. Many extreme partisans are incapable of listening, can see only their vile stereotypes. They cannot interact with real people, only with their stereotypes. If possible, when they are attacking one of their vile stereotypes, recognize that they aren't really attacking you. If by their nature they are incapable of understanding, acknowledging or respecting who you are and what you stand for, how much is their opinion really worth? Approximately zero? Zilch? Less? If their thinking through stereotypes is childish, is letting their childish tantrums hurt your feelings childish as well? If they cannot defend themselves through logic, fact and ideals, if their defense mechanism is switching to 'childish' personal attacks and insults, is it possible not to be drawn down to their level? "When they go low..." Anyway, everyone has to find their own approach to dealing with the extreme partisans. What works for me might not feel right for you. But to me you do seem sensitive to attacks and criticism, and tend to throw fits in response. You tend to get prickly and indigent easily and often. If you want to play nice, to have serious issue related conversations, you might want to watch that tendency. If someone is losing at the values and fact level, and wants to pivot, to move away from values and fact, they can easily prod you into exchange of personal attacks mode. You are more than a tad sensitive. You might consider watching that. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Bob Butler 54 - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 09:00 PM)taramarie Wrote: First and foremost my choice now is to ignore those comments. I did not retort back to him. I instead warned him that I had reported him and will do so again if it is particularly nasty. Call it a new strategy. Life is too short for that nonsense when one just behaves in that manner. Good call, though ignoring a problem does not make the problem go away. Extreme partisanship is a good sized part of the problem. Unchecked, the extreme partisans will flood the board with hate and absurdity. I find I can't leave them an entirely clear field. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Eric the Green - 11-12-2016 The National Popular Vote Compact: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Eric the Green - 11-12-2016 The request by the moderator was to talk about issues, not each other. I have reported one post here that violates this request. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Eric the Green - 11-12-2016 (11-12-2016, 08:38 PM)Odin Wrote: The lunatics (Boomers and Xers) are running the asylum... Do you think when millennials and homelanders "take over" things will be better? I have my doubts. Boomers' own hopes for this in the sixties have been dashed, by the Boomers themselves and the Xers. Things never seem to change in this country; the process of change stopped in 1980 and has not resumed. The USA is sclerotic and shows no sign of changing. I have predicted that this would finally change in the 2020s. Now, it would be a mammoth, wholesale and 180-degree change, as of Tuesday. So, good luck to the USA. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Webmaster - 11-12-2016 If you aren't listening to another poster or have them on your ignore list it would bet better to do it without announcing it. |