Presidential election, 2016 - Printable Version +- Generational Theory Forum: The Fourth Turning Forum: A message board discussing generations and the Strauss Howe generational theory (http://generational-theory.com/forum) +-- Forum: Fourth Turning Forums (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-1.html) +--- Forum: Current Events (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-34.html) +---- Forum: General Political Discussion (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-15.html) +---- Thread: Presidential election, 2016 (/thread-24.html) |
RE: Presidential election, 2016 - SomeGuy - 01-16-2017 Quote:I don't know of many farmers (Republican voters) who still rely on people (manual labor) to harvest their crops (wheat, corn, soybeans, potatoes, so on). It's more of a thing with fruit/vegetable crops than it is staples. Strawberries in particular still use a lot of stoop labor. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - David Horn - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 12:37 PM)SomeGuy Wrote:(01-16-2017, 12:31 PM)David Horn Wrote:(01-15-2017, 10:41 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: ... You just reread American Nations or something? Odin and I have had this conversation in the past. My upbringing was similar, albeit not in the upper Midwest. At Christmas, we still had young teenage girls running around with candles in their hair. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Warren Dew - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 12:27 PM)David Horn Wrote:(01-15-2017, 04:45 PM)Warren Dew Wrote:(01-15-2017, 02:34 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Does anyone want Soviet-style internal passports? That is what it would take to fully thwart illegal residence. Yes. You've never been stopped by a policeman who asked to see your license and registration? Quote:Warren Dew Wrote:(01-15-2017, 03:19 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: E-verify would no more be a sign of incipient fascism/Stalinism/general "bad"-ism as is the fact that I have to show a valid ID to check into a motel. PTB? RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Warren Dew - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 12:16 PM)David Horn Wrote:(01-15-2017, 01:06 PM)SomeGuy Wrote:My money is on the farmers, who are overwhelmingly Republican these days. Can't get the <insert fruit or vegetable> picked? Scream about lack of access to farm labor.(01-15-2017, 11:16 AM)David Horn Wrote: I'm going with "useful tool", but it may prove a very different tool than the proponents expect. If e-verify stands between our fresh food and immigration policy, I'm betting on food. The farmers in question - produce, not grain - have already lost. They are going to be killed by the new California minimum wage law. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - SomeGuy - 01-16-2017 Dave, Quote:Odin and I have had this conversation in the past. My upbringing was similar, albeit not in the upper Midwest. At Christmas, we still had young teenage girls running around with candles in their hair. How is this relevant? I am not asking him about his comments on Scandinavian-American culture, but his specific, repeated references to Woodard in this and other threads. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - SomeGuy - 01-16-2017 Warren, PTB = Powers that be RE: Presidential election, 2016 - David Horn - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 12:49 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(01-16-2017, 12:16 PM)David Horn Wrote:I don't know of many farmers (Republican voters) who still rely on people (manual labor) to harvest their crops (wheat, corn, soybeans, potatoes, so on).(01-15-2017, 01:06 PM)SomeGuy Wrote:My money is on the farmers, who are overwhelmingly Republican these days. Can't get the <insert fruit or vegetable> picked? Scream about lack of access to farm labor.(01-15-2017, 11:16 AM)David Horn Wrote: I'm going with "useful tool", but it may prove a very different tool than the proponents expect. If e-verify stands between our fresh food and immigration policy, I'm betting on food. That may be true for row crops. Most fruits and truck vegetables still need attending. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - David Horn - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 03:21 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Dave, You are SO literal! Chill! RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Warren Dew - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 03:22 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Warren, Thanks. In that case, I agree with David that the data the government collects has immense potential for abuse, but that's already true. I still don't see E-verify as changing the present situation much. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Eric the Green - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 08:55 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:(01-16-2017, 07:38 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: Immigration today just seems an excuse by Trump, Sessions and other such demagogues to use in order to get votes through creating fear. It has no real bearing on the fortunes of our country or the people. That's true. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - David Horn - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 03:16 PM)Warren Dew Wrote:(01-16-2017, 12:16 PM)David Horn Wrote: My money is on the farmers, who are overwhelmingly Republican these days. Can't get the <insert fruit or vegetable> picked? Scream about lack of access to farm labor. We'll see. Similar predictions have proven hollow in other industries. Of course the owners want to pay less, but that doesn't make it allowing it mandatory. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - SomeGuy - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 04:10 PM)David Horn Wrote:(01-16-2017, 03:21 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Dave, I wasn't even talking to you about this! Chill yourself! RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Ragnarök_62 - 01-16-2017 (01-16-2017, 04:09 PM)David Horn Wrote:(01-16-2017, 12:49 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(01-16-2017, 12:16 PM)David Horn Wrote:I don't know of many farmers (Republican voters) who still rely on people (manual labor) to harvest their crops (wheat, corn, soybeans, potatoes, so on).(01-15-2017, 01:06 PM)SomeGuy Wrote:My money is on the farmers, who are overwhelmingly Republican these days. Can't get the <insert fruit or vegetable> picked? Scream about lack of access to farm labor.(01-15-2017, 11:16 AM)David Horn Wrote: I'm going with "useful tool", but it may prove a very different tool than the proponents expect. If e-verify stands between our fresh food and immigration policy, I'm betting on food. Uh, not anymore! https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Fruit-picking-machine_60587915328.html?s=p http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2013/07/14/robot-farming/ http://strawberryplants.org/2010/10/strawberry-picking-robot/ There's now no excuse for not using E-verify. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - SomeGuy - 01-16-2017 Right? That's clearly a Chinese machine. I want to see its papers first. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Bob Butler 54 - 01-18-2017 I'm watching PBS's Frontline Episode, The Divided States of America. It seems a good review of Obama's time, how his early attempts at unity came to naught, but instead fueled the revolt of the Republican base and extreme partisanship. It's a decent review of how we got where we are. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Odin - 01-18-2017 (01-16-2017, 08:55 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:(01-16-2017, 07:38 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: Immigration today just seems an excuse by Trump, Sessions and other such demagogues to use in order to get votes through creating fear. It has no real bearing on the fortunes of our country or the people. A big problem is that no US citizen or resident alien trying to become a citizen is going to be a fruit or veggie picker for a wage low enough for the market to bear. Hell, a lot of people wouldn't do the job period, because it sucks. We could expand the number of migrant workers allowed in, but the Right doesn't like that. A few years ago there was a big crackdown on illegal immigrants in (IIRC) Alabama and it lead to crops rotting in the fields. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Odin - 01-18-2017 (01-16-2017, 12:31 PM)David Horn Wrote:(01-15-2017, 10:41 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: ... You just reread American Nations or something? It's what I was taught in Minnesota History in school. The Scandinavians and New Englanders generally got along well, but those groups tended to annoy the Germans, especially the German Catholics. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - SomeGuy - 01-18-2017 (01-18-2017, 08:30 AM)Odin Wrote:(01-16-2017, 08:55 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:(01-16-2017, 07:38 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: Immigration today just seems an excuse by Trump, Sessions and other such demagogues to use in order to get votes through creating fear. It has no real bearing on the fortunes of our country or the people. Exactly, Odin, think of the poor strawberries! RE: Presidential election, 2016 - Anthony '58 - 01-18-2017 The strawberries will do just fine: Convicts from nearby prisons will pick them. RE: Presidential election, 2016 - SomeGuy - 01-18-2017 (01-18-2017, 11:36 AM)Anthony Wrote: The strawberries will do just fine: Convicts from nearby prisons will pick them. Problem solved: Lock them up! |