(06-13-2020, 09:31 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: > I am a bit amused by the crisis war predictions. China will make
> war with India, Tiawan, the Philippines, the US, Japan, Hong Kong,
> China.... Anyone else?

(06-06-2020, 01:06 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(06-06-2020, 12:39 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: "A black man’s death was blamed on democrat cops in a democrat city with a democrat police chief and a democrat mayor in a democrat state with a democrat governor. Then democrats got together and burned democrat cities. The democrat mayors and police chiefs allowed black businesses and neighborhoods to burn. Black people died in the riots."

It's all Trump's fault.

There is a reason the people are looking to the Democrats to change the violence and racism of the police.  Changing the culture is not easy.  The mass protests are necessary if you are going to get a cultural reboot.

Trump?  It is not directly his fault.  He did encourage racism for his personal gain.  He did change the atmosphere to encourage the open display of racism.  It might have effected things but there is no direct link.  It is not acceptable to a lot of people.  I assume you watch the news?

More of a concern is that he would rather intensify the violence than listen to the people.  That is more an after the event reaction.  I believe it will hurt him in November.

You know, I believe the resurgence of racism and its open display was in answer to Obama.  Trump was one enabling factor.  On the other hand, the current wave of protests is a response to the resurgence of racism.   You go to one extreme and you swing to the other…. Then you swing back and then some.

The racist resurgence went against the arrow of progress.  In particular, it goes against equality.  In the long run, I anticipated that equality would continue long term gains.  I confess, I didn’t anticipate the American push for all men being equal under law coming this hard and this soon.  Still, there it is.

(06-14-2020, 12:05 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: Which culture needs to be changed, the fucked up blue culture that we've seen several times  and know exists that people like you tend to ignore and often dismiss and claim as minor or blame on us or blame on a couple of groups that you associate with us or the police  culture that don't pay enough that you expect to deal with their shit and deal with liberal shit and deal with petty liberal politicians trying to make names for themselves every fucking day. Like I've said, we're going to have cops and will probably be adding more cops as blue cities are cutting funds and losing cops like crazy.

• Covid-19 cases in Pakistan

(06-14-2020, 08:57 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(06-14-2020, 12:05 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: Which culture needs to be changed, the fucked up blue culture that we've seen several times  and know exists that people like you tend to ignore and often dismiss and claim as minor or blame on us or blame on a couple of groups that you associate with us or the police  culture that don't pay enough that you expect to deal with their shit and deal with liberal shit and deal with petty liberal politicians trying to make names for themselves every fucking day. Like I've said, we're going to have cops and will probably be adding more cops as blue cities are cutting funds and losing cops like crazy.

The American culture needs to be changed.

One of the features of this case was all sorts of video sowing the murderer cops altering the crime scene.  The taser was moved next to the body in order to show false evidence of a threat.  Shell casings showing weapons fire were picked up.  In general that shows an awareness of guilt.  If they believed it was a clean shoot, they would have wanted evidence to prove it.  Instead, lots of video showing evidence tampering was generated.  They were no more truthful than Fox News or Trump.

The Democrats have not tackled the racist cops.  The people are leaving them little choice.  The reds whining that the culture depends on racism to keep the {expletive deleted} in line has persisted.  That mood has shifted.  The militancy of the police unions has been challenged.  The people are looking for justice and equality.  These are American virtues, long expected, long not delivered.

The current red alliance is between racists, elites, and small government believers.  I see the Tea Party and Black Lives Matter targeting two of the three.  Thus far, the two movements have been successful.  What is left is a hedonistic blindness to the Scientific evidence that the virus is targeting.  The reds can push killing people in their own greed, and the results will show in November.

After the Revolution, the die hard royalists moved to Canada.  After the Civil War, the slaveowners turned to KKK terrorist violence and Jim Crow.  After World War II, McCarthy tried to push his personal standing by targeting good people who happened to believe the Great Depression had proven the combination of Capitalism and Democracy hadn’t worked very well.

The slave compromises give the conservatives the upper hand for much of the turnings.  This is overturned in spades in the crisis heart and lately in the awakening.  Naturally, the conservatives will whine and cry and fight for the old values.  Naturally, the culture moves on.  The culture’s greatest faults are attacked.  Problems are addressed.  The history books are written.  The conservative old values are dumped on.

If you are so eager to stand with the racists, to threaten violence, to claim justice and equality are not called for, so be it.

(06-14-2020, 12:05 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(06-06-2020, 01:06 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(06-06-2020, 12:39 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: "A black man’s death was blamed on democrat cops in a democrat city with a democrat police chief and a democrat mayor in a democrat state with a democrat governor. Then democrats got together and burned democrat cities. The democrat mayors and police chiefs allowed black businesses and neighborhoods to burn. Black people died in the riots."

It's all Trump's fault.

There is a reason the people are looking to the Democrats to change the violence and racism of the police.  Changing the culture is not easy.  The mass protests are necessary if you are going to get a cultural reboot.

Trump?  It is not directly his fault.  He did encourage racism for his personal gain.  He did change the atmosphere to encourage the open display of racism.  It might have effected things but there is no direct link.  It is not acceptable to a lot of people.  I assume you watch the news?

More of a concern is that he would rather intensify the violence than listen to the people.  That is more an after the event reaction.  I believe it will hurt him in November.

You know, I believe the resurgence of racism and its open display was in answer to Obama.  Trump was one enabling factor.  On the other hand, the current wave of protests is a response to the resurgence of racism.   You go to one extreme and you swing to the other…. Then you swing back and then some.

The racist resurgence went against the arrow of progress.  In particular, it goes against equality.  In the long run, I anticipated that equality would continue long term gains.  I confess, I didn’t anticipate the American push for all men being equal under law coming this hard and this soon.  Still, there it is.

Which culture needs to be changed, the fucked up blue culture that we've seen several times  and know exists that people like you tend to ignore and often dismiss and claim as minor or blame on us or blame on a couple of groups that you associate with us or the police  culture that don't pay enough that you expect to deal with their shit and deal with liberal shit and deal with petty liberal politicians trying to make names for themselves every fucking day. Like I've said, we're going to have cops and will probably be adding more cops as blue cities are cutting funds and losing cops like crazy.

(06-14-2020, 12:49 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: > America has no monolithic "blue" culture. "Blue culture" includes
> much diversity in class, ethnicity, and religion. That "Blue"
> America is itself so diverse reflects the weakness of "Red"
> culture. Start with music: "Red" America surely listens to much
> more country music than the rest of America. Country music may be
> honest in expression of realities of personal life in much of
> America, but it seems to be rather light on intellectual content
> and musical innovation.

> We "Blue" Americans are, if white, decidedly better educated than
> the rest of America. If Asian, much better educated. To be sure
> there are some ill-educated blacks and Hispanics, but the black
> bourgeoisie and middle-class Hispanics recognize the poor in their
> own ethnic group as people to uplift. Middle-class white people of
> "Red" America seem not to do much for poor white people in the
> Mountain and Deep South.

> I do not have a problem with relatively-conservative parts of
> "Red" America getting "Blue" results with limited resources. Maybe
> we in "Blue" America could pick up some pointers. On the other
> hand, some very "Red" areas are very poor.

Higgenbotham Wrote:> I think I understand your (and Vince's) view on the Depression.
> That view is regardless of what the Fed did between the late 1990s
> and now, there will be a Depression and its magnitude will be
> approximately the same, but it will just occur later. Is that
> right? If the target for the ultimate low in the Dow was some
> percentage of the trend line, it remains approximately the same
> percentage of the trend line regardless of how long it takes for
> the Depression to materialize or by what manner and how long the
> Fed holds it off.

Higgenbotham Wrote:> I also remember a discussion a few years ago where you said that
> the longer the Dow is above the mean reversion line (what I
> referred to above as the trend line), the longer it would stay
> below the mean reversion line in the future in order to balance
> out the area above and below.

Quote:> "So one way or another, we're gonna see lots of
> additional cases.

> Will reopening [end lockdowns] increase the number of cases? It
> should, and in some states it's substantially increasing, but in
> some states it's been dropping. We don't understand why.

> We're not driving this tiger - we're riding it. we're going to
> go from 5% of the population affected with all the pain, death,
> suffering and economic disruption that's occurred today. Trust
> me, we have a long ways to go to get to that 60 or 70% of people
> infected, unless we get a vaccine in time. How we're gonna get
> there is still unclear.

> My greatest concern is if cases did start to disappear across the
> country, suggesting that we're in a "trough," meaning a true wave
> change. We may have several months of few cases. That would
> suggest it could be like influenza, and come back with a very
> significant second wave late in the fall. ...

> The important thing is that we're not planning for the fact that
> we're going to see a very substantial part of the country becoming
> infected over the next 12-18 months, if we don't have a vaccine.
> We will never be blue and red again. We'll be covid
> colored."

(06-14-2020, 07:36 PM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: So let me be clear.  You live in the CNN bubble, among people who have absolutely no idea what's going on, but sit there are tell each other how clever and intelligent you are, and how the people outside are stupid racist white supremacists.  I listen to all the channels, so I know.  CNN is a sewer, and being in the CNN bubble means that most Trump supporters are far more intelligent than you.

(06-14-2020, 12:49 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: America has no monolithic "blue" culture. "Blue culture" includes much diversity in class, ethnicity, and religion. That "Blue" America is itself so diverse reflects the weakness of "Red" culture. Start with music: "Red" America surely listens to much more country music than the rest of America. Country music may be honest in expression of realities of personal life in much of America, but it seems to be rather light on intellectual content and musical innovation. 

We "Blue" Americans are, if white, decidedly better educated than the rest of America. If Asian, much better educated. To be sure there are some ill-educated blacks and Hispanics, but the black bourgeoisie and middle-class Hispanics recognize the poor in their own ethnic group as people to uplift. Middle-class white people of "Red" America seem not to do much for poor white people in the Mountain and Deep South.

I do not have a problem with relatively-conservative parts of "Red" America getting "Blue" results with limited resources. Maybe we in "Blue" America could pick up some pointers. On the other hand, some very "Red" areas are very poor.

(06-16-2020, 01:24 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(06-14-2020, 12:49 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: America has no monolithic "blue" culture. "Blue culture" includes much diversity in class, ethnicity, and religion. That "Blue" America is itself so diverse reflects the weakness of "Red" culture. Start with music: "Red" America surely listens to much more country music than the rest of America. Country music may be honest in expression of realities of personal life in much of America, but it seems to be rather light on intellectual content and musical innovation. 

We "Blue" Americans are, if white, decidedly better educated than the rest of America. If Asian, much better educated. To be sure there are some ill-educated blacks and Hispanics, but the black bourgeoisie and middle-class Hispanics recognize the poor in their own ethnic group as people to uplift. Middle-class white people of "Red" America seem not to do much for poor white people in the Mountain and Deep South.

I do not have a problem with relatively-conservative parts of "Red" America getting "Blue" results with limited resources. Maybe we in "Blue" America could pick up some pointers. On the other hand, some very "Red" areas are very poor.

Are you really better educated than me overall? Are the blues really better educated than the reds overall? I don't think so myself. I mean that's what really counts and determines outcomes these days. I mean, look at you. You're living proof that education alone does not determine outcomes and the way you write and what you write about and the side you support proves it too. You have an economics degree. Me, I've just been in business for almost thirty years and I've just worked with thousands of people. I've  been through shit and dealt with shit  that you couldn't handle or financially survive. I've been in situations with people  that you couldn't manage or emotionally  handle either. I've made decisions that you wouldn't have the balls or the heart to make either. Your economic degree means squat to me.

(06-16-2020, 09:10 AM)John J. Xenakis Wrote: Pbrower's issues have nothing to do with education.  He already knows that his education isn't worth shit.

His problem is his vitriolic hatred of 63 million Tea Partiers and Trump supporters, the same kind of hatred that Hutus had towards Tutsis, or that Nazis had toward Jews.  He's said as much many times, and he's even sometimes used the same kinds of words that Hitler used.

The problem with CNN is not simply that it's biased.  CNN is a sewer that specifically caters to the kind of hatred that pbrower exhibits.  CNN is even contrasted to MS-NBC, which is backed up by a real news department at NBC News that keeps the editorial content under control.

(06-16-2020, 09:01 AM)Tim Randal Walker Wrote: Many college degrees, in practice, don't lead to high paying careers.  It means that one is well educated in terms of book learning,  but not necessarily in the practical skills ones needs for success outside of school.

I think that the emphasis on college is a hold over from an earlier time, when relatively few went.  Having a college degree might have seemed special at one time because they were scarce.

I recall an article I read once, probably at least ten years ago, that argued that many people would be better off if they went into some form of job training right out of high school.