Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - Printable Version +- Generational Theory Forum: The Fourth Turning Forum: A message board discussing generations and the Strauss Howe generational theory (http://generational-theory.com/forum) +-- Forum: Fourth Turning Forums (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-1.html) +--- Forum: Current Events (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-34.html) +---- Forum: General Political Discussion (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-15.html) +---- Thread: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability (/thread-620.html) |
RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - Classic-Xer - 02-23-2021 (02-22-2021, 10:59 AM)> David Horn Wrote:A proletarian revolution would hurt the Democratic side much more than the Republican side (the American right). I don't know, the proletariat seemed to have plenty of time on its hands last summer since it was able to continue battling with police pretty much non stop for several months. You must not have seen all the violence (the proletarian revolution of sorts) and all the damage that occurred last summer that went on for several months all over the country. Is it your political bias that's causing a problem with your inability to see/acknowledge what we saw last summer or is it your eye sight, hearing or your memory associated with your age that's failing you? As far I could tell, you were able to see and you were fully aware of it as it was going on back then.(02-22-2021, 02:27 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(02-22-2021, 01:02 AM)Einzige Wrote: I love the assumption, coming from well-to-do (relatively speaking) members of the American labor aristocracy as populate this board, that a proletarian revolution would be immiserating. You should know by now that we're either going to fight to the bitter end or split the country and force the Democrats to make the same mistake as the British/Confederates/Imperialist Japanese did and trigger an all out war with all Americans. Like I said, the American right doesn't represent slavery or a monarchy/aristocracy or fascism/communism or a particular religious faith or any other form of a dictatorship. The Democrats do today. As I told Bob, the country isn't the same country as it was during our grandparents time. The country has more American believers today than it had back then. All the Democratic groups are doing now is setting themselves up for defeat/slaughter when America sets rule aside and takes its gloves off. The American right represents American freedom, the American Constitution, the American flag, American values and core principles and the American way of life like it always has throughout American history. I don't care who wins a war between fascist Democrats ( the Woke's) and socialist Democrats (the urban social justice crowd/third world mentalities). If we're separated, we'll defeat which ever group wins or if we're not, we'll destroy both of them at the same time during a Civil War war. What's a dead billionaire or a dead heir of some billionaire of the past worth? RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - Classic-Xer - 02-23-2021 (02-23-2021, 12:44 AM)Einzige Wrote:Well, both sides are capitalist and both are in cahoots that way. You're the twit who hasn't come to grips with the fact that you were born in a capitalist country. You quit before you started, whose fault is that? I wasn't born with a silver spoon in my mouth but that didn't stop me from learning a skill and making a decent living and accumulating wealth. I didn't have someone misguiding me and telling me stupid shit or teaching me that I'm inferior and I'll never make it without them. So, who fucked up you? Did someone like Eric indoctrinate you and fuck you up? Lots of that going on these days with the internet being the way that it is these days.(02-23-2021, 12:15 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(02-22-2021, 02:48 AM)Einzige Wrote:We know there's a group of Republicans who are in cahoots with the Democrats (5 Senators, 10 Congress people). We refer to them as half Republicans or Rhino's these days. We've known about them for many years now. They're about as spineless and wishy washy and eager to please/bow down to the media and corporations/donor class as the Democrats these days.(02-22-2021, 02:27 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(02-22-2021, 01:02 AM)Einzige Wrote: I love the assumption, coming from well-to-do (relatively apeaking) members of the American labor aristocracy as populate this board, that a proletarian revolution would be immiserating. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - pbrower2a - 02-23-2021 (02-23-2021, 12:44 AM)Einzige Wrote:(02-23-2021, 12:15 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(02-22-2021, 02:48 AM)Einzige Wrote:We know there's a group of Republicans who are in cahoots with the Democrats (5 Senators, 10 Congress people). We refer to them as half Republicans or Rhino's these days. We've known about them for many years now. They're about as spineless and wishy washy and eager to please/bow down to the media and corporations/donor class as the Democrats these days.(02-22-2021, 02:27 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(02-22-2021, 01:02 AM)Einzige Wrote: I love the assumption, coming from well-to-do (relatively apeaking) members of the American labor aristocracy as populate this board, that a proletarian revolution would be immiserating. Political life at its best is transactional: that one gives up something to get something. It requires people to contemplate that the Other Side of some sectarian, regional, interethnic, or interclass rift is legitimate. When that breaks down one gets at first gridlock, and perhaps (if nothing resolves itself) a command-and-control system. Marxism depends upon the assumption that the economic elites operate as a monolith without conflicts between urban and rural elites, between ownership and management, and between the blatant money-grubbers and the creative people. When the economic elites are all joined in purpose, then Marx' depiction of capitalist society fits well. When Marxism describes the economic and political order well, that order has decayed into a nightmare. The ultimate expression of identity politics is the class struggle. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - David Horn - 02-23-2021 (02-23-2021, 12:44 AM)Einzige Wrote: No, you twit - they're all in cahoots with each other. If all the politicians are on the other side of the line, then it's unlikely your side of the line will ever win. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - Bob Butler 54 - 02-23-2021 (02-23-2021, 01:58 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: A proletarian revolution would hurt the Democratic side much more than the Republican side (the American right). I don't know, the proletariat seemed to have plenty of time on its hands last summer since it was able to continue battling with police pretty much non stop for several months. You must not have seen all the violence (the proletarian revolution of sorts) and all the damage that occurred last summer that went on for several months all over the country. Is it your political bias that's causing a problem with your inability to see/acknowledge what we saw last summer or is it your eye sight, hearing or your memory associated with your age that's failing you? As far I could tell, you were able to see and you were fully aware of it as it was going on back then. The Confederates were the cavalier, rural, racist faction. They lost. They have contributed heavily to the US in many ways, but when they confront the roundhead, urban, principled culture head on they lose. The red support the Constitution, the flag, many of the values and core principles, but they take exception to solving the problems confronting the culture, most notably racism. Conservatives want to keep the current structure unchanged, which is why the don't want to solve problems that can only be solved by changing that structure. They are on the do nothing side on all the current crisis level problems. That is why they have lost in the past, and why I anticipate the conservative values will fail again given the crisis mind set. In the crisis heart, the focused disciplined objective is to solve the crisis problems. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - Eric the Green - 02-23-2021 (02-23-2021, 12:15 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(02-22-2021, 02:48 AM)Einzige Wrote:We know there's a group of Republicans who are in cahoots with the Democrats (5 Senators, 10 Congress people). We refer to them as half Republicans or Rhino's these days. We've known about them for many years now. They're about as spineless and wishy washy and eager to please/bow down to the media and corporations/donor class as the Democrats these days.(02-22-2021, 02:27 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(02-22-2021, 01:02 AM)Einzige Wrote: I love the assumption, coming from well-to-do (relatively apeaking) members of the American labor aristocracy as populate this board, that a proletarian revolution would be immiserating. The 7 Republicans senators and 10 congresspeople who voted to convict Trump are actual Republicans. The rest are just Trump loyalists. You and other Trump loyalists are simply the Party of Trump, now. It is a cult of personality only. When he goes, it will go, and the Republicans will just go back to being the Republicans again-- wrong as before on all the policy issues, but at least no longer hypnotized by one man who does not respect law, democracy or decency. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - pbrower2a - 06-14-2021 (posted in the wrong forum, so it is deleted) RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - Eric the Green - 07-01-2021 Under Abraham Lincoln, you wrote that Trump gets a #1 rating. I don't really agree with these historian evaluations, especially because they rate one of the worst presidents, Reagan, as one of the best. I guess they are trying to be ideologically neutral, but I suggest that in the long run, a president with a wrong and destructive ideology is a bad president, even though Reagan was "successful" in imposing this wrong ideology and distorted and destructive "vision" upon us. Of course Reagan also rates highly in my horoscope scoring of candidates. He has an awesome persuasive ability, which got him elected. Trump doesn't do too badly by this measure either. But I don't see how Trump can be rated as anywhere but as #44. And I disagree with the new high rating of Eisenhower. The mistakes you mentioned brower help sink him in my estimation. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - pbrower2a - 07-02-2021 (07-01-2021, 06:13 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Under Abraham Lincoln, you wrote that Trump gets a #1 rating. Correction made here. I'm sure that plenty of people think Donald Trump "up there" with Washington, Lincoln, and FDR (Egad!).. I see him as the worst President in American history, differing from Buchanan in inadequacy only that Buchanan did not get away with it. Buchanan might have been a fine president twenty to thirty years earlier... but by the late 1850's he was way past prime. Donald Trump was never adequately prepared for the President, nothing about his life grooming him for the greatest responsibility in American life. I fault Eisenhower on two issues of foreign policy -- Jacobo Arbenz, who would have made Guatemala a much different country than what it became. Ike was under pressure from the United Fruit Company that wanted to keep Guatemala as its complete fief. United Fruit succeeded, and the Guatemalan people have paid a high price... which includes the reality that many Guatemalans have sought refuge in America from civil strife relating to economic entities far worse than United Fruit (drug cartels) ever was. The other is Mohammed Mossadegh in Iran. Shah Reza Pahlavi II had a love-hate relationship with America as a puppet for over twenty years . Look at how that turned out! Perfect knowledge of the future is not available even with astrology. Modified post: Quote:C-Span just released a poll by historians of how Trump rates against other Presidents. Of the 44 Presidents that we have had (Cleveland counted as one) Trump gets an overall rank of #41, reflecting assessments of being Donald Trump is the Nero of American Presidents. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - pbrower2a - 07-02-2021 ARIZONA: It's mostly a favorability poll, so I can use it solely for calibration. Governor Doug Ducey ® 47-49 on favorability President Joe Biden (D) 49-48 on favorability former President Donald Trump ® 46-51 on favorability US Senator Mark Kelly (D) 48-41 on favorability US Senator Kyrsten Sinema (D) 50-37 on favorability ...Arizona could be the equivalent in 2020 of Virginia in 2008 in partisan tendency. https://www.politico.com/f/?id=0000017a-53b6-d92f-a1fe-d3f62f8b0000 Do you support or not support the audit of the ballots in Maricopa County? 46% support (37% strongly) 49% oppose (42% strongly) Thinking about future elections in Arizona, if a candidate for elected office in Arizona supported this Maricopa County audit, would you be more or less likely to vote for that candidate? 37% more likely, 46% less likely If the election for President of the United States were held again today and the candidates were – Joe Biden and Donald Trump, whom would you vote for? 51% Biden, 44% Trump ...relevant because Maricopa County is the focus of the hack audit of the vote for President. It is unpopular in Arizona. I know, I know, I know... Trump supporters are often convinced that there is no way in which Trump could have lost in view of how wonderful he was (and according to them still should be) as President. Like much of America, Arizona is highly polarized in its partisan allegiance. Demographics are the difference between Arizona in 2016 and 2020; with the demographics of 2016, Trump would have won the Grand Canyon State. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - Eric the Green - 07-02-2021 Another problem about Reagan that historians overlook now is the extraordinary corruption in his pro-business and anti-regulation administration. Along with several other Republican presidents, far more of Reagan's associates were indicted or convicted of crimes than under Democrats and more-honest Republicans. One scandal after another happened among his cabinet officials and departments. Reagan was very hands off, and that's how the EPA and the Pentagon and Labor Departments had scandal and how Iran-Contra happened. Historians tend to forget what an outrage his whole Iran and Nicaragua policies were and how he allowed Poindexter and Oliver North to get away with their misdeeds. The chart below was made during rather than after the Trump administration so his figures by now are even higher. Here's a more updated one: Quote:Donald Trump is the Nero of American Presidents. Some say in fact Trump IS Nero reincarnate. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - pbrower2a - 09-30-2021 Donald Trump, the Law and Order President. Not! #32 in public persuasion #41 in crisis leadership #34 in economic management #44 in moral leadership #43 in international relations #44 in administrative skills #42 in relations with Congress #36 in vision and setting an agenda #40 in pursuing equal justice for all #42 in context for the times. With all the corruption he was creating pointless crises. Trump is to integrity in government what Bill Cosby was to ethical dating or Bernie Madoff in fiscal probity. Mobsters have their own strange way of keeping people in line, but those ill fit the Fortune 500 businesses. Equal justice for all? Trump likely turns up better than those Presidents who promoted or appeased slavery. "Criminal justice" usually means the suppression of crime, and not seeking breaks for well-connected criminals. The Chicago Machine wanted Barack Obama out of Chicago and indeed Illinois, and certainly not in federal prosecution or a federal judgeship in Illinois. Can you imagine facing Obama as a prosecutorial adversary or a judge hearing one's corruption case? He would have been a monster. Obama is the classic exponent of "do the crime, do the time". He was not generous with pardons. RE: Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability - pbrower2a - 10-08-2021 OK, the man for whom the Presidency was defined, and who defined what it means to be President: GEORGE WASHINGTON #4 in public persuasion #2 in crisis leadership #2 in economic management #2 in moral leadership #2 in international relations #2 in administrative skills #1 in relations with Congress #2 in vision and setting an agenda #14 in pursuing equal justice for all #2 in context for the times Of course he owned slaves... but several other Presidents did, too. That was normal for anyone from the South who had any economic status. Otherwise #1, #2, and #4. AS I see it the only way in which Trump can be redeemed is if he redeems himself or if some acolyte compels America to become like his dream -- and a nightmare for everyone not part of the well-connected or those exempt due to extreme wealth, talent, or skill from having to meet the reality of a market. ...and how about the President who saved America from a scenario similar to that in The Man in the High Castle? FRANKLIN DELANO ROOSEVELT #1 in public persuasion #3 in crisis leadership #3 in economic management #1 in moral leadership #1 in international relations #3 in administrative skills #3 in relations with Congress #3 in vision and setting an agenda #9 in pursuing equal justice for all #3 in context for the times Need I say more about the Second Lincoln in the Civil War of modern industrial civilization? |