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Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - Printable Version +- Generational Theory Forum: The Fourth Turning Forum: A message board discussing generations and the Strauss Howe generational theory (http://generational-theory.com/forum) +-- Forum: Fourth Turning Forums (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-1.html) +--- Forum: Current Events (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-34.html) +---- Forum: Economics (http://generational-theory.com/forum/forum-12.html) +---- Thread: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies (/thread-68.html) |
Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - Odin - 05-13-2016 Link Quote:magine an economy without bosses. It’s not a utopian vision but a growing daily reality for many enterprises. A close analysis of the performance of worker-owned cooperative firms—companies in which workers share in management and ownership—shows that, compared to standard top-down firms, co-ops can be a viable, even superior way of doing business. We have a strong Socialist tradition of worker co-ops here in the upper-midwest, and so I thought this was an interesting article. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - Kinser79 - 05-13-2016 Not surprising. If the workers themselves own and manage the company they are naturally more productive. Each has a direct stake in the profits of the company. Furthermore, they have no interest in offshoring their own job/profit-generation-machine. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - TnT - 05-13-2016 Seems to me there's a disconnect here ... If co-ops are inherently more productive, then why have the MBAs not turned all companies into co-ops? Clearly, everyone would make more money if it were true. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - Kinser79 - 05-13-2016 (05-13-2016, 06:58 PM)TnT Wrote: Seems to me there's a disconnect here ... The answer is rather simple. In a Co-Op situation the profits generated are shared out amongst the workers, in a traditional corporate setting the profits are split up amongst management. Therefore it is not in the interests of Mr. MBA to have a co-op as he'd get a smaller slice of the pie because he has to split it with the plebs. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - Galen - 05-14-2016 (05-13-2016, 07:21 PM)Kinser79 Wrote: The answer is rather simple. In a Co-Op situation the profits generated are shared out amongst the workers, in a traditional corporate setting the profits are split up amongst management. Therefore it is not in the interests of Mr. MBA to have a co-op as he'd get a smaller slice of the pie because he has to split it with the plebs. I have heard of this but I am not certain how well this would scale since virtually every company I know has management. Only a few companies have every done this so it is hard to tell what the limits really are. It does suggest that the modern regulatory state is necessary since the assumption that everyone is evil clearly is not true. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - Kinser79 - 05-14-2016 I would argue that the problem with the argument "A regulatory state is necessary because people are evil" runs into a problem with the statement that people are evil. I would say that persons who truly are evil are incredibly rare. Most people, the vast majority (we're talking >95% here), are neither evil nor good, they operate however on the principle of their own self-interest and in the interests of their in-group. Interestingly, in a co-op situation, the company itself creates an in-group. I do know that in Japan it is seen that the corporation is seen as having an in-group responsibility to its employees to provide them with decent pay and the ability to retire comfortably. Establishing an in-group relationship, and in turn employees are expected to work as hard as possible to make the corporation as profitable as possible. Where regulation comes into play is between these in-groups and the public at large. I would argue in large part where the US lost its way was in the ideology that businesses should operate solely in the interests of its owners (share holders) and that is the end all be all of the social responsibility. This makes companies in general, and corporations in particular, sociopathic and destructive to the largest in-group possible the nation. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - TnT - 05-14-2016 YOUR answer is rather simple, but in fact, if an enterprise is inherently more profitable and more efficient as a co-op, it would out-compete the traditional corporate organization. It could underprice and out-service the traditional organization. Profits are not the only feature that makes an enterprise competitive. In fact, I would argue that a profits-only perspective tends to generate bad customer service and cheap crap product. You would think that in a co-op, the collective desire to provide good service, make good product, out-compete competitors, and thereby guarantee one's livelihood, would ultimately lead to a business society of co-ops. Of course, I'm not a believer that co-ops ARE more efficent or more productive, but that's another story. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - Odin - 05-14-2016 (05-14-2016, 03:14 PM)Kinser79 Wrote: I would argue that the problem with the argument "A regulatory state is necessary because people are evil" runs into a problem with the statement that people are evil. I would say that persons who truly are evil are incredibly rare. Most people, the vast majority (we're talking >95% here), are neither evil nor good, they operate however on the principle of their own self-interest and in the interests of their in-group. FWIW my workplace does a good job keeping us happy with donuts every Monday morning, pizza on the last Friday of the month, and a Thanksgiving dinner on the day before Thanksgiving. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - Kinser79 - 05-14-2016 (05-14-2016, 03:57 PM)Odin Wrote: FWIW my workplace does a good job keeping us happy with donuts every Monday morning, pizza on the last Friday of the month, and a Thanksgiving dinner on the day before Thanksgiving. Your workplace is a rarity. Most places I've worked for this was not the case, and where it did happen it was largely the result of management digging into their own pocket. I happen to know having just paid, out of my own pocket no less, for a "pizza party" for scoring 100% on an inspection from corporate (my boss actually hates that I do this, but then again my store has the most profit, most product turn over and the highest morale so she usually leaves me alone). And doesn't even get into how I came in very late to insure that my overnight people didn't get the nasty pizzas nobody wanted. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - Bronco80 - 05-14-2016 (05-14-2016, 03:14 PM)Kinser79 Wrote: I would argue in large part where the US lost its way was in the ideology that businesses should operate solely in the interests of its owners (share holders) and that is the end all be all of the social responsibility. This makes companies in general, and corporations in particular, sociopathic and destructive to the largest in-group possible the nation. Recently, I've taken it upon myself to explain to certain friends just how perverse the concept of shareholding is. It essentially consists of a group of people who have absolutely nothing to do with the operations of the firm, yet they are allowed to reap a portion of the revenue generated by the firm on the sole basis of being recognized by firm bylaws and government enforcement as an "owner" of the firm. Here in Boise we have a grocery store founded here called WinCo, and I try to buy as much as I can there due to the fact that they're employee owned. I've been futilely trying to convince some of my otherwise left-leaning friends to go there instead of the Whole Foods a couple blocks away--its founder is well known for being a libertarian nut. RE: Worker Cooperatives Are More Productive Than Normal Companies - pbrower2a - 05-16-2016 The modern world has five classes of potential exploiters: 1. Traditional big landlords 2. Tycoons and financiers, the owners who can enforce poverty upon workers who have no viable alternatives. 3. Bureaucratic elitists 4. Intellectual shysters (from shamans to political hacks) 5. Organized crime The absence of these elites allow people to live better lives even with a lower level of productivity. If most of the income is going to those elites, then much of the productivity of a society is for naught aside from the elites. A well-functioning capitalist system can function on capitalists getting small margins on huge volumes of productivity. Marxist-Leninist regimes generally killed or exiled the big landowners and tycoons. But Marxist-Leninist regimes often allowed bureaucratic elitists to take much of the role of capitalists, and because they did not own the property, they could not exploit as capitalists did. Sometimes they simply exploited in different ways, like granting themselves huge salaries while sweating and starving their workers. There's plenty of money to be had as a government official in charge of some ministry charged with production through embezzlement if people get away with it. It is far easier to steal and get away with it if one is a director than if one is a checker-cashier. Co-ops are private sector, so they are not socialism. If they can operate without bureaucratic elites, then that is one way to avoid some exploitation. Are they effective? They might not be as responsive as companies with despotic management and ownership. If they have some internal democracy, then they can be very political. But unlike bad business organizations, the worker at the least has a stake in the system other than avoiding getting fired. |