09-02-2016, 12:05 PM
(08-28-2016, 08:47 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:(08-28-2016, 10:05 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:The Republicans have always been the party of business. Robber Barons have a tendency to get in the way of business which requires them to be removed. Who are the Robber Barons of today? Who are the Rockefeller's, the Carnegie's, the Vanderbilt's and the Morgans of our time? Trump isn't financially big and powerful enough to be viewed as a Robber Baron. BTW, if you don't know who today's Robber Barons are, ask your candidate because she's most likely done business with them. Hillary isn't going to buck the system that turned her into a multi millionaire anymore than LBJ was going to buck the system that turned him into a millionaire. Bernie bucked the system enough to receive funds to purchase another home for himself. No, you're only hope is for a Republican to do what's needed to be done. Are Republicans falling a part at the seams or trimming off the unwanted fat/crap associated with the past? Nature has entered and is now the force in play within the Republican party. Do you trust nature or science? Hint...Republican voters are more in tune with nature than science.(08-28-2016, 02:48 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: You may want to take a bit of your own advice. It's going to be fun to watch as Hillary is being attacked from the left and right. Are you a fan of the Democratic party like most Democratic voters that I know? What are Democratic voters going do after their party is destroyed?
I'm more of a fan of blue values than of the Democratic Party. Though the unravelling, both parties were trying to win by spending more on advertising than the other guys, and thus were taking money hand over fist from those with the most money. As the Republicans were the party of Big Money, the Democrats didn't do well with this approach. Bernie took a good shot at changing the culture, but couldn't pull it off. We'll have to see if other Democrats follow his lead in future elections.
In the Awakening, the Democrats had been in power far too long. They had become corrupt and complacent. They were still working more for the People than Big Money, looking to buy black votes through programs like the War on Poverty and Civil Rights legislation. This lost them the southern racists vote when Nixon pushed his southern strategy. Hey. I liked the New Deal. FDR truly revitalized the nation. Still, leave any set of politicians in power indefinitely, even when they start out with fresh energetic ideas, and they can stand getting shaken up a few decades down the road.
I'm hardly a blind fan of the Democrats. The basic approach of working for the People rather than the Robber Barons is sound. As for the rest, they are still politicians. One always has to keep a fire lit under their rear ends or they'll implement rule of the elite, for the elite, by the elite.
The Republicans have always been the party of the Robber Barons. Thing is, there are too few Robber Baron votes that they can't stay in power serving the Robber Barons alone. They have to sell, one way or another, the idea that what is good for the Robber Barons (or General Motors) is good for America. Pro business is pro America, at least in theory.
I found myself somewhat bemused an upset by the Bush 43 era Republican coalition. Big Oil. Fundamentalists. Neo-Con militarists. Wall Street. They didn't have a lot in common save a dislike for the Democrats. That was enough to win the election, but could they play well together in the world? They couldn't play well together in Iraq at least. The militarists wanted to prove that high tech could replace boots on the ground, that the US could kick ass and didn't have to walk as gently as they had since Vietnam. They planed for quick in, take the WMDs, and quick out. High tech worked great for them during the conventional war, but couldn't replace boots on the ground when the insurrection came. Big Oil had boots on the ground near the oil and tried to reap the profits. They couldn't let the military do their planned quick exist. The idealists and fundamentalists thought changing the culture of a conquered people at gun point would be easy. I mean, couldn't anyone see how superior they were to the locals? It turns out that the local style of corrupt wasn't very compatible with the Republican form of corrupt. Why couldn't they just accept the oil money and behave themselves? I mean, that what the Arabs had been doing for years, why not now?
Add the unwillingness of 43 to pay the costs of his adventure with new taxes with the resultant collapse of the economy and you had a big time SNAFU. Situation Normal, All Fouled Up.
At this point the Republican base is fed up. Hey, even you are disassociating yourself with their fractured remnants. For many, supply side has failed once too often. For many, the Republican eagerness to put troops near the oil led to disaster. Some care that the Republicans had lied to start an optional war for oil. Others are upset that they didn't filibuster the Democrats persistently enough. The Establishment Republicans also seem to be loyal more to the Robber Barons than the Culture Warriors. As a result the Alt Right is rising, trying to pull together the next wave of Culture Warriors.
Fourth Turnings are supposed to be transformative. Well, the conservatives are doing their part... falling apart at the seams, nominating a total outsider who doesn't look to have a chance. Alas, the Democratic Establishment is too intact for my taste. They need to fall apart and reinvent themselves too. I don't know that Hillary will be a transformer. She sorta almost talks a decent game. She is persistent enough. Can she get a regeneracy going? I don't know. It's hard to fall apart and reinvent one's self when the opposition beat you to the punch. It would be too tempting to stand pat.
We'll have to see. You, Eric and I have three different visions of the upcoming regeneracy and transformation. I just don't know how hard Hillary will try to push, or whether the remnants of the Republican Establishment can or will try to dig in heels.
Republicans are the ones who most steadfastly refuse to pass or enforce anti-trust laws. The Reagan ideology of the free market is against breaking up corporations and banks. That's "government interference with the market," according to Republicans and Reaganoids and Tea Party fanatics like the ones in congress. There is zero hope for them to do anything about robber barons. They are against any restrictions on them. Only the progressive Democrats would do it. I don't know if Hillary would, but Bernie would.