Presidential election, 2016

[Bob Butler 54]

(11-15-2016, 03:08 PM)taramarie Wrote:

(11-13-2016, 02:31 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: "Keeping the conversation away from where their inflexible way of perceiving things has failed them" would be a good way to keep the peace, to keep the forum more civilized.  It would not be a good way to communicate your own values or attempt to change theirs.  Values change is traumatic.  Defense mechanisms such as vile stereotypes, rejection of fact, insults and tantrums reflect the trauma.  There might be a choice between inflicting the trauma or giving up on communicating."

Unfortunately it is the truth though as I do listen to everyone and pick up on these things. I can put myself in other people's shoes and sense these things. I do not know how to tell them otherwise. I am trying to warn them. I am not very good at getting across that message. But as you say it would take a war for them to consider a different view.

I don't see war as the only way to open minds to significant values change.  It has been the most common way of doing it in an S&H crises.  There are such wars in most such crises.  Still, an economic collapse on the scale of the Great Depression or an ecological collapse on the scale of the Dust Bowl might well do it.  Alas, the 2008 economic collapse was not enough to wean the Republican base off borrow and spend trickle down.  From the looks of things, the Earth will have to be pretty well wrecked before they honestly evaluate climate change.  Things have to get really really bad before regeneracy and transformation.  Bush 43 just wasn't horrible enough.

But neither war nor collapse are available as working tools to the typical poster in a political internet chat room.  We have to make do with childish insults, which isn't the same thing.

Those with scientific values might question a theory or perspective if it conflicts with what happens in the real world without traumatic values shaking events.  I just have to kind of hope that there are enough people in the world or reading these boards who can see reality without a multiple megaton kick in the rear.