[quote pid='13435' dateline='1479542212']
It's just me. I love classical music, but I know plenty of people who don't. If I want to introduce someone to classical music I obviously introduce that person to some of the more accessible music -- like Mozart, whose music is attractive for the same reason that Big Band music is attractive -- that it works at several aesthetic levels at once. Magnificent as the late quartets of Beethoven are, I would not introduce those first to anyone new to classical music. Those are clearly 'acquired tastes'.
I have even coined my own euphemism for death for someone not d@mned to Hell for wickedness: "(insert name) is listening to a lot of Mozart now".
Indeed I rarely see Classic X'er using history or art of any kind as a rationale for his beliefs. I rarely see anything other than his personal experience. Contrast me: I recognize how distorted and limited my experiences are for discussing history. I would not wish the last five years of my life on anyone else. I'd like wider experiences in the world than I now have... and it could be that my knowledge of classical music or old movies reflects that at one time such were easy to get; perhaps because of Asperger's syndrome that has given me plenty of leisure time instead of the opportunity to make a good living, I can go in depth in culture and knowledge as few can without being employed to do so.
Doesn't everyone think that I would rather have a normal family life and a solid work history at a series responsible positions that, with my aptitudes for language and mathematics would have made me a rich man, at the expense of familiarity with music that offers difficulties worth the delights? That's Asperger's undiagnosed far too long. It has messed my life as badly as could a prison term or an extended involvement with addictive drugs. With that nasty condition as a known quality, I might have made some fitting adjustments -- like a vasectomy. My (in reality, non-existent) wife and I would probably have far better things to do than participate on a blog. Our children (adopted, and probably resembling neither of us) would likely be academic and vocational successes instead of having been aborted or abused.
Yes, sustainable happiness is the sole reasonable measure of a wholesome life (thank you, Aristotle). If I had to choose between being a creative person of profound achievement but an otherwise-miserable life (Richard Wagner, Vincent van Gogh) or a happy person with a steady-but-banal job and plebeian tastes, then I would take the latter.
He engages us, but he has done nothing to convince us. Maybe I would have been wiser to learn to install and service heating-and-cooling units instead of attending college. But who could ever know that at age 18? Would I have the same political values as he? Probably not. Would I enjoy classical music that has some difficulties worth transcending for profound feelings in the music, as with Anton Bruckner's symphonies? Maybe.
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Bob Butler 54 Wrote:(11-19-2016, 12:25 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: You're seeing what happens and witnessing the negative results when there's a major divide/difference/gap that exists between the level of character or the content of ones character. I consider myself to have a fairly high level of character and I prefer to hang out and socialize with those who have higher levels of character. I'll drop down a few notches in character in order to directly and effectively engage with certain progressives on an equal playing field.
I'd watch the difference between a gathering of people of high character, and a gathering of people with the same values. We recently had a discussion involving appreciation of classical music making fans of classical music feel superior to fans of country and western. The resulting perception if one isn't a fan of classical music is arrogance, which can result in hostility. Now, I'm not particularly obsessed with either form of music, I tend to jump styles a lot, but have favorite songs from both traditions. Still, It seems politically impatient and just rude to be snobbish and superior.
It's just me. I love classical music, but I know plenty of people who don't. If I want to introduce someone to classical music I obviously introduce that person to some of the more accessible music -- like Mozart, whose music is attractive for the same reason that Big Band music is attractive -- that it works at several aesthetic levels at once. Magnificent as the late quartets of Beethoven are, I would not introduce those first to anyone new to classical music. Those are clearly 'acquired tastes'.
I have even coined my own euphemism for death for someone not d@mned to Hell for wickedness: "(insert name) is listening to a lot of Mozart now".
Quote:But to me you (Classic X'er) come across as a strident partisan rather than a person of high character. This is not to say you are alone in this. We have no lack of people here with quite variant positions that I perceive of as strident partisans. I guess you could claim that intensely clinging to one's beliefs might be part of having a high character. Still, do the extreme partisans advocating blue perspectives come across to you as having high character? Do they not make it clear how they perceive you?
Indeed I rarely see Classic X'er using history or art of any kind as a rationale for his beliefs. I rarely see anything other than his personal experience. Contrast me: I recognize how distorted and limited my experiences are for discussing history. I would not wish the last five years of my life on anyone else. I'd like wider experiences in the world than I now have... and it could be that my knowledge of classical music or old movies reflects that at one time such were easy to get; perhaps because of Asperger's syndrome that has given me plenty of leisure time instead of the opportunity to make a good living, I can go in depth in culture and knowledge as few can without being employed to do so.
Doesn't everyone think that I would rather have a normal family life and a solid work history at a series responsible positions that, with my aptitudes for language and mathematics would have made me a rich man, at the expense of familiarity with music that offers difficulties worth the delights? That's Asperger's undiagnosed far too long. It has messed my life as badly as could a prison term or an extended involvement with addictive drugs. With that nasty condition as a known quality, I might have made some fitting adjustments -- like a vasectomy. My (in reality, non-existent) wife and I would probably have far better things to do than participate on a blog. Our children (adopted, and probably resembling neither of us) would likely be academic and vocational successes instead of having been aborted or abused.
Yes, sustainable happiness is the sole reasonable measure of a wholesome life (thank you, Aristotle). If I had to choose between being a creative person of profound achievement but an otherwise-miserable life (Richard Wagner, Vincent van Gogh) or a happy person with a steady-but-banal job and plebeian tastes, then I would take the latter.
Quote:I appreciate any effort you (Classic X'er) might try to make in engaging with progressives. We need more of that from both sides. I don't know that being willing to listen and reducing the antagonism and hostility ought to be described as dropping down your character, though. At least from my perspective, people of good character ought to be able to listen and share, ought not to be so defensive about flaws in one's own perspective, so aggressive in demonizing one's opposites.
He engages us, but he has done nothing to convince us. Maybe I would have been wiser to learn to install and service heating-and-cooling units instead of attending college. But who could ever know that at age 18? Would I have the same political values as he? Probably not. Would I enjoy classical music that has some difficulties worth transcending for profound feelings in the music, as with Anton Bruckner's symphonies? Maybe.
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The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.