The Maelstrom of Violence

[Eric the Green]

(08-29-2017, 10:16 AM)Warren Dew Wrote:

(08-28-2017, 10:24 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Not equally evil, because antifa seeks to stop fascism before it starts. We have no idea what kind of government antifa would institute. But yes both are wrong because they are too violent and lawless.

Actually we have a very good idea, since their goal is to 'destroy capitalism' and they fly anarchocommunist flags.  Stalinism is at the end of that road.  They might not be exactly equal - Stalin killed several times more people than Hitler - but they're on the same level.

No, the ideals of the antifa are not Stalinism, and Stalinism is not the end of that road. The anarcho element should be a clue. They are leftists, but the Left does not equal Stalin. That type of totalitarianism was intended to impose industrialism on poor backward peoples, and flourished in countries that were used to centuries of tyrannical imperial rule and did not know democracy. I can't say for sure what they mean by "destroy capitalism," but my suspicion is that they want to take down the huge corporate state that concentrates wealth and power and uses it to drain the prosperity, peace and ecological sustainability of the world.

I don't even know if most participants in antifa have any other goal but to oppose fascism and protest against their rallies and speeches.
http://www.npr.org/2017/08/26/546323215/...-at-antifa

"What does antifa actually want?
Sean Illing
Antifa defines itself in purely negative terms, in terms of what they’re against. But what do they want? Do they have any concrete political goals?

Mark Bray
That’s a great question, and one that often gets overlooked. For the most part, these are pan-leftist groups composed of leftists of different stripes. They all seem to have different views of what they think the ideal social order looks like. Some of them are Marxists, some are Leninists, some are social democrats or anarchists. But they cohere around a response to what they perceive as a common threat."
https://www.vox.com/2017/8/25/16189064/a...-interview

You can't narrow down the views of these leftists into a particular program; it is a loose coalition of revolutionaries. They are not liberal Democrats.

I'm sure all this is enough to earn your opposition, Warren. But lots of people will not agree with your opinion that their movement leads to Stalinism.