09-04-2017, 07:28 AM
You know, in a lot of ways it would be nice to have a black perspective. Instead, we have a black guy who goes against the grain, fighting the usual black perspective. What we've got is one man's opinion, to be taken with a grain of salt... perhaps a lot of salt.
You are wrong as usual. I sympathize with BLM on their original issue. The federal government is making too much military surplus equipment available to local police. This has contributed to a militarized attitude. Not enough training is being made available. The court system seems to allow 'I was afraid' as a defense, and too many are afraid of people of color. BLM has a legit gripe.
The clan? Well, power is not the only relevant metric.
Both equality and non discrimination are desirable. I just don't see that either one need eliminate the other under all circumstances. Arbitrarily jumping on one bandwagon at the expense of the other seems strange.
The Democrats, seeking the urban black vote, did drive away from the largely conservative (and racist) white southerner. Party affiliation for most has remained that way since. I could accept that Nixon got a bit too much credit for it. He may have recognized it a bit earlier than most rather than initiating it. Still, the trend is quite real if one isn't value locked out of it.
Both parties played politics and won the loyalty of those they were seeking. May both find joy with what they claimed.
Again, I find both ending discrimination and equality as worthy goals, parallel in fact. Knee jerk reactions of ending one to achieve the other are misguided. You should try to be more sophisticated.
With Trump's use of racism in his campaign, the increase and openness of calls to prejudice and hate have increased. Any attempting contact with reality would see it. I'll stick with resurfacing as an appropriate word, and wonder a bit at the wannabe black guy siding with Trump.
That is more measurable. The see saw seems is alive and well. You can pretend that Trump is building a culture defining and changing status as much as you like. Your delusion, not mine. I am seeing declining popularity, discord, a president with a split party, a guy who will be lucky to get a second term let alone build a consensus to rival Lincoln's and FDR's. Much of the problem is he needed to sell the unraveling memes to steal the Republican base. This gives him a problem about respecting the memes in office... cut domestic spending, push a tough military, borrow and spend trickle down, etc... He has the choice of honoring obsolete ideas or breaking promises. One guarantees failure, while the other loses him his base. Being he is intuitive rather than dogmatic, honoring promises seems unlikely. This parallels a divide between those who want him to become more presidential and those who want to ride the wild card that got him as far as it did.
I've been trying not to be too judgemental, but he's far enough along that it is hard not to. He still has time to pull out of his flat spin. He's got a hard road, though.
For decades I've grumbled that the division in DC is so strong that nobody can get anywhere. Finally, that trend seems almost a good thing.
(09-04-2017, 02:42 AM)Kinser79 Wrote: In that case you have to oppose BLM as much as the Klan then. In fact the former is far more powerful than the latter at current.
You are wrong as usual. I sympathize with BLM on their original issue. The federal government is making too much military surplus equipment available to local police. This has contributed to a militarized attitude. Not enough training is being made available. The court system seems to allow 'I was afraid' as a defense, and too many are afraid of people of color. BLM has a legit gripe.
The clan? Well, power is not the only relevant metric.
(09-04-2017, 02:42 AM)Kinser79 Wrote: If the demand is for non-discrimination then ending Affirmative Action is necessary. As for myself, I don't believe in equality. Different people have different strengths and weaknesses, different desires and abilities. As such equality is not only impossible to achieve, but any attempt to achieve it must result in the pulling down of the smart and the strong to the level of the weak and the stupid.
Both equality and non discrimination are desirable. I just don't see that either one need eliminate the other under all circumstances. Arbitrarily jumping on one bandwagon at the expense of the other seems strange.
(09-04-2017, 02:42 AM)Kinser79 Wrote: Of the Segregationist Governors and Legislators at the state and Federal level only one crossed the floor, Strom Thurmond. The Democrats lost the White South not because they stopped being racist--they are still very racist. I've explained to you how soft-bigotry works at least 100 times Bob. Rather what changed is the Democrats drifted so far to the left as to alienate the largely conservative white southerner.
The Democrats, seeking the urban black vote, did drive away from the largely conservative (and racist) white southerner. Party affiliation for most has remained that way since. I could accept that Nixon got a bit too much credit for it. He may have recognized it a bit earlier than most rather than initiating it. Still, the trend is quite real if one isn't value locked out of it.
(09-04-2017, 02:42 AM)Kinser79 Wrote: Unnecessary. The GOP just had to stay conservative, the Democrats drifting left did all the work.
Both parties played politics and won the loyalty of those they were seeking. May both find joy with what they claimed.
(09-04-2017, 02:42 AM)Kinser79 Wrote: No it didn't. Racism is alive and well and has been as loud as it has ever been. Simply put the Democratic party cannot allow racism to die its natural death because they need it to deliver black voters (the low information ones anyway) to the polls to pull the lever for the guy with the D after his name.
The rest of the time they spend pushing race quotas, because black people obviously can't get to a university on their own or something. How you can't see the racism in that is beyond me, but whatever. I've already concluded that you are values locked and probably have been since before I was born anyway.
Again, I find both ending discrimination and equality as worthy goals, parallel in fact. Knee jerk reactions of ending one to achieve the other are misguided. You should try to be more sophisticated.
(09-04-2017, 02:42 AM)Kinser79 Wrote: No, it never went away so it can't be resurfacing. Racism is weaker because the understanding that judging someone on the basis of his race is flawed is much stronger. That would be the universe bending toward justice. As for demeaning others, that is covered under freedom of speech. Again freedom of speech is absolute except in cases of incitement.
With Trump's use of racism in his campaign, the increase and openness of calls to prejudice and hate have increased. Any attempting contact with reality would see it. I'll stick with resurfacing as an appropriate word, and wonder a bit at the wannabe black guy siding with Trump.
(09-04-2017, 02:42 AM)Kinser79 Wrote: I'm going to leave my response to this post here because it is just more of the same refusal to recognize the regeneracy that has already happened because it does not conform to your expectations.
That is more measurable. The see saw seems is alive and well. You can pretend that Trump is building a culture defining and changing status as much as you like. Your delusion, not mine. I am seeing declining popularity, discord, a president with a split party, a guy who will be lucky to get a second term let alone build a consensus to rival Lincoln's and FDR's. Much of the problem is he needed to sell the unraveling memes to steal the Republican base. This gives him a problem about respecting the memes in office... cut domestic spending, push a tough military, borrow and spend trickle down, etc... He has the choice of honoring obsolete ideas or breaking promises. One guarantees failure, while the other loses him his base. Being he is intuitive rather than dogmatic, honoring promises seems unlikely. This parallels a divide between those who want him to become more presidential and those who want to ride the wild card that got him as far as it did.
I've been trying not to be too judgemental, but he's far enough along that it is hard not to. He still has time to pull out of his flat spin. He's got a hard road, though.
For decades I've grumbled that the division in DC is so strong that nobody can get anywhere. Finally, that trend seems almost a good thing.
That this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom, and that government of the people, by the people, for the people shall not perish from the earth.