The Maelstrom of Violence

[Eric the Green]

(09-12-2017, 11:52 PM)Warren Dew Wrote:

(09-12-2017, 11:09 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(09-12-2017, 10:38 AM)Warren Dew Wrote:

(09-12-2017, 09:42 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(09-11-2017, 11:11 AM)beechnut79 Wrote: filling gas tanks.

There's a job that is pretty much a thing of the past these days. Except in the states of New Jersey and Oregon, where self-serve is illegal.

I was surprised to discover this when I drove up to see the eclipse in Oregon. Interesting; one gas-filler guy told me Oregon adopted this law because it rains so much that it's not nice to make people get out of their cars and pump gas. But Oregon isn't the only state where it rains a lot, and New Jersey is probably not one of those states. Oregon has some good ideas and goes its own way a lot.

I'm not sure the law is needed, if gas stations are required instead to provide roofs over the gas tanks and the drive-through areas. I think most CA stations have those.

No requirement at all is needed.  If roofs are really an issue, people will go to gas stations with roofs and the other gas stations will have to get them or go out of business.

When I get gas in New Jersey, I preferentially go to a station that looks the other way if you decide to pump your own gas.

Whether a requirement is needed is a matter of opinion, much depending on whether you are a free market conservative like yourself, or whether you think business needs to be regulated for the good of the people. I have no opinion on this particular issue; it was just interesting to experience the difference between Oregon and CA. 

But I am sure that relying on the free market alone does not necessarily lead to a business having no customers if they do not supply what the people need. As a democratic-free-market/socialistic inclined person, I don't agree that the market will necessarily supply what the people need if left to itself. Much experience quite convinces me otherwise.

A competitive free market always provides what customers on the whole actually prefer.  This may not be to your liking if, for example, you prefer a roof over gasoline that is 2c/gal cheaper, while everyone else prefers the cheaper gasoline, but regulating to your preference against the preferences of everyone else is worse for everyone but you.

No, the free market provides what the business prefers. It provides what is convenient for the business to provide. This usually means buyouts right away, consequent lack of choice, poor wages and working conditions, severe environmental damage. In the case of roofs, the gas stations if not required to provide them, may not provide them if it decides that its market is secure and it's cheaper to not provide the roofs. 

Is the free market actually working in this case without laws? I don't know. Oregon decided a law was needed to maintain service at service stations to help people stay out of the rain. The people of Oregon decided this through their representatives. Nothing wrong with that. I don't know if CA has a law requiring roofs. But many stations have them.

Apparently requirements for gas stations in CA are decided by city ordinance. Elk Grove (near Sacramento) has ordinances that came up first on a google search. Now, can you claim that all of these requirements can be decided by customers deciding whether to shop at gas stations in Elk Grove?
http://www.codepublishing.com/CA/ElkGrov...e2372.html

I'm not advocating laws in this particular case of course; it's just an example of how the free market works, or doesn't work. Sometimes the free market works; sometimes it doesn't. The error on your part (or on the part of some extreme socialist OTOH) is to claim it always or never works.