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Backlash against Speech
#21
(07-22-2016, 12:53 AM)taramarie Wrote:
(07-22-2016, 12:42 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: When you're over here and you hear the same carp for 35 or 40 years, there is no need to "listen" to what I already know they are going to say. Same old trickle-down nonsense. Same o prejudice. Same o stuff over and over. There's no idealism on the other side; sorry Tara.

For example, see if you can recognize someone in this video making the typical trickle-down argument. A hint; he spoke last night. see about 6:30




Same-o same-o, for 35 years. Who needs to listen? They need to be defeated. For good. We need new parties, and a new system.
Are they ALL prejudiced though? I have listened to some of them and they say no they are not. They may stand with the repubs for other reasons. They are not all clones of each other I am sure. Do you know that I was called a racist just because i want to simply listen to the other side? I want to listen to understand the individuals rather than label them all as racists or prejudiced etc. The fact i was labeled a racist simply for listening tells me it has gotten so bad over there that one push is all that is needed for your country to tear itself apart completely. I am genuinely concerned about the labels the smears and the polarization. Do you realize that is partly what is radicalizing both sides?

No, it's not. What is radicalizing both sides are real problems. We have a stagnant economy, foreign terrorists, pollution, people who can't get ahead here anymore. Real problems. And a government that cannot act, because of people stuck in ideologies, and the power of money. But one side has some real answers, while the other side is causing the problems.

What we need to be concerned about, are politicians who use thinly-veiled racism and xenophobia to get people to vote for them, because people are hurting economically or don't like changes, and don't read a lot, and can be hoodwinked into voting for these politicians because of their fears and prejudices instead of supporting candidates who actually have policies that bring progress and solve problems. Somehow people need to get informed about what the real problems are, so they don't support the wrong politicians because of their knee-jerk reactions.

If Trump can't even run a convention any better than this, with among other things, a plagiarized speech by your own wife, how can he run the White House, let alone America?

I say, any Trump bashing is 1000% in the national interest. We need to bash him so bad that his small fingers bleed. We need to bash and smash him into absolute oblivion. No, there's nothing to be gained by "listening" to Trump and his supporters. We already have listened. I bleepin listened to him for 73 minutes straight tonight! There is nothing new to hear. WE HAVE HEARD IT ALL; EVERY LAST BIT OF IT!! It's time to defeat him, and the GOP. I don't like insulting people, and I usually don't. But someone running for president has to be called on for his lies and his nonsense and his failure and smokescreen! Watch that John Oliver show; get to know what we are dealing with here. It's nothing like you have to deal with in NZ.

Polarization is not the problem. The problem is those on the wrong side. Being in the middle is not necessarily being in the truth.

Did you watch the video? Did you see who I mean?
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
Reply
#22
(07-22-2016, 01:10 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(07-22-2016, 12:53 AM)taramarie Wrote:
(07-22-2016, 12:42 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: When you're over here and you hear the same carp for 35 or 40 years, there is no need to "listen" to what I already know they are going to say. Same old trickle-down nonsense. Same o prejudice. Same o stuff over and over. There's no idealism on the other side; sorry Tara.

For example, see if you can recognize someone in this video making the typical trickle-down argument. A hint; he spoke last night. see about 6:30




Same-o same-o, for 35 years. Who needs to listen? They need to be defeated. For good. We need new parties, and a new system.
Are they ALL prejudiced though? I have listened to some of them and they say no they are not. They may stand with the repubs for other reasons. They are not all clones of each other I am sure. Do you know that I was called a racist just because i want to simply listen to the other side? I want to listen to understand the individuals rather than label them all as racists or prejudiced etc. The fact i was labeled a racist simply for listening tells me it has gotten so bad over there that one push is all that is needed for your country to tear itself apart completely. I am genuinely concerned about the labels the smears and the polarization. Do you realize that is partly what is radicalizing both sides?

No, it's not. What is radicalizing both sides are real problems. But one side has some real answers, while the other side is causing the problems.

What we need to be concerned about, are politicians who use thinly-veiled racism and xenophobia to get people to vote for them, because people are hurting economically or don't like changes, and don't read a lot, and can be hoodwinked into voting for these politicians because of his fears and prejudices instead of supporting candidates who actually have policies that bring progress and solve problems. Somehow people need to get informed about what the real problems are, so they don't support the wrong politicians because of their knee-jerk reactions.

If Trump can't even run a convention any better than this, with among other things, a plagiarized speech by your own wife, how can he run the White House, let alone America?

I say, any Trump bashing is 1000% in the national interest. We need to bash him so bad that his small fingers bleed. We need to bash and smash him into absolute oblivion. No, there's nothing to be gained by "listening" to Trump and his supporters. We already have listened. There is nothing new to hear. WE HAVE HEARD IT ALL; EVERY LAST BIT OF IT!! It's time to defeat him, and the GOP. I don't like insulting people, and I usually don't. But someone running for president has to be called on for his lies and his nonsense and his failure and smokescreen! Watch that John Oliver show; get to know what we are dealing with here. It's nothing like you have to deal with in NZ.

Polarization is not the problem. The problem is those on the wrong side. Being in the middle is not necessarily being in the truth.

Ok before i read your message i need to address that part i highlighted. I am not in the middle to be in the right. I am simply hearing ouut both sides without tearing them down to get to the truth. THEN i can pick out what sounds understandable and what doesnt. I like and dislike some issues on both sides atm. Here in NZ i already left the lefty party (labour) for a party that is actually more in the middle as they address the actual issues without causing more problems from what i can see currently. Are they xenophobic or are they worried about issues caused by unsustainable immigration as well as the regressive culture they bring in? As a woman i do worry about the latter issue as we fought for our rights to be seen as equal. They are not what they were back in the 60s. They seemed to enjoy more freedom back then. Not anymore. What do you think about this? We fought for these rights. Do you think they can impact our culture to regress back to before women had many rights? As for unsustainable immigration look i am not against it if they are to be entrepreneurs or when jobs are plentiful as well as housing. Here in NZ we are struggling in both departments. The latest with the housing crisis in Auckland is that nurses, teachers and police are actually moving away from Auckland as they cannot live there anymore. Too pricey for the average kiwi. But when refugees come in they are from what i have heard are given a house and a car. Neither of which an average kiwi can afford. Especially for kiwi millennials. We rely heavily on buses as it is what we can afford and we have been labelled generation rent for obvious reasons. This is partly why i listen to them. Because i can understand the frustration regarding immigrants who are taking away jobs which are a struggle to get (cheaper to hire). It may be a totally different situation over there. I have heard they are wanting to send ILLEGAL or undocumented immigrants home. If they are illegal that is understandable. I can understand the POV of them bringing in a regressive culture into the country IF that is what they agree with. I am sure you can understand my concern given my gender and what we fought so hard for. I have no opinion on trickle down economics. Not sure what your alternative is. I am just simply trying to form my own opinion currently to figure out a sustainable solution and perhaps when i come to a conclusion it could work for my country too. I think we are going through something similar although it is worse over there and thankfully we do not have issues with cops and guns and people in general shooting people. THANKFULLY!

"Somehow people need to get informed about what the real problems are" That is what i am trying to figure out.



"politicians who use thinly-veiled racism and xenophobia to get people to vote for them" I have heard some of it like from Trump for instance on his talk about Mexicans. Quite disgusting. Note that i do not like the man. He appears to be a sociopath narcissist. From his behaviour I can read that. But there have been a few policies that seem reasonable to me despite his antics. No does not mean i ok him. I can say the same about more policies from the left as keep in mind I was a hard core lefty till the recession smacked me in the face and i became more conservative (nz first party) about looking after our own first economically. This is only due to the recession. When we have gotten over the recession which is deepening over here i would loosen up on that. I am very much left wing when it comes to social issues. You probably have seen that a lot around here though. I am pretty vocal about it. As well as giving benefits to those who desperately need it and the elderly as well. We need to look after our own. But i am still forming my opinion on American politics. But i see a lot of errors over there on both sides that neither can face. I will watch the vid now.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply
#23
(07-22-2016, 01:10 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(07-22-2016, 12:53 AM)taramarie Wrote:
(07-22-2016, 12:42 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: When you're over here and you hear the same carp for 35 or 40 years, there is no need to "listen" to what I already know they are going to say. Same old trickle-down nonsense. Same o prejudice. Same o stuff over and over. There's no idealism on the other side; sorry Tara.

For example, see if you can recognize someone in this video making the typical trickle-down argument. A hint; he spoke last night. see about 6:30




Same-o same-o, for 35 years. Who needs to listen? They need to be defeated. For good. We need new parties, and a new system.
Are they ALL prejudiced though? I have listened to some of them and they say no they are not. They may stand with the repubs for other reasons. They are not all clones of each other I am sure. Do you know that I was called a racist just because i want to simply listen to the other side? I want to listen to understand the individuals rather than label them all as racists or prejudiced etc. The fact i was labeled a racist simply for listening tells me it has gotten so bad over there that one push is all that is needed for your country to tear itself apart completely. I am genuinely concerned about the labels the smears and the polarization. Do you realize that is partly what is radicalizing both sides?

No, it's not. What is radicalizing both sides are real problems. We have a stagnant economy, foreign terrorists, pollution, people who can't get ahead here anymore. Real problems. And a government that cannot act, because of people stuck in ideologies, and the power of money. But one side has some real answers, while the other side is causing the problems.

What we need to be concerned about, are politicians who use thinly-veiled racism and xenophobia to get people to vote for them, because people are hurting economically or don't like changes, and don't read a lot, and can be hoodwinked into voting for these politicians because of their fears and prejudices instead of supporting candidates who actually have policies that bring progress and solve problems. Somehow people need to get informed about what the real problems are, so they don't support the wrong politicians because of their knee-jerk reactions.

If Trump can't even run a convention any better than this, with among other things, a plagiarized speech by your own wife, how can he run the White House, let alone America?

I say, any Trump bashing is 1000% in the national interest. We need to bash him so bad that his small fingers bleed. We need to bash and smash him into absolute oblivion. No, there's nothing to be gained by "listening" to Trump and his supporters. We already have listened. I bleepin listened to him for 73 minutes straight tonight! There is nothing new to hear. WE HAVE HEARD IT ALL; EVERY LAST BIT OF IT!! It's time to defeat him, and the GOP. I don't like insulting people, and I usually don't. But someone running for president has to be called on for his lies and his nonsense and his failure and smokescreen! Watch that John Oliver show; get to know what we are dealing with here. It's nothing like you have to deal with in NZ.

Polarization is not the problem. The problem is those on the wrong side. Being in the middle is not necessarily being in the truth.

Did you watch the video? Did you see who I mean?
I am about to watch the video but keep in mind i said it is only part of the problem. I did not say it was THE problem. Of course it is also real problems. But when people of a party bash people who are on the other side or people who are in the middle simply listening and they get bashed too (i know i have) it does tend to lead to people not listening anymore, hardening down on what they stand for and stagnation. If someone bashed your ideas would that lead you to want to listen to that person? I see a civil war coming your way and that is why i am very concerned.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply
#24
(07-22-2016, 01:10 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(07-22-2016, 12:53 AM)taramarie Wrote:
(07-22-2016, 12:42 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: When you're over here and you hear the same carp for 35 or 40 years, there is no need to "listen" to what I already know they are going to say. Same old trickle-down nonsense. Same o prejudice. Same o stuff over and over. There's no idealism on the other side; sorry Tara.

For example, see if you can recognize someone in this video making the typical trickle-down argument. A hint; he spoke last night. see about 6:30




Same-o same-o, for 35 years. Who needs to listen? They need to be defeated. For good. We need new parties, and a new system.
Are they ALL prejudiced though? I have listened to some of them and they say no they are not. They may stand with the repubs for other reasons. They are not all clones of each other I am sure. Do you know that I was called a racist just because i want to simply listen to the other side? I want to listen to understand the individuals rather than label them all as racists or prejudiced etc. The fact i was labeled a racist simply for listening tells me it has gotten so bad over there that one push is all that is needed for your country to tear itself apart completely. I am genuinely concerned about the labels the smears and the polarization. Do you realize that is partly what is radicalizing both sides?

No, it's not. What is radicalizing both sides are real problems. We have a stagnant economy, foreign terrorists, pollution, people who can't get ahead here anymore. Real problems. And a government that cannot act, because of people stuck in ideologies, and the power of money. But one side has some real answers, while the other side is causing the problems.

What we need to be concerned about, are politicians who use thinly-veiled racism and xenophobia to get people to vote for them, because people are hurting economically or don't like changes, and don't read a lot, and can be hoodwinked into voting for these politicians because of their fears and prejudices instead of supporting candidates who actually have policies that bring progress and solve problems. Somehow people need to get informed about what the real problems are, so they don't support the wrong politicians because of their knee-jerk reactions.

If Trump can't even run a convention any better than this, with among other things, a plagiarized speech by your own wife, how can he run the White House, let alone America?

I say, any Trump bashing is 1000% in the national interest. We need to bash him so bad that his small fingers bleed. We need to bash and smash him into absolute oblivion. No, there's nothing to be gained by "listening" to Trump and his supporters. We already have listened. I bleepin listened to him for 73 minutes straight tonight! There is nothing new to hear. WE HAVE HEARD IT ALL; EVERY LAST BIT OF IT!! It's time to defeat him, and the GOP. I don't like insulting people, and I usually don't. But someone running for president has to be called on for his lies and his nonsense and his failure and smokescreen! Watch that John Oliver show; get to know what we are dealing with here. It's nothing like you have to deal with in NZ.

Polarization is not the problem. The problem is those on the wrong side. Being in the middle is not necessarily being in the truth.

Did you watch the video? Did you see who I mean?

Ok trickle down economics. So if they spend more others get to benefit from it. You buy from a store, that store benefits from it. Well the store does, but not the employees if their wages remain starvation level. It would benefit the company for sure but not employees if the wages remain the same. I have heard from the other side that if you increase wages it increases the prices of everything else including tax. What do you think? As far as i can see currently trickle down would help companies but not the employees if wages do not increase.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply
#25
Ah there just as i suspected. (still watching it) It did not benefit the poor due to no wage increase. In fact it would have hurt them more given that over time prices increase. It only benefited the richest in the country. Rich getting richer and poor getting poorer. Hey sounds exactly like what National is doing! (right wing in nz)
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply
#26
Ok so tax cuts on the rich led to a higher deficit. So, increase taxes on the rich to pay for the huge deficit and for the companies that can afford it increase wages so they are not at starvation wage. If anyone has thoughts on what i just said i am listening of course.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply
#27
For trickle down to work companies need to increase wages so that everyone benefits from it. Not just the rich.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply
#28
Very informative and interesting video Eric. Thanks for sharing it.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply
#29
(07-22-2016, 02:21 AM)taramarie Wrote: For trickle down to work companies need to increase wages so that everyone benefits from it. Not just the rich.

That's right. And in case you missed it, the guy I refer to defending trickle-down economics in the Maddow video, is Mike Pence-- just nominated for vice president by Trump and the Republicans.
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
Reply
#30
(07-22-2016, 11:27 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(07-22-2016, 02:21 AM)taramarie Wrote: For trickle down to work companies need to increase wages so that everyone benefits from it. Not just the rich.

That's right. And in case you missed it, the guy I refer to defending trickle-down economics in the Maddow video, is Mike Pence-- just nominated for vice president by Trump and the Republicans.

Ah ok yeah i missed it. I have been following his nomination but i did not recognize him.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply


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