06-05-2018, 01:22 AM
(06-04-2018, 04:46 PM)TheNomad Wrote:(06-04-2018, 09:27 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:(06-04-2018, 03:34 AM)TheNomad Wrote:(06-04-2018, 12:44 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:(06-02-2018, 11:27 PM)TheNomad Wrote: I will come back to the rest of this post because there are good arguments. But for now:
You said: The boomers in the 2T sought to develop this. Your generation views us as having failed in that. However, your generation also rejects the spiritual renaissance that provided the means for people to discover their spirit and morals within.
The spiritual renaissance which sought desperately to not give birth to us so they could explore their selfish dreams and sexual fantasies, and the morals that made killing us in the womb legal. So, if you guys had it your way, we wouldn't even exist and you would be frolicking in the poppy fields into elderhood with The Doors anthology on a loop.
Just to be clear, YOU maybe got to explore your inner discovery. WE got fast lessons on how to use a microwave and no one cared where we were after the sun went down. Even your intimate knowledge of your own generation and what you feel it was meant to be possibly betrays you didn't even pay attention to what you guys did to your kids in the Nomad position.
I realize not everyone is the same. But for the most part, you ARE all pretty much the same to a point. It's all about YOU.
Nomad gets the shaft from in the womb forward, Boomer blames Nomad for everything they can, Millennial can't tell the difference and Artist is too busy handjobbing the Millennial to acknowledge the others. Yet, I'm no complainer.
The consciousness revolution of the 2T was for everyone, and remains open to everyone. It is about a fuller, richer life, and those of us in the movement believe that means finding a better life for everyone. "frolicking" and discovery of the inner life is for everyone. We did need to reduce the children we had (I "neglected" my children to such an extent that I did not have any at all), and some silent and boomer parents neglected their children too. That was the nomad's lot. I hear that, but on the other hand, it also enabled you to be more self-reliant, self-directed and pragmatic survivalists; the mark and talent of your generation. There were advantages to your plight, as well as difficulties. One advantage you had, being part of a less-numerous generation than boomers, was less competition for available jobs. That was very hard for me to deal with.
To resent what your elders did, and thereby reject the spiritual renaissance that we and others started, and that is part of a heritage that goes back millennia, is not an advantage to you though. But it's your choice whether to do that. It is all open to you, and opening to spirit does have its moral dividends too, and we wanted it for everyone.
You correctly noted that it takes more than politics to being about a better world. I just pointed out that this requires the spiritual renaissance that you guys have rejected. It would be wise for your generation to take another look, now that you are grown and can look past your resentment of elders, just as we boomers had to do when we were grown. The only non-political means to bring the growth in moral awareness that you say we need, is to pursue this spiritual renaissance and inner discovery which, when understood, does not promote selfishness, no matter how selfish many boomers actually were and still are.
I guess these internet discussions are fun. But sadly, it rarely results in any exchange of knowledge or opening to alternative ideas or feelings. Mere words on a screen are not very convincing, and don't resonate very deeply. That is true in our dialogue. I explained why 9-11 is not the crisis, and you just re-posted your question; there you go....
I need to be sick more often to be seeing posts! But if you responded to 911 no crisis I must have missed it? will look.
But I gotta say: That was the nomad's lot. I hear that, but on the other hand
That is the Nomad's life. "WE HEAR YOU, BUT...". Then you want to include everyone into the renaissance. I have no ill-will for positive thinking nor for realizing what about my childhood was awesome and what sucked. But it's amazing the glossing over and the "well, just look on the bright side" that doesn't happen to millennial children.
Also, I'm for real. You can take every word on the screen for what I'm about. My written word skills are SO exceptional as to convey the
version of my best self and with a communication level far exceeding most.
When I first looked, I wanted to agree with the renaissance idea being an answer to this evil we see in Corporatacracy and super-wealthy kin scheming to stay up there at our expense. But according to the Strauss & Howe ideas it is the opposite. Prophets are a dark-mirror image of Heroes. It is the very inner renaissance of the prophets which bring so much entropy and doom. The Heroes are NOT inner-directed souls on a path to bio-enlightenment, they are outer-directed souls on a path to systemic transformation.
So, you may be confused (with all respect, sir).
S&H did not say prophets are a dark mirror image of heroes. They say all archetypes are necessary to the process. Prophet idealism provides the direction and blueprint for reform and change during the 4T. That blueprint is there for us. Yes, that's correct about Heroes. They are outer-directed and will be primarily interested in systemic transformation. And that will be about politics. The majority of what is needed to change the corporatacracy now is political. Even so, the next 10 years will not transform it entirely; It will still be there. I hope and expect some reforms which will set our political process back on the right path. During the 1T these reforms will be consolidated and extended. But the next Second Turning, when the Alpha Prophets come of age and Gen Z is in midlife, will bring back the consciousness revolution both outwardly and inwardly, and it will fulfill many of the goals of the sixties revolution and further extend the spiritual renaissance inwardly and the green revolution outwardly.
S&H do point to the consciousness revolution as having the side effect of too much inner focus and narcissism. But that is because American culture is not able to understand and pursue inward transformation as it truly is. Our culture is too commercial, materialist and self-centered to begin with, for it not to coopt a spiritual renaissance. But there were many boomers and other participants who pursued it well. And they became good, supportive parents to millennials. It has brought transformation to a degree; just not enough. That just means it must continue. In a healthy society, spirituality continues through all turnings, whereas in ours, so far, it has only happened in 2Ts, with only non-spiritual traditional religion happening in the other turnings.
The consciousness revolution is the only path to putting our moral and inner lives on a higher plane. Our nation needs to become a spiritual and not a materialist one. You say politics alone can't transform the corporatocracy. That is true; but then the only alternative is to transform ourselves and our worldview; the way we perceive ourselves and the world. There's a third alternative though; and that's just to be cynical and let things unfold the way they are going now. I don't see that as resulting in anything but the rapid decline and fall of our society. Gen Xers need to look beyond resentment and critique of the consciousness revolution, and instead embrace it and what it offers both outwardly and inwardly.
If millennials are not told to look on the bright side, it's because they naturally do, and Xers don't. The millennials got more support in childhood than Xers did. So yes, Xers need to cultivate just enough hope and idealism to be able to contribute their pragmatic and managerial talents to working through the crisis and emerging into the 1T which they will oversee.
It's hard to believe that we prophets will be over the hill and start disappearing just 10 years from now. Boomers to me will always be the "new generation," and I will always see them as dedicated to transforming the world, even if most of us have had our inspiration and dedication to higher consciousness and social and economic idealism just dry up and fade away. But I think some of us will continue to be young in heart and body, and keep on contributing and helping to lead the way forward in the 1T to come in just 10 years.
S&H did not say prophets are a dark mirror image of heroes.
I make up my own terminology to simplify. S&H make very clear the distinction between INNER DIRECTED prophets and OUTER DIRECTED Heroes. One causes the doom and the other fixes it.
Being inner-directed does not cause dooms. It means we inner-directed ones can think for ourselves and make our own decisions. We don't cause the doom; we envision the solution which the heroes later act on.