Millennials and GenZ horribly misidentified

[NobodyImportant]

(05-26-2019, 04:27 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: The Millennial Generation has gotten the rawest deal that any generation has ever gotten

I didn't disagree with that. But if people traumatized to the point of lunacy will take the wheel then nothing good will actually come out of it except for the powers that be just laughing at useful idiots who can be swayed to do their bidding.

Quote:*summary of crash*

A very neat and quaint summary that i fully agree with, but what is your point?
I completely understand that the system in place is corrupt but millennials didn't do *shit* to fix it.
They took bernie - the only non establishment candidate on the side more supported by them - being fucked over lying down, and vent and voted for the absolute epitome of super pac, wallstreet, public-and-private-position-on-policy, establishment politics herself en masse.
Trump is a corporatist, but he at least has done more for small businesses and working class people in the US than others, if you look at the employment numbers. Even though he - of course - backtracked on most of his reformist ideas. He also restarted the space program which, under Obama, was relegated to just barely still existing. This is a thing that is always a massive benefit to the entire society and economy.
In fact the "we are going back to the moon" thing from nasa is one of the very few things that makes me believe we might actually have a glimmer of hope and be starting to stabilize the crisis.
To portray him as a "believer in pure plutocracy" when he had the least amount of superpac fundint of any candidate in the recent past is ridiculous.

Quote:The GOP has cast all questions of economic equity to the Democrats while ensuring a 52-48 split of power, with the 52% acting as a cadre party. The Chinese Communist Party may have largely abandoned Marxism-Leninism, including Maoism, but it has never abandoned dictatorship. The Chinese political system is basically a permanent 65-35 split in representation, and the majority rules. In America the GOP would be satisfied with a permanent 55-45 split of power, especially if some orthodox believer in pure plutocracy is the President. Trump is the vehicle for winning over people who see educated people as the exploiters and oppressors as well as unforgivable rakes damned to Hell for their homosexuality, abortions for fun, mockery of televangelists, and rejection of young-earth creationism.  

Again, none of this is a response to what i said.
The *people* think this way and wholeheartedly buy into this way of thinking too. Millennials more than anyone, in fact they CHAMPION this.
If you look around you now, not during obama, the GOP and their media seems far far less hateful towards democrats than democrats towards republicans. You remember the calls for that kids life to be ruined because he smirked in the wrong sort of hat.
You remember big names in journalism and media, and the media itself calling for this and helping with this, while others called for mass murder of the entire school? You remember CNN actively blackmailing someone over a meme? Not even regular people in Alabama heartland are calling for such shit with the democrats. The only people that do are a tiny and fringe minority. Not the faces of their political side.

Quote:Milo went too far.

I really don't see how he did, and the fact that you think that he did implies to me that you are not completely free from the grasp of outrage culture either.

Quote:The Hard Right is as tied to an outrage culture as the Hard Left ever was. Even so I see a big problem for America: that there is now no real home for genuine conservatives who believe in thrift, small-scale enterprise, education, legal precedent, and a nexus between doing right and doing well.

Yes that's exactly what i said.

Quote:We are not yet through sorting the political mess that is the contemporary Crisis. The Hard Right is as nasty as ever, and it still has great power.

Yes, and i precisely said that GenY will not be the ones to sort through it, so we will not be through it any time soon.
GenY lack the anchors to reality that would be required to actually deal with things, and they wholeheartedly buy into the partisanly split population/partisanly split issues mindset that is preventing anything from changing. GenZ do not seem to do so with their cynicism and lack of support for traditional political parties.

Quote:The urban-rural split in American politics, between people who live mostly on near-starvation pay and people who get good pay but have responsibilities to enrich the Master Class above all else, is much of the divide. Both have good cause to hate the current Establishment, but they are still in hostile camps. The Master Class wins so long as such is so.

Yes, but this had nothing to do with what i said. My point was that millies are similar all over not just on the coasts.
And as long as they remain wholly invested into the "my issues/your issues" dichotomy they are not going to do anything of the sort of resolving the crisis.

Quote:Civic generations believe in institutions as solutions.

Eeeeh that's reaching.
The sovereignty of a nation can be seen as strengthening british institutions, instead of having some nebulous concept of some in europe.

Quote:The Right has the same capacity to offer bad ideas that sound good in theory or good so long as one ignores the consequences to most people. Tara (Gone with the Wind) was a great place to live -- so long as one was not a slave. Romanticism about the past is not so good as the reality of the past. (I would now be satisfied with a sustainable future looking much like the 1950s, but without the male heterosexist chauvinism, polio, Southern segregationism, the Commie menace, environmental destruction, and Blood Alley roads. I see the Hard Right and I see the nasty social order of the Planet Mongo, obviously modeled after the totalitarian orders of the time, in Flash Gordon serials of the 1930s.

Yes, i said that just at the end of the paragraph you quoted.

Quote:Assuming that you are British, I recognize a difference between America and Europe. Western Europe was reorganized to replace nationalism (the source of fascism) with a welfare state in an expanded market. America has devolved into a country in which the landlords, loan-sharks, and lobbyists control things. We thought fascism completely un-American except for the ludicrous people who prance around in ghostly robes and burn crosses before going on night rides -- and thus impossible here. Well, It Has Happened Here, and we all know who the real-life Berzelius Windrip is!

That is fucking ridiculous. If you buy into the whole "orange man bad" ideology i don't know what i can tell you. You have literally zero basis for that argument.

Also i'm not british i'm european. Conceived in one country, born in another, raised in yet another, and most friends in yet another, relatives in yet another. Friends with MEPs, educated in two different countries, soon to be three, soon working in a fourth. I am fluent in four languages and learning more. I have dealt with questions and problems of the european union in school and in real life, and i've seen a shitload of enviornments, people and ways of dealing with things.
All the while i'm mostly interacting with america and americans and american politics, because that's what dominates the internet. And the world.

With all this in mind i can confidently say that while there might be differences, the basic problems are roughly the same in both places:
a) A left that has betrayed the working class in favor of corporate and special interest groups thus becoming exactly like the corporate right, save for the flavoring of their agendas.
b) The same left having also, and in support of this fully bought into the tribalistic social justice nonsense that is so exquisitely destroying human civilization.
c) The normal right having been brought into this in some places as well, but more importantly wholeheartedly and unquestionningly supporting the special interest groups.
d) The newer right being extremely reactionary, and doing just 'pushback politics' and being the other side of the tribalistic social justice bullshit.
e) All of this because both sides consistently and wholeheartedly buy into the idea that the ideas of the other side aren't even legitimate, so the different sides have ownership of the PROBLEMS and not the SOLUTIONS to the problems.
f) Which in turn ensures that no side can actually command any strong enough support to really oust the plutocratic bullshit that is destroying society.