The Partisan Divide on Issues

[Eric the Green]

(06-26-2020, 01:53 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(06-25-2020, 03:09 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Well thanks for trying to answer my question, at least. After 15 years, your version of "America" is still rather vague, and I don't think you have sufficiently distinguished what you mean by America from what I and other lefties mean by it. Yes, the USA (as I prefer to call it) has an army, a flag, a nation, a republic, a constitution and an economic system. We don't question the existence of these things. We need those things. But we think that the real America is one that is willing to grow, progress and change to make it better for all its citizens, not just for the privileged view that your side favors.

That constitution permits us to burn that flag in protest if we want. Even your guy Scalia said so. That constitution can be amended, and has been a number of times. I would support abolishing the Second, and you would not. That is a perfectly constitutional question. Our economic system is fine and brings prosperity as long as it is reformed, regulated, taxed and supplemented with social programs and state enterprises, as it has always been. I may disagree with your Reaganomics program of dismantling much of this, but much still survives, and can be brought back, so that our economic system is fair and enables opportunity for all, instead of allowing a few to hog all the riches and despoil our land, seas and air.

And we lefties don't want to disband the army, but we want an end to needless imperial interventions like those in Vietnam and Iraq, or today's support for bin Salman's attacks on Yemen. We support the right of protest against unnecessary and immoral USA war policies, and your side does not. What "America" means to you guys is to crush and stop any dissent or any movement to make America more of what it is supposed to be, as stated in our Declaration, our Constitution, Lincoln's Gettysburg address, FDR's 4 freedoms, Martin Luther King Jr.'s Dream, etc. That is what "America" means to you: an America that stands pat. Your side screams at Jane Fonda and brings guns to god bless america rallies. It wants to bring confederate flags to them too, while our side considers the Confederacy to be a failed and immoral uprising by racist traitors.

America is a great country, and the republic is great. Nevertheless, the USA has some original sins. Slavery and white supremacy is embedded in our election and government system, and its heritage remains. Our conquest of Native peoples was not fair or just. Our rape of the land and environment was catastrophic. Our imperial wars left scars upon our nation and its people. Working people have often been exploited and cheated. America is an unfinished project, not a set of established powers and follies to maintain. The real America is the one that is willing to grow and change with the times and aspire to be even greater than it is now, not to return to some never-existing nation from the past.

Dude, opportunity is available to all and has been for quite a while now. So, what's wrong with the Left and the lack of opportunity mainly pertaining to them these days? The American left seems to be doing about as good as the American right these days. So, what's wrong with the Left? You're on the Left. So, what's going on with the Left? Why is the Left so fucked up and immoral and so into radical Marxism these days? I mean wasn't the complete destruction of Nazi Germany and the collapse of the Soviet Union enough to teach the higher educated to ignore or stay away from getting involved with Marxism and the Left all together.

The Left is not into radical Marxism these days.

The Nazis are on your side of the table.

Opportunity has diminished in America. Economic and social mobility has declined under Reaganomics.

Quote:Do you know what I did today? I had a discussion with a long time Democratic voter/ fellow American and avid CNN watcher for many years who is now on board with the American right and no longer emotionally attached to the Democratic party. Yes, the Left's war with America has created some deep wounds that will never heal and some scars that will never go away and pretty much created a natural divide that's damn near impossible to overcome without a miracle. So, I guess we'll see which side is right and comes out on top in the long run. Personally, I don't see the Left being able to overcome all the losses that we inflict and I don't see the losses that we take in the short term as things are being settled with the Left mattering that much in the long term. Like I've said, I think the entire American right has been pretty tolerant and relatively non violent so far compared to the Left. The way I see it, if you prefer to be governed by hardened criminals and prefer to be largely influenced by angry mobs and spend what's left of your life trying to survive in a lawless world that's fine with me. It's a major step back to me but if you view it as progress and progressive that's fine with me too.

We are now being governed by a hardened criminal, and you don't seem to mind so much.

Your definition of "American" remains vague. My theory remains intact that for you it just means the status quo and traditional values.