The cancer infecting the political Left

[Eric the Green]

(07-24-2020, 11:32 PM)Mickey123 Wrote: Of course the West is in the middle of a cultural collapse.  This is the essence of what the Unravelling is.  It's the death of the old First Turning culture, which then must be replaced with something, but there's nothing to replace it with.  A Crisis is then necessary to reform society and create a new culture.

The last Awakening was in my mind the most intense we've seen in our history, and it's led to a unusually extreme unravelling.  What you're seeing all around us is cultural collapse, you just don't recognize it as such.  This is because you, and liberals in general, misinterpret everything going on as some sort of step in the direction of liberalism.

Awakenings are the source of culture, not Crises. Crises being new institutions; Awakenings bring new culture.

The Awakening brought a new culture. Just because it has been ignored and not followed up on doesn't mean it isn't there.

4Ts have always resulted in the liberal or more progressive approach and institutional reforms being adopted. So it's no wonder we interpret it this way. If this 4T is not leading in the direction of liberalism, it will be the first time. It likely means the USA has failed. I don't think this will happen, and I don't think our generations are less capable or more depraved than previous ones.

Quote:Liberals see the Black Lives Matter movement and they think it's a liberal movement.  They think it is about standing up for black lives.  But it has nothing whatsoever to do with that.  It's part of the general effort going on to break society down.  The media carries out a continuous nonstop drum beat of "racism racism racism racism" all day every day, week after week, month after month, year after year, to turn people against each other.  The message is non stop, whites are racist, whites are racist, whites are racist, the problems of blacks are caused by racism, racism is the worst thing in the world, whites are racist, blacks can never get ahead, the U.S. is racist, whites are privileged, the police are racist, and so on and so on endlessly.

You obviously don't see or know what's going on. I don't know why. Black Lives Matter is exactly standing up for black lives and it is a liberal movement. The facts about white racism are chanted because they need to be chanted. And racism is perhaps the worst thing in the world; certainly one of the most perverse things in the world.

Quote:Meanwhile, the U.S. and other western nations are probably the least racist countries in the world, at the least racist time in modern memory.  But you would never know that to watch or read the news, as reporters scour the country looking for any misconduct by a white policeman against someone black, or any white person to have inappropriately called the police on someone black.

Why would a society carry out such a self destructive and self loathing campaign as this?  None of this is in any way intended to help black people (or other racial or religious minorities), it is intended to keep them feeling angry and helpless.  Telling people that all their problems are caused by someone else, and that this group has all the power over them and is evil and destructive, all of this disempowers people - as it's intended to.

Meanwhile, liberals mistake all of this for some legitimate attempt to help blacks and to improve society.  "Black lives matter", who could disagree with that?  Racism is bad, and police brutality is bad, and people communicating about their issues is good, it all sounds so liberal, if you aren't paying attention to the bigger picture.

It is always empowering to speak out against those who oppress you. It takes some courage. And for whites to join in just shows their awareness that when the lives and rights of some are threatened, the rights and lives of all of us are not secure. It is not black peoples' fault if police treat them unfairly; it is the police's fault. That does not mean that blacks are not responsible for crimes they commit.

Quote:To address one of the other points, you say, "the Left (as you describe them) is using the tools of Western civilization against a would-be tyrant who shows little influence upon his life from the glories of that civilization".   I'll repeat my statement that you, as a liberal, mistakenly believe that the conflict going on in society is between the liberal left and the authoritarian right.  Meanwhile, what's actually happening is an ever growing authoritarian left bent on destroying society, versus an authoritarian right which is just about to conclude that seizing power and arresting all their political opponents is the only way forward.  With liberals in the middle between the two, thinking they're the left.

The insanity you see on the right is one side of the coin, matched by the insanity of the left. 

You will never move forward by defeating Trump, because we've reached a point of collapse.  There is no return to stability.  Every move by any side destabilizes the whole system further.  Attack Trump successfully, and you strengthen the left, which further strengthens the resolve of the right.  If Trump wins the election, the left will come back and attack 10 times as hard, and states may begin openly defying the federal government.  If he loses, he may likely attempt to seize power.

I can't predict how all of this is going to turn out.  But you will never understand anything that's happening if you mistakenly think that the left is liberal, and if you fail to see the ever spreading cancer that has taken over much of leftist thinking.

I had already refuted all of your claims that you have made here again. The question is why you want to think this way.

The right-wing is on the way out. Demographics are against them, and it consists of older people. Red states are turning purple and purple states are turning blue.

Deposing Trump provides a chance for the republic to return to democracy and normal behavior. Whether this also provides a path for progress to return after 40 years of regression and stalemate will be up to the people and their leaders. But that is what I am still predicting will happen. A nation cannot remain in neutral or reverse forever and still prosper. The question is why you ignore this problem and why you want the stalemate to continue indefinitely.

The pandemic and the black lives matter movement provides an opening for progress, and a return to government that can act and be empowered and controlled by an active citizenry, and it will need to encompass many other issues too if our republic is to get off the dime and move again. We on the left can form alliances and address these concerns and ideals and move forward again, and then there won't be such an impulse among some to, as you see it, just tear down the country. What needs to be torn down are the barriers to progress which the right-wing has put up over the last 40 years of Reaganomics. That many whites are marching with blacks now shows the potential for these alliances.