The Partisan Divide on Issues

[pbrower2a]

(07-26-2020, 04:05 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(07-26-2020, 04:50 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(07-26-2020, 04:36 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(07-25-2020, 08:43 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: I expect his motive is more saving America.  If it were just the Democratic Party at risk, he would likely let another candidate take it.  With Trump, he was in a position to do what is necessary.

America is fine. The Democratic party is more at risk of falling apart. I think its pretty clear that the elites had no faith in any of the other candidates which why Biden had to be coaxed out of retirement to unify and save the Democratic party from imminent destruction.

It is the old values that are rejected and fall apart in a crisis heart.  Looks no different this time.

I don't represent the old Marxist laden Democratic values.

Then who does? Yeah, my body is loaded with Commie tattoos -- hammers and sickles, images of Lenin, Marx, Engels, Mao, Castro, Che Guevara, and for good measure Kim il-Sung. And of course, the slogan "Workers of the world, unite!" Sure. And the household cat is a strict vegan. 

Truth be told, we liberals recognize that Marxism-Leninism is a catastrophic failure that brought neither peace, progress, nor prosperity that a humane capitalism couldn't achieve. Markets are good controls for keeping people from producing worthless stuff and are good at getting people to do things that they might find unpleasant or inconvenient.     

The only people that I know who believe most of the tenets of Marxism are those who believe that capitalism must be a brutal, inequitable, soul-crushing, repressive order in which over nine of ten people exist to suffer for a small elite responsible to none but themselves. Such people differ from Marxists only in endorsing what commies excoriate. It is best that such people wield no power, for if they do they are exactly the sorts of people who make a Marxist revolution a near certainty. Such people seek to meld the traditional hierarchy of feudalism with the productivity of capitalism. If you believe such, then it is a good thing that you have no power to exploit people as you endorse. 

Quote:I represent traditional American values that have withstood the tests of time.

Human sacrifice, slavery, despotism, religious persecutions and bigotry, racism, child labor, male subjection of women, helplessness of workers against bosses, and homophobia stood the test of time until they no longer did. Except for human sacrifice and despotism, all of those have been part of the American way of life. At that, Donald Trump acts like a despot instead of a Constitution-abiding President. 

Ancient truth and beauty withstand the test of time. Ancient superstition and cruelty do not.     

Quote:American culture itself is much stronger, much larger and much more powerful than it was back at the turn of the last century.

America is not and has never been a cultural monolith. Pizza and a pinata at a birthday party for a child of Polish and Swedish ancestry  is consistent with America. In case you think that America is such a cultural monolith, then check what you had for dinner over the last couple of weeks. 

Besides, this is clearly not American. 

Quote:I've been trying to tell you that for the last fifteen years but you don't want to listen. I hate to tell you this, but we could turn blue America upside down without the government and starve blue America and eliminate the blue courts and slaughter the blue tax collectors and the blue law enforcement that have the power to seize property. Do you think Americans are going to have a problem with pretty women like AOC being executed by an American?

The best-looking of women executed since 1976 in America might have been Karla Faye Tucker, who was stupid enough to say while in custody that she got an orgasm while stabbing someone to death with an ice pick. She was incarcerated long enough to have a change in her soul, and Pat Robinson believed her well enough to seek clemency for her. Most of the rest of such executed women seem to have not been the sort that you would pick from a dating site even had they not done horrible things, at least according to their mug shots.

More significant, though, is that you suggest that someone who has never done a violent crime, who has never dealt drugs, and who now has a stake as part of the Establishment is on the fast track to execution for holding values that you do not share. You project. 

I dislike capital punishment, and someone has to be a particularly culpable perpetrator of horrific crimes such as genocide or human trafficking to merit execution. 

I suggest that you get help. Social worker, psychologist, clergy -- whatever it takes to keep you from going off the deep end.   

Quote:You better wake up and recognize the position that Democrats are in these days? You won't find an American who is hooked on free lunches or free school supplies or free government housing or free health insurance or free college tuition or special rules or special treatment or positions relating more to their race or gender or sexual preference on the American side today.

For many businesses, health insurance is a costly fringe benefit, and many people are unable to do any better than to get group rates from an insurance company for working for the company for which they work. The largest vendor to General Motors is... Blue Cross and Blue Shield of Michigan. Not a steel or glass company. College education? In a country like Germany which offers college education for as far as one is qualified to benefit from it based on grades alone, the people who go farthest in the educational system typically end up paying huge taxes through income taxes, real estate taxes, and the VAT.  Nothing that the government does really is free.  

Quote:The gay American is nothing more than an American on the American side today. That's where we are at and plan to stay through hell and high water as Democratic groups are left to settle things and  fight it out among themselves like the old days so to speak.

We Democrats are not turning against each other yet.