You Will Own Nothing. You Will Be Happy.

[Eric the Green]

(07-30-2021, 11:54 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: The primary problem with representative democracy is that the representatives see themselves as members of the elite.  Thus, government comes to favor the elite creating the huge division of wealth Marx was upset about.  The solution is direct vote computer democracy, to take the representatives out of the picture, but we seem not to be ready for that given security and cultural issues.

Revolution is not a way to get there as the revolutionaries are too tempted to become the new elites.  Thus far, every communist revolution has resulted with a new group of elites replacing the old.  They have an affinity for the owners of the means of production just as much as the old nobility that preceded them.  As none of the Neo Marxist groups have suggested how to solve that problem, the intuitive rejection of Marxism as yet another autocratic system that favors an elite gets rejected.  How far can Marxism go if not trusted by the people?

I would rather work on getting rid of the representatives than convince the violent people not to use violence to make elites of themselves.

As far as I can tell, the representatives are pretty much what the people vote for. So the primary problem with representative democracy is with the voters who send the representatives; voters who see themselves as potential members of the elite.

But as their representatives continue to uphold the elite, and keep the voters happy with slogans insisting that their policies provide "freedom" for them to become the elite, or by appealing to their prejudices and fears, the only hope is for enough of the voters to perceive the results of their own votes, ditch the deceptive freedom ideology, and change their votes. Usually it is easier for younger people, and some of the more-oppressed people, to see through the sham.

Another major aspect of the sham, is to convince people that both current political parties are the same; just different aspects of the elite. The people so convinced are also the primary clientele of the conspiracy culture. They are deceived into thinking that those who offer the best policies are just dividing the people and causing polarization. This way they will either not participate, so the elite can continue to dominate, or just go along with the status quo, or else submit to the sensational slogans of phony demagogues like Trump who promise to smash the system to pieces.

Of course, votes only can be shifted far enough, if enough people are allowed to vote. In many countries, a few elite tyrants have erased this ability, and in the USA the system was originally set up, and continues to be shaped, in ways that give the advantage to those who uphold the elite, so there needs to be a supermajority of voters who see through the sham; such as when Biden had a 7 point lead among the voters; just enough to barely win the electoral vote and create a 50-50 senate; a new regime that, being not completely free of the deceptions and the power of the elite, may provide better but still inadequate policies to meet the real needs of the people.

More direct democracy such as initiatives like we have in some states would allow the people to bypass their representatives and create laws. But for this to be productive, the money needs to be taken out of this process, just as it needs to be taken out of the election process.

At the end of this video which explains the primary delusive, deceptive ideology of "freedom" that oppresses the people, George Monbiot says that "undefined better option" is being developed.