The Partisan Divide on Issues

[Cynic Hero '86]

(12-07-2019, 05:49 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(12-07-2019, 05:32 PM)Cynic Hero Wrote:

(12-07-2019, 05:28 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(12-07-2019, 04:27 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(12-07-2019, 02:48 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: I was thinking though, given the effectiveness of the Lichtman Keys, and one of them is domestic unrest, that if it happens before Nov.2020 that could turn a key against Trump. So if the blacks get riled again by another police shooting or two, or if some antifas manage to arouse a huge uprising, or just enough demonstrations about gun violence and climate change happen to raise the temperature enough, maybe that could be effective after all if it turns a Lichtman Key!

By the way I would still consider you far right, Classic Xer, even though you are not at today's looney extreme. Anyone who so passionately accepts the trickle-down philosophy that has been rejected everywhere else in the world outside Red America, is far right. Anyone opposed to a fair immigration system and fearful of tax money going to welfare, is extreme right. 

It was extreme right in 1964, with Barry Goldwater as the standard bearer. It was known as extreme right then. The problem is that not only is the USA a center-right country to begin with, relative to the rest of the world, it's right wing has gone off the scales and taken over the Republican Party increasingly since then, so that America has regressed instead of progressed since the sixties.

My crystal ball says this is going to change now. But the right-wing has erected formidable barriers to progress that will not easily or quickly be taken down. But taken down, they must be. Many reforms are on the agenda. 

I hope we can get a lot more immigrants in our country, despite the walls Trump and the Republicans are erecting; more latinos who will have lots of kids and vote Democratic for a while. And make you squirm and complain, and cause a few of your red states to leave our country through secession, leaving us with a secure hold on the USA.

A Litchman key would require a large scale coordinated effort and the massacre of thousands of people at one time to make a nation like ours move in either direction. Do you really care about the school children who were massacred or do you care more about adding to the Lichman key effect and moving towards the result you want? Yes, I have shown you signs of being extreme at times and I have shown you signs of uncaring as it pertains to you and your well being and the well being of those affiliated with the system that you obviously support. I have shown signs of being the opposite of what you would expect, what you believe would/should occur, what you believe should/would happen or be the result, how you think people would respond and react as well.

I hate to bust your bubble but I am stronger than you, more powerful than you, more confident than you, more capable than you, more courageous than you, more knowledgeable, more experienced and more accepted and more understood and more popular than you are too. Gee, I'm just one of the 60 some million die hard Americans who placed the liberals on ignore and showed up on election day in 2016 and voted for Trump. So, what side of the American iron curtain would most Americans prefer to be on these days. The Quasi Socialist side or the American side? What do you (the Quasi Socialist side truly represent? I say Quasi Socialism, you can say/call it whatever you want and try to defend it and promote it. Me, I have no interest in your buyers or your believers either.

I don't think it takes such a massacre to turn the "domestic unrest" key. I'm not sure what it takes. I have stated here and elsewhere many times that gun massacres will continue to increase as long as meaningful gun control is not enacted, which it hasn't been. So it's not a matter of what I want; I want gun control and bans of semi-automatic weapons and an end to massacres, but obviously that's not going to happen this year, and so the question is whether a mass uprising even surpassing the march for our lives will arise from further massacres that would be enough to turn the Lichtman Key, or other uprisings against such things as police shootings, climate change and so on, which as long as Trump and the Republicans control our government will continue to get exponentially worse, and if this Key IS turned it could end the reign of Trump and the Republicans which could in fact be the first and most-necessary step toward ending these outrages. But I don't think riots will convince the convinced Republican voters such as yourself to change sides or make any change; it will be up to a few independent voters to make that change, seeing how fast the country is going downhill, and this means Lichtman Keys turning. 

I don't know if it will happen. It could happen, but I am not on the record predicting it to happen in 2020. So it will be no use for you to crow on November 4th 2020 that you were right and your side won instead of mine, because I have not made any such prediction that my side will win in 2020 to begin with.

I am the true American, because the true Americans now are the Quasi-Socialists and Greens and liberals of all stripes, while your side has betrayed everything this USA is supposed to represent at its core. If you are stronger than me, congratulations. The only issue is whether enough swing voters in those 3 normally-blue states in the upper mid-west come back to their senses and have "buyers" remorse of what they did to America in 2016. You are not one of those voters in one of those states, and there's nothing you can do about that.

Sorry Eric, But Most Americans Hate unrestrained free-trade unrestrained Immigration and Unrestrained globalist Polices. They are two Options available for 2020: Trump Gets reelected or Trump Loses to a Berniecrat. If the DNC nominates an Establishment Candidate, one can call 2020 Election right then and there at the convention and it would be a Trump Reelection. Only if a Berniecrat gets nominated would the actual election be actually decided in November. If an establishment candidate is rammed down the peoples throat the the election would effectively be over in the summer and the actual vote in november would just be a formality pretty much.

Ha ha. You don't know what most Americans hate. 

I am not in love with unrestrained globalism; borders don't need to be entirely open, though I do recognize that we are essentially members of one planet and not of one nation. But that does not mean I support so-called free trade; that is part of neo-liberalism, which I oppose. Trade needs to be negotiated so that countries on more or less the same level of regulation and wages can trade freely while those on a lower level need to have some leveling tariffs applied so that our own domestic jobs, companies and workers are not hollowed out as they have been these last 40-plus years.

I would prefer the Berniecrat (preferably Bernie himself) be the nominee, myself. I know there is impassioned dissension from berniebros against establishment Democrats, since I encounter this on facebook all the time. I don't have the confidence to predict that defection by berniecrats would cause the Democrats to lose, or to split up. It seems just as likely, or even more so, that moderate Democrats would defect from a berniecrat nominee. I am just looking at the facts as I see them. And probably neither defection would be decisive to the outcome.

What I learn from my esoteric crystal-ball investigations, and it's therefore something anyone can observe who sees the history and the scores, is that only skilled candidates ever win presidential elections in the USA. So the Democrats's success in 2020, if it happens at all, is going to turn not on whether they nominate Bernie or Biden, but on whether they nominate either of those, or Warren or Buttigieg. The latter two do not have the skills to win against the skilled demagogue Drumpface. It will be the person nominated, not the ideology chosen, that will determine whether Democrats have a chance to win in November. Either Biden or Bernie can win, although whether they will actually win is undetermined at this point.

It doesn't take a genius or a prophet to observe that the Democratic candidates who were skilled, like Barack Obama and Bill Clinton, were the ones who won, while less-skilled Democratic candidates like Hillary Clinton, John Kerry and Michael Dukakis did not. Obama and Bill Clinton are universally recognized as skilled, confident, cool and charismatic candidates who connected with the people. Bernie can fill that bill; Elizabeth cannot. The nerdie policy wonks do not win. That's how it works in the USA.

All the existing frontrunner candidates have moved in favor of globalist ways of doing things except Trump. Even Bernie has been cowed compared to 2016. Americans want an American Just like them to be in the white house. We are tired of being ruled by globalist control freaks. We are tired of the tyranny, It doesn't matter if you thing doing something or the other is the "right thing" you need the citizenry's permission to do things. The choice between doing good and evil is not up for you to decide for me; for example it is purely up to me. Globalist establishment control freaks want to impose their view of the world on the mass of the populace.