The Partisan Divide on Issues

[Bob Butler 54]

(08-20-2020, 12:13 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: A small portion of the old GOP is in as much trouble as the DNC today. I'd say the entire old Washington establishment is in deep trouble with the American people today. Yes, there is a bit of a rift between the fiscal conservatives and the borrow and spend Republicans (Rhino's) and old Neo Cons these days but that's about it these days. Trump is a libertarian conservative like most everyone else on the American right these days. If Trump was a fascist, he would be doing what you are criticizing him about not doing today.

I'd agree the old Washington Republican Establishment is in deep trouble, except to the extent that they enable Trump.  The base acts much as a personality cult.  The Tea Party objective of ridding themselves of the old establishment has turned into a loyalty for Trump that embraces the establishment if the establishment enables Trump.  If Trump says the establishment enablers are OK, they are OK.  If they cross Trump, he will send a few mean tweets and they are toast.  I'm not sure if Trump is gone how the Establishment would be ranked.

I think the Neo Cons are laying low.  They were right that we could use our superior force to win conventional wars, but very wrong in our ability to confront proxy insurgent wars.  There is such a reluctance since Iraq to put boots on the ground that the Neo Cons are not a major factor.  We could not occupy Iraq let alone change the values of the whole Middle East.

Agreed the Republican base is very much into libertarian conservativism, but Trump is more into Trump.  The question is whether the base will start to look more favorably on domestic spending.  Health care for all?  Fighting global warming?  One large feature of the unravelling mindset was to ignore problems to keep taxes low and government small.  COVID made a dent in that mode of thinking.  We have to see how big a dent.  In a 4T, the problems are addressed decisively and the old way of looking at things virtually disappears.  I am assuming this will happen again, but it has yet to manifest.  The commitment of the Democrats at there convention seems to be there, but it has to pass congress to be real.  We will have to see what happens should Biden win in November and the mid terms come around.

Most everything turns so drastically on the November election that looking beyond it is hard.  The Republicans are pretty much in turmoil just now.  Without knowing how they will reconstitute themselves, things get really murky.  The establishment is into elitism, the base into racism, the true conservatives have a chance to renounce both, but it is hard to see who keeps control of the party.  Thus, my crystal ball gets mighty murky.  My only thought is that whichever of the three factions come out on top, they will not be able to contest against the Democrats.  They will be diminished.

I would not consider Trump a classic fascist.  I have never been into the 'all Republicans are fascist, all Democrats are Communist' games that were played a while back.  I have no trouble distinguishing between the situation in the 1940s and today.  Trump is not into military conquest or alliance.  Still, in being more loyal to himself than the country he becomes bad enough.

But in many ways Trump is making the 4T possible.  He is discrediting the old way of thinking so clearly that wiping out the old values becomes more easy and obvious.

I don't see the Democrats as disunited or in trouble.  They are more united than they have been for some time.  That claim seems to be one extremist's attempt to cling to his ideals.  It used to be a topic if the establishment Democrats and the radical Democrats would become the two dominant political parties, but the radical policies of say Warren and Sanders are now part of the main party platform.  Thus, it seems like one of the three Republican factions will become the main challenger.  I just don't know which one yet.

The establishment faction has been tainted a lot by their forced loyalty to Trump, and no one loves the elite hold on Washington. There are lots of racists, which might hold the base, but Black Lives Matter has shifted their hold on American values. They seem on track to hold the Republican remnants, but they will no longer be dominant enough to challenge the Democrats. I would personally prefer that the true conservatives should reject both the elite and racist influence and become dominant, but that seems to be more wistful thinking than likely. One can hope, but I am foreseeing a weakened racist base as trying vainly to slow the Democrats down, but having trouble in the high fighting for a racist ethic when most Americans no longer thinks the racist tendency acceptable.