(11-09-2020, 02:58 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: In short, we don't need your politicians or your third world politics because we are all quite capable of standing on our own two feet and surviving so to speak. Just so you understand what you're really dealing with, the number of individuals like me in the country grew substantially over the last four years and the blues (Democratic side) had to scrap the bottom of the barrel of society for the votes that it needed to win and the situation for most of those who are on the Democratic side ain't going to get better for them than it is for them right now either. What you are going to see is two countries functioning more and more like two countries than anyone has ever seen in this country before now and a realization by those in DC that there is nothing that they are able to do about the growing partisan divide that exists in this country today.

(11-09-2020, 11:36 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-09-2020, 04:53 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-08-2020, 04:31 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-08-2020, 12:44 PM)gabrielle Wrote:

(11-08-2020, 07:26 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: Can people overcome their 'stars'? If people can overcome something so horrible as heroin, can't they find ways to frustrate the 'stars'?

Eric's system is based upon the electability of the candidate rather than effectiveness of the elected in office, no? This could be subject to change as American tastes and perceptions change, I would think. After all, some astrologers, including Eric, have been predicting that these years we are living in will see a great paradigm shift, due to rare, once-in-a-millennium configurations. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

My system does change over time. It is based on all the candidates in history and the aspects in their charts. As history continues, the database increases and shifts. Nothing in the stars sets our lives in stone. The horoscope indicates to some degree our character, and character is destiny. I believe character can improve, and that's part of the journey of our unfoldment, in this life, and probably from life to life. Yes, paradigms are slowly shifting-- not as fast as I had hoped when I wrote my first book in 1997 (published the same day as The Fourth Turning), but the rhythms of life and the evolution of humanity and planet Earth go on.

There is more in heaven and earth than is dreamt of in limited philosophies, whether they be scientific or spiritual. I can make predictions based on trends. The predictions based on the system are not perfect, but they show the significance of our connection to the cosmos around us. In this case, the "stars" are the planets, centered on the Earth-- the most significant planet in astrology.

It is great that Kamala Harris has made history. However, that will not be a sufficient basis on which to nominate her for president in 2024, or any time. The horoscope scores, although not set in stone, have a degree of accuracy that should be heeded. And we can see them at work. The scores indicate which candidates will connect the best with the "soul of America," as Joe Biden puts it. Now with his victory, his score improved a little bit, enough to barely top The Donald's. So I predicted his victory. It was always going to be a close call, and the two candidates had scores close to each other before the election as well as afterward. 

Kamala Harris, however, does not connect well. Her campaign showed this. The Democrats will need to pick someone else if they want to keep the White House. Unless they do, things will be even worse than they are now, and we will have missed the chance in this 4T to make change. 

Only Theodore Roosevelt is certain to have thoroughly beaten his score. 6 other major party candidates, although only 1 since 1932, have also won although having a slightly lower score than their opponent. Other factors were at work too in these 7 cases. But no-one has ever won or served as president with a score as low as Kamala's. American tastes and perceptions will not change that fast. Even so fast as since the 2019-2020 primary campaign! So, be ready to support someone like Mitch Landrieu, who if nominated will surely win. Soon-to-be-I-hope Secretary of State Susan Rice is another good alternative, or Terry McAuliffe.

http://philosopherswheel.com/presidentialelections.html

So, you tweaked Biden's score a bit after he won to go along with your prediction? What's the point of doing that? You're fortunate that the majority of Blue Americans aren't as sharp as the majority of us  these days or the majority of you would be out of business so to speak. It's kind of cool that we are now divided enough to place each other on ignore and no longer care about the outcomes pertaining to each other these days. So, how are you going to get rid of Harris without causing a rift  along racial and gender lines and further  weakening the Democratic party.

In early October I updated my calculations to make them easier to update and for greater accuracy. And I added all the 2020 viable candidates, including Joe Biden assuming his victory. I also calculated what the aspect points and scores would be if Trump were to win instead. Luckily I don't have to go with that scenario. This was all done by Oct.15, and Biden's new score was better than Trump's. Now, after the election, the new scores reflect the new reality that would have been exactly the same had I waited until after the election to develop them. This time, my prediction was right. I didn't have to change a single thing after Biden won.

I don't know how we are going to get rid of Harris. If she had the candidate skills necessary to win on her own, it would not matter what her identity is. But being chosen mainly because she put her hat in the ring in 2019, and has particular identities, it will be a tough cross for Democrats to bear. If she runs it will be a great chance for Tom Cotton or even Trump himself to come back into power, if she is actually nominated. Ironically, maybe the only hope is that Democrats pay attention to my horoscope scores more than folks like you do.

Your minions are in the street holding up signs saying "smash socialism" and crying for civil war. You may get it, but it will be your side that is smashed if you start it. Nothing is more ridiculous than your and your half of America's phobia about "socialism." It is a good and necessary, if not sufficient, approach, and no other country is obsessed with hating it. Our rugged, reaganoid individualism is our biggest problem, and you guys are our biggest obstacle to progress in America.

Our side wants a mixed economy, which is what we already have, but maybe a bit more (like health care for all). We want freedom for entrepreneurs, as long as they obey regulations which they should obey voluntarily anyway. Pay your workers a fair and living wage. Approve of higher taxes on the wealthy, and rid yourselves of the delusion that the benefits of not doing this will trickle down. Trickle down don't trickle. It tinkles. Get over your ancient ideologies and you and the country will be MUCH happier. Go ahead and ignore my advice as you always do. We'll fight it out and may the best side win.

(11-13-2020, 04:23 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(11-09-2020, 02:58 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: In short, we don't need your politicians or your third world politics because we are all quite capable of standing on our own two feet and surviving so to speak. Just so you understand what you're really dealing with, the number of individuals like me in the country grew substantially over the last four years and the blues (Democratic side) had to scrap the bottom of the barrel of society for the votes that it needed to win and the situation for most of those who are on the Democratic side ain't going to get better for them than it is for them right now either. What you are going to see is two countries functioning more and more like two countries than anyone has ever seen in this country before now and a realization by those in DC that there is nothing that they are able to do about the growing partisan divide that exists in this country today.

To some extent, this is a belief that one can save money by not buying insurance.  If you don't buy health insurance,  and you don't get sick, you have won, right?  Most people don't get that sick.  For years when working I didn't use my company provided health care except for one case where I sprained a knee playing ultimate frisbee.  Years of paying in with no return.  Then I developed diabetes and had the brain tumor.  The fact that the insurance was there allowed me to fight the various diseases and not worry about finances.  I got good care and didn't go bankrupt.

Having everybody have health care means no one is forced to gamble.  Our society doesn't let people go untreated, at least in normal times.  The emergency room can't turn people away because they are not insured.  So instead, the hospitals jack the price of all health care, and everybody has to pay.  The supposedly independent gambler is just leeching off those who can pay.

Me, I am not that much a gambler.  The idea that if you are in need the government has a policy to get you through is acceptable.  The idea that a certain small but finite number of people are going to be schrod does not seem desirable or acceptable.

(11-13-2020, 04:23 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(11-09-2020, 02:58 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: In short, we don't need your politicians or your third world politics because we are all quite capable of standing on our own two feet and surviving so to speak. Just so you understand what you're really dealing with, the number of individuals like me in the country grew substantially over the last four years and the blues (Democratic side) had to scrap the bottom of the barrel of society for the votes that it needed to win and the situation for most of those who are on the Democratic side ain't going to get better for them than it is for them right now either. What you are going to see is two countries functioning more and more like two countries than anyone has ever seen in this country before now and a realization by those in DC that there is nothing that they are able to do about the growing partisan divide that exists in this country today.

To some extent, this is a belief that one can save money by not buying insurance.  If you don't buy health insurance,  and you don't get sick, you have won, right?  Most people don't get that sick.  For years when working I didn't use my company provided health care except for one case where I sprained a knee playing ultimate frisbee.  Years of paying in with no return.  Then I developed diabetes and had the brain tumor.  The fact that the insurance was there allowed me to fight the various diseases and not worry about finances.  I got good care and didn't go bankrupt.

Having everybody have health care means no one is forced to gamble.  Our society doesn't let people go untreated, at least in normal times.  The emergency room can't turn people away because they are not insured.  So instead, the hospitals jack the price of all health care, and everybody has to pay.  The supposedly independent gambler is just leeching off those who can pay.

Me, I am not that much a gambler.  The idea that if you are in need the government has a policy to get you through is acceptable.  The idea that a certain small but finite number of people are going to be schrod does not seem desirable or acceptable.

(11-13-2020, 12:21 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-09-2020, 11:36 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-09-2020, 04:53 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-08-2020, 04:31 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-08-2020, 12:44 PM)gabrielle Wrote: Eric's system is based upon the electability of the candidate rather than effectiveness of the elected in office, no? This could be subject to change as American tastes and perceptions change, I would think. After all, some astrologers, including Eric, have been predicting that these years we are living in will see a great paradigm shift, due to rare, once-in-a-millennium configurations. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

My system does change over time. It is based on all the candidates in history and the aspects in their charts. As history continues, the database increases and shifts. Nothing in the stars sets our lives in stone. The horoscope indicates to some degree our character, and character is destiny. I believe character can improve, and that's part of the journey of our unfoldment, in this life, and probably from life to life. Yes, paradigms are slowly shifting-- not as fast as I had hoped when I wrote my first book in 1997 (published the same day as The Fourth Turning), but the rhythms of life and the evolution of humanity and planet Earth go on.

There is more in heaven and earth than is dreamt of in limited philosophies, whether they be scientific or spiritual. I can make predictions based on trends. The predictions based on the system are not perfect, but they show the significance of our connection to the cosmos around us. In this case, the "stars" are the planets, centered on the Earth-- the most significant planet in astrology.

It is great that Kamala Harris has made history. However, that will not be a sufficient basis on which to nominate her for president in 2024, or any time. The horoscope scores, although not set in stone, have a degree of accuracy that should be heeded. And we can see them at work. The scores indicate which candidates will connect the best with the "soul of America," as Joe Biden puts it. Now with his victory, his score improved a little bit, enough to barely top The Donald's. So I predicted his victory. It was always going to be a close call, and the two candidates had scores close to each other before the election as well as afterward. 

Kamala Harris, however, does not connect well. Her campaign showed this. The Democrats will need to pick someone else if they want to keep the White House. Unless they do, things will be even worse than they are now, and we will have missed the chance in this 4T to make change. 

Only Theodore Roosevelt is certain to have thoroughly beaten his score. 6 other major party candidates, although only 1 since 1932, have also won although having a slightly lower score than their opponent. Other factors were at work too in these 7 cases. But no-one has ever won or served as president with a score as low as Kamala's. American tastes and perceptions will not change that fast. Even so fast as since the 2019-2020 primary campaign! So, be ready to support someone like Mitch Landrieu, who if nominated will surely win. Soon-to-be-I-hope Secretary of State Susan Rice is another good alternative, or Terry McAuliffe.

http://philosopherswheel.com/presidentialelections.html

So, you tweaked Biden's score a bit after he won to go along with your prediction? What's the point of doing that? You're fortunate that the majority of Blue Americans aren't as sharp as the majority of us  these days or the majority of you would be out of business so to speak. It's kind of cool that we are now divided enough to place each other on ignore and no longer care about the outcomes pertaining to each other these days. So, how are you going to get rid of Harris without causing a rift  along racial and gender lines and further  weakening the Democratic party.

In early October I updated my calculations to make them easier to update and for greater accuracy. And I added all the 2020 viable candidates, including Joe Biden assuming his victory. I also calculated what the aspect points and scores would be if Trump were to win instead. Luckily I don't have to go with that scenario. This was all done by Oct.15, and Biden's new score was better than Trump's. Now, after the election, the new scores reflect the new reality that would have been exactly the same had I waited until after the election to develop them. This time, my prediction was right. I didn't have to change a single thing after Biden won.

I don't know how we are going to get rid of Harris. If she had the candidate skills necessary to win on her own, it would not matter what her identity is. But being chosen mainly because she put her hat in the ring in 2019, and has particular identities, it will be a tough cross for Democrats to bear. If she runs it will be a great chance for Tom Cotton or even Trump himself to come back into power, if she is actually nominated. Ironically, maybe the only hope is that Democrats pay attention to my horoscope scores more than folks like you do.

Your minions are in the street holding up signs saying "smash socialism" and crying for civil war. You may get it, but it will be your side that is smashed if you start it. Nothing is more ridiculous than your and your half of America's phobia about "socialism." It is a good and necessary, if not sufficient, approach, and no other country is obsessed with hating it. Our rugged, reaganoid individualism is our biggest problem, and you guys are our biggest obstacle to progress in America.

Our side wants a mixed economy, which is what we already have, but maybe a bit more (like health care for all). We want freedom for entrepreneurs, as long as they obey regulations which they should obey voluntarily anyway. Pay your workers a fair and living wage. Approve of higher taxes on the wealthy, and rid yourselves of the delusion that the benefits of not doing this will trickle down. Trickle down don't trickle. It tinkles. Get over your ancient ideologies and you and the country will be MUCH happier. Go ahead and ignore my advice as you always do. We'll fight it out and may the best side win.

As I've mentioned before, oil and water doesn't mix and the Democratic side is going to find that out soon enough. Right now, I'm in the mix but not as not as heavily into the mix as the capitalist Democratic supporters who live in California or New York or Illinois these days. Minnesota is mainly capitalist these days. Third World Omar doesn't represent Minnesota/American values and the Democratic supporters who fear her and the segment of society she represents don't represent them either. I feel sorry for that group being they're in a similar position as the Jews/ moderate people of Europe. Like I said, this is going to boil to the Left vs Hard Core America so I hope your ready for a repeat of World War II here buddy. I don't really care who kills you or what kills you, I just know that I'm speaking to a dead man right now and speaking to a bunch of wishful thinkers with cozy blues lives who are going to find themselves being severely impacted one way or another. Do you know who I am. I'm the Devil are far as your concerned and I'm cool with that distinction buddy.

(11-12-2020, 11:21 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-09-2020, 02:58 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-05-2020, 12:06 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-04-2020, 06:04 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: The theory suggests different moods, different styles of action.  In the unravelling there is a lot of talk, compromise, arguing and stalemate.  In the crisis there is a lot of effort to solve problems, and you let go of those values which cause problems.  In the high, you worship the solutions that worked, suppress the values that caused the problems while building infrastructure.

One angle to look at the situation is that there are too many people fond of the old values so it is impossible to solve the problems.  Biden can change the tone.  Unless he has two houses of Congress backing him up, he can’t solve the problems alone.

A part of the problem is an unwillingness to compromise.  We elected a black president.  This resulted in a racist unwillingness to compromise.  Apart from Obamacare, we have not moved much since.  As things are looking, if the red continue this obstruction, the blue will be unable to get anything through congress, and the veto will prevent them from getting anything through congress.  What results is like it or not a continuation of the unravelling.  The problems don’t get solved.

That does not make a lot of sense.  That seems the way we could be heading.

I read a short piece about historical context earlier today.  One of the commenters made the argument that this is the 1850s.  I've always believed that the 1850s were fully a part of the ACW Crisis period (not a lot of support for that, but it's still my view).  We can't have a sectional war this time., because the sections are all intertwined, but that doesn't eliminate anarchic violence, and I think we may have put ourselves there two days ago. 

My county went Trump 3 to1. I'm not surprised, but still can't understand the attraction.  Most of my neighbors are white, educated and financially comfortable.  They're still all-in for the Orange One.  I understand the resentment faction, with declining opportunities and stressed lives. What's with the others like my neighbors?  Is it all 401k, and screw everything else?

We understand/ know what your side represents these days and we don't get caught up in the emotional drama/aspect that's being largely driven by the blue media these days. We are mainly white (although we are less white than we were before Trump was elected) , pretty well educated (we are much better educated and more seasoned than the typical Democratic/Progressive voter these days) and more well rounded than we're given credit for as well.

In short, we don't need your politicians or your third world politics because we are all quite capable of standing on our own two feet and surviving so to speak. Just so you understand what you're really dealing with, the number of individuals like me in the country grew substantially over the last four years and the blues (Democratic side) had to scrap the bottom of the barrel of society for the votes that it needed to win and the situation for most of those who are on the Democratic side ain't going to get better for them than it is for them right now either. What you are going to see is two countries functioning more and more like two countries than anyone has ever seen in this country before now and a realization by those in DC that there is nothing that they are able to do about the growing partisan divide that exists in this country today.

Ha ha. Any survey of the electorate proves that the Democrats/blues/The Left are the college educated, and you guys are not. We are the well-educated ones, not you.

The number of individuals like you grew. That seems to be the case, if you go by the presidential vote. But the number of individuals like me grew even more, if you go by the presidential vote.

(11-13-2020, 01:51 PM)pbrower2a Wrote:

(11-13-2020, 12:21 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-09-2020, 11:36 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-09-2020, 04:53 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-08-2020, 04:31 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: My system does change over time. It is based on all the candidates in history and the aspects in their charts. As history continues, the database increases and shifts. Nothing in the stars sets our lives in stone. The horoscope indicates to some degree our character, and character is destiny. I believe character can improve, and that's part of the journey of our unfoldment, in this life, and probably from life to life. Yes, paradigms are slowly shifting-- not as fast as I had hoped when I wrote my first book in 1997 (published the same day as The Fourth Turning), but the rhythms of life and the evolution of humanity and planet Earth go on.

There is more in heaven and earth than is dreamt of in limited philosophies, whether they be scientific or spiritual. I can make predictions based on trends. The predictions based on the system are not perfect, but they show the significance of our connection to the cosmos around us. In this case, the "stars" are the planets, centered on the Earth-- the most significant planet in astrology.

It is great that Kamala Harris has made history. However, that will not be a sufficient basis on which to nominate her for president in 2024, or any time. The horoscope scores, although not set in stone, have a degree of accuracy that should be heeded. And we can see them at work. The scores indicate which candidates will connect the best with the "soul of America," as Joe Biden puts it. Now with his victory, his score improved a little bit, enough to barely top The Donald's. So I predicted his victory. It was always going to be a close call, and the two candidates had scores close to each other before the election as well as afterward. 

Kamala Harris, however, does not connect well. Her campaign showed this. The Democrats will need to pick someone else if they want to keep the White House. Unless they do, things will be even worse than they are now, and we will have missed the chance in this 4T to make change. 

Only Theodore Roosevelt is certain to have thoroughly beaten his score. 6 other major party candidates, although only 1 since 1932, have also won although having a slightly lower score than their opponent. Other factors were at work too in these 7 cases. But no-one has ever won or served as president with a score as low as Kamala's. American tastes and perceptions will not change that fast. Even so fast as since the 2019-2020 primary campaign! So, be ready to support someone like Mitch Landrieu, who if nominated will surely win. Soon-to-be-I-hope Secretary of State Susan Rice is another good alternative, or Terry McAuliffe.

http://philosopherswheel.com/presidentialelections.html

So, you tweaked Biden's score a bit after he won to go along with your prediction? What's the point of doing that? You're fortunate that the majority of Blue Americans aren't as sharp as the majority of us  these days or the majority of you would be out of business so to speak. It's kind of cool that we are now divided enough to place each other on ignore and no longer care about the outcomes pertaining to each other these days. So, how are you going to get rid of Harris without causing a rift  along racial and gender lines and further  weakening the Democratic party.

In early October I updated my calculations to make them easier to update and for greater accuracy. And I added all the 2020 viable candidates, including Joe Biden assuming his victory. I also calculated what the aspect points and scores would be if Trump were to win instead. Luckily I don't have to go with that scenario. This was all done by Oct.15, and Biden's new score was better than Trump's. Now, after the election, the new scores reflect the new reality that would have been exactly the same had I waited until after the election to develop them. This time, my prediction was right. I didn't have to change a single thing after Biden won.

I don't know how we are going to get rid of Harris. If she had the candidate skills necessary to win on her own, it would not matter what her identity is. But being chosen mainly because she put her hat in the ring in 2019, and has particular identities, it will be a tough cross for Democrats to bear. If she runs it will be a great chance for Tom Cotton or even Trump himself to come back into power, if she is actually nominated. Ironically, maybe the only hope is that Democrats pay attention to my horoscope scores more than folks like you do.

Your minions are in the street holding up signs saying "smash socialism" and crying for civil war. You may get it, but it will be your side that is smashed if you start it. Nothing is more ridiculous than your and your half of America's phobia about "socialism." It is a good and necessary, if not sufficient, approach, and no other country is obsessed with hating it. Our rugged, reaganoid individualism is our biggest problem, and you guys are our biggest obstacle to progress in America.

Our side wants a mixed economy, which is what we already have, but maybe a bit more (like health care for all). We want freedom for entrepreneurs, as long as they obey regulations which they should obey voluntarily anyway. Pay your workers a fair and living wage. Approve of higher taxes on the wealthy, and rid yourselves of the delusion that the benefits of not doing this will trickle down. Trickle down don't trickle. It tinkles. Get over your ancient ideologies and you and the country will be MUCH happier. Go ahead and ignore my advice as you always do. We'll fight it out and may the best side win.

As I've mentioned before, oil and water doesn't mix and the Democratic side is going to find that out soon enough. Right now, I'm in the mix but not as not as heavily into the mix as the capitalist Democratic supporters who live in California or New York or Illinois these days. Minnesota is mainly capitalist these days. Third World Omar doesn't represent Minnesota/American values and the Democratic supporters who fear her and the segment of society she represents don't represent them either. I feel sorry for that group being they're in a similar position as the Jews/ moderate people of Europe. Like I said, this is going to boil to the Left vs Hard Core America so I hope your ready for a repeat of World War II here buddy. I don't really care who kills you or what kills you, I just know that I'm speaking to a dead man right now and speaking to a bunch of wishful thinkers with cozy blues lives who are going to find themselves being severely impacted one way or another. Do you know who I am. I'm the Devil are far as your concerned and I'm cool with that distinction buddy.

"Third World Omar" is in Minnesota, and not Somalia. She made a choice, and she ended up in a place very different from Somalia  -- even in climate.




(as you will notice, Somalia is mostly hot desert and secondarily hot semi-desert, with a pair of small areas with tropical savanna. Minnesota has real winters everywhere, and places in Minnesota such as the Twin Cities and Mankato are just warm enough in the summer to require air conditioners for optimal comfort. But you don't have to go to the Third World to experience hot desert (Phoenix, Tucson, Palm Springs, Bakersfield, Las Vegas, and arguably El Paso or St. George, Utah will suffice) or hot steppe (Lancaster, California, or Midland or Odessa in Texas). Tropical savanna? South Florida... Key West is surprisingly dry). 

Of course America is as capitalist as it can be, considering that Big Business mucks up so much and demands so much that America needs Big Government just to meet the needs of Big Business for human capital (a skilled workforce) and infrastructure such as streets and sewers and courts of laws for deciding disputes and judging the most blatant miscreants. If you want to live where there is no government... well, there is Somalia. Plenty of guns, and the culture is clearly male-chauvinist. Of course, where government is weak, lynching is the style. That is ugly. 

Considering that with the distinctions of class, region, ethnicity, religious heritage, and sexual orientation that already exist, there are plenty of possible ways to be an American. Get this clear: a gay male, middle-class, Japanese-American Buddhist-Shinto fusion in California is just as American as a straight, female, economically-wrecked, Christian Protestant fundamentalist in West Virginia. Those two people may have only two things in common: that they are both Americans with light skin color. This is one of the most important realities in America, and when we all understand this we are well on the way to solving the divisions that some ruthless, amoral people have sought to impose and exploit for questionable purposes.   Difference is legitimate because it is unavoidable and inevitable. Need I calculate the permutations of ways in which it is possible to be an American? 

Violent schism? Welcome to Somalia, a place that "Third World Omar" fled.  

Need I tell you about Dearborn, Michigan again? It's a reasonably good place to live if you have some family values, but a place to leave immediately if you are a whore, pimp, drunk, druggie, or criminal. Better the mosque than the whorehouse. It has one of the largest percentages of Muslims in a small city in America, and it is far more livable than the abutting southwest side of Detroit, a moral cesspool of alcoholism, drugs, prostitution, and sexually-oriented businesses. I am secular -- but I am not that sort of secular. 

Yes, I have very conservative family values, and I believe in law and order as necessary for a civil society. I am for LGBT rights because those are more compatible with law and order and family values than is their denial. As a serial adulterer who has ditched wives for newer models and who has had an affair with someone in the 'sexual entertainment business' to whom he has paid hush money, and a sleazy operator in business and politics, Donald Trump offends my sensibilities.

(11-13-2020, 03:20 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Liberalism is the diametric opposite of fascism.

I am careful to avoid calling any elected official a word referring to feces. I will save that for...

To call this person a piece of shit is to insult shit.

Peter William Sutcliffe (2 June 1946 – 13 November 2020), also known as Peter William Coonan, was an English serial killer who was dubbed the Yorkshire Ripper by the press. On 22 May 1981, Sutcliffe was convicted of murdering 13 women and attempting to murder seven others. He was sentenced to 20 concurrent sentences of life imprisonment, which were converted to a whole life order in 2010. All except two of his murders took place in West Yorkshire; the others were in Manchester.


Sutcliffe initially attacked women and girls in residential areas, but appeared to have moved to red light districts because he was attracted by the vulnerability of prostitutes.[1][2] Sutcliffe had allegedly regularly used the services of prostitutes in Leeds and Bradford. He carried out murders over five years, from 1975 to 1980.[3] After his arrest in Sheffield by South Yorkshire Police for driving with false number plates in January 1981, he was transferred to West Yorkshire Police, who questioned him about the killings. He confessed to being the perpetrator, saying that the voice of God had sent him on a mission to kill prostitutes. At his trial, Sutcliffe pleaded not guilty to murder on grounds of diminished responsibility, but he was convicted of murder on a majority verdict. Following his conviction, Sutcliffe began using his mother's maiden name of Coonan.

West Yorkshire Police were criticised for their failure to catch Sutcliffe despite having interviewed him nine times in the course of their five-year investigation. Because of the sensational nature of the case, the police handled an exceptional amount of information, some of it misleading (including the Wearside Jack hoax recorded message and letters purporting to be from the "Ripper"). Following Sutcliffe's conviction, the government ordered a review of the investigation, conducted by Lawrence Byford, known as the "Byford Report". The findings were made fully public in 2006 and confirmed the validity of the criticism against the force. The report led to changes to investigative procedures which were adopted across UK police forces.[4] In 2019, The Guardian described the manhunt as "stunningly mishandled".[5]

Sutcliffe was transferred from prison to a high-security psychiatric hospital in March 1984 after being diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia.[6] The High Court dismissed an appeal by Sutcliffe in 2010, confirming that he would serve a whole life order and never be released from custody. In August 2016, it was ruled that Sutcliffe was mentally fit to be returned to prison, and he was transferred that month to HM Prison Frankland in Durham. He died on 13 November 2020 at the age of 74.

(11-13-2020, 03:20 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Liberalism is the diametric opposite of fascism.

I am careful to avoid calling any elected official a word referring to feces. I will save that for...

(11-13-2020, 10:00 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: This ought to be good for quick censure in the next Congress. Advocating violence and acts of at most marginal legality involving a federal election (for president) is... well, fecal behavior.

Republican Congressman Helped Organize Ugly Far-Right Protest Against Election Result

Rep. Paul Gosar (R-Ariz.) rallied in Maricopa County last week with extremists intent on undermining democracy.
  

Three days before Joe Biden was officially projected to win the presidency, a group of at least 150 Donald Trump supporters ― some of them armed militia members ― assembled in the parking lot outside the Maricopa County Recorder’s Office, convinced the fix was in.


Nevermind that Fox News had called Arizona for Biden. Leaders of the AZ Patriots militia raged about Sharpiegate, a debunked conspiracy theory spread by Trump’s adult sons. Far-right activist Mike Cernovich barreled in from his home in Southern California to lead the crowd in a “Stop the Steal” chant and to lend his massive Twitter platform to the effort to delegitimize U.S. democracy.
But among the crowd peppered with extremists — some of whom may have violated local laws and intimidated election officials who continued to count ballots — was a member of Congress known for peddling disinformation and bigotry. Rep. Paul Gosar (R-Ariz) played a key role in amplifying the rally only days after he easily won reelection in Arizona’s neighboring 4th Congressional District.

“We’re fighting to the bitter end,” Gosar told the crowd, speaking through a megaphone. “This is our Alamo.”
Earlier in the evening, AZ Patriots members had barged into the elections center, looking for nonexistent evidence of fraud. Maricopa County Sheriff’s Office deputies politely escorted them out. Years of falsehoods from Trump and his right-wing propagandists had conditioned protesters to believe disinformation about a rigged election. And to hate the media.

Predictably, they soon turned their wrath on local television reporters there to cover the results, shouting profanities and “fake news” at them.

When Kim Powell, a reporter for the local CBS affiliate, arrived at the protest just before 8 p.m., protesters targeted her immediately. One Trump supporter yelling “fake news” approached Powell from behind in an effort to get on camera. Powell’s security guard blocked him. The protester then threatened to find where Powell and her cameraman live. He returned to the crowd and began pointing out the reporter to other people, according to Powell. Soon, five men began circling her and her cameraman, glaring at them. The journalists left, fearing for their safety.

“It almost felt like we were being circled by hyenas,” Powell told HuffPost. Her cameraman recorded footage of the initial harassment and filed a police report.

The protesters were so rowdy that election workers needed a police escort back to their cars at the end of the night. If the crowd caused those workers to feel threatened or intimidated, it would violate an Arizona law that prohibits interfering with election officers on duty, according to Tom Ryan, an attorney in nearby Chandler, Arizona, who specializes in election law.


“That’s a class 5 felony,” Ryan said. “That’s punishable with prison. That’s a serious felony.” The militia members who entered the election center may have committed that crime and, according to the attorney, “should have been arrested immediately.”


The Maricopa County Sheriff’s Office did not respond to a request for more information by the time of publication.



Ryan says the protest was clearly orchestrated. “This wasn’t just a grassroots swelling of citizens,” he said. “These people had pre-manufactured signs. They all showed up based on a social media notice to come to Maricopa County and protest.”



Gosar had more than a little to do with that. The congressman has two Twitter accounts ― one for his work as a federal official and a second, personal account. He used his personal Twitter to baselessly assert that “some shady things” were happening in Arizona. He also used Twitter to coordinate Wednesday’s protest with Cernovich, a longtime dirty trickster who works with numerous far-right extremists. The original plan was to rally outside the Arizona State Capitol building, but the organizers soon shifted the location to the elections center.


For years, law enforcement and social media executives have allowed Cernovich, who did not respond to HuffPost’s request for comment, to spread disinformation that has real-world, sometimes dangerous, effects. In 2016, he and neo-Nazi collaborator Jack Posobiec, who is now a One America News correspondent, orchestrated Pizzagate, which almost got diners in a Washington, D.C., pizza restaurant killed. Since then, Gosar has interacted with Cernovich on Twitter many times, frequently praising the Kremlin-amplified propagandist.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/paul-gosar-far-right-protest-arizona_n_5fada218c5b6370e7e311861

Personal comment: what part of "Awful, awful, quite unlawful!" do you not understand? 

(11-14-2020, 12:35 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-13-2020, 03:20 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Liberalism is the diametric opposite of fascism.

I am careful to avoid calling any elected official a word referring to feces. I will save that for...

What's your point? You're not careful to avoid calling elected officials that you don't like something bad and neither am I. Dude, I'd call her a piece of shit to her face and if she wants to call me a racist for doing it that's fine because there's plenty of proof that I'm not one. Dude, this country is becoming American minority enough to strip a piece of shit black woman of every special protection that she thinks/feels she has today. Times are changing and the American people are waking up. The Democratic people are still centered on themselves and their issues. The only shared issue is COVID right now.

(11-14-2020, 01:14 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-14-2020, 12:35 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-13-2020, 03:20 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Liberalism is the diametric opposite of fascism.

I am careful to avoid calling any elected official a word referring to feces. I will save that for...

What's your point? You're not careful to avoid calling elected officials that you don't like something bad and neither am I. Dude, I'd call her a piece of shit to her face and if she wants to call me a racist for doing it that's fine because there's plenty of proof that I'm not one. Dude, this country is becoming American minority enough to strip a piece of shit black woman of every special protection that she thinks/feels she has today. Times are changing and the American people are waking up. The Democratic people are still centered on themselves and their issues. The only shared issue is COVID right now.

That's another problem; COVID is not a shared issue because your side has politicized it and encouraged people not to wear masks or socially distance or get tested. Is your side going to get vaccinated?

(11-14-2020, 02:11 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-14-2020, 01:14 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-14-2020, 12:35 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-13-2020, 03:20 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Liberalism is the diametric opposite of fascism.

I am careful to avoid calling any elected official a word referring to feces. I will save that for...

What's your point? You're not careful to avoid calling elected officials that you don't like something bad and neither am I. Dude, I'd call her a piece of shit to her face and if she wants to call me a racist for doing it that's fine because there's plenty of proof that I'm not one. Dude, this country is becoming American minority enough to strip a piece of shit black woman of every special protection that she thinks/feels she has today. Times are changing and the American people are waking up. The Democratic people are still centered on themselves and their issues. The only shared issue is COVID right now.

That's another problem; COVID is not a shared issue because your side has politicized it and encouraged people not to wear masks or socially distance or get tested. Is your side going to get vaccinated?

Biden ran on COVID, the blue media conducted a COVID fear campaign for months that traumatized a significant portion of the country and Biden probably won the election because of it and now you're accusing me/ our side of politicizing it. Give me a break. Do we really need to get vaccinated when those who are at high risk are vaccinated? Dude, I've been out and about in public working and shopping and socializing during the pandemic for months. I know that I've either been directly exposed or actually had it in January after Christmas or probably had it without knowing it. I assume the older/high risk people will get vaccinated despite Biden being in office. They're not a bunch of traumatized Biden supporters, so I doubt Biden being in office will matter to them like it would have with the Democratic supporters with Trump in office.

(11-14-2020, 01:14 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: The people can get rid of gerrymandering if at any time they vote for Democrats for state legislators. Some states have initiatives they can vote for. Our side is going to need to get rid of gerrymandering so that we can actually have a government that represents the people. What your side wants, Classic Xer, is for politicians to choose their voters, rather than voters choose their politicians. Your side is interested only in tyranny and in undermining democracy. Your side does not value democracy, and that's why you also vote for Nero/Mussolini as your president.

(11-14-2020, 04:01 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: Your side did it. You politicized it. Encouraging people to express their "freedom" by not observing the behavior that could have stopped the virus. If Trump had stayed in office, he would have botched distribution of the vaccine just like he botched the distribution of protective equipment and testing.

(11-14-2020, 04:46 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-14-2020, 04:01 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: Your side did it. You politicized it. Encouraging people to express their "freedom" by not observing the behavior that could have stopped the virus. If Trump had stayed in office, he would have botched distribution of the vaccine just like he botched the distribution of protective equipment and testing.

Do you wing it and make shit up all the time? I bet Biden uses Trumps distribution plan for the vaccine that Trump eliminated the bureaucratic red (tape) that paved the way for it's development in record time. I'd say that it's impossible to distribute protective equipment and testing equipment the country doesn't have at the time and no longer manufactures. All in all, I think Trump did a pretty good job myself considering we were blind sided by an unknown virus at the time. I can't wait for Biden to get in office so I can be as nasty and critical and as unrealistic about whatever he does or doesn't do like you guys have been doing with Trump.

(11-14-2020, 04:06 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-14-2020, 01:14 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: The people can get rid of gerrymandering if at any time they vote for Democrats for state legislators. Some states have initiatives they can vote for. Our side is going to need to get rid of gerrymandering so that we can actually have a government that represents the people. What your side wants, Classic Xer, is for politicians to choose their voters, rather than voters choose their politicians. Your side is interested only in tyranny and in undermining democracy. Your side does not value democracy, and that's why you also vote for Nero/Mussolini as your president.

You won't agree with me but your side seems to be flirting with tyranny right now. You should pay more attention to what you write and release for public consumption. I assume that your side is so used to speaking to it's own crowd that it forgets while in the presence of members associated with the other side. So, how long do you think it's going to be before our side has national platforms that match yours and a national channel with a conservative slant that everyone gets for free? Your side pretty much pulled out all the stops and laid it all on line to win this election for Biden which was an eye opener for the entire American right. In a way, if there's a time that you don't want a Democrat in office, the time is now. Oh, the time that the American right is actually looking to the government to do something is now as well.