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(01-10-2017, 10:46 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: (01-10-2017, 04:11 PM)Mikebert Wrote: (01-09-2017, 06:24 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Pumpkin pie is delicious, especially with a scoop of ice cream.
I'm on team, apple. It figures 
Pecan pie is the only pie worth having. Too bad we didn't elect Cruz.
Cruz never had a chance. Trump is a better choice.
… whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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(01-11-2017, 09:12 AM)radind Wrote: (01-10-2017, 10:46 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: (01-10-2017, 04:11 PM)Mikebert Wrote: (01-09-2017, 06:24 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Pumpkin pie is delicious, especially with a scoop of ice cream.
I'm on team, apple. It figures
Pecan pie is the only pie worth having. Too bad we didn't elect Cruz.
Cruz never had a chance. Trump is a better choice.
-- Bernie was the best choice. But between Big Ted & the Donald.... actually l don't choose either one. But we are stuck with the Donald so we must deal with it
 my 2 yr old Niece/yr old Nephew 2020
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(01-11-2017, 09:32 AM)Marypoza Wrote: (01-11-2017, 09:12 AM)radind Wrote: (01-10-2017, 10:46 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: (01-10-2017, 04:11 PM)Mikebert Wrote: (01-09-2017, 06:24 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Pumpkin pie is delicious, especially with a scoop of ice cream.
I'm on team, apple. It figures
Pecan pie is the only pie worth having. Too bad we didn't elect Cruz.
Cruz never had a chance. Trump is a better choice.
-- Bernie was the best choice. But between Big Ted & the Donald.... actually l don't choose either one. But we are stuck with the Donald so we must deal with it
I had concerns with Bernie, but did think that he was honest.
It would be great for us deal with the Trump election, but I am not hopeful so far.
… whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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He's beginning to look more like America's Mussolini:
Quote:President-elect Donald Trump refused to take a question from CNN reporter Jim Acosta during a press conference Wednesday, calling the network “fake news.”
Acosta repeatedly tried to get Trump’s attention during the president-elect’s first press conference in six months.
“You are fake news!” Trump yelled at the reporter while refusing to answer his questions.
Throughout the press conference, Trump and his team decried a report that CNN published Tuesday, which said intelligence officials had presented Trump with claims that Russian operatives say they have compromising personal and financial information about the president-elect.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/dona...7a465ccc0b
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.
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Did Mussolini refuse to take questions from a reporter at CNN as well?
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(01-12-2017, 03:43 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: Did Mussolini refuse to take questions from a reporter at CNN as well?
There was practically no press freedom in Italy under Mussolini. It took a couple of years for Mussolini to utterly destroy democracy in Italy.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.
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Well, when you put it like that, the parallel is clear. Trump is in fact Mussolini. It's just a small step from here (the thing with the CNN reporter) to the suspension of elections and the rise of paramilitary elements with great uniforms. First they came for CNN, which I thought had become a terrible network and hadn't watched for more than 5 minutes at a time in years, and so I did not speak out...
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Dr. Lawrence Britt has examined the fascist regimes of Hitler (Germany), Mussolini (Italy), Franco (Spain), Suharto (Indonesia) and several Latin American regimes. Britt found 14 defining characteristics common to each:
Powerful and Continuing Nationalism - "Make America Great Again!"
Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights - Donald's open sanctioning of torture
Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause - Muslims or Mexicans take your pick.
Supremacy of the Military - N/A
Rampant Sexism - Donald's sexism is a matter of public record
Controlled Mass Media - Donald is advocating being able to sue any media outlet that writes something bad about him.
Obsession with National Security - Donald has played the terrorism card over and over again.
Religion and Government are Intertwined - Donald frequently questions the faith of his opponents and has even had a fight with the Pope over faith.
Corporate Power is Protected - One look at Donald's economic plans will show you that.
Labor Power is Suppressed - Donald favors taking down the unions.
Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts - In fairness Donald shows a lot of disdain these are just among them
Obsession with Crime and Punishment - A major part of his campaign
Rampant Cronyism and Corruption - N/A
Fraudulent Elections - Donald hasn't directly been involved but his party is frequently responsible for fraudulent elections and stealing voter's rights.
http://www.rense.com/general37/char.htm
(Supremacy of the military) Well, he is having a stormy relationship with the Armed Forces. I can see a purge coming.
(Corruption and cronyism) He is a corrupt businessman, and I expect no improvement at that.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.
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I agree, you should abandon all hope.
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(01-12-2017, 05:44 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: I agree, you should abandon all hope.
I now have great hope.
… whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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01-12-2017, 10:03 AM
(This post was last modified: 01-12-2017, 10:29 AM by TeacherinExile.
Edit Reason: Correction
)
(01-12-2017, 05:17 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: Well, when you put it like that, the parallel is clear. Trump is in fact Mussolini. It's just a small step from here (the thing with the CNN reporter) to the suspension of elections and the rise of paramilitary elements with great uniforms. First they came for CNN, which I thought had become a terrible network and hadn't watched for more than 5 minutes at a time in years, and so I did not speak out...
Trump strikes the pose of a Mussolini onstage, that's about it. I will say, however, that Trump is playing a very dangerous game with the press. Nixon also had an adversarial relationship with the press, but Trump is taking his hostility to a whole new level.
I share with you a similar disdain for cable news. My GF and I don't subscribe to--much less watch--what passes for news on CNN, FOX or MSNBC. (Our basic cable package doesn't include them.) I don't miss any of them at all. No, I get my "fake news" the old-fashioned way--I "read all about it." Here's a good example why I tune cable news out:
Rachel Maddow: Will Donald Trump Send Me To A Camp?
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2..._camp.html
When Maddow is asked what "first question" she would pose to Trump in an imaginary interview--which I hardly doubt he'll ever grant her--she answers half-jokingly. Yet methinks there is something to her answer that is emblematic of the near-hysteria about Trump emanating from the Left.
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Yeah, cable news in general (Fox, CNN, MSNBC, etc.) is pretty terrible in general. Of course, I really don't watch it because I don't own a television. Reading became my pastime of choice at a young age, and that is how I prefer to receive information. My only quibble now with reading the news is that it necessarily comes through the filter of the author's perceptions and biases, and I have simply lost trust in journalism as a profession.
Berlusconi is at least a decent comparison. These incessant "Trump is Hitler, no, Trump is Mussolini... He's Hitlerini! memes going around are the worst sort of garbage.
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(01-12-2017, 10:28 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: Yeah, cable news in general (Fox, CNN, MSNBC, etc.) is pretty terrible in general. Of course, I really don't watch it because I don't own a television. Reading became my pastime of choice at a young age, and that is how I prefer to receive information. My only quibble now with reading the news is that it necessarily comes through the filter of the author's perceptions and biases, and I have simply lost trust in journalism as a profession.
Berlusconi is at least a decent comparison. These incessant "Trump is Hitler, no, Trump is Mussolini... He's Hitlerini! memes going around are the worst sort of garbage.
The Fourth Estate failed us miserably during the presidential campaign. The movie Network has proved so prescient. When TV news departments became profit centers, ratings became the name of the game, the truth be damned. Look up the comments of the CBS executive when pressed as to why Trump was getting the lion's share of TV news coverage. I recently watched the movie Truth about the fall of CBS news anchor Dan Rather, with Robert Redford in the starring role. Of course, Rather comes off looking like a hero. But the dramatization of events tends to gloss over the sloppy journalistic work of him and his assistants in developing their expose of George W. Bush's alleged "absence without leave" while serving in the Texas Air National Guard. The film simply reinforced my jaundiced view of modern journalism--its depiction of the rush to get a "scoop" right before the re-election of Bush. It's becoming harder and harder to discern the truth from "fake news," and I'd like to think that I'm a discriminating reader, as I assume some posters on this forum are as well. But even I must admit that the blurring of truth and "truthiness" has posed an especial challenge for me in our "post-fact" world. That, coupled with what I perceive to be a growing civic ignorance, is a dagger aimed at the very heart of our democracy.
As for the imminent prospect of tyranny (Shame on you, Robert Reich; you should know better)... How will we know when fascism has truly arrived on American shores? When people in the streets holding up signs saying "Trump Is a Fascist" are suddenly "disappeared," that's how. Of course, by then the proverbial "frog in the pot" will already be hardboiled, and it will be much too late to mount any real resistance. (Even for those paramilitary types dressed in camouflage and running around in the woods with their assault rifles.)
My fear all along is not so much Trump the man, but the Trumpism that may survive him. After all, McCarthyism has reared its head now and again, long after that disgraced senator from Wisconsin passed from the scene. Once we allow any space at all for political leaders-- above all, our presidents--to defy the Constitution or international law, we set ourselves on a very dangerous path. I remember the chill that shot down my spine when David Frost interviewed a not-too-chastened Richard Nixon, post-Watergate:
Frost:...Would you say that there are certain situations - and the Huston Plan was one of them - where the president can decide that it's in the best interests of the nation, and do something illegal?
Nixon: Well, when the president does it, that means it is not illegal.
Of course, Nixon's widely quoted response since then has been taken out of its proper context. Still...
As for me, I will simply watch for the signposts of an emergent fascism--as I understand it from my reading of history--knowing that we have only briefly flirted with it in the past. We are some ways yet from any real menace. Conditions are not yet ripe enough, though they may be slowly ripening all the same.
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(01-12-2017, 09:29 AM)radind Wrote: (01-12-2017, 05:44 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: I agree, you should abandon all hope.
I now have great hope.
you like fascism.
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(01-12-2017, 09:29 AM)radind Wrote: (01-12-2017, 05:44 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: I agree, you should abandon all hope.
I now have great hope.
(01-12-2017, 03:31 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Trump IS Mussolini
Fascism always reminds me of the schoolyard bully that I did everything possible to get away from. I know of a couple of them -- who went to prison to face the biggest bully of them all, the state penal system.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.
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(01-12-2017, 03:30 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: (01-12-2017, 09:29 AM)radind Wrote: (01-12-2017, 05:44 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: I agree, you should abandon all hope.
I now have great hope.
you like fascism.
At least he's hopeful. I mean, say what you will about the tenets of National Socialism, AT LEAST it's an ethos!
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(01-12-2017, 05:29 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: (01-12-2017, 03:30 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: (01-12-2017, 09:29 AM)radind Wrote: (01-12-2017, 05:44 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: I agree, you should abandon all hope.
I now have great hope.
you like fascism.
At least he's hopeful. I mean, say what you will about the tenets of National Socialism, AT LEAST it's an ethos!
I have no use for fascism. I don't see Trump as a fascist.
… whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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01-12-2017, 06:03 PM
(This post was last modified: 01-12-2017, 06:06 PM by David Horn.)
(01-10-2017, 10:19 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: (01-10-2017, 09:05 AM)David Horn Wrote: The guy exiting the scene is our own Hamlet. I don't think DJT is Macbeth, but he aspires to be Prospero. In any case, he has theater written all over him.
Would that make Ivanka Miranda? Hillary Clinton Sycorax?
There's nothing worse than taking a metaphor one step too far. 
On the other hand, applying a judicious helping of Shakespeare can't really hurt.
Intelligence is not knowledge and knowledge is not wisdom, but they all play well together.
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