What the left has devolved to.

[Eric the Green]

Right; you anti-immigrant (xenophobe) folks have joined forces with you trickle-down economics Reaganomics folks now.

[Classic-Xer]

(02-06-2017, 07:32 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Right; you anti-immigrant (xenophobe) folks have joined forces with you trickle-down economics Reaganomics folks now.

You meant, you anti-illegal immigration (pro American law and order) folks right. I'd rather be one of them than be the anti-American, anti-capitalism, anti-American Constitution, pro-illegal immigration, anti-republic, anti-law enforcement, anti-cop folks, anti-national security folks on the left.

[Ragnarök_62]

(02-06-2017, 11:47 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-06-2017, 07:32 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Right; you anti-immigrant (xenophobe) folks have joined forces with you trickle-down economics Reaganomics folks now.

You meant, you anti-illegal immigration (pro American law and order) folks right. I'd rather be one of them than be the anti-American, anti-capitalism, anti-American Constitution, pro-illegal immigration, anti-republic, anti-law enforcement, anti-cop folks, anti-national security folks on the left.

Uh, maybe Eric's pro Zika and pro dengue fever? One never knows what diseases illegals carry since they don't get checked by border doctors like my Swedish ancestors. I'm a tropical diseaseophobe myself.

[Eric the Green]

In CA illegals are not allowed to remain in the shadows; they can get social services and health services.

I'm not any of those things Classic says (and he IS what I say he is; typical), but I'm sure I lean in that direction too far for him, in his point of view. Too bad 40% of the people (including him) have such disdain for liberals, which after all make America what it is, supposedly, a "liberal" democracy, not the authoritarian state which Republicans want.

[Galen]

(02-07-2017, 01:45 AM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: I'm not any of those things Classic says (and he IS what I say he is; typical), but I'm sure I lean in that direction too far for him, in his point of view. Too bad 40% of the people (including him) have such disdain for liberals, which after all make America what it is, supposedly, a "liberal" democracy, not the authoritarian state which Republicans want.

Liberals haven't been for they very long time.  They have devolved into a nasty bunch of authoritarians who shout racist or some other such nonsense at the slightest provocation.  Has it occurred to you that people are starting to hate the left more than they do Trump.  You would do well to listen to what Rubin has to say Obtuse One.

[The Wonkette]

(02-06-2017, 12:31 PM)gabrielle Wrote:

(02-05-2017, 03:14 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: I see he's a fan of Katy Perry as well.  I hope that she, and the rest of her fans, do some soul-searching over this. 

As far as I know, Katy Perry isn't calling for a "Muslim ban" or Muslim citizen registry or retooling the Countering Violent Terrorism program to "Countering Islamic Extremism."

If I read Someguy correctly, he was making a snarky comment about the quality of Katy Perry's music, not a political statement. Someguy can correct me if I misread him.

[SomeGuy]

Gladly, Ms. Wonk.  

I was simply pointing out the silliness of drawing sweeping conclusions based on what some random weirdo liked on his Facebook page.


Katy Perry is hot.  Her music?

*shrugs*

I have no strong feelings either way.

[Classic-Xer]

(02-07-2017, 03:40 PM)X_4AD_84 Wrote:

(02-04-2017, 11:40 PM)gabrielle Wrote: Since you guys ignored me earlier, I am forced to repeat myself in a simpler and more direct fashion.

Why is there a 10+ page thread devoted to a few broken windows and fires at Berkeley yet no mention of what happened a week ago, when A TRUMP SUPPORTER MURDERED PEOPLE just for being Muslim?

Because it's more fun to make fun of us Californians.

In spite of our extreme value add and extreme contributions to the national Treasury, we have become everyone's favorite whipping children. Granted having our excess share of mouthy gadflies some of whom are either idiots or are in The Bubble, does create a target rich environment, meanwhile the concentration of media and "sexy" tech firms may incite envy leading to wrath.

Would America lose the bulk of its value add and the bulk of its contributions to the national Treasury? I don't think so. I think the bulk of it would pack up and move to the American states where it doesn't have to deal with so-called liberal shit. Anyway, Trump has my permission to push the so-called liberals to the brink of disaster.

[pbrower2a]

(02-08-2017, 08:04 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-07-2017, 03:40 PM)X_4AD_84 Wrote:

(02-04-2017, 11:40 PM)gabrielle Wrote: Since you guys ignored me earlier, I am forced to repeat myself in a simpler and more direct fashion.

Why is there a 10+ page thread devoted to a few broken windows and fires at Berkeley yet no mention of what happened a week ago, when A TRUMP SUPPORTER MURDERED PEOPLE just for being Muslim?

Because it's more fun to make fun of us Californians.

In spite of our extreme value add and extreme contributions to the national Treasury, we have become everyone's favorite whipping children. Granted having our excess share of mouthy gadflies some of whom are either idiots or are in The Bubble, does create a target rich environment, meanwhile the concentration of media and "sexy" tech firms may incite envy leading to wrath.

Would America lose the bulk of its value add and the bulk of  its contributions to the national Treasury? I don't think so. I think the bulk of it  would pack up and move to the American states where it doesn't have to deal with so-called liberal shit. Anyway, Trump has my permission to push the so-called liberals to the brink of disaster.

Much of the income in America is now intellectual property.  Think of the most expensive appliance in your house, and divide its value (either replacement cost or initial cost) by its lifetime.  That's most likely your refrigerator. Now compare that to the amount that you spend on recorded music and videos, books, magazines, ant tickets to theaters and concerts. Where do you spend more of your  money? Now contemplate how much money is spent on computer software just in business.

OK, I forgot your car. I am reminded of what Lee Iacocca said of high technology -- much of the most expensive high technology goes into vehicles and energy extraction.

Maybe the engineers are slightly conservative -- but most of the other creative people are liberals. Creative activities attract liberals because people who think outside the box generally aren't authoritarian right-wingers. OK, Hitler (a fascist) and Churchill (an arch-conservative) were both painters... and Churchill seems to have been good enough that [snark]if he hadn't wasted his talent on saving Western Christian Civilization from a not-so-great artist he might have made a good living and be quite famous for his art[/snark].

But all in all, people who have creative talent are generally not drawn to money-grubbing finance or to machine-paced work -- and they tend to be liberals. Even with the engineers, many are members of vulnerable ethnic and religious groups...

If you want to lose much of America's GNP, then chase off the creative people.  Creative people are far more mobile, and they have no value to take with them but their creativity. But what value! Think of how great German cinema was around 1930; it rivaled American cinema. But much of that talent was liberal or Jewish and it had to leave for more tolerant places -- like Hollywood. Much of the talent behind the Golden Age of Hollywood had fled Hitler.

...Coastal California is a paradise for scenery, climate, and culture, and one pays a high price for living there. But who would want to live in rural central Illinois unless one is very sentimental or owns a lucrative farm? Winters are cold and bleak, and summers are oppressively hot and humid; it is part of Tornado Alley. For someone passing through by car, the scenery is best appreciated at night because of the topography (seemingly-endless, featureless flatland). Culture? Go to Chicago or perhaps St. Louis.

[Ragnarök_62]

SJW goes off the deep end:

STOP HATING ON SONIC!  

[Marypoza]

(02-09-2017, 03:31 AM)pbrower2a Wrote:

(02-08-2017, 08:04 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-07-2017, 03:40 PM)X_4AD_84 Wrote:

(02-04-2017, 11:40 PM)gabrielle Wrote: Since you guys ignored me earlier, I am forced to repeat myself in a simpler and more direct fashion.

Why is there a 10+ page thread devoted to a few broken windows and fires at Berkeley yet no mention of what happened a week ago, when A TRUMP SUPPORTER MURDERED PEOPLE just for being Muslim?

Because it's more fun to make fun of us Californians.

In spite of our extreme value add and extreme contributions to the national Treasury, we have become everyone's favorite whipping children. Granted having our excess share of mouthy gadflies some of whom are either idiots or are in The Bubble, does create a target rich environment, meanwhile the concentration of media and "sexy" tech firms may incite envy leading to wrath.

Would America lose the bulk of its value add and the bulk of  its contributions to the national Treasury? I don't think so. I think the bulk of it  would pack up and move to the American states where it doesn't have to deal with so-called liberal shit. Anyway, Trump has my permission to push the so-called liberals to the brink of disaster.

Much of the income in America is now intellectual property.  Think of the most expensive appliance in your house, and divide its value (either replacement cost or initial cost) by its lifetime.  That's most likely your refrigerator. Now compare that to the amount that you spend on recorded music and videos, books, magazines, ant tickets to theaters and concerts. Where do you spend more of your  money? Now contemplate how much money is spent on computer software just in business.

OK, I forgot your car. I am reminded of what Lee Iacocca said of high technology -- much of the most expensive high technology goes into vehicles and energy extraction.

Maybe the engineers are slightly conservative -- but most of the other creative people are liberals. Creative activities attract liberals because people who think outside the box generally aren't authoritarian right-wingers. OK, Hitler (a fascist) and Churchill (an arch-conservative) were both painters... and Churchill seems to have been good enough that [snark]if he hadn't wasted his talent on saving Western Christian Civilization from a not-so-great artist he might have made a good living and be quite famous for his art[/snark].

But all in all, people who have creative talent are generally not drawn to money-grubbing finance or to machine-paced work -- and they tend to be liberals. Even with the engineers, many are members of vulnerable ethnic and religious groups...

If you want to lose much of America's GNP, then chase off the creative people.  Creative people are far more mobile, and they have no value to take with them but their creativity. But what value! Think of how great German cinema was around 1930; it rivaled American cinema. But much of that talent was liberal or Jewish and it had to leave for more tolerant places -- like Hollywood. Much of the talent behind the Golden Age of Hollywood had fled Hitler.

...Coastal California is a paradise for scenery, climate, and culture, and one pays a high price for living there. But who would want to live in rural central Illinois unless one is very sentimental or owns a lucrative farm? Winters are cold and bleak, and summers are oppressively hot and humid; it is part of Tornado Alley. For someone passing through by car, the scenery is best appreciated at night because of the topography (seemingly-endless, featureless flatland). Culture? Go to Chicago or perhaps St. Louis.

--  tell me about it. Last summer I had to drive 64 thu lL & IN to get to a wedding in St Louis & then back home. Dreary boring landscape (StL was cool, however) & Michigrim is pretty grim itself. I have an Aunt & Uncle who used to live near Detroit & l can remember going to visit them & thinking, what dreary landscape. That was in the summer when school was out. I have no desire to go up there during wintertime

[Eric the Green]

(02-08-2017, 08:04 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-07-2017, 03:40 PM)X_4AD_84 Wrote:

(02-04-2017, 11:40 PM)gabrielle Wrote: Since you guys ignored me earlier, I am forced to repeat myself in a simpler and more direct fashion.

Why is there a 10+ page thread devoted to a few broken windows and fires at Berkeley yet no mention of what happened a week ago, when A TRUMP SUPPORTER MURDERED PEOPLE just for being Muslim?

Because it's more fun to make fun of us Californians.

In spite of our extreme value add and extreme contributions to the national Treasury, we have become everyone's favorite whipping children. Granted having our excess share of mouthy gadflies some of whom are either idiots or are in The Bubble, does create a target rich environment, meanwhile the concentration of media and "sexy" tech firms may incite envy leading to wrath.

Would America lose the bulk of its value add and the bulk of its contributions to the national Treasury? I don't think so. I think the bulk of it would pack up and move to the American states where it doesn't have to deal with so-called liberal shit. Anyway, Trump has my permission to push the so-called liberals to the brink of disaster.

The smart and innovative people have been moving to blue states and cities for some decades now. Living in the backwater red states does not stimulate them, and does not conform to their mindsets. They are bored by fundamentalist religion and gun fanaticism. The smart people understand that business and other powerful folks can't just be left to their own devices; greed and other vices exist in the minds and guts of these people. So government of and by the people is necessary to make the proper investments in the community. And so although taxes may be higher in blue states, which the TEA Party don't like, the smart young people who have moved to blue states understand that contributions to the community required of all the folks DO pay off for themselves and the marketplace. Blue people are not deceived by Ayn Rand, Ludwig Mises or Ronald Reagan. Smart people know that trickle-down doesn't trickle.

You are all for pushing the smart blue people to disaster. However, what you are doing, and have done, is push yourselves living in the red states and counties into disaster. And then you try to find solace and solution for your pain by voting for a demagogue who wants to destroy everything. It won't work fer ya.

[Eric the Green]

The right wing has been like that for decades, Rags. It's disgusting. Now, the SJWs have to get riled too. We should recruit this young guy. Maybe.

[Ragnarök_62]

(02-09-2017, 02:16 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: The right wing has been like that for decades, Rags. It's disgusting. Now, the SJWs have to get riled too. We should recruit this young guy. Maybe.

You're correct of course Eric, fruit bats on both sides have a hang up of telling other people how to conduct their lives. So yeah, for example, SJW's and anti abortion fruit bats certainly have that in common.  So a pox on both houses and yes, the hating on Sonic is the ultimate parody for both.

[SomeGuy]

No commentary about the riot at Middlebury College over Charles Murray?

Here is an account from the NYT, here is Dr. Murray's account of what happened, and here is the Facebook posting from the professor who was assaulted and briefly hospitalized trying to escort him out:

Quote:I apologize for the impersonal and lengthy nature of this communication, but I wanted to provide a general response to the many people who wrote to me on Friday, and this was the most efficient way to do so. Your cards, gifts, and letters have meant so much to me. Please know that I will be responding to you individually in due time.
I agreed to participate in the event with Charles Murray, because several of my students asked me to do so. They are smart and good people, all of them, and this was their big event of the year. I actually welcomed the opportunity to be involved, because while my students may know I am a Democrat, all of my courses are nonpartisan, and this was a chance to demonstrate publicly my commitment to a free and fair exchange of views in my classroom. As the campus uproar about his visit built, I was genuinely surprised and troubled to learn that some of my faculty colleagues had rendered judgement on Dr. Murray’s work and character, while openly admitting that they had not read anything he had written. With the best of intentions, they offered their leadership to enraged students, and we all now know what the results were.
I want you to know what it feels like to look out at a sea of students yelling obscenities at other members of my beloved community. There were students and faculty who wanted to hear the exchange, but were unable to do so, either because of the screaming and chanting and chair-pounding in the room, or because their seats were occupied by those who refused to listen, and they were stranded outside the doors. I saw some of my faculty colleagues who had publicly acknowledged that they had not read anything Dr. Murray had written join the effort to shut down the lecture. All of this was deeply unsettling to me. What alarmed me most, however, was what I saw in student eyes from up on that stage. Those who wanted the event to take place made eye contact with me. Those intent on disrupting it steadfastly refused to do so. It was clear to me that they had effectively dehumanized me. They couldn’t look me in the eye, because if they had, they would have seen another human being. There is a lot to be angry about in America today, but nothing good ever comes from demonizing our brothers and sisters.
Things deteriorated from there as we went to another location in an attempt to salvage the event via live-stream for those who were still interested in engaging. I want you to know how hard it was for us to continue with fire alarms going off and enraged students and outside agitators banging on the windows. I thought they were going to break through, and I then wondered what would happen next. It is hard to think and listen in such an environment. I am proud that we somehow continued the conversation. Listen to the video and judge for yourself whether this was an event that should take place on a college campus.
When the event ended, and it was time to leave the building, I breathed a sigh of relief. We had made it. I was ready for dinner and conversation with faculty and students in a tranquil setting. What transpired instead felt like a scene from Homeland rather than an evening at an institution of higher learning. We confronted an angry mob as we tried to exit the building. Most of the hatred was focused on Dr. Murray, but when I took his right arm both to shield him from attack and to make sure we stayed together so I could reach the car too, that’s when the hatred turned on me. One thug grabbed me by the hair and another shoved me in a different direction. I noticed signs with expletives and my name on them. There was also an angry human on crutches, and I remember thinking to myself, “What are you doing? That’s so dangerous!” For those of you who marched in Washington the day after the inauguration, imagine being in a crowd like that, only being surrounded by hatred rather than love. I feared for my life.
Once we got into the car, the intimidation escalated. That story has already been told well. What I want you to know is how it felt to land safely at Kirk Alumni Center after taking a decoy route. I was so happy to see my students there to greet me. I took off my coat and realized I was hungry. I told a colleague in my department that I felt proud of myself for not having slugged someone. Then Bill Burger charged back into the room (he is my hero) and told Dr. Murray and I to get our coats and leave—NOW. The protestors knew where the dinner was. We raced back to the car, driving over the curb and sidewalk to escape quickly. It was then we decided that it was probably best to leave town.
After the adrenaline and a martini (full disclosure; you would have needed a martini too) wore off, I realized that there was something wrong with my neck. My husband took me to the ER, and President Patton, God bless her, showed up there, despite my insistence that it was unnecessary. I have a soft brace that allowed me, after cancelling my Friday class, resting up all day, and taking painkillers, to attend our son’s district jazz festival. He’s a high school senior who plays tenor sax, and I cried when I realized that these events had not prevented me from hearing him play his last district concert.
To people who wish to spin this story as one about what’s wrong with elite colleges and universities, you are mistaken. Please instead consider this as a metaphor for what is wrong with our country, and on that, Charles Murray and I would agree. This was the saddest day of my life. We have got to do better by those who feel and are marginalized. Our 230-year constitutional democracy depends on it, especially when our current President is blind to the evils he has unleashed. We must all realize the precious inheritance we have as fellow Americans and defend the Constitution against all its enemies, both foreign and domestic. That is why I do not regret my involvement in the event with Dr. Murray. But as we find a way to move forward, we should also hold fast to the wisdom of James Baldwin, “Not everything that is faced can be changed, but nothing can be changed until it is faced.”

Cue Odin's misuse of Karl Popper here.

[Eric the Green]

On the one hand, it's better to let people speak than to shut them down. On the other, I doubt even if they had read his works, that they would have found out much they had not already heard a zillion times. The right wing is totally stuck on various kinds of hate speech combined with trickle-down economics. We've heard it all before. So, what's to shut down? Did Dr. Murray really have anything new to say? Maybe; I haven't read him either. I have a feeling maybe I don't need to read him. I'll look him up though; I don't really remember what exactly his schtick is.

wikipedia:
Charles Alan Murray (born January 8, 1943) is an American libertarian conservative political scientist, sociologist, author, and columnist.

He became well known for his book Losing Ground: American Social Policy 1950–1980 (1984), which discussed the American welfare system.[3] He is best known for his controversial book The Bell Curve (1994), written with Richard Herrnstein, in which he argues that intelligence is a better predictor than parental socio-economic status or education level of many individual outcomes such as: income, job performance, pregnancy out of wedlock, and crime.[3] His other works include In Pursuit: Of Happiness and Good Government (1988), What It Means to be a Libertarian: A Personal Interpretation (1997), Human Accomplishment: The Pursuit of Excellence in the Arts and Sciences, 800 B.C. to 1950 (2003), In Our Hands: A Plan to Replace the Welfare State (2006), and Real Education: Four Simple Truths for Bringing America's Schools Back to Reality (2008).[3]

Gee whiz, do people really think he has anything to say? Just more libertarian conservative tripe. Yeah, there's nothing new here; same o same o bullshit that stinks to high heaven. Trickle-down tinkle-down libertarian tripe. I probably wouldn't have to listen to him for more than 5 seconds to get what he's saying.

[SomeGuy]

Quote:On the one hand, it's better to let people speak than to shut them down. On the other, I doubt even if they had read his works, that they would have found out much they had not already heard a zillion times. The right wing is totally stuck on various kinds of hate speech combined with trickle-down economics. We've heard it all before. So, what's to shut down? Did Dr. Murray really have anything new to say? Maybe; I haven't read him either. I have a feeling maybe I don't need to read him. I'll look him up though; I don't really remember what exactly his schtick is.

That's about the response I figured.  Read?  What's that? 

[Eric the Green]

(03-07-2017, 03:21 PM)SomeGuy Wrote:

Quote:On the one hand, it's better to let people speak than to shut them down. On the other, I doubt even if they had read his works, that they would have found out much they had not already heard a zillion times. The right wing is totally stuck on various kinds of hate speech combined with trickle-down economics. We've heard it all before. So, what's to shut down? Did Dr. Murray really have anything new to say? Maybe; I haven't read him either. I have a feeling maybe I don't need to read him. I'll look him up though; I don't really remember what exactly his schtick is.

That's about the response I figured.  Read?  What's that? 

The Right having devolved down to zero or below, it's no wonder that the left has devolved too in some cases. Instead of shouting him down, the most appropriate response probably might have been to just ignore him, and let him get the small crowd for his predictable nonsense that it deserves.

[Ragnarök_62]

(03-07-2017, 02:54 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: No commentary about the riot at Middlebury College over Charles Murray?

Here is an account from the NYT, here is Dr. Murray's account of what happened, and here is the Facebook posting from the professor who was assaulted and briefly hospitalized trying to escort him out:

<snip>


Cue Odin's misuse of Karl Popper here.

1.  I'll toss this out.  How bout using RICO on those SJW ninjas?

2. I'd reckon that professor can sue for pain and suffering.

[Odin]

Murray's career is based in racist pseudoscience, he has no ideas worth giving a platform for.