Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability

[pbrower2a]

(02-10-2021, 09:19 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-09-2021, 02:02 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(02-09-2021, 12:26 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: You seem to be ignoring that as the American right (the Republican base) has been moving the Republicans further to the right, the Left has been been moving the Democratic party further to the left to the point where the Democratic Party is barely recognizable as an American party these days. So, which side that's controlled by ideological zealots is going nuts these days?  So, how many crazy left wing women are going to directly participate in the war that they start with America? You are now in very dangerous territory and we won't be fighting over slavery this time. We'll be fighting over a country vs a foreign regime that you either f-d up and elected or wanted. I can tell you this, the Left is going to lose and the Democratic side is going to be destroyed in the process.

The GOP has certainly continued it's rightward trend, and that's saying something considering how far right the party is already. The Dems are moving left, but, as I pointed out on another thread, they are still to the right of center in contrast to other left parties in the advanced world. And let's get real.  The warrior class is on the right -- male and female.  Just look at the idiots in Michigan as a prime example.

I fail to understand the cowardice of the chest-thumping Right, when they are only out in public when armed to the teeth.  Are we really all that scary?  BOO!

Well, there are quite a few armed thugs/criminals/violent people who have no values or respect for others who are now directly associated with the Left and the Democratic party these days. So, what you see is a sample of what you're in for now that concept of so called unity is gone? Personally speaking, I'd walk over and show Nancy what real life violence is like and see how well she responds to being punched in the face and teach her the double standard that she's accustomed to receiving or applying doesn't exist in the real world.

I had no idea that the MAGA crowd included people who would beat police, attack people with flag poles, threaten elected public officials. But the sort of stuff that went on on January 6?  I expect that of rapists, muggers, and drug traffickers, people that I ordinarily consider scum. Maybe they come from broken homes or have endured obscene abuse, neglect, exploitation and poverty. This said, there are good people from the ghetto, the barrio, and the Rez. Some people do the decent thing and rebel against the evil that they experience. They deserve our admiration and not our contempt. 

For the worst of all human behavior, the record of the fascists as butchers of Humanity is well known. Soldiers, businessmen, attorneys, physicians, nurses, journalists, research scientists, college professors, and even clergy committed horrific crimes against helpless people in the service of horrific social orders. It wasn't only the people that one saw as brutes and perverts who left no question that they enjoyed doing what they did or automatons who would obey any order. Some people were tasked with the problem of how to exterminate large numbers of people without offending the sensibilities of those who might see something wrong -- and did an excellent job at that monstrous crime.  

. With this I speak of people who should have known better -- but acted contrary to the barest expectations of human decency and dignity. Contrary to myth,

[Classic-Xer]

(02-13-2021, 06:37 PM)pbrower2a Wrote:

(02-10-2021, 09:19 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-09-2021, 02:02 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(02-09-2021, 12:26 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: You seem to be ignoring that as the American right (the Republican base) has been moving the Republicans further to the right, the Left has been been moving the Democratic party further to the left to the point where the Democratic Party is barely recognizable as an American party these days. So, which side that's controlled by ideological zealots is going nuts these days?  So, how many crazy left wing women are going to directly participate in the war that they start with America? You are now in very dangerous territory and we won't be fighting over slavery this time. We'll be fighting over a country vs a foreign regime that you either f-d up and elected or wanted. I can tell you this, the Left is going to lose and the Democratic side is going to be destroyed in the process.

The GOP has certainly continued it's rightward trend, and that's saying something considering how far right the party is already. The Dems are moving left, but, as I pointed out on another thread, they are still to the right of center in contrast to other left parties in the advanced world. And let's get real.  The warrior class is on the right -- male and female.  Just look at the idiots in Michigan as a prime example.

I fail to understand the cowardice of the chest-thumping Right, when they are only out in public when armed to the teeth.  Are we really all that scary?  BOO!

Well, there are quite a few armed thugs/criminals/violent people who have no values or respect for others who are now directly associated with the Left and the Democratic party these days. So, what you see is a sample of what you're in for now that concept of so called unity is gone? Personally speaking, I'd walk over and show Nancy what real life violence is like and see how well she responds to being punched in the face and teach her the double standard that she's accustomed to receiving or applying doesn't exist in the real world.

I had no idea that the MAGA crowd included people who would beat police, attack people with flag poles, threaten elected public officials. But the sort of stuff that went on on January 6?  I expect that of rapists, muggers, and drug traffickers, people that I ordinarily consider scum. Maybe they come from broken homes or have endured obscene abuse, neglect, exploitation and poverty. This said, there are good people from the ghetto, the barrio, and the Rez. Some people do the decent thing and rebel against the evil that they experience. They deserve our admiration and not our contempt. 

For the worst of all human behavior, the record of the fascists as butchers of Humanity is well known. Soldiers, businessmen, attorneys, physicians, nurses, journalists, research scientists, college professors, and even clergy committed horrific crimes against helpless people in the service of horrific social orders. It wasn't only the people that one saw as brutes and perverts who left no question that they enjoyed doing what they did or automatons who would obey any order. Some people were tasked with the problem of how to exterminate large numbers of people without offending the sensibilities of those who might see something wrong -- and did an excellent job at that monstrous crime.  

. With this I speak of people who should have known better -- but acted contrary to the barest expectations of human decency and dignity. Contrary to myth,

The Democratic party and all it's wisdom has now embarked  (already committed you and everyone else) on collision coarse with America dude and you're still stuck and still have your panties up in a bunch over the relatively minor event that took place on January 6th. You ain't seen nothing yet dude. All you seen was a relatively small display of over all capability. You just wait and see how ugly things are after two years of continues Democratic fuck ups and misreads with Americans paying the price dude. You're going to be lucky if you have a pot to piss in after this buddy.

[pbrower2a]

(02-14-2021, 04:30 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-13-2021, 06:37 PM)pbrower2a Wrote:

(02-10-2021, 09:19 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-09-2021, 02:02 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(02-09-2021, 12:26 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: You seem to be ignoring that as the American right (the Republican base) has been moving the Republicans further to the right, the Left has been been moving the Democratic party further to the left to the point where the Democratic Party is barely recognizable as an American party these days. So, which side that's controlled by ideological zealots is going nuts these days?  So, how many crazy left wing women are going to directly participate in the war that they start with America? You are now in very dangerous territory and we won't be fighting over slavery this time. We'll be fighting over a country vs a foreign regime that you either f-d up and elected or wanted. I can tell you this, the Left is going to lose and the Democratic side is going to be destroyed in the process.

The GOP has certainly continued it's rightward trend, and that's saying something considering how far right the party is already. The Dems are moving left, but, as I pointed out on another thread, they are still to the right of center in contrast to other left parties in the advanced world. And let's get real.  The warrior class is on the right -- male and female.  Just look at the idiots in Michigan as a prime example.

I fail to understand the cowardice of the chest-thumping Right, when they are only out in public when armed to the teeth.  Are we really all that scary?  BOO!

Well, there are quite a few armed thugs/criminals/violent people who have no values or respect for others who are now directly associated with the Left and the Democratic party these days. So, what you see is a sample of what you're in for now that concept of so called unity is gone? Personally speaking, I'd walk over and show Nancy what real life violence is like and see how well she responds to being punched in the face and teach her the double standard that she's accustomed to receiving or applying doesn't exist in the real world.

I had no idea that the MAGA crowd included people who would beat police, attack people with flag poles, threaten elected public officials. But the sort of stuff that went on on January 6?  I expect that of rapists, muggers, and drug traffickers, people that I ordinarily consider scum. Maybe they come from broken homes or have endured obscene abuse, neglect, exploitation and poverty. This said, there are good people from the ghetto, the barrio, and the Rez. Some people do the decent thing and rebel against the evil that they experience. They deserve our admiration and not our contempt. 

For the worst of all human behavior, the record of the fascists as butchers of Humanity is well known. Soldiers, businessmen, attorneys, physicians, nurses, journalists, research scientists, college professors, and even clergy committed horrific crimes against helpless people in the service of horrific social orders. It wasn't only the people that one saw as brutes and perverts who left no question that they enjoyed doing what they did or automatons who would obey any order. Some people were tasked with the problem of how to exterminate large numbers of people without offending the sensibilities of those who might see something wrong -- and did an excellent job at that monstrous crime.  

. With this I speak of people who should have known better -- but acted contrary to the barest expectations of human decency and dignity. Contrary to myth,

The Democratic party  and all it's wisdom has now embarked  (already committed you and everyone else) on collision coarse with America dude and you're still stuck and still have your panties up in a bunch over the relatively minor event that took place on January 6th. You ain't seen nothing yet dude. All you seen was a relatively small display of over all capability. You just wait and see how ugly things are after two years of continues Democratic fuck ups and misreads with Americans paying the price dude. You're going to be lucky if you have a pot to piss in after this buddy.

Let me tell you about a city that I know and like. It's actually a suburb of Detroit, Michigan, even bordering on "Detritus, Michigan".* It's Dearborn, and it actually borders the worst giant city in America. But go to Dearborn and you will notice that it is quite livable. Michigan Avenue (US 12) goes through downtown Detroit past the site of the now-demolished Tiger Stadium into a sleazy mockery of a community (southwest Detroit) full of sexually-oriented businesses and liquor stores. Prostitutes and drug dealers ply their trade, and drunks and addicts wander about. Cross into Dearborn and you see a Dearborn police car, a deterrent to the social dregs of southwest Detroit coming into town. Wander into Dearborn drunk or on drugs or dressed like a whore and you will be stopped before you get past the first kebab house, let alone a mosque. Dearborn is family-friendly, The large Arab and Muslim populations like it that way, and they impress that upon the local politicians. Alcoholic beverages aren't banned, but brawls are. I'm not much of a drinker (I can't hold my liquor as I used to) but I prefer to drink in peace.

Arab-Americans and Muslims prefer life family-friendly, and Dearborn offers that. Guess what? Many Jews, Christians, agnostics, and atheists like it that way, too.

I don't know what you mean by America, but your belligerence would clash with a small part of America called Dearborn, Michigan. It votes heavily Democratic.

*Detroit now suffers from black flight. Who would want to consign one's children to the awful Detroit Independent School District?

[Bob Butler 54]

(02-14-2021, 04:30 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: The Democratic party  and all it's wisdom has now embarked  (already committed you and everyone else) on collision coarse with America dude and you're still stuck and still have your panties up in a bunch over the relatively minor event that took place on January 6th. You ain't seen nothing yet dude. All you seen was a relatively small display of over all capability. You just wait and see how ugly things are after two years of continues Democratic fuck ups and misreads with Americans paying the price dude. You're going to be lucky if you have a pot to piss in after this buddy.

Trump had to pull violent insurrectionists from all over the country to hold the capitol insurrection.  Trump proceeded to throw the insurgents under the bus.  They made few attempts to hide their identities.  There were lots of cameras.  The government is now taking red violence seriously.  All for a negligible delay in certifying the election.  Such a vote counting delay can not happen again.  On inauguration day the violent insurgents took one look at all the protection around the capitol and state capitols and turned and ran.

Expensive, but effective.

[David Horn]

(02-14-2021, 07:59 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(02-14-2021, 04:30 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: The Democratic party  and all it's wisdom has now embarked  (already committed you and everyone else) on collision coarse with America dude and you're still stuck and still have your panties up in a bunch over the relatively minor event that took place on January 6th. You ain't seen nothing yet dude. All you seen was a relatively small display of over all capability. You just wait and see how ugly things are after two years of continues Democratic fuck ups and misreads with Americans paying the price dude. You're going to be lucky if you have a pot to piss in after this buddy.

Trump had to pull violent insurrectionists from all over the country to hold the capitol insurrection.  Trump proceeded to throw the insurgents under the bus.  They made few attempts to hide their identities.  There were lots of cameras.  The government is now taking red violence seriously.  All for a negligible delay in certifying the election.  Such a vote counting delay can not happen again.  On inauguration day the violent insurgents took one look at all the protection around the capitol and state capitols and turned and ran.

Expensive, but effective.

As a nation we're moving on, but not in Classic's preferred direction.  I'm not sure he understands how far to the extreme right the GOP is today.  Most of the apples-to-apples comparisons put the GOP in the same camp with Modi's party in India and Erdogan's in Turkey.  Not the best of company. The nation is tiring of the RW rhetoric and the abusive politics even moreso. That said, the nation is still far to the right of just about every advance nation on earth, so the journey is just beginning.

[Classic-Xer]

(02-13-2021, 01:23 AM)Einzige Wrote:

(02-13-2021, 12:28 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-10-2021, 12:48 PM)Einzige Wrote: You have more in common with pbrower than I do. You both want to preserve the market economy. I want it abolished.

PB has more in common with you than you think. All the Marxists would have to do is continue to provide for PB and PB would be cool with Marxism.

PB would provide in turn. It's just that the definition of provision, decoupled from things that have monetary value today such as direct production, could largely be anything.

Well, he's willing to vote for more stuff and he's willing to trade away his rights for more stuff and he's able to spread propaganda too. It's kind of silly that the two of you are opposed to one another when you guys have so much in common these days.

[Classic-Xer]

(02-15-2021, 01:20 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(02-14-2021, 07:59 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(02-14-2021, 04:30 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: The Democratic party  and all it's wisdom has now embarked  (already committed you and everyone else) on collision coarse with America dude and you're still stuck and still have your panties up in a bunch over the relatively minor event that took place on January 6th. You ain't seen nothing yet dude. All you seen was a relatively small display of over all capability. You just wait and see how ugly things are after two years of continues Democratic fuck ups and misreads with Americans paying the price dude. You're going to be lucky if you have a pot to piss in after this buddy.

Trump had to pull violent insurrectionists from all over the country to hold the capitol insurrection.  Trump proceeded to throw the insurgents under the bus.  They made few attempts to hide their identities.  There were lots of cameras.  The government is now taking red violence seriously.  All for a negligible delay in certifying the election.  Such a vote counting delay can not happen again.  On inauguration day the violent insurgents took one look at all the protection around the capitol and state capitols and turned and ran.

Expensive, but effective.

As a nation we're moving on, but not in Classic's preferred direction.  I'm not sure he understands how far to the extreme right the GOP is today.  Most of the apples-to-apples comparisons put the GOP in the same camp with Modi's party in India and Erdogan's in Turkey.  Not the best of company. The nation is tiring of the RW rhetoric and the abusive politics even moreso. That said, the nation is still far to the right of just about every advance nation on earth, so the journey is just beginning.

How did you become so partisan? Who indoctrinated you? What country do you live in? Do you live in the Democratic states of America or do you still live in the United States of America? So, have you and the others figured out what you guys are going to do when the experiment that you're all related to and reliant upon one way or another ends. I don't really care if Harris and Pelosi end up sharing the same fate of Marie Antoinette. The Democrats are in the process of burning their last bridge with America and starting a war with America over issues that most could care less about and you think you're winning at this point? Which advanced nation isn't reliant upon America to keep the Boogeyman at bay or the United Nations afloat? Now, I understand that you're used to being around a bunch of clueless idiots with college degree's who are used to going along with morons for a living. I don't know, maybe you're getting old and unable to use that brain of yours and I should cut you some slack out of respect for your age and the wisdom that you are supposed to represent these days.
What is it with the Left and the Left's lack of common sense these days? Biden's acting more like Erdogan these days. Biden's the one who is over reacting to a relatively minor problem and abusing his authority by participating in racial/ ideological profile and ignoring the existence of the Constitution at the moment. I mean, Biden ain't shit compared to Big Tech these days. So, how you done anything about big tech calling all the shots yet or are you sucking up and going a long with them like every other clueless Biden supporter who doesn't value their own or anyone elses freedoms these days. So, who wants all of you guys today? Is there an advanced country out there that wants all you guys today? You better start looking for country's that want you dude.

[Classic-Xer]

(02-14-2021, 07:59 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(02-14-2021, 04:30 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: The Democratic party  and all it's wisdom has now embarked  (already committed you and everyone else) on collision coarse with America dude and you're still stuck and still have your panties up in a bunch over the relatively minor event that took place on January 6th. You ain't seen nothing yet dude. All you seen was a relatively small display of over all capability. You just wait and see how ugly things are after two years of continues Democratic fuck ups and misreads with Americans paying the price dude. You're going to be lucky if you have a pot to piss in after this buddy.

Trump had to pull violent insurrectionists from all over the country to hold the capitol insurrection.  Trump proceeded to throw the insurgents under the bus.  They made few attempts to hide their identities.  There were lots of cameras.  The government is now taking red violence seriously.  All for a negligible delay in certifying the election.  Such a vote counting delay can not happen again.  On inauguration day the violent insurgents took one look at all the protection around the capitol and state capitols and turned and ran.

Expensive, but effective.

The government should be paying more attention to all the violence and increases in crime that's occurring in and near to blue cities. I think it's pretty clear that anti-wall Democrats aren't opposed to building walls when they feel that their precious lives are at risk. I suppose you could view the lack of violence on inauguration day as a cop out by Right Wing anarchist groups. Me, I look at the result and I believe that they succeeded in scaring the shit out of a bunch of worthless politicians living off the dole in Washington DC. I suggest that the Democrats fix all those election laws that their side broke while changing them during 2020 and admit their guilt of doing it. That would be a step in the right direction that would eliminate the possibility of a repeat of history. But, what's the chances of the third world party doing that these days? I say none. The Democratic party isn't smart enough or wise enough to be able to do that these days.

[Eric the Green]

I would say, to whatever Classic says, that the opposite is true. You are likely to be correct.

[Classic-Xer]

(02-14-2021, 07:44 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Let me tell you about a city that I know and like. It's actually a suburb of Detroit, Michigan, even bordering on "Detritus, Michigan".* It's Dearborn, and it actually borders the worst giant city in America. But go to Dearborn and you will notice that it is quite livable. Michigan Avenue (US 12) goes through downtown Detroit past the site of the now-demolished Tiger Stadium into a sleazy mockery of a community (southwest Detroit) full of sexually-oriented businesses and liquor stores. Prostitutes and drug dealers ply their trade, and drunks and addicts wander about. Cross into Dearborn and you see a Dearborn police car, a deterrent to the social dregs of southwest Detroit coming into town. Wander into Dearborn drunk or on drugs or dressed like a whore and you will be stopped before you get past the first kebab house, let alone a mosque. Dearborn is family-friendly, The large Arab and Muslim populations like it that way, and they impress that upon the local politicians. Alcoholic beverages aren't banned, but brawls are. I'm not much of a drinker (I can't hold my liquor as I used to) but I prefer to drink in peace.

Arab-Americans and Muslims prefer life family-friendly, and Dearborn offers that. Guess what? Many Jews, Christians, agnostics, and atheists like it that way, too.

I don't know what you mean by America, but your belligerence would clash with a small part of America called Dearborn, Michigan. It votes heavily Democratic.

*Detroit now suffers from black flight. Who would want to consign one's children to the awful Detroit Independent School District? 

Anyone here live in Dearborn? So, how many Arab Americans and Muslims share the Liberal/Progressive view of me (white supremacists) without meeting me. I hope the Democratic voters who live in Dearborn aren't as dumb as you and Eric and the others otherwise a bunch of them may end up being killed over something stupid or a lie that's spread by some ignorant/careless group of Democrats believes is true these days.

[Classic-Xer]

(02-16-2021, 02:21 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: I would say, to whatever Classic says, that the opposite is true. You are likely to be correct.

If you haven't figured it out by now, that's the way it's intended to be.

[pbrower2a]

(02-16-2021, 12:56 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-15-2021, 01:20 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(02-14-2021, 07:59 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(02-14-2021, 04:30 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: The Democratic party  and all it's wisdom has now embarked  (already committed you and everyone else) on collision coarse with America dude and you're still stuck and still have your panties up in a bunch over the relatively minor event that took place on January 6th. You ain't seen nothing yet dude. All you seen was a relatively small display of over all capability. You just wait and see how ugly things are after two years of continues Democratic fuck ups and misreads with Americans paying the price dude. You're going to be lucky if you have a pot to piss in after this buddy.

Trump had to pull violent insurrectionists from all over the country to hold the capitol insurrection.  Trump proceeded to throw the insurgents under the bus.  They made few attempts to hide their identities.  There were lots of cameras.  The government is now taking red violence seriously.  All for a negligible delay in certifying the election.  Such a vote counting delay can not happen again.  On inauguration day the violent insurgents took one look at all the protection around the capitol and state capitols and turned and ran.

Expensive, but effective.

As a nation we're moving on, but not in Classic's preferred direction.  I'm not sure he understands how far to the extreme right the GOP is today.  Most of the apples-to-apples comparisons put the GOP in the same camp with Modi's party in India and Erdogan's in Turkey.  Not the best of company. The nation is tiring of the RW rhetoric and the abusive politics even moreso. That said, the nation is still far to the right of just about every advance nation on earth, so the journey is just beginning.

How did you become so partisan? Who indoctrinated you? What country do you live in? Do you live in the Democratic states of America or do you still live in the United States of America?

You could as easily be saying this of me, in view of your extreme division of America into parts that really are Americans and parts that aren't. If one isn't hyper-partisan now, then most likely one is going from one side to the other. America does not divide neatly by geography into two nations, one that you see as holders of all genuine and necessary virtues and the other completely lacking in those. 

There is no "Democratic States of America" and "Republican States of America". Even the states have their inner divisions. Greater Cleveland, Columbus, Cincinnati, Dayton, and Toledo are strongly D although the rural areas are very R. Greater Memphis (which does extend into Mississippi and Arkansas) and Nashville are strongly D while most of the state is strongly R. On the other side, Atlanta is politically more like Los Angeles  than like rural Georgia, and rural Michigan is about as R as Nebraska outside of Lincoln and Greater Omaha. If you dream of splitting America along Party lines you would get a patchwork of small "blue" areas over a largely "red" map. That is much, if with a different color scheme, how most countries would look. 

"Red" America produces the food that largely goes to "Blue" America, and "Blue" America prepares the surplus for export that makes "Red" America's farmers able to not have to live like peasants. "Blue" America has the colleges that educate  the Best and Brightest of Red America and creates  the entertainment and supplies the information that keeps "Red" America from becoming even more mindless than it already is. Are you a Country fan? Nashville is predominantly D in its voting. We really do need each other. 

No, we are not going to send "specially-trained black men" to seduce your precious white daughters and impregnate them so that they can betray the white race in their wombs. No, we are not going to send Muslim missionaries to your communities so that your youth can transform churches into mosques because they have converted to Islam.  

If you want my opinion on what is wrong with America economically, it is that people who believe that profit is the only legitimate objective in life, even for those who cannot enjoy more than an animal level of existence due to an all-for-the-few ideology of tycoons and executives who buy the politicians still control the campaign funds. Nasty as things are for working people, those tycoons and executives want things to get even harsher. I do not believe in any pie-in-the-sky-when-you-die promise contingent on suffering in This World on behalf of rapacious elites. If those rapacious elites truly believed in it then they would divest themselves of their economic privilege and suffer like their victims. In education? We have dedicated K-12 schooling mostly to train people to fit into entry-level, dead-end jobs that fit the ideology of the Master Class, and even college education for something just slightly more advanced. To that end in collegiate education we have sacrificed the old objective of liberal arts education which was to improve the youth by demonstrating that there is more to life than material gain and indulgence, bureaucratic power, and unrefined hedonism (sex & drugs & rock-and-roll) with the word luxury as a "sucker" appeal. 

I remember when the Republican Party had some appeal to smart, rational people. That is over! That is as much over as the Cold War. The Republican Party has aligned itself with all sorts of political madness on the Right.

Quote:So, have you and the others figured out what you guys are going to do when the experiment that you're all related to and reliant upon one way or another ends. I don't really care if Harris and Pelosi end up sharing the same fate of Marie Antoinette.

If fascism takes over in America and brings America onto some disastrous course of genocide and military aggression,  then I will take delight when the principals of such a course of action end up sharing the same fate as Joachim von Ribbentrop and Hideki Tojo. 

Quote:The Democrats are in the process of burning their last bridge with America and starting a war with America over issues that most could care less about and you think you're winning at this point?

Joe Biden and Kamala Harris got 81 million+ votes and (what matters) 306 votes in the Electoral College with a higher percentage of the overall popular vote than Ronald Reagan got in 1980. Donald Trump and Mike Pence got fewer than 75 million popular votes and only 232 electoral votes. Had Americans of all political stripes known what would happen on January 6, then I could imagine Joe Biden and Kamala Harris winning a margin  of the popular vote like that of Ronald Reagan against Walter Mondale. Mondale was an awful politician, but he was at least a good person. We will never know, just as we will never know how different America would be had someone been guarding the entrance to the President's box at Ford's Theater one night in April 1865.

Donald Trump has transformed the Party of Lincoln into a fascist cult. That is shameful in the extreme.     

Quote:Which advanced nation isn't reliant upon America to keep the Boogeyman at bay or the United Nations afloat? Now, I understand that you're used to being around a bunch of clueless idiots with college degree's who are used to going along with morons for a living. I don't know, maybe you're getting old and unable to use that brain of yours and I should cut you some slack out of respect for your age and the wisdom that you are supposed to represent these days.

The bogeyman is Donald Trump. Rumors are that Queen Elizabeth II despises him. It's no secret about Angela Merkel.

The problem with the college degree today is not its lack of intellectual rigor; it is now the lack of intellectual breadth. People with college degrees who have chosen social work as a career are often dealing with morons that the system wants to keep out of institutions. I see at least two years of liberal arts education as a desirable solution to transforming callow youth into intellectually-competent adults who don't rely upon mass low entertainment as leisure and recognize propaganda as harm. 

I have yet to see you condemn Q-Anon, which I have mocked as Qu Qlux Qlan-on for its Qraziness.   

Quote:What is it with the Left and the Left's lack of common sense these days?  Biden's acting more like Erdogan these days. Biden's the one who is over reacting to a relatively minor problem and abusing his authority by participating in racial/ ideological profile and ignoring the existence of the Constitution at the moment.

Do we have anything like Q-Anon? Do we have the Proud Boys, The Base, and the Atomwaffen Division that Canada just put on its list of terrorist organizations? Do the people caught plotting to kidnap the Governor of Michigan have any parallel on what passes as the American Left? 

By now Democrats are becoming the Party of civic peace, rule of law, rationality, ethnic inclusion, and the promotion of skill and learning. 

Quote:I mean, Biden ain't shit compared to Big Tech these days. So, how you done anything about big tech calling all the shots yet or are you sucking up and going a long with them like every other clueless Biden supporter who doesn't value their own or anyone elses freedoms these days. So, who wants all of you guys today? Is there an advanced country out there that wants all you guys today? You better start looking for country's that want you dude.

Big Tech depends upon well-educated people to do the design and engineering.  Think of those thugs breaking up demonstrations in Portland, Oregon this summer. They had similar vehicles with large US flags and Trump banners. Is that how we want law enforcement (and a secret police that has yet to name itself does things that way) to act? No thanks! I'll leave law enforcement to the local cops who bust spouse-beaters, car thieves, and operators of meth labs. 

Because of COVID-19 Americans of all political orientations, places of residence, and levels of skill and education are unwelcome as tourists. Thank you, Donald Trump, for having a year of plague as the most memorable event of your catastrophic Presidency!

[Classic-Xer]

(02-16-2021, 04:43 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: By now Democrats are becoming the Party of civic peace, rule of law, rationality, ethnic inclusion, and the promotion of skill and learning. 

So, who indoctrinated you and how long did it take? You must not be paying attention to the unsavory politicians and corporations that currently have your fate in their hands. You seem to think the Democrats that we get to see on a regular basis are bunch of decent/trustworthy/caring human beings aka saintly, can do no wrong who are worth saving these days. I doubt Jesus has an interest in the life of a self serving cunt from San Francisco who downplayed and went along with the use violence for several months.

[Bob Butler 54]

(02-16-2021, 01:50 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: The government should be paying more attention to all the violence and increases in crime that's occurring in and near to blue cities. I think it's pretty clear that anti-wall Democrats aren't opposed to building walls when they feel that their precious lives are at risk. I suppose you could view the lack of violence on inauguration day as a cop out by Right Wing anarchist groups. Me, I look at the result and I believe that they succeeded in scaring the shit out of a bunch of worthless politicians living off the dole  in Washington DC. I suggest that the Democrats fix all those election laws that their side broke while changing them during 2020 and admit their guilt of doing it. That would be a step in the right direction that would eliminate the possibility of a repeat of history. But,  what's the chances of the third world party  doing that these days? I say none. The Democratic party isn't smart enough or wise enough to be able to do that these days.

There were violent people operating on the fringes of the Black Lives Matter protests, but the racial protests have mostly paused with the cooler weather or have turned to a pro Trump anti government focus.  Racist groups based their violence less on race and more on government.  They saw a Biden victory meant voting rights, cutting bad cop protections and legislation against systematic racism, and changed their priority from violence against blacks to violence against blue government.  At this point they have played their hand and lost.  Biden's rising approval ratings, Trump's corresponding disapproval trend indicates how the battle of hearts and minds is going.

The prime objective of the voting changes in 2020 was to make voting safe during a pandemic by expanding vote by mail and early voting.  This is better that the gerrymandering and making it hard to register to eliminate minority votes that the Republicans had been using.  I see the activists training minority voters in how to bypass the hurdles on voting likely as claiming territory faster than the Republican attempts and putting up more hoops to jump through.  If anything, I could see the trend of 2020 continuing.

I'm not sure I get what you mean by a third party, but I have hear talk of both Trump and the true conservatives splintering off from the wreck of the Republicans.  I see the major effect as splitting the conservative vote.  I have talked of elite and racist influence in the Republican Party.  It seems that Trump is leading the racists, McConnell is leading the establishment, and the true conservatives want nothing to do with either.  If the split up turns formal, they will just not be able to combat an effective focused crisis government.

In short, the predicted collapse of the conservative values is underway.

[Bob Butler 54]

(02-17-2021, 12:28 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-16-2021, 04:43 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: By now Democrats are becoming the Party of civic peace, rule of law, rationality, ethnic inclusion, and the promotion of skill and learning. 

So, who indoctrinated you and how long did it take? You must not be paying attention to the unsavory politicians and corporations that currently have your fate in their hands. You seem to think the Democrats that we get to see on a regular basis are bunch of decent/trustworthy/caring human beings aka saintly, can do no wrong who are worth saving these days.

It is just the turnings turning.  Through the unraveling it seemed wise to keep the government small by not solving problems.  The result was problems that cannot be ignored.  I count them as COVID, the economy, systematic racism, global warming and red violence.  In time the problems will be less, the government more corrupt, and the pendulum will swing the other way.  However, that time is decades in the future.

[pbrower2a]

(02-17-2021, 12:28 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-16-2021, 04:43 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: By now Democrats are becoming the Party of civic peace, rule of law, rationality, ethnic inclusion, and the promotion of skill and learning.

So, who indoctrinated you and how long did it take? You must not be paying attention to the unsavory politicians and corporations that currently have your fate in their hands. You seem to think the Democrats that we get to see on a regular basis are bunch of decent/trustworthy/caring human beings aka saintly, can do no wrong who are worth saving these days. I doubt Jesus has an interest in the life of a self serving (word hostile to women) from San Francisco who downplayed and went along with the use violence for several months.

[/quote]

The only indoctrination that I got was learning to detect deceit and incompetence. It may not always be possible to distinguish the two because incompetent people are often extremely deceptive about their abilities and diligence, deceitful people often are themselves gullible enough to believe their own lies, and incompetent and deceitful people are easy to manipulate by telling them exactly what they want to believe. 

I have met enough incompetent and dishonest people in my lifetime to be able to pick up the clues. Incompetent people in positions of responsibility make things look harder than they are. They are more show than substance. They put more emphasis on self-image than on developing a system that makes things look easy. Most obviously, liars eventually contradict themselves and then go into all sorts of contortions to cover one lie with another. Incompetence and deceit go together. Incompetent people ultimately must deceive themselves into believing how wonderful they are. Honest, competent people know their limitations and the boundary conditions of a system. They don't need ego boosts because they well know that they are replaceable. Everyone is. 

I'll spare some doubt on whether the Democratic Party consists solely of honest, competent people. Republican voters and the GOP establishment united behind Donald Trump, someone that I have known to be "all hat and no cattle" since he first entered the public scene. First of all, successful businesspeople do what they can to avoid the limelight unless it is to push their creative efforts or market their contributions to GDP. They sell something... well, that was valid with Thomas Edison and George Westinghouse with their inventions, Henry Ford with a mass-produced automobile with his name on the plate, Walt Disney with his entertainment business, or (while he was alive) Sam Walton with his discount stores. Donald Trump would love to be associated with something glorious or world-changing as was so with Edison, Westinghouse, Siemens, Ford, Disney, Walton, Morita  ("Mister Sony" in Japan)  or (still) Gates. Trump never offered me anything that wasn't cheaper and better somewhere else. Yes, one can undercut at the cost of quality, and one can do better by making something slightly more expensive. With Trump what one gets is overpriced and substandard. 

...Donald Trump compares to the traditional Five Greatest Presidents in American history (as one fellow put it, "Mount Rushmore and FDR")... as an antithesis.  George Washington knew that there were people smarter and more skilled than he, and knew enough to defer to them on much. Jefferson had one of the broadest bases of curiosity that anyone ever had in his time. Lincoln intended to be a restorer but became a revolutionary as he came to the conclusion that slavery was incompatible with freedom. Theodore Roosevelt humanized capitalism without overthrowing it. FDR with his good buddy Churchill saved Western Christian Civilization. Trump has no humility, no curiosity, no imagination, no humane streak, and no talent for pushing humane change. Trump is Ronald Reagan without the geniality, caution, or verbal coherence of Ronald Reagan. Oh, he is charming? Well, that is a commonplace characteristic of the sociopath, a person who must find ways to get people to lower their guard against being cheated out their assets... or worse. Adolf Hitler and Ted Bundy were charming blokes. Good people don't need to turn on the charm.

Let me remind you that there are plenty of people who don't need Jesus, and they can be quite moral. The most obvious ones, as Jesus and His apostles are all that separates them from Christianity, are Jews. I've seen the Jewish explanation of how people get to the glorious abode of the Saved, and it is the most promising one. Be just in This World, and you will get ready admission in the Next World. You will be saved, but of course you will convert to Judaism irrespective of what you were in This World. It is not the fault of a gentile that he was raised in a culture that denied him a reasonable chance to become Jewish, but it is the fault of a gentile (as is so for a Jew) for choosing wickedness as a course of life. Evil souls are out of sight and out of mind in the Jewish conception of Heaven. Devout Jews on the whole impress me for morality. Jews never persecuted my Huguenot, Quaker, Mennonite, and possibly Hussite ancestors. Among non-blacks, Jews were far out of proportion in the struggle for civil rights for Southern blacks. Let us remember that most of the Nazis were at least nominal Christians, and that they fell far short of the moral command to not commit the Holocaust. The only difference that I see between Jews and Christians is that Christians are more likely to display prudery, which is  not particularly moral. I can only assume what some of my seventh-cousins once or twice removed or so did in the Greater Germany Reich and occupied countries: the Holocaust. I've told a few Nazis on the Web that if I had to choose between being a Jew and a Nazi I would be a Jew because such would require no compromises of my morals and culture. Many of the Jews that Hitler murdered were my cultural and moral kin. 

(I have my idea of a possible torment of Hell. A puritan view of Hell was that the Saved had the delight of watching the suffering of the Damned. I think that the telescope or closed-circuit TV would be turned the other way, showing the delights that the Saved get to enjoy that the Damned are denied eternally). 

Get her name right. It's Nancy Pelosi. You are one of the most extreme male chauvinists of whom I have ever heard, unless you are discussing rapists who use sex as a way to demean and humiliate women. I have always assumed that any woman who got tangled with me would become a feminist if she weren't one to begin with. I look at some of the strongest female leaders of all time, and they are as chilly rationalists as men can be. Sure, there are tyrants' molls like Lady Macbeth to Magda Goebbels, Chiang Ching, and Imelda Marcos. I doubt that you want to get into an intellectual match with Angela Merkel.

[pbrower2a]

(02-17-2021, 07:21 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(02-17-2021, 12:28 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-16-2021, 04:43 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: By now Democrats are becoming the Party of civic peace, rule of law, rationality, ethnic inclusion, and the promotion of skill and learning. 

So, who indoctrinated you and how long did it take? You must not be paying attention to the unsavory politicians and corporations that currently have your fate in their hands. You seem to think the Democrats that we get to see on a regular basis are bunch of decent/trustworthy/caring human beings aka saintly, can do no wrong who are worth saving these days.

It is just the turnings turning.  Through the unraveling it seemed wise to keep the government small by not solving problems.  The result was problems that cannot be ignored.  I count them as COVID, the economy, systematic racism, global warming and red violence.  In time the problems will be less, the government more corrupt, and the pendulum will swing the other way.  However, that time is decades in the future.

Yes. The next 3T likely begins around 2060. and then people will have generally tired of abstract causes that don't pay off financially, youth coming of age will dismiss moralizing elders on behalf of hedonism and materialism both devoid of any moral pretense, and McKinley-like or Reagan-like leaders will suddenly be in vogue.  The world will be less austere and restrictive, but regrettably... out come the scammers offering easy money. 

After COVID-19 is gone, it is on to the new era of relatively equable results in return for diligent, competent work; a family-friendly culture (maybe multiple versions that resemble in overall behavior if not culture those that Model Minorities have shown); a disdain for ostentatious indulgence (1950's style was austere); and a bland if perhaps increasingly whimsical culture (as I expect the Homeland Generation to act much like the Silent).  Economic results will be more even and opportunity will be more readily available through competence instead of being born into the Right Family.  

So what could get in the way? Maybe the mad leadership of North Korea decides to unify the Korean peninsula once and for all.

[pbrower2a]

(02-16-2021, 03:15 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-14-2021, 07:44 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Let me tell you about a city that I know and like. It's actually a suburb of Detroit, Michigan, even bordering on "Detritus, Michigan".* It's Dearborn, and it actually borders the worst giant city in America. But go to Dearborn and you will notice that it is quite livable. Michigan Avenue (US 12) goes through downtown Detroit past the site of the now-demolished Tiger Stadium into a sleazy mockery of a community (southwest Detroit) full of sexually-oriented businesses and liquor stores. Prostitutes and drug dealers ply their trade, and drunks and addicts wander about. Cross into Dearborn and you see a Dearborn police car, a deterrent to the social dregs of southwest Detroit coming into town. Wander into Dearborn drunk or on drugs or dressed like a whore and you will be stopped before you get past the first kebab house, let alone a mosque. Dearborn is family-friendly, The large Arab and Muslim populations like it that way, and they impress that upon the local politicians. Alcoholic beverages aren't banned, but brawls are. I'm not much of a drinker (I can't hold my liquor as I used to) but I prefer to drink in peace.

Arab-Americans and Muslims prefer life family-friendly, and Dearborn offers that. Guess what? Many Jews, Christians, agnostics, and atheists like it that way, too.

I don't know what you mean by America, but your belligerence would clash with a small part of America called Dearborn, Michigan. It votes heavily Democratic.

*Detroit now suffers from black flight. Who would want to consign one's children to the awful Detroit Independent School District? 

Anyone here live in Dearborn? So, how many Arab Americans and Muslims share the Liberal/Progressive view of me (white supremacists) without meeting me. I hope the Democratic voters who live in Dearborn aren't as dumb as you and Eric and the others otherwise a bunch of them may end up being killed over something stupid or a lie  that's spread by  some ignorant/careless  group of Democrats believes is true these days.

I have been there. I have met plenty of Muslims. They would loathe you for your racism and religious bigotry, and rightly so. Islamic sensibilities are male chauvinist, but they do not sexualize women as you do. You remind them of their heroic villains, the Crusaders... and yes, the Crusaders were nasty people, about as many people now see Nazis and Stalinists. 

Dearborn is a place of tolerance on religious identity, but not of such pathological behavior as drunkenness, drug use, and prostitution. 

If you will notice, the 9/11 plotters avoided Dearborn. Maybe had they discussed some of their plots or given allusions to such while speaking in Arabic, Arab-speaking people might  have figured out enough to tattle on them to the FBI.  There was a terrorist plot in which some "Crusaders" of the modern sort were caught with explosives for blowing up a mosque. They got caught.

Dearborn has a low crime rate unlike its neighbor Detroit, one of the most dangerous cities in America. (the Woodward Avenue corridor that includes Beaumont Hospital, the Detroit Opera, the Fox Theater, the Detroit Museum of Art, Joe Lewis Arena, Comerica Park, Ford Field, the Vegas-quality gambling casinos, and Hitstown USA is safe -- but definitely avoid the rest of Detroit). But if you live next to a moral sewer like Southwest Detroit and want your community to be livable, you need a good police force to deter the troublemakers.  

I can think of far more objectionable places than Dearborn as "waves of the future" for America in the upcoming 1T.

[David Horn]

(02-17-2021, 07:21 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(02-17-2021, 12:28 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-16-2021, 04:43 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: By now Democrats are becoming the Party of civic peace, rule of law, rationality, ethnic inclusion, and the promotion of skill and learning. 

So, who indoctrinated you and how long did it take? You must not be paying attention to the unsavory politicians and corporations that currently have your fate in their hands. You seem to think the Democrats that we get to see on a regular basis are bunch of decent/trustworthy/caring human beings aka saintly, can do no wrong who are worth saving these days.

It is just the turnings turning.  Through the unraveling it seemed wise to keep the government small by not solving problems.  The result was problems that cannot be ignored.  I count them as COVID, the economy, systematic racism, global warming and red violence.  In time the problems will be less, the government more corrupt, and the pendulum will swing the other way.  However, that time is decades in the future.

Another example of 3T thinking gone sour: the Texas electric grid has been under funded for decades, and collapsed under a load it couldn't sustain.  And the wind turbines they bought were bottom-of-the-barrel as well.  The Canadians and Swedes have no problems with theirs in much harsher conditions. "You get what you pay for" is just as true today as ever.

[beechnut79]

(02-17-2021, 11:26 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(02-17-2021, 07:21 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(02-17-2021, 12:28 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(02-16-2021, 04:43 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: By now Democrats are becoming the Party of civic peace, rule of law, rationality, ethnic inclusion, and the promotion of skill and learning. 

So, who indoctrinated you and how long did it take? You must not be paying attention to the unsavory politicians and corporations that currently have your fate in their hands. You seem to think the Democrats that we get to see on a regular basis are bunch of decent/trustworthy/caring human beings aka saintly, can do no wrong who are worth saving these days.

It is just the turnings turning.  Through the unraveling it seemed wise to keep the government small by not solving problems.  The result was problems that cannot be ignored.  I count them as COVID, the economy, systematic racism, global warming and red violence.  In time the problems will be less, the government more corrupt, and the pendulum will swing the other way.  However, that time is decades in the future.

Another example of 3T thinking gone sour: the Texas electric grid has been under funded for decades, and collapsed under a load it couldn't sustain.  And the wind turbines they bought were bottom-of-the-barrel as well.  The Canadians and Swedes have no problems with theirs in much harsher conditions. "You get what you pay for" is just as true today as ever.

Not in all cases. You can get a cut of steak for, say, $17 at a modest restaurant while that very same cut at a trendy location can set you back $30 or more.