Brexit Results

[Ragnarök_62]

[qutote=Eric The Green] [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dean_Baker][/url]BUT.... I like witches!  They are unfairly maligned by superstitious, dogmatic folks. [/quote]

It's just a figure of speech. So yeah, that comparison is an insult to actual witches.

Quote:I don't know if it's not democratic. The leaders of the EU are ministers from the various countries, who have their positions because of elections in the various countries. Congress decides on trade deals in the USA; they are not directly voted upon. Same thing.

Trade deals or anything else for that matter that are kept secret from the public are by definition undemocratic. The People, regardless of nation are the employers of their representatives. That means they have every right to know the particulars of all legislation up for votes. I'd also extend that to stuff like the NSA here in the US.

Eric The Green Wrote:I don't know if I am in favor of the European-American trade deal or not. I of course don't want to see secret corporate control that stifles regulations on labor, the environment, etc.

That's what the TPP for the US is and the TPIP is for Europe and the US.

Quote:But nothing I see from you or elsewhere is enough to fully make up my mind. I lean in favor, because of the point I made that you are ignoring. Free trade among equal partners on the same economic and political level are good for their economies.

They are not good when arbitration panels replace the rule of law. If you want to confirm or deny my assertions, just search for TPP / TPIP on the interwebs and read for yourself.  Do not try this with MSM sites like CNN, ABC, CBS, etc. because you won't find the information there. In fact the MSM has become as relevant to me as the National Enquirer.  They all have the same amount of actual journalism.  https://www.rt.com even beats the MSM.
That's saying something because rt.com is a Russian media outlet.

Quote:The common market helped Western Europe to recover and prosper. The USA and Europe are on a fairly equal footing. The USA and Mexico are not. Neither are the USA and the Asian Pacific Rim. So this European deal is not like NAFTA or TPP.

I don't think it's the common market that's got folks livid over the EU.  It's the power overreach on the part of Brussels.  Arrogant policy makers engender that reaction. In fact in the current 4T, where folks just get angry over the status quo anyhow, that attitude will become a larger and larger lightening rod as time passes.  So also, Congress/US bureaucrats  beware.

Quote:Clinton is not much influenced by her campaign money. She is just playing the game, and is all in favor of changing it.

So why do economic entities just toss money away then?

Quote:She is just not as bold as Bernie in relying on small contributions. She should be, but most Democrats are not, since they consider it "unilateral disarmament."

It isn't unilateral disarmament.   I bet if the DNC got behind Sanders like they did Clinton as per leaked DNC files, then Bernie would have been the nominee. Since I've decided, based on the leaked documents , that the DNC decided to be one sided, I'm going to say the hell with them and again, vote for Jill Stein.  I do not suffer obvious bias by political parties.

Quote:Clinton is more hawkish than Obama, by a degree, but that does not make her a hawk compared to the neo-cons. You keep forgetting, Rags, that over-simplified exaggeration is not a good approach to policy or choosing candidates.

I've researched that topic, as such
http://www.salon.com/2016/06/10/another_...tatus_quo/

Quote:Just as over-simplified, brash loudness is not a good approach to music. I see a common link of temperament there in your approach. Bash things! Go overboard! It may be a common attitude among Jonesers and core Xers; I don't know.

LOL!  Since I'm in that crowd, it's hard to sort out being on the inside looking out.

Quote:I don't know. Austerity is not a good approach. The European economy needs stimulus. They are copying America instead. But Europe was also at a disadvantage because it didn't have a FED. Now it does, and that may help.

Quote:I don't know why giving money to Greece's creditors doesn't reduce their debt. Isn't their debt owed to their creditors? I don't know if default and be done with it is the right approach.

That money goes for interest payments only and does not reduce the debt load.  Since this sort of policy has been going on for years now and there has been no change to Greece's financial situation, default is the best option for the Greeks.  Default by definition means the debt load just goes poof.

Quote:But I do know that Greece itself was dominated by economic elites who absorb most of the wealth in that society. Greece needs to take some of that wealth away, as well as get its own small businesses going rather than be too dependent on the state. A state that pays people their salaries, but does not require the wealthy to contribute, cannot be solvent.

That is a problem, but minor as to the amount of money involved. With that said, yes I agree with you.

Quote:Yes I know. Honesty is the best policy too. Still, people can see further beyond their inclinations if they choose to.

Dunno about that. When I see my economic betters feathering their nests, I say to myself, why not help myself?

Quote:Pecuniary goals means greed. That also means support for policies based on greed which you don't like. When money is seen only as a means to ends, not as an end in itself, the people prosper. Seek first the things of the Spirit, and all these things will be yours as well.

It's a mix of cynicism, anger, and self justification.  I'm not sure which generation(s) suffer from such handicaps, but I'm just being upfront.  The elites do that shit and since anger is the prime thing to get rid of, the act of helping myself makes it go away.  Anger is not a pleasant emotion by any means.  The spirit thingie might work better if/when the thumscrews go away.

Quote:The previous period was better, when people could see beyond narrowing limits. I am hoping this time around Taurus also means respect and care for the Earth, and pecuniary benefit through the green energy revolution. When Uranus goes into Taurus in 2018, I expect the green energy industry boom to fully take off.

But, but, IIRC you by some means there's Saturn messing up Rag's stuff.

Quote:Nope, older folks see that TPIP train coming down the track. The UK got off that train before the inevitable
train wreck.

Quote:Older folks were voting on cultural and economic xenophobia and resentment against immigrants, not on a trade deal which may happen even despite Brexit.

Uh, that's for the most part Boomers.  What happened to that youthful idealism?

Something like this?


Educational posters for migrants that try to get the idea in their head that they are in Austria/Germany now and women are not playthings for males.

Quote:No, you or anyone does not have to pick a tribe. In our times tribes are irrelevant. They mean next to nothing. Geneology is interesting and all, but I am nothing at all like my ancestors and I don't even have much in common with my parents, let alone all the English, Germans and Dutch etc.

I bet you look like some some mix of those tribes.

Quote:My identity has been shaped by my own talents and interests, not by my ancestry or which government entity happens to control where I live. Nationality means very little to peoples' real identity, except that people like what they are used to. Diversity and multi-culturalism is relatively new, and people just have to get used to it, since it's inevitable.

Quote:1. Has Eric considered Kulturkampf ?
2. Both Bill Clinton in the 1990's [remember the repeal of Glass Steagall? ] and Hillary are both neo liberals.
To paraphrase Nixon, both the Democratic party and the Republican party are all neo-liberals now.  Yes, there are some exceptions like Sanders and emergant shift/realignment segment of Republicans.
http://www.investors.com/politics/editor...ade-party/
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/04/de...ill-117066

So, it's a 4th turning and the eagerly awaited realignment is nigh.  The names may remain the same, but the policies will change.

The Kulterkamp was the culture wars, and that's 3T. It influences the 4T, but it's just the reactionary element of it. The 4T re-alignment will be the decisive defeat of reactionary xenophobia, neo-liberalism and neo-conservatism; "the whole lot" as Kenneth Clark might say!

Eric The Green Wrote:Lumping Clinton together with Republican neo-liberals and neo-conservatives is just more over-simplified thinking. It ain't so; it's a matter of degree. The so-called emergent shift among Republicans is just more neo-liberalism. Trump may be neo-liberalism on steroids, considering his tax and deregulation proposals. There's more to Trump than just his over-wrought and xenophobic opposition to free trade.

http://www.salon.com/2016/06/10/another_...tatus_quo/

I think she's a neocon herself because other neocons like here.  I even have a position in a defense stock, United Technologies in place for the expected Clinton win.  I may not like her, but at least I've done something to profit from her.  Since I can't get those juicy speaking fees like her, at least I can profit from her.  That's another way I mollify my anger.  In short, finding some way, some how to make money on something that pisses me off works wonders to bring peace to my soul.

Quote:There have been rapes you know..
http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/346059

So, it is for good reason that resentment is growing.  Feminists are gonna have a hard time.  Either they defend women in Europe AND demand border controls or they discredit themselves.  There is no other way.  That's a nice feature of 4th turnings.  There arise situations where choices and consequences are demanded.

Quote:Sounds like Trump's description of Mexicans. "They're rapists."

Trump may have said that, but I don't recall coming across anything on the internet news sites that confirms that. All I've seen is that Mexicans are pretty much like other immigrant waves in that they tend to assimilate.

Quote:Then what's with their politicians who are trying to "negotiate" a soft-landing for their exit?

and...

Quote:Those who voted Brexist are also the corporate elites who want deregulation so they can oppress their people.

Simple, you answered your own question.  A hard landing would hit the pocket books of the elites pretty bad. Sort of like those messed up Friday markets.

Quote:Don't know what that is.

H1-B is a sort of work visa where companies can hire foreign workers to work in the US.  The intent of the visa is to relive labor shortages.  However it's used in financial engineering to replace US workers with cheap imported foreign labor.

Quote:I've been to Stavanger Norway.  It's no sweat to get a damn passport.  You don't need papers if you have a passport.  I think that's all that will be required.  Norway has no special stuff for US citizens.  Swedes yes.

Quote:Maybe tourists can go there with a passport, but Brexit is about limiting people from freely living and working in the various EU countries.

No decision has all positive results.

Quote:Awwwww, Eric's disappointed in historical Anglo-Saxon behavior. We're gonna be allies due to historical tribal ties.
Canada, Australia, US, UK, and New Zealand have long lived tribal and historical ties.  Tribal ties are also the main reason our dodos at the state department and defense department can't figure out the Middle East.

Maybe; the anglo-sphere will still exist. But yes, I am disappointed. But, of course, xenophobia is not limited to anglos. The Middle East is far more tribal than the anglo-sphere. We're supposed to be better than that; not sink back toward their level.

Quote:1. Yes, different deals.
2. Both are huge bull markets for Monsanto and Exxon Mobil though.  Perhaps Eric can feather his nest ... just like Rags.  I can't decide if said trade agreements get ratified, but I can make investment choices based on ratification or non ratification.

Quote:I don't know; Europe restricts GMOs and other Monsanto misbehavior. The European trade deal may not be as corporate as the TPP and NAFTA. Since Europe has better regulations against corporate takeovers and misbehavior compared to America, if anything it may be LESS favorable to the big companies to HAVE the trade deal than NOT to have it.

TPP/TPIP override any regulations that may keep Monsanto's misbehavior in check.  Under either treaty, Monsanto gains the right to sue over anything that messes up its profits.  

Quote:Meanwhile, the best investment advice is not to pick and choose but to invest in indexed funds. Knowledgeable people have proven this to be the fact. Just relax and don't try to pick and choose. You lose that way. The market moves too fast, and big investors have a huge advantage over the little guy.

It's the 4th turning.  While index funds were the way to go, they are not that way now. Anyhow, to each their own.
I just prefer to have a strategy as such.

Any company I select to buy shares in must have these 2 criteria with just maybe 1 holding that has other favorable aspects.

a. The company must have a strong balance sheet. The debt to equity ratio must be real low or non existent.
b. The company must pay a dividend.*

*If there's a company out there that does not pay a dividend, but has a good balance sheet, then 1 or 2 or those may be allowed.  Case in point,  First Solar.  First solar is obviously a growth type stock, but the kicker was they've sourced a non China supply of tellurium - a necessary input for solar panels.  They own a gold mine in Mexico that also produces tellurium.  So, if China relations go south, it won't hurt them. This company also has a lot of management with skin in the game.  Those positive attributes are sufficient to own this stock.

Schwab has a stock selector where you can select whatever criteria you want.  The criteria I chose came back with less 100 stocks. That means broad index funds do not match my investment goals.

Small investors do indeed have disadvantages.  The best I do is to not become a trader, but rather as per the goals is to find stocks that match a pre defined set of attributes and hold those.  I do not buy "tout stocks" like the stuff Cramer's always spouting off about.  Cramer has never to my knowledge had some list of stocks to get rid of. Sock touters just don't do that.  I just go in twice a year and make sure the stuff I do have still matches the pre defined criteria and chuck anything that no longer matches.  The way I see it, I must have reasons to own a certain set of stocks and if something no longer matches, be frank enough with myself to chuck things without regret.

Now, the regular brokerage account does have a "mad money" dollar amount.  That is used to buy puts [a bet against a lousy company]  when I see such opportunities arise.  Such an event has just materialized and once I've locked in my trade, I'll give Eric the trade info and the reasoning behind it.