Donald Trump: polls of approval and favorability

[Eric the Green]

(01-22-2021, 02:12 PM)mamabug Wrote:

(01-22-2021, 05:15 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: It's true, mamabug and classic. The nub of the problem is really people not disowning Republican ideas. 

So, basically, the problem of the crisis is 'wrong think'.  Or, to borrow from an earlier era, "The Crisis will not end until those evil papists turn from their sin and embrace the King as the head of the Church!"

I think I've read enough of your views to understand I have little hope in convincing you of why I see this as an incredibly dangerous mentality to take hold in those who control the levers of power, you seem fully immersed in the stereotypical Boomer 'Black vs. White' thinking.  I'm sure if, in the coming months, a few eggs need to be broken to form the coming utopia I will be able to read your justifications of it.

I'm just going to repeat my earlier assertion that a Crisis Era does not arise because there is an actual, real problem that needs drastic action to solve.  The 'problem' is just a manifestation of underlying splits in society - you could subtitle this hypothesis 'King George was Right.'  The Crisis Era arises when generations align in a structure that fosters a social belief that not only does a given, selected 'problem' need to be solved, but it is so important they become willing to solve it via force and are able to morally justify marginalizing, impoverishing, imprisoning and/or outright killing their neighbor.

In the last turning, we directed most of that willingness outward.  The two turnings before that we directed it inward (North vs. South, loyalists vs. freedom fighters).  Both were very bloody.   Of course, in the modern era, we could have a kinder, gentler suppression where we simply 'unperson' people by depriving them of their jobs, access to federal services, the ability to access the public square, and equal protection under the law.  

If you disagree that the democrats could or would do this, please explain to me how you would resolve the Crisis of 'people holding Republican ideas' if almost exactly 1/2 of the country hold one or more ideas that could be considered 'Republican.'

Biden is open to compromise to get things done, and so am I. I am forecasting the end of the libertarian reign, which has been very harmful, but I know the United States has been spellbound by Reaganomics for 40 years so I know there's only so much progress that can be made. But I am convinced we are starting a new era, and if the country changed before from keynesian to reaganoid, it can change again, gradual though it may be. Those who are holding on to this ideology for dear life, like Rand Paul and the Trump crazies, will gradually pass from the scene to be replaced by the younger, more-diverse generations.

I agree with Strauss and Howe instead that the problems that arise in the Crisis are real and arise from the neglect that happened because of the focus on cultural renewal followed by culture war. In the 4T, we must refocus on dealing with the "outward" problems or secular problems again and remember the value of institutions as opposed to individualism. These are the two poles that the saeculum oscillates between: secular/institutional and sacred or spiritual and individualist. I think if you read the book, you will find that this is the authors' view, not just that prophets come along and decide to solve made-up problems by force. And Boomers today I believe have been succeeded by Xers who have an even more drastic conception of black vs. white.

I would put the Revolution as "directing the willingness to solve" outward, since the British were viewed as an invading army. But there is some direction inward in these outward-directed 4Ts too, as was also the case in the Great Depression. I agree that in the age when war is becoming obsolete and outdated, the 4T struggle this time will be kinder and gentler. But it is the Republicans today who are "depriving them of their jobs, access to federal services, the ability to access the public square, and equal protection under the law."

The only way to resolve the current divide is for one side to win. The fourth turning is an all- or- nothing affair, more or less. Some compromises may be made here and there. Obama basically compromised the chance for renewal away. But the critical needs of the country are real, and so the Left will press forward. Since in this "double rhythm" we are more directed toward our own country, where the biggest problems are, it could lead to civil war. Or, if we are kinder and gentler, perhaps an agreement of red and blue to separate for a while. Or, just a political victory at the ballot box by the blue, and suppression of those who, like those on Jan.6, choose not to accept solutions and destiny, and violently rebel. These days, the red side cannot win the popular vote, and can take power only through the outdated electoral college and voter suppression, or through an attempted coup.

I suggest you take a good look at the ideology you are holding onto, and see where you might be willing to let go of some of it for the sake of achieving consensus. Do you see Reagan or Trump as your prophet? Must you be wedded to neo-liberalism as the only solution? Can you accept people who are different from you as being allowed to live freely in your country? Can you accept that sometimes taxes need to be raised, and regulations must be adopted to rein in businessmen who are too greedy and abusive? Can you see the value of public ownership and de-monopolizing of some enterprises, while preserving the right of entrepreneurs to go into business and make money? Can you see the value of public investment in the national interest? Can you see the value of some regulation of guns? Can you see the possible error of your ways if you denied the covid crisis and the need for protective measures? Must you cling to the idea that giving breaks to the wealthy will trickle down, when they don't? Can you see that democracy is the way forward, not authoritarian rule by a leader who denies a free and fair election and calls it rigged when it was not, and spearheads a coup attempt because he didn't get his way?

If we want consensus, then both sides will have to adapt, and the red side, which is the conservative stand-pat side that must yield some ground in the Crisis, or be defeated, must adapt more. The progressive side has always won in 4Ts in the USA/UK saeculum, and it must win again if we are to progress and not decline.

And, in it's time, in the Wars of the Roses, and in the following Elizabethan era, the way of progress was indeed through the Tudors and then the rule of the King or Queen over the Papists. Then, next time, was the way of partial Parliamentary rule over corrupt absolute rule by kings. Then, it was a new Republic rather than the King of the colonies. Then, it was a union dedicated to freedom rather than one section dedicated to slavery. Then, as still today, it was the rule of the common man over big business, and, maybe also like today, human dignity over racism and world conquest by dictators. But this time, a livable planet also hangs in the balance.