Millenial Turnover

[Bob Butler 54]

CNN has one of the better articles on how the Millennials might look at things differently politically.

[David Horn]

(10-07-2018, 10:41 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: CNN has one of the better articles on how the Millennials might look at things differently politically.

Unfortunately, they seem more than a little distracted.  It's as if they live in a bubble that floats through the world of not-them.  They don't feel any real attachment to that world, or any responsibility for it.  They are angry about their lives; they see themselves as pawns in a game they don't play.  Many are just accepting of their fate.  It's sad, to be frank about it.  If I have to use a single term, it's lethargic.  I'm not sure what breaks that pattern.

[pbrower2a]

(10-09-2018, 10:55 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(10-07-2018, 10:41 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: CNN has one of the better articles on how the Millennials might look at things differently politically.

Unfortunately, they seem more than a little distracted.  It's as if they live in a bubble that floats through the world of not-them.  They don't feel any real attachment to that world, or any responsibility for it.  They are angry about their lives; they see themselves as pawns in a game they don't play.  Many are just accepting of their fate.  It's sad, to be frank about it.  If I have to use a single term, it's lethargic.  I'm not sure what breaks that pattern.

It is hard to develop much of a bond to the world if it does not fit one's world-view. Such is so if one has the perception that someone else made the world, and that that world forces one to destroy one's ego to fit in. Also in economics -- it is also hard to latch onto an economic reality in which one is overworked and underpaid, a common reality for young workers who have yet to specialize into something lucrative.
Politics? The old bastards run things, and they do so badly.

This is nothing new; it seems to have always been so.

[Eric the Green]

But people used to be willing to rebel or vote to change their lot. Now millennials don't think they can do that, or are too lethargic to do that. And we all suffer because they are not doing their part. And of course we all suffer because the older generations have also lost faith with truth and justice, and have surrendered to the ideologies of greed and prejudice instead.

[David Horn]

(10-09-2018, 02:34 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: But people used to be willing to rebel or vote to change their lot. Now millennials don't think they can do that, or are too lethargic to do that. And we all suffer because they are not doing their part. And of course we all suffer because the older generations have also lost faith with truth and justice, and have surrendered to the ideologies of greed and prejudice instead.

Perhaps Attention Deficit Disorder is real, and a large part of the problem.  I heard a roaming interview of students at UC Irvine.  Only one planned to vote, and his girlfriend said she would but had no clue about doing it.  The other 20 or so acted like it was something that happened to other people, not them.

[Eric the Green]

Maybe if we got another warmonger president who wanted to institute the draft again? That was a big motivator for us boomers when young to vote and work for candidates like McGovern. Maybe the young people need to feel the hand of the state upon their backs a lot harder. Right now it's just a bit too invisible.

[Galen]

(10-09-2018, 05:18 PM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: Maybe if we got another warmonger president who wanted to institute the draft again? That was a big motivator for us boomers when young to vote and work for candidates like McGovern. Maybe the young people need to feel the hand of the state upon their backs a lot harder. Right now it's just a bit too invisible.

That doesn't surprise me in the slightest.  Boomers, despite the rhetoric, were always about saving their own asses.  Couldn't really be bothered to worry about anyone else.

[David Horn]

(10-10-2018, 03:16 AM)Galen Wrote:

(10-09-2018, 05:18 PM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: Maybe if we got another warmonger president who wanted to institute the draft again? That was a big motivator for us boomers when young to vote and work for candidates like McGovern. Maybe the young people need to feel the hand of the state upon their backs a lot harder. Right now it's just a bit too invisible.

That doesn't surprise me in the slightest.  Boomers, despite the rhetoric, were always about saving their own asses.  Couldn't really be bothered to worry about anyone else.

Obviously, you need a class on irony.  

[Eric the Green]

(10-10-2018, 10:14 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(10-10-2018, 03:16 AM)Galen Wrote:

(10-09-2018, 05:18 PM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: Maybe if we got another warmonger president who wanted to institute the draft again? That was a big motivator for us boomers when young to vote and work for candidates like McGovern. Maybe the young people need to feel the hand of the state upon their backs a lot harder. Right now it's just a bit too invisible.

That doesn't surprise me in the slightest.  Boomers, despite the rhetoric, were always about saving their own asses.  Couldn't really be bothered to worry about anyone else.

Obviously, you need a class on irony.  

Millennials don't seem to worry about anyone else either. In their ironic detachment, they wait for someone else to change things. They wait for us boomers, the ones they scream and moan about, to save them, while they whine and occupy streets.

[Galen]

(10-10-2018, 10:14 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(10-10-2018, 03:16 AM)Galen Wrote:

(10-09-2018, 05:18 PM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: Maybe if we got another warmonger president who wanted to institute the draft again? That was a big motivator for us boomers when young to vote and work for candidates like McGovern. Maybe the young people need to feel the hand of the state upon their backs a lot harder. Right now it's just a bit too invisible.

That doesn't surprise me in the slightest.  Boomers, despite the rhetoric, were always about saving their own asses.  Couldn't really be bothered to worry about anyone else.

Obviously, you need a class on irony.  

One thing Xers get is irony.  Check out some of the charity work that goes on and you will see a surprising number of Xers.

[Eric the Green]

Obama teaches millennials. They aren't learning yet.

https://youtu.be/66TSD2YiNhg?t=54m36s

[Galen]

(10-10-2018, 06:07 PM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: Obama teaches millennials. They aren't learning yet.

The only thing to be learned from Obozo is what not to do.

[David Horn]

(10-10-2018, 03:18 PM)Galen Wrote:

(10-10-2018, 10:14 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(10-10-2018, 03:16 AM)Galen Wrote:

(10-09-2018, 05:18 PM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: Maybe if we got another warmonger president who wanted to institute the draft again? That was a big motivator for us boomers when young to vote and work for candidates like McGovern. Maybe the young people need to feel the hand of the state upon their backs a lot harder. Right now it's just a bit too invisible.

That doesn't surprise me in the slightest.  Boomers, despite the rhetoric, were always about saving their own asses.  Couldn't really be bothered to worry about anyone else.

Obviously, you need a class on irony.  

One thing Xers get is irony.  Check out some of the charity work that goes on and you will see a surprising number of Xers.

Most of the Xers I know, and its actually many, neither participate in charitable work, charitable giving nor the paying of taxes (if they can wiggle out of it).
Yours is not a charitable generation, and mine isn't either.  You know who gives and serves?  The poor.  It's sad, but those most nearly in wont themselves are typically the first to step up to help others.

[David Horn]

(10-10-2018, 11:43 PM)Galen Wrote:

(10-10-2018, 06:07 PM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: Obama teaches millennials. They aren't learning yet.

The only thing to be learned from Obozo is what not to do.

Glib.  Wrong … but glib nonetheless.  It's your generation's prime talent.

[Eric the Green]

Yeah, I know Galen and folks like him would love nothing better than for millennials to not learn from Obama and not to vote, and they usually get their wish, Obama notwithstanding. But Obama tries his best.

[pbrower2a]

(10-10-2018, 11:43 PM)Galen the Quack Wrote:

(10-10-2018, 06:07 PM)Eric the (Green) Wrote: Obama teaches millennials. They aren't learning yet.

The only thing to be learned from (Obama) is what not to do.

Uh.... I know that you have little respect for academics other than those with whom you might agree, but the American Political Science Association the American Political Science Association assessed the merits of all 44 Presidents (for them Grover Cleveland counts as one) this year. Trump rates 44th of 44.

From FDR the Presidents rate

FDR 3 (his role in saving Western Christian Civilization merits such a spot)
Truman 6
Eisenhower 7
Kennedy 16 (would be higher except for the sexual stuff)
LBJ 10
Nixon 33
Ford 25
Carter 26
Reagan 9
GHWB 17
Clinton 13
Dubya 30
Obama 8
Trump 44

1, 2, 3, 4, and 5 are Lincoln, Washington, FDR, Teddy Roosevelt, and Jefferson, respectively.

The position of Obama between Eisenhower and Reagan suggests some similarities. I have frequently compared Obama to Eisenhower for temperament, respect for precedent and protocol, rejection of pointless adventures, avoidance of scandal, and refusal to do demagoguery. Reagan is similarly adept at communication even if the message is very different, and got good results in foreign policy.  Although Trump claims to repudiate everything that Obama did, it is likely that the next President will lionize him -- and eventually he will be the model in behavior for a conservative President even if the agenda is different. 

I may have not liked the Reagan agenda, but Trump makes Reagan look great -- by contrast.

[Eric the Green]

I certainly disagree with those rankings, but if Galen made them, I would disagree a whole lot more.

[Galen]

(10-11-2018, 02:12 PM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: Yeah, I know Galen and folks like him would love nothing better than for millennials to not learn from Obama and not to vote, and they usually get their wish, Obama notwithstanding. But Obama tries his best.

According to Bezo's Blog they seem to have the not voting part down.

[pbrower2a]

(10-11-2018, 11:13 PM)Galen the Quack Wrote:

(10-11-2018, 02:12 PM)Eric the (Green) Wrote: Yeah, I know Galen and folks like him would love nothing better than for millennials to not learn from Obama and not to vote, and they usually get their wish, Obama notwithstanding. But Obama tries his best.

According to Bezo's Blog they seem to have the not voting part down.

The oldest members of the Millennial Generation are turning 36 this year, and that is about when a generation starts making its way into the high public office. Millennial style in politics is far closer to GI style than to Silent, Boom, or X style. Neither the Silent, the Boom, nor X gets it right with the Millennial Generation.

The Millennial Generation has no desire to be stepped on, and it is finding out from Donald Trump what to avoid. Obama may not be perfect, but at least he gets much right.

[Galen]

(10-12-2018, 02:54 AM)pbrower2a Wrote:

(10-11-2018, 11:13 PM)Galen Wrote:

(10-11-2018, 02:12 PM)Eric the Obtuse Wrote: Yeah, I know Galen and folks like him would love nothing better than for millennials to not learn from Obama and not to vote, and they usually get their wish, Obama notwithstanding. But Obama tries his best.

According to Bezo's Blog they seem to have the not voting part down.

The oldest members of the Millennial Generation are turning 36 this year, and that is about when a generation starts making its way into the high public office. Millennial style in politics is far closer to GI style than to Silent, Boom, or X style. Neither the Silent, the Boom, nor X gets it right with the Millennial Generation.

I think the Millies are finding out that while they may not like how Xers go about things we have the advantage of being competent.  This is not something that Boomers are known for.  The GIs did not disrespect the Lost and what ever you might think of the Lost in the end the GIs realized that they were necessary for the outcome.  I saw them interact enough to realize what was going on.

Consider this scene from Patton movie for a moment.





It is Hollywood and a bit overly dramatic and also a combination of two different events that actually occurred.  In spite of that it contains much truth about how the Lost and GIs interacted.  Many of us Xers will go out of our way to help a Millie that is trying and not giving up.  The Snowflakes, on the other hand, are who Xers tend to have no respect for because quitting is the true failure.


In my experience the Millies who are not living in their parents basements are going to have enough of a grip on reality to realize those surly Xers know what they are about.  They don't have to like us, they just have to respect us and understand us enough to realize we are trying to clean up a really big mess that their grand-parents left.  In the end I think most of them will let the Xers do what needs to be done because all of the other options will be worse.  That was the choice the GIs faced when they were young.  For them listening to the Lost gave them the best chance of surviving which they recognized.