The Coronavirus

[Classic-Xer]

(05-12-2020, 09:27 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(05-11-2020, 07:54 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: Dude, we've always been committed to country and the left has always been opposed and in favor of establishing it's own country. Yes, we are getting there and we should be getting there even faster now that this occurred.

In recent coverage of the virus, they emphasize that the isolation policy protesters are in a vast minority, and a significant number of people of both parties approve more of what the governors are doing than the president.

Thus, like your own talk of violence while not doing anything, I don’t think the protesters will do anything either.  You just represent a small minority.

The spiral of violence seems to be stuck still at the lone nut level.  I don’t see anything comparable to say Bleeding Kansas, the Harper’s Ferry raid, or the violence in Boston that led to the Revolution.

So I am just not impressed.

I hope violence never comes but if it does, I will adjust to it and deal with it accordingly as I've clearly stated many times here and the previous site. There's no need for violence yet. It's political now and politics generally has to fail before violence ensues. As far as the protestor's, the protestors represent the view of the majority of the country that matters right now. As long as the liberals persist in keeping things closed down and continue to delay economies from opening up and continue do blatant shit because they can do it right now, I expect the majority to grow more every day it goes on. News flash, in today's world, you're not going to see it coming because today's world moves faster than it ever has before. You keep looking back when you should be gazing at today figuring out what to expect tomorrow. I guess we're even. I've never been impressed by the liberals.

[Classic-Xer]

(05-12-2020, 11:56 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Most new cases in the USA on May 12:
IL 4014
CA 1735
NY 1504
TX 1011
NJ 942
FL 941
MA 870
PA 849
GA 846
VA 730
MN 695
MD 688

Texas, Florida and Georgia moving up! Chickens starting to come home to roost. It takes a week or two.


USA total: 22,802
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

Here we go again. As we've mentioned before, as the amount of testing increases the amount of cases will rise accordingly. Your state needs more testing.

[Classic-Xer]

(05-12-2020, 10:53 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: We on the left teach that people of color have been enslaved and oppressed up until recently, and still are in many cases. We support anti-poverty programs and welfare because they protect us all and promote economic growth, as we have explained. So because Democrats advocate some of these ideas, some of the time, people of color know which party to support, and like the other party, Democrats rally and encourage their supporters to vote. You claim this is getting political power by catering to POC and Democrats are dependent on them for this. I agree with JFK instead who said when the rights of one are violated, the rights of all are threatened. That's why POC support Democrats, because they protect their civil rights and anti-poverty programs, which help everyone. You vote Republican because the rights you care about are property and gun rights. You don't support the rule of law or democracy, because you support a president and party that violates and destroys these things. For you guys, the flag matters but what it stands for does not.

We know what you've been teaching them, we hear it from them all the time and we are threatened to be sued by them all the time. I agree with what JFK said too, which is why the American libertarians are going to cripple you politically and end your reign and force them to accept equality or get the fuck out of here.

[Bob Butler 54]

(05-12-2020, 11:56 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Texas, Florida and Georgia moving up! Chickens starting to come home to roost. It takes a week or two.

Nitpick.  I understand that some of the chickens are being sent to meat packing plants.  I understand death is calling.

[pbrower2a]

(05-13-2020, 12:28 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(05-12-2020, 09:27 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(05-11-2020, 07:54 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: Dude, we've always been committed to country and the left has always been opposed and in favor of establishing it's own country. Yes, we are getting there and we should be getting there even faster now that this occurred.

In recent coverage of the virus, they emphasize that the isolation policy protesters are in a vast minority, and a significant number of people of both parties approve more of what the governors are doing than the president.

Thus, like your own talk of violence while not doing anything, I don’t think the protesters will do anything either.  You just represent a small minority.

The spiral of violence seems to be stuck still at the lone nut level.  I don’t see anything comparable to say Bleeding Kansas, the Harper’s Ferry raid, or the violence in Boston that led to the Revolution.

So I am just not impressed.

I hope violence never comes but if it does, I will adjust to it and deal with it accordingly as I've clearly stated many times here and the previous site. There's no need for violence yet. It's political now and politics generally has to fail before violence ensues. As far as the protestor's, the protestors represent the view of the majority of the country that matters right now. As long as the liberals persist in keeping things closed down and continue to delay economies from opening up and continue do blatant shit because they can do it right now, I expect the majority to grow more every day it goes on. News flash, in today's world, you're not going to see it coming because today's world moves faster than it ever has before. You keep looking back when you should be gazing at today figuring out what to expect tomorrow. I guess we're even. I've never been impressed by the liberals.

Aside from self-defense, war, and rescue, violence is abominable. (I recognize that self-defense or defense of others is itself consummately violent. Mess with puppies in the presence of a mother dog and you will get mauled. The proper solution to unjustifiable violence is suppression by law enforcement and punishment as prescribed by courts of law. Most violence comes from people with a proclivity to do violence anyway. Violence is ordinarily criminal, and its perpetrators ordinarily don't get a chance to explain any high purpose while on trial. All too often it is "I was drunk" or "I was on drugs". 

Violent people do not get a break on the claim of affront. If someone goes after me for being Jewish (I am not Jewish, but I fit three Jewish stereotypes and I have some quirks of behavior that put others off) then that will be his legal problem should I be hurt. Maybe we can express clearly that someone making a pass on a spouse is going too far and would wisely back off. Civilized people honor such a request. If it is my wife and some drunk keeps pressing forward with such an advance, then my wife and I are going to find a way out of that mess. Maybe the bouncer will solve the problem.

(OK, I have exposed that I don;t like being around drunks and druggies.

The majority view is that many things that we used to do with little thought of danger are now consummately dangerous due to COVID-19. A fringe denies the disease or claims that it will kill only weaklings (as if that is a defense of exposing the weak to inappropriate risks). Most Americans are making sacrifices to avoid getting a dangerous disease and spreading it if we have it. People on the "Open America now!"  side are the minority. Guess what -- your beloved Big Business, your usual ally on most political issues, is not on your side. The most basic rule of good business is "Do not hurt your customers, direct or indirect". The liquor industry approves of minimum ages for drinking and of laws that prohibit selling alcohol to people already drunk. Brewers have supplied ads that strongly discourage drunk driving.  Kellogg's Corporation (the cereal company that also makes Keebler crackers and cookies) pressed charges against a firm that sold them bad peanut butter that the company ended up not using -- and people who sold the company the bad peanut butter that should have never been sold to anyone  have since been sentenced to prison terms. Kellogg's was not going to tolerate harm to its customers.

Big Business does not want its customers being sickened, hurt, disabled, or killed. Big Business is as much behind this as we liberals are. When the highly-pecuniary NBA and NHL shut down seasons because of COVID-19 with little warning, such indicated that the disease was too big a menace. Things could be worse for sports franchises and federations than to lose big revenue -- being the villains whose events became epicenters of an all-too-often lethal contagion and get subjected to huge lawsuits that bankrupt them. 

We are all in the same pickle.  Yes, you are, too. The protesters have no coherent idea of how to reopen America with minimal risk to Americans. People will find ways to make much of American commerce and hedonism safe again. Those people are medical researchers, physicians, professionals in public health, engineers, non-medical scientists, and business owners and executives.  I have seen evidence that most of the protesters are cranks and extremists who have other agendas such as "gun rights". What do firearms have to do with "opening America"?

We will find ways; we always do because that is the American way of doing things. We will re-invent and re-engineer. We have the entrepreneurial spirit and faith in our abilities.  We will modify our customs and practices much as we did after 9/11. We know what we miss most and what compromises we can make to do again what we cherish or what we must put off for now but must do again if we are to have fully-human lives. I trust science and even the entrepreneurial tendency more than I trust your protesters. We are stuck with virtual reality (in a way, recordings are as virtual as one can get) instead of the real thing. 

The response to COVID-19 by Americans is not quite the same as Americans did against genocidal fascists  -- but we are treating COVID-19 with  deadly seriousness. I'm not going to say that the strictures of American economic life were quite the same... but we have yet to have rationing and price controls, and one can go on a Sunday drive. In World War II one could still go into stores and shop (but the shelves were nearly bare), could attend church services, have big weddings and showy funerals, and attend professional sporting events.  Crisis Eras eventually shape behavior because something matters then far more precious than the spur of the moment -- long-term survival of precious values, including freedom and human dignity.

[David Horn]

(05-13-2020, 12:28 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: I hope violence never comes but if it does, I will adjust to it and deal with it accordingly as I've clearly stated many times here and the previous site. There's no need for violence yet. It's political now and politics generally has to fail before violence ensues. As far as the protestor's, the protestors represent the view of the majority of the country that matters right now. As long as the liberals persist in keeping things closed down and continue to delay economies from opening up and continue do blatant shit because they can do it right now, I expect the majority to grow more every day it goes on. News flash, in today's world, you're not going to see it coming because today's world moves faster than it ever has before. You keep looking back when you should be gazing at today figuring out what to expect tomorrow. I guess we're even. I've never been impressed by the liberals.

Assuming that some outright fraud doesn't happen, we'll see whether your so-called majority of "Americans" shows up to vote. Note: I don't discount the possibility of fraud. The Russians are already starting active measures -- a step they avoided in 2016. This time, they may prefer havoc to backing Donald Trump, since havoc is their long term goal.

[David Horn]

(05-13-2020, 01:21 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: We know what you've been teaching them, we hear it from them all the time and we are threatened to be sued by them all the time. I agree with what JFK said too, which is why the American libertarians are going to cripple you politically and end your reign and force them to accept equality or get the fuck out of here.

What constitutes your idea of equality?

[pbrower2a]

(05-13-2020, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:21 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: We know what you've been teaching them, we hear it from them all the time and we are threatened to be sued by them all the time. I agree with what JFK said too, which is why the American libertarians are going to cripple you politically and end your reign and force them to accept equality or get the fuck out of here.

What constitutes your idea of equality?

Here is my idea of what he thinks of equality: all wealth is created equal, and it is the right way to determine who gets what in political life.

Such is feudal or fascist, as I see it.

Heck, even I recognize that much of the opening up of America economically will depend upon the ability of the private sector, including Big Business, to find innovative solutions to the mess that we are in. Such is the appointed role of any executive with shareholders breathing down his back! We don't need excuses! We need solutions that will not blow up in our faces (or mess up people's lungs).

Street theater will solve nothing.

[Eric the Green]

(05-13-2020, 01:21 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(05-12-2020, 10:53 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: We on the left teach that people of color have been enslaved and oppressed up until recently, and still are in many cases. We support anti-poverty programs and welfare because they protect us all and promote economic growth, as we have explained. So because Democrats advocate some of these ideas, some of the time, people of color know which party to support, and like the other party, Democrats rally and encourage their supporters to vote. You claim this is getting political power by catering to POC and Democrats are dependent on them for this. I agree with JFK instead who said when the rights of one are violated, the rights of all are threatened. That's why POC support Democrats, because they protect their civil rights and anti-poverty programs, which help everyone. You vote Republican because the rights you care about are property and gun rights. You don't support the rule of law or democracy, because you support a president and party that violates and destroys these things. For you guys, the flag matters but what it stands for does not.

We know what you've been teaching them, we hear it from them all the time and we are threatened to be sued by them all the time. I agree with what JFK said too, which is why the American libertarians are going to cripple you politically and end your reign and force them to accept equality or get the fuck out of here.

Well, we'll see, my classic friend. We new agers and progressives may well achieve the victory instead over the retrograde "American" libertarians, for whom "freedom" means only free enterprise, guns of any kind for anyone, freedom to discriminate against people who are different in religion, sexual/gender orientation, or ethnicity/national origin from them, and freedom and democracy for whites only. The gun-toting demonstrators against necessary precautions taken for the coronavirus do not represent the people.

We'll see! Demographically, and in the opinion polls and in the popular vote, we are already the growing majority. The majority wants what we want, including what Bernie wants, and not what you want. Only outdated aspects of our constitution (the senate, electoral college) and outdated political practices (gerrymandering, money ruling politics) stand in our way.

We hope that some of you may realize someday just what "American" means, and what you really want, and you will graduate from your ancient red and blue memes and join the green and yellow new age of progress, and help us all to continue to unfold the real USA, the original and essential USA.

[Bob Butler 54]

(05-13-2020, 02:25 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: We hope that some of you may realize someday just what "American" means, and what you really want, and you will graduate from your ancient red and blue memes and join the green and yellow new age of progress, and help us all to continue to unfold the real USA, the original and essential USA.

What?  Slaves?  The government not regulating the economy, thus you get booms and busts?  Taking a bit more land from the natives when that’s convenient.

We have solved a few problems along the years.  The spirit of America is solving a few more.  Stepping into the past won’t do it.  Dropping fantasies that all problems are hoaxes and fake news, keeping your eyes shut so you don’t see what needs fixing, that is the non American part.

[Classic-Xer]

(05-13-2020, 01:36 PM)David Horn Wrote: Assuming that some outright fraud doesn't happen, we'll see whether your so-called majority of "Americans"  shows up to vote.  Note: I don't discount the possibility of fraud. The Russians are already starting active measures -- a step they avoided in 2016. This time, they may prefer havoc to backing Donald Trump, since havoc is their long term goal.

I'm sure Russia and China and other nations will all be politically active in 2020. The liberals are going to have to be very careful about the information/propaganda that they use and spread this season.

[Classic-Xer]

(05-13-2020, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:21 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: We know what you've been teaching them, we hear it from them all the time and we are threatened to be sued by them all the time. I agree with what JFK said too, which is why the American libertarians are going to cripple you politically and end your reign and force them to accept equality or get the fuck out of here.

What constitutes your idea of equality?

In my opinion, a sense of mutual respect and commonality are needed to achieve/gain equality among peers. You're the kings of equality. What constitutes equality in your opinion? MLK and his followers were willing to earn/gain equality the American way. So, what do you think about liberals who continue teaching minorities that their inferior to them as their calling whites racists and blaming issues related to them on racism? Do you thinks that's OK and think it should continue being taught by the left? I happen to think you're all racists and view minorities as their servants and their means to remain in power these days. I have faith in my peers to begin figuring that out and begin to distance themselves from the Democratic party.

[Bob Butler 54]

(05-13-2020, 05:44 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: In my opinion, a sense of mutual respect and commonality are needed to achieve/gain equality. You're the kings of equality. What constitutes equality in your opinion? MLK and his followers were willing to earn equality the American way. So, what do you think about liberals who continue teaching minorities that their inferior to them as their calling whites racists and blaming issues related to them on racism? Do you thinks that's OK and think it should continue being taught by the left? I happen to think you're all racists and view minorities as their servants and their means to remain in power these days. I'm glad that I'm not one of them these days.

So the racists such as the KKK, the Neo Nazi, the conservative 'Americans' and their ilk, who refuse respect and commonality, are the center of the problem?

You are calling giving minorities the right to eat at a restaurant or stay at a hotel the American way?

Do you think continuing to wish to be able to treat minorities with a lack of respect American?

[pbrower2a]

(05-13-2020, 05:44 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:21 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: We know what you've been teaching them, we hear it from them all the time and we are threatened to be sued by them all the time. I agree with what JFK said too, which is why the American libertarians are going to cripple you politically and end your reign and force them to accept equality or get the fuck out of here.

What constitutes your idea of equality?

In my opinion, a sense of mutual respect and commonality are needed to achieve/gain equality among peers. You're the kings of equality. What constitutes equality in your opinion? MLK and his followers were willing to earn/gain equality the American way. So, what do you think about liberals who continue teaching minorities that their inferior to them as their calling whites racists and blaming issues related to them on racism? Do you thinks that's OK and think it should continue being taught by the left? I happen to think you're all racists and view minorities as their servants and their means to remain in power these days. I have faith in my peers to begin figuring that out and begin to distance themselves from the Democratic party.

If liberals don't believe in equality of results, then they at least believe in equality of opportunity and equal rights to basic dignity. If you are talking about MLK, you must remember that his idea of the American Way was quite different from the concept that Bull Connor held. We may not be able to decide what is any single American way (Fulton Sheen and Elijah Muhammad had very differences on religion, and both are equally American), but we might be able to decide what isn't American -- like showing support for a cause like Stalinist Communism, Nazism, or ISIS intolerant of the values of most Americans. (OK, I relish some music that is in no way American, but I am not going to destroy rap music in the name of Johann Sebastian Bach or Dmitri Shostakovich).

Yes, many of the problems that many blacks have have nothing to do with white racism. Anyone who fails to take advantage of the opportunity to learn in school is a schmuck no matter what his pigmentation. Poor whites envy middle-class non-whites who have done much to improve their lot. Crime? Street drugs? Premarital sex leading to unwed pregnancy? Those all offer equal opportunity for prospective losers.  Racism is real, but some things can hurt people even more. 

I can say this: a member of the black bourgeoisie would be more desirable as a potential in-law than some white meth-head. Most people have means of sizing up others for intelligence and achievement (such as grammar, word choice, topics of discussion, and choices of accessories). I can even cut through an accent or broken English as with someone whose English is not as good as his expertise at some academic or professional field. Expressions of homophobia, racism, and religious bigotry rub me the wrong way.  Yes, I can exercise moral judgment.

Most of us liberals know people in the black bourgeoisie. I do not assume that a dark-skinned woman in an expensive house is "the maid" unless she is dressed to look like a maid. Many of us cannot afford to hire domestic servants. 

Finally -- it is the current Hard Right that has given America's model minorities no cause to associate with it. Contempt for learning is contempt for what brought success to non-white and non-Christian members of the American middle class, as well as to most in the white middle class. Superstition, anger, and ignorance are all for losers.

[Kinser79]

(05-13-2020, 05:44 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:21 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: We know what you've been teaching them, we hear it from them all the time and we are threatened to be sued by them all the time. I agree with what JFK said too, which is why the American libertarians are going to cripple you politically and end your reign and force them to accept equality or get the fuck out of here.

What constitutes your idea of equality?

In my opinion, a sense of mutual respect and commonality are needed to achieve/gain equality among peers. You're the kings of equality. What constitutes equality in your opinion? MLK and his followers were willing to earn/gain equality the American way. So, what do you think about liberals who continue teaching minorities that their inferior to them as their calling whites racists and blaming issues related to them on racism? Do you thinks that's OK and think it should continue being taught by the left? I happen to think you're all racists and view minorities as their servants and their means to remain in power these days. I have faith in my peers to begin figuring that out and begin to distance themselves from the Democratic party.

Perhaps it is time for the perspective of someone who is a racial minority.  I suggest myself.

I think in this instance that Classic and the Blue Boomer Libtards on this board want essentially the same thing.  The problem is that the Libtards being both Boomers and thus stuck in a time warp that is at least 20 years out of date and being tarded...hence why I call them Libtards...fail to see their own racial bigotry.

Indeed as a black person I have found nothing more racist than what George W. Bush called the "soft bigotry of low expectations".  The problem among black people these days is not that they are bared from university or employment or even financial assistance.  Rather the problem is that a certain proportion of those things is reserved especially for them.  Furthermore, those blacks that get those reserved spots are often the scions of the black bourgeoisie and their taking of those spots (which if we do not adhere to the idea that someone is black therefore they must be incapable of obtaining said education [or whatever] without a set aside) means that they are taking a spot that ideally was intended to be taken up by someone of a lower economic station regardless their race.

The racial politics coming from the left for decades has been that blacks and other persons of color are incapable of obtaining education, job opportunities and even loans without crumb handouts from the Democratic party.  Anyone who actually thinks about this for more than five seconds actually realizes what this left is saying, and it rings loud and clear for someone is very conscious of his racial identity.  The Democrats have said and been saying since the 1960s at least "Because you are a Nigger, you need thus and so hand out from us and we of course need your vote.  Something for something, because we understand your ignorant nigger ass could never understand how to look up the Latin Quid Pro Quo."

Given the choice between that, and the Klan, I'll take the Klan any day of the week.  Their racism is naked and understood by even the most ignorant of persons.  Conversely the Soft Bigotry requires thought and reading between the lines.

Then again one shouldn't expect anything else from a Party founded on the principles of exterminating Native Americans and enslaving Black Americans.  I believe Dinesh D'souza made a film about it.  I highly recommend it.

In lieu of that film I offer this:

https://www.c-span.org/video/?449302-3/w...party-race

[pbrower2a]

(05-14-2020, 07:14 PM)Kinser79 Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 05:44 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:21 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: We know what you've been teaching them, we hear it from them all the time and we are threatened to be sued by them all the time. I agree with what JFK said too, which is why the American libertarians are going to cripple you politically and end your reign and force them to accept equality or get the fuck out of here.

What constitutes your idea of equality?

In my opinion, a sense of mutual respect and commonality are needed to achieve/gain equality among peers. You're the kings of equality. What constitutes equality in your opinion? MLK and his followers were willing to earn/gain equality the American way. So, what do you think about liberals who continue teaching minorities that their inferior to them as their calling whites racists and blaming issues related to them on racism? Do you thinks that's OK and think it should continue being taught by the left? I happen to think you're all racists and view minorities as their servants and their means to remain in power these days. I have faith in my peers to begin figuring that out and begin to distance themselves from the Democratic party.

Perhaps it is time for the perspective of someone who is a racial minority.  I suggest myself.

I think in this instance that Classic and the Blue Boomer Libtards on this board want essentially the same thing.  The problem is that the Libtards being both Boomers and thus stuck in a time warp that is at least 20 years out of date and being tarded...hence why I call them Libtards...fail to see their own racial bigotry.

I may be twenty or more years behind the times on technology and pop culture. Technology that I see goes mostly into entertainment, and entertainment is for people who have nothing better to do. Pop culture? I largely outgrew it when I was in my teens. 

Human nature seems to change far more slowly, which explains why Plato and Freud could both offer a tripartite division of human nature, why (with reservations) the ancient moral wisdom is mostly valid, and the normal rules of getting along with people usually remain valid. There are people to avoid, and I well know that for some people I am one of them. But yes, such a word as "libtard" is not the sort of word that you want to say if you don't want the door slamming on your face as if you are a cold-calling door-to-door salesman selling meat to a vegetarian. 

Quote:    
Indeed as a black person I have found nothing more racist than what George W. Bush called the "soft bigotry of low expectations".  The problem among black people these days is not that they are barred from university or employment or even financial assistance.  Rather the problem is that a certain proportion of those things is reserved especially for them.  Furthermore, those blacks that get those reserved spots are often the scions of the black bourgeoisie and their taking of those spots (which if we do not adhere to the idea that someone is black therefore they must be incapable of obtaining said education [or whatever] without a set aside) means that they are taking a spot that ideally was intended to be taken up by someone of a lower economic station regardless their race.

In my experience we white middle class types do practically nothing for poor whites. We often ridicule poor whites especially from the Mountain South and related areas as "hillbillies", "peckerwoods", "crackers", "rednecks"... I have never experienced that myself, so I don't know how it feels. The black bourgeoisie does far more for poor blacks who show promise. But know well: the black bourgeoisie does as well as possible at preparing their kids to be chips off the old block. That is no different than skilled workers edging their kids toward the skilled trades. 

It is up to parents, irrespective of origin, to promote learning among their children and to insist upon maximal rigor in K-12 education

There is not and has never been a classless society. Almost everyone who has a soft life wants his kids to get much the same. Did you think that the Soviet nomenklatura wanted its kids to work in a factory or on a collective farm?    

Quote:The racial politics coming from the left for decades has been that blacks and other persons of color are incapable of obtaining education, job opportunities and even loans without crumb handouts from the Democratic party.  Anyone who actually thinks about this for more than five seconds actually realizes what this left is saying, and it rings loud and clear for someone is very conscious of his racial identity.  The Democrats have said and been saying since the 1960s at least "Because you are a Nigger, you need thus and so hand out from us and we of course need your vote.  Something for something, because we understand your ignorant nigger ass could never understand how to look up the Latin Quid Pro Quo."

Of course we all know the loving kindness that the Hard Right has for the poor in a society in which owners, executives, landlords, shysters, and loansharks are the kings. The Hard Rights treats all low proles badly irrespective of ethnicity and religion. We have a President who ridicules learning. This said, if social mobility no longer exists, then learning is strictly an elite practice that must price out multitudes.    

Quote:Given the choice between that, and the Klan, I'll take the Klan any day of the week.  Their racism is naked and understood by even the most ignorant of persons.  Conversely the Soft Bigotry requires thought and reading between the lines.

NO YOU WON'T!

I see the Klan as the sort of people who would make America much like Nazi Germany if it had the chance -- complete with torture chambers and concentration camps. Klan ideology, including its objects of hatred, are practically the same as those of the Nazis. Klan groups have bombed and lynched.

Quote:Then again one shouldn't expect anything else from a Party founded on the principles of exterminating Native Americans and enslaving Black Americans.  I believe Dinesh D'souza made a film about it.  I highly recommend it.

In lieu of that film I offer this:

https://www.c-span.org/video/?449302-3/w...party-race

The Republican Party used to be the party of deep thinkers with moral agendas. Now it is a Party of self-righteous people out for themselves alone. The Democratic Party used to be associated with "Rum, Rebellion, and Romanism" as late as the 1932 election. The Democratic Party has kept unionized workers and ethnic and religious (Mormons excluded) minorities, but it has gained the well-honed minds (what used to be "Rockefeller Republicans" while losing the old Southern agrarian interests. That is so much so that aside from Jews, blacks, and unionized workers sticking with Democrats and ranch interests staying Republican, the demographics of  Eisenhower voters and Obama voters are much the same. Do you remember my beloved overlay of Eisenhower and Obama elections? It helps that the two are similar in temperament and that both were paragons of integrity in office.

Trump, like most hustlers, is an expert at telling people what they want to hear. I know what I want to hear; it might not be what I need to hear.

[Blazkovitz]

(05-13-2020, 02:25 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: The gun-toting demonstrators against necessary precautions taken for the coronavirus do not represent the people.

People don't protest against the lockdowns because they love big guns and want Reagan back. People are sick and tired of staying at home and spending all the day looking at screens. People are sick and tired of not being able to participate in a live music event, or kiss a cousin's cheek to say hello. People are also scared of what's happening to the economy, both in the UK and the USA.

Also the precautions are mostly necessary to protect old people, because young and middle aged people rarely die of Covid. Why didn't the government simply isolate old people, and let the rest enjoy normal life? Maybe this would be the case if the Covid pandemic happened in 2005, or 1995, or 1985.

[Bob Butler 54]

(05-15-2020, 04:47 AM)Blazkovitz Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 02:25 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: The gun-toting demonstrators against necessary precautions taken for the coronavirus do not represent the people.

People don't protest against the lockdowns because they love big guns and want Reagan back. People are sick and tired of staying at home and spending all the day looking at screens. People are sick and tired of not being able to participate in a live music event, or kiss a cousin's cheek to say hello. People are also scared of what's happening to the economy, both in the UK and the USA.

Also the precautions are mostly necessary to protect old people, because young and middle aged people rarely die of Covid. Why didn't the government simply isolate old people, and let the rest enjoy normal life? Maybe this would be the case if the Covid pandemic happened in 2005, or 1995, or 1985.

Some people would rather kill others than be inconvenienced.  Some people value their own money over other’s lives.  Such people see an act intended to save lives as tyranny.  Some people would sit on a life saving report in order to look better politically.  Some people will ignore a professional piece of advice for the good of the community out of selfish interest.

All of that’s less a moral judgement than a statement of fact.  You can read a moral judgement in it if you wish.  The question is what is to be done of it.

After the trigger, people are supposed to reject the unravelling hedonism and selfishness and sacrifice for the good of the common community.  Some are not willing to do that.  Community pressure to force it is sometimes required.  This trip around, more so than others.

[Eric the Green]

(05-15-2020, 04:47 AM)Blazkovitz Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 02:25 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: The gun-toting demonstrators against necessary precautions taken for the coronavirus do not represent the people.

People don't protest against the lockdowns because they love big guns and want Reagan back. People are sick and tired of staying at home and spending all the day looking at screens. People are sick and tired of not being able to participate in a live music event, or kiss a cousin's cheek to say hello. People are also scared of what's happening to the economy, both in the UK and the USA.

Also the precautions are mostly necessary to protect old people, because young and middle aged people rarely die of Covid. Why didn't the government simply isolate old people, and let the rest enjoy normal life? Maybe this would be the case if the Covid pandemic happened in 2005, or 1995, or 1985.

It is obvious that these demonstrators do not represent the people at all. Bringing their Trump signs and hats and their guns show they are militant right-wingers. They are also financed by Betsy DeVoss and other right-wing financiers. Do not be fooled; they do not represent people having real concerns about the economy and not being able to go to concerts and kiss people.

Polls have shown that 70 to 80 percent agree that opening the economy too soon will spread the pandemic. Precautions are necessary to protect everyone, since everyone and not just old people are at risk, and older people should not be discriminated against and allowed to die just so the economy can reopen. Trump wants to open the economy to help his election chances.

Of course we all want to reopen the economy and be able to get out and talk with people again. I can't go to church which is about my only real contact with people, besides visiting a friend. We hoped that this situation would be temporary. Distancing from people for a couple of months and putting people infected in quarantine should have stopped the virus. But since Trump and other government officials delayed action, and have not provided what people need (economic support, PPE, testing and tracking, etc.) and have relaxed the restrictions, and too many people have gathered at beaches and parks and restaurants, and some businesses are defying the rules, it looks like this virus will continue to infect and make people sick for many months to come. If we had what we need, we could reopen some businesses, but we don't. It's a sad and pathetic fourth turning we are in, and who knows when it will end, especially if people are not allowed to vote in November. According to reports from Reuters and Thomson, 67 people were infected with coronavirus after voting in Wisconsin in the April primary. The economy will continue to slide, and this prolonged shutdown will soon cause a financial collapse and knock over the dominoes of our neo-liberal "free market" economy that has not been sufficiently reformed. Too big to fail banks will fail again. 

And the virus is just too contagious. Even though the number of cases and deaths have been reduced by the lockdowns, the disease is still spreading and many thousands of people are infected in almost every state and country. Almost 90000 people have died in the USA alone, and well over 300,000 in the world. And we have no vaccine yet, and treatments are not being made available. We have a libertarian neo-liberal, pro-market president and political party in charge in the USA, the UK and Brazil, so cases continue to rise in these countries and around the world. We needed national mobilization, but we have an "executive that doesn't act," and so violent rebellions from the left and the right are possible in the months and years ahead. "Some honest citizens of Marseilles could undertake the amazing feat of marching in a sweltering July all the way to Paris, tugging two pieces of canon, and singing a new song." This time in the USA, UK and Brazil.

[Eric the Green]

(05-13-2020, 05:44 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(05-13-2020, 01:21 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote: We know what you've been teaching them, we hear it from them all the time and we are threatened to be sued by them all the time. I agree with what JFK said too, which is why the American libertarians are going to cripple you politically and end your reign and force them to accept equality or get the fuck out of here.

What constitutes your idea of equality?

In my opinion, a sense of mutual respect and commonality are needed to achieve/gain equality among peers. You're the kings of equality. What constitutes equality in your opinion? MLK and his followers were willing to earn/gain equality the American way. So, what do you think about liberals who continue teaching minorities that their inferior to them as their calling whites racists and blaming issues related to them on racism? Do you thinks that's OK and think it should continue being taught by the left? I happen to think you're all racists and view minorities as their servants and their means to remain in power these days. I have faith in my peers to begin figuring that out and begin to distance themselves from the Democratic party.

By definition, support from "minorities" are not enough to gain and remain in power. The Left is not in power now, and really hasn't had power nationally except perhaps partial power for 7 months in 2009, ever since Reagan took over on behalf of his big business, racist and religious-right clientele. Liberals teach "minorities" that they are equal, but Republicans continue to appeal to racism (often in the form of opposition to welfare as well as immigration) to gain and keep power, and it works for them. It works on you, and you fall for it.