omg it seems the McCain funeral WAS sort of a dividing line of a Public Shift in Mood against the current president.

The funeral was a very public platform - a stage - on which to sort of reveal the "beak" of the bird. 

-It revealed a message of unity across party lines even and up to W and the Obamas against the current president.
-The NYT op-ed makes shock claim of secret cabal fighting for "freedom" by managing the president in the name of America.
-The legal woe noose tightens significantly.
-Cracks appear in the veneer: the washington mall image is proved a fake.
-Syrian/Iranian wargames involving Russia spike.
-Justice nominee has Roe problem from the past.
-All kinds of staff resigning/leaving.
-Obama appears on the scene and begins campaigning.
-News outlets like CNN on full magnitude coverage (even higher than normal, like buzzards).
-Numerous public officials question faculty of president to rule.
-Sen Warren openly calls for impeachment.
-Guliani is complete mess, like mobster wiping blood off the pavement before the cops arrive.
-Reports of "isolated" and "unstable" with foes lurking.
-NEW 9/8/19: VOW TO USE MILITARY TO BUILD WALL http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...d-DHS.html

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We can see the heightened escalation in just the last few weeks.  What are we witnessing?  Why did it happen?  McCain funeral: just a spark for he embers... not purposefully significant, just an event we may look back upon and say "that was when it began"? 

Does it reveal anything of our current location in the saeculum/turning?

The inauguration photos WERE fake.  The crowd (and CNN) were real... and the mall was somewhat empty.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/09/07/politics/...index.html

"Spicer, the White House press secretary, also reached out to the park service, and a staffer said she understood he asked "for NPS to provide photographs in which it appeared the inauguration crowd filled the majority of the space in the photograph."

I try to learn from all things.  What I learned from this is when you conclude something already, you might try to go in search of "evidence" to support your conclusion.  When, the Scientific Process is just the opposite: go in search of information and THEN form a conclusion (if you can).  Do we want to be like the liars?  If not, we need to stop seeking information that supports a conclusion and turn that around to the opposite.

A story from The Guardian is much more harsh:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/s...tos-edited



the images -- left is the actual photo... to the right is the 2008 election mall.

I think the statement was made it was "the highest attendance of any presidential election".  What total liars.  Guliani will be on CNN later to argue the photo is a creation of an Alex Jones in the left-wing... created to further demean the president in this time of turmoil.. and photographer will soon be under investigation.

It seems to me the current situation fits very well into the "First Turning" scenario where homogeneity and groupthink is what the populace wants and needs to move forward.  I find I am personally very uncomfortable with the virtual clampdown on who can speak, who cannot, who should speak, who should not, who it is 'OK' to assault for their speech and who it is not, etc...

I personally do not care about white supremacists or kkk or any of these people where it seems these people are not supposed to speak and are not allowed to speak.  We even have Obama asking "how hard is it to say white supremacy bad" but is that his or anyone's place?  I do not feel like these lopsided viewpoints like a white supremacy or whatever, they have no ability to affect hardly anyone.  It has no real mass power or anything of the kind.  I hear a lot "they need to be silenced because they teach violence" to which I ask when is the last time you (who says that) were at a burnt cross meeting to know what they are teaching?

Right.  Hearsay.  Someone else mentioned "there is evidence" to support the current president is crazy.  To which I say "were you there?"  Did you attend white house meetings?  OR are you simply taking the information of your chosen news source as gospel truth?  There are not many innocent people on that front.  Right now that is just the way it is.

But nonetheless, I do not like when anyone is silenced.  The lines are almost completely blurred right now.  We can no longer tell the difference between SPEECH and ACTION.  I ask people "where is the boundary to what I say compared to what he/she DOES based on what I say?"  Am I responsible for their actions?  Are they responsible for my actions?

Does anyone think this is not a trait of typically 1st Turning scenario where everyone is afraid to cross any boundaries?  Where the FEAR to be like everyone else is too compelling to be anything outside the ordinary?  If so, what does that say about the current location within this saeculum? (<-- btw that sounds more like an Artist situation, they are the ones who REALLY stfu and keep their collective heads down).

Oh and this does include assailants from all sides including the president wanting the FBI to investigate the NYT article and all this nonsense.  No one wants to allow anyone else to speak.  Festering wound.  Strange times and it got strange rather quickly.

This may actually belong in the thread I made about the McCain funeral because there seems to be a lot has shifted since then.  Yes, in just the last few weeks.  Am I seeing it incorrectly?  There's no right/wrong answer here, I enjoy feedback and free speaking.  I'm American.

Are we watching the beginning of a coup?  coup=powerful cabal working in the shadows to seize power.

It all seems too convenient.  Massive attacks from multiple angles all at once.  It seems like 'victory' is near with this mess, but one cannot help to look past my own possible joy(?) others who are actually THERE say things like 'don't worry there ARE adults in the room' and things like 'removing documents from his desk in the name of patriotism'............. it all seems really great.

I know nothing about the vice president.  And I don't need all of you providing me with links and information about him (thank you tho ) since that is the person to assume power if this one is removed.

No one believed and people still do not believe today there are secret cabals of power that dominate through inter-agency transactions and private partnerships and alliances... we are seeing it right now.  The idea there are clusters of "patriotic americans" subverting the president in the name of "protecting the nation" SERIOUSLY?

If these people exist, and can get their agenda published anonymously in the NYT, and have it read to millions in entirety through media outlets.................. it smells like democracy!  Is it really?  And what can we learn from this?  Some of you giggle when I write about JFK or whatever, I don't know if it is because you don't believe cabals are possible................ or that they are not powerful enough to kill a president.............. or if you are just so hell-bent on wanting a lone angry figure to blame......... I am not sure.  But for whatever reason, you need to look long and hard at what is happening right now. 

It smells like democracy but it feels like a setup.

Prabhat Ranjan Sarkar (1921-1990), an Indian philosopher of history, suggested a cycle of history Ia law of social cycle) whose basis was a sequence of elites. History goes through predictable stages of organization and the dominance of certain classes in sequence.

Thus, and I cite Wikipedia,

The law of social cycle is a theory of Varna, arising out of the Indian episteme (Inayatullah, 2002). This law states that while people in any society are all relatively similar, they have generally the same goals, desires and ambitions but differ in the way they go about achieving their goals. An individual's specific methods for achieving success depend on his physical and psychological makeup. Essentially, there are four different psychological types of people, warriors, intellectuals, acquisitors and labourers, who find basic fulfillment in four different kinds of ways.

Warriors, or Kshatriya in Sanskrit, have strong bodies, vigorous physical energy and a sharp intellect. Warriors tend to develop the skills that take advantage of their inherent gifts of stamina, courage and vigor. Their mentality is one that is not averse to taking physical risks. Examples of people in our society with the warrior mentality include policemen, firemen, soldiers, professional athletes, skilled carpenters, and tradesmen. They all achieve success through their physical skills and a deep understanding of their profession.


Intellectuals, or Vipra, have a more developed intellect than the warriors, but generally lack the physical strength and vigor. Intellectuals are happiest when they try to achieve success by developing and expressing their intellectual skills and talents. Teachers, writers, professors, scientists, artists, musicians, philosophers, doctors and lawyers, and above all, priests, are professions intellectuals tend to pursue.



Acquisitors, or Vaishya, have a penchant for acquiring money. If money can be made the acquisitors will find a way to make it. They are not considered as bright as the intellectuals, nor as strong as the warriors, but they are keen when it comes to making and accumulating money and material possessions. Such people are the traders, businessmen, managers, entrepreneurs, bankers, brokers, and landlords in our society.



Laborers, or Shudra, are altogether different from the first three groups. Laborers lack the energy and vigor of the warriors, the keen intellect of the intellectuals, or the ambition and drive of the accumulators. In spite of the fact that their contribution to society is profound – in fact, society could not function without them – the other groups generally look down upon and tend to exploit them. The laborers are the peasants, serfs, clerks, short order cooks, waiters, janitors, doormen, cabdrivers, garbage collectors, truck drivers, night watchmen and factory workers who keep society running smoothly by working diligently and without complaint.


To Sarkar, each age would run its course, with the social motivity going too far, causing much grief to the majority of people (Sarkar, 1967). The situation could go on unchecked for a long time, before things got so bad that a spontaneous revolution and overthrow of the system took place. In fact, as this was the reason for social change, it was clear that no single class of people could remain dominant indefinitely. Social power was destined to pass from one class to next in the prescribed order, or cycle. The 'age of warriors', which brings strict order to society and a return to fundamental values, essentially leads to excessive focus on strong man rule and warfare. It is followed by an 'age of intellectuals', which bring a sense of liberation in the mental sphere but soon replace that freedom with the yoke of newer ideas. Over time this age merges into an 'age of acquisitors', which brings progress in the material sphere, but this is soon replaced by increased physical and mental exploitation. The Servile Wars spelled the doom of the Roman Republic. Labour conflict could be the undoing of Capitalism, according to this theory. And so the cycle moves on its endless round, until the civilisation ceases to exist or is taken over by a superior or more powerful civilisation.

Groups of each type of people make up the social classes in society. Sarkar simplifies society into four classes, divided by inherent traits:

• Warriors defend the nation and keep the peace;
  
• Intellectuals develop our ideas about the world, in the form of religion, art, law and new inventions;
  
• Acquisitors manage the practical aspects of life, including farms, factories, financial institutions and stores;
  
• Laborers do the routine work, waiting tables, collecting trash, and other low-tech, low skill jobs.
  

I've been sickened to the core at Ws unlikely resurrection from the most-hated president to love-in member knighted exclusively by the Obamas at McCain's funeral.

No one is outraged.  No one cares.  No one remembers? 

The current president has foment no war, ordered no killing on the war front.  Yet, we immediately term this as "worse" and gloss over this contrast as if  never existed and never lied to EVERYONE with racism that actually ended in genocide in the Arabian Peninsula. 

Did W tell us "Ayrabs hate us because we are free and that's why they knocked down the WTC"? 

Did this happen or not?  I see no one acknowledging it.

The lie in bold above is the PLATFORM and FOUNDATION probably of all future wars America will be involved in - in the near future at least.  W helped lay the foundation (with the patriot act) that would allow the current maniac and anyone else in power to wage war with much greater ease than any before. 

The fact the public consciousness has sort of skipped over W by branding current the "worst" causes my gut to flip over.  Let's be real.

I am NOT baiting.  This is a serious issue we need to ask if we are prognosticating with current events.  If we are truly just erasing things in the past and glossing over things like this in the present, we have no frakking hope at all.  People in this forum I have a higher respect for that IF someone is in here, they understand the concepts of a saeculum.  If they can do that, they can think on the level this thread requires.  This is SO important.  If powermongers can do their evil and be forgotten or exonerated in less than 2 decades, we are frakking doomed.  It is like Scully said to Mulder "they just scatter back into the woodpile".  And unfortunately, this has also revealed a different terrible truth that the "woodpile" has a blue sign on it and a red sign.  No one is exempt.  If the Obamas really have such a fervor against W and the evil he helped perpetrate, they would not be holding hands and passing the pipe and doing Free-Love with the enemy.

I'm serious, this event really shocked me.  I can't believe no one else sees it.

I have been trying to get my brain about the phenomenon which have occurred in the political sphere in the last decade. I have personally been going about with my life and not being too concerned about what is happening politically. Although I have been going through an existential crisis over the last year or so, after a long-term relationship I was in fell apart.
 
My life so far has been a curious mixture of one of those nerds from the film “Revenge of the Nerds” and the classic Nomad “wild youth” type as Strauss and Howe described. I know ever since I first read “The Fourth Turning” a long time ago, I never identified with the Millennial generation, instead I identified strongly with Generation X. Right now, I am in the process of becoming a “young fogey”, I am surprised how Conservative in my world outlook I have gotten compared to many in our society When I was young back in the turn of the millennium I would have never seen myself as Conservative in any way. For example; as a teenager I would never voted for a Far-Right party like One Nation, however now I am more than prepared to vote for a similar party.
 
As I have stated earlier I was born in 1983, however Australian generations are a little bit behind America's and don't see my age cohort being a part of the Millennial generation. However, I do see those born about say 4 years later as part of another generation.
 
The Fourth Turning started with the Global Financial Crisis here in Australia, however it wasn't a dramatic way like it did in Europe. Rather the transition in hindsight has been rather gradual, which is different from the last Fourth Turning here which had a much more dramatic transition. I believe has to do with Australia having escaped the Global Financial Crisis so far.
 
Lately I have been getting myself up to speed about political developments which have occurred and only recently I have noticed these phenomena happening here in Australia. 
 
I am wrapping my brain about various phenomena and putting them into a generational context such as identity politics, social justice warriors, the alt-left and alt-right. Personally, as a decent minded British style Liberal, I have to say I do not approve of developments and consider identity politics in any form extremely toxic to body politic and I am worried about the increasing restrictions on free speech all in the name of offending as few people as possible. 

Also, some of the stuff the left wing SJW's are arguing runs what we know about human behavior from evolutionary psychology. Since I believe that human behavior can be explained through our evolution as a species. For example; gender identity is not a social construct and it is obvious that male and female brains are structured differently. When it comes to transgender people I have read scientific research which showed their brains were structured in the way of the gender they identified with.

I could wrong, however as I see it the leaders of the alt-right or white identarian movement are Mid Life X'ers for the most part, with the alt-left they are more dominated by Millennial's. Although the followers of both movements seem to be predominately Millennial. Also, I see the whole Social Justice Warrior phenomenon seems to me as a female Millennial phenomenon. 
 
I know in YouTube and elsewhere I am often attracted to Gen X'ers who are of a similar mind to me in being critical of identity politics and SJW's, along share passion for defending free speech even if it offends people. People for example; such as Jordan Peterson (b.1962), Carl Benjamin or Sargon of Akkad (b.1979) and others.

Assumptions:
America's 4T started about 2008 and will probably last until 2028.
The current crisis in 2018 appears to be the corrupt Trump administration, Trumps associates pleading guilty or on trial, and the investigation into the 2016 election hacking supported by Russia.

A non-profit, "The Climate Mobilization" ( https://www.theclimatemobilization.org ) is calling for a mobilization of America like the 1940s.  Maybe Climate Change is part of the 4T crisis era that will mobilize society to change.
Maybe Climate Change results in an economic change like what happened to USA during 1940s.
Maybe Climate Change results in democratic values, the end of culture wars and unifying America against a common enemy.

The current Dems vs Reps, Trump vs Mueller, seems so small compared to a global crisis like climate change.


50% of Russian government revenues come from fossil fuels.
What crisis happens if the Russian government collapses when Europe and Asia suddenly stop buying fossil fuels?

It became so clear after taking in the events of the funeral, there is no such thing as even a dual party system in America anymore.  It is one controlled UNIT at the top, and then there is the rest of us.

It blasted home to me when seeing W sharing candy for Michelle Obama at that funeral.

BUT WAIT..... with me there is always media involved.  This time, it was the film V For Vendetta (2005).  "Remember, Remember The Fifth Of November".  The ideology is not a person.  It is a thought which lives on in others.  Just because someone point to a donkey instead of an elephant, that does not mean their ideology is so different. The election of W was no less hated than the election in 2016 with the current villain.  Yet, some years have passed and now they are all great friends sitting there playing the Across-Party-Aisle fakery.  All of them had negative things to heap onto the current president while they, themselves, shined as blameless lambs.  We hated some of them THEN, but the love-in proves we can rise above "ignorance" and "hatred" and "unite" across "party lines". 

That made me sick.  Both because the dead are disrespected, but because it shows that these people are not really so different at all.  They all sit down and are friends at the end of the day.  

And since the Fourth Turning authors were Meta Thinkers and viewed things in a top-down manner, I must include the McCain event as part of a whole which includes the Aretha Franklin memorial where the president was also blasted.  Of course, the dead are just husks while this is going on, they are simply being used by the living.  Used to spew politics and political subjectivity at others while using a ceremony for the dead to do it.

I know what some will say "WELL, THEY WEREN'T AS BAD".  Not so much.  They were throwing eggs at W motorcade before even the election itself.  People knew even before the election there would be WAR.  Before 911, some of us knew. But there he is feeding Michelle that candy.  There will be the rest of W's life encased in FORGIVENESS by showing that until the end of time.  W is now no longer the most hated president in recent memory. 

If Papi Bush could understand right now, he would cry a tear for the redemption of his son.  He was always traumatized that America did not understand why W had to avenge 'Merica toward them Ayrabs that want to kill us because we are free.

LOOK!  I have been preaching this in here............. it was only a decade ago when we were in the news with the arcane idea THIS was the whole crux of why America was still in Afghanistant anyway.  THAT "ARABS" ATTACKED US ON 911 BECAUSE WE ARE FREE.  But the president who made that lie a reality just got exonerated by maybe the only people on Earth who could do that: THE OBAMAS!  And not President Obama............. but HIS WIFE!  If Michelle approves, that means you do too.

If the Obamas are forgiving W, that means we truly have never had a choice in any political leaning.

I'm not playing that game... the one where we all appear united by shitting on others.  It's inappropriate.  More importantly, it proves we no longer really have choices with elections.  If W can sit next to Obama to mourn McCain while bashing the current president................ if that is even possible................... they are not different in any way, their policies don't matter, their differences of opinion mean nothing to anyone, and we thought we could choose between 2 parties but in reality this proves they all are one in the beginning just as they are one later on in the end.

My name is Tristan and I used to be involved on the old Fourth Turning forum back in the day. I was born in 1983 and currently live in Hobart, which is in the Island state of Tasmania, which is part of nation of Australia. I have been busy with my life in recent years, however the saeculum still remains on my mind. I must admit William Strauss and Neil Howe's predictions have been extremely accurate so far and my faith in the saeculum is stronger than ever. I am a short to medium term pessimist, however a longer-term optimism since winter will end eventually and spring will come. 
 
Generationally I would see myself as a late wave Reactive or Nomad, since Australia I estimate about 4 years behind North America when it comes to turnings. I do see people a few years younger than me in a different generation, which I find hard to relate to. Personally, I do feel I have become a “young fogey”, which Strauss and Howe did predict that for Generation X as they entered midlife hehe

When it comes to the Millennial generation here in Australia I am very optimistic about them and they will achieve a lot. However I am worried especially once we suffer through our own Great Financial Crisis (which has been delayed), some authoritarian regime supported by the Millennials could arise in response to the likely response from the political class, namely a very expensive public bailout of the banks facing collapse.