ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma

[Kinser79]

(03-13-2017, 07:08 AM)Odin Wrote:

(03-13-2017, 06:55 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: Nobody has said the present system is working great, they've just pointed out that, like college textbooks, the prices have gone to ludicrous levels because almost nobody is expected to pay for them themselves.

On the flip side, various universal healthcare systems (single payer in Canada, whatever the term is for the German system is, and the regulated private system is Switzerland) work just fine, but conservatives either always have some excuse about why they supposedly can't work here, or spout complete bull about they are supposedly collapsing and failing. There are a shit-ton of different healthcare systems out there to use as a basis to fix the US healthcare system, but conservatives ignore them all because they are ideologically inconvenient and threaten the profits of a bunch of powerful people.

Actually Odin the NHS and Health Canada do not work great.  Sure you can get cheap drugs, and if you're deathly ill you're shoved to the front of the line.  However both suffer from near constant doctor shortages and both also have private practices and hospitals that deal with those who can afford it.

Canadians vacation down here and many given the choice get treatment here rather than Canada--so that should tell you something.

Furthermore we must examine the material realities of places like Canada, Germany, and the UK.

1.  Germany and the UK are small geographically which makes unitary rule. They are also both far more homogeneous than the US.  Canada is large but its population is small, and also more homogeneous than the US.

2.  Given that the vast majority of the countries with these various forms of universal health coverage are smaller than the US and more homogeneous than the US it might be more prudent to tackle this problem on a state level.  This would mean that California and Vermont could try an NHS type model, Florida could try a Swiss model, and Texas a German model.

3.  Trying to implement a model on a national level will result in the whole health care system being flipped over once every 4 to 8 years.  You have to take into consideration that we are not Britain or Canada--we have a presidential system rather than a Westminster system.

This constant change in a sector that comprises about 1/5th of the entire economy (we're talking trillions of dollars) every year will cause not only chaos in health care but in the economy and politics.  Which for me is an other reason to send it to the states.

4.  If we're going to have a welfare state at all like Europe we also have to shut down immigration totally.  It is my firm belief that one can have a welfare state, or one can have open boarders but one cannot have both.

But let me leave this here---