ACA Repeal/Replace: Progressives Face Moral Dilemma

[Eric the Green]

(03-27-2017, 01:07 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(03-27-2017, 11:40 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(03-26-2017, 05:06 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(03-26-2017, 01:02 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(03-25-2017, 08:49 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: The Republicans were placed on ignore during the process associated with Obamacare. Arrogant Democrats don't have to listen to or include Republicans when they have a super majority and a rubber stamp in the White House. Trump doesn't care if Obamacare fails and a bunch of older/younger OBAMA voters who didn't vote (seem to hate him) eventually lose their free healthcare. As he said, the proper thing to do as far as political interest go would be allow it to fail as it will and move on the passing other things leaving the Democrats to deal with their own mess. Well, he tried and the Democrats didn't seem to want anything to do with it or seem to care that's it's failing. So fuck them, it's their baby. The spent seven years presenting stuff that they knew wasn't going to get passed because that's what politicians do to keep their jobs. I'm sure Trumps election surprised them as much as it surprised the Democrats. Myself, I wouldn't bailout the Democrats. I'd let them deal with their own failure.

Republicans in 2009 (and most of the time for the last several decades) are only interested in one thing: blocking anything to be done. Their project is to reduce the government they don't like so it fits inside a bathtub, and building up the government they do like into an autocracy to protect the oligarchy. The Republicans never did anything but resist a compromise health care reform bill that was patterned after their own earlier plans and those of Gov. Romney. No Democratic leader can work with today's Republicans, because their only goal is to destroy and to oppose Democrats. They do not compromise or work with Democrats.

Ryan and Trump didn't "try;" they only want to protect free enterprise, not peoples' health. Their failure is their baby now. They have the majority in the government, and could have passed it by the reconciliation process just like the Democrats passed Obamacare, but their bill was so poor and unpopular that they couldn't even get their own Republicans behind them. The Republicans spent 7 years repealing Obamacare and offering no alternative. They still don't have an alternative to offer, and that's because they never wanted reform at all.

The only hope for Trump is to dump his Republicans after many failures in the coming months, and govern from the center instead by working with Democrats. But he probably can't do that, because he has surrounded himself with extreme right wingers, and has proposed an extreme right wing budget that he has to stand behind at least for a year or two. Because he can't admit that he is ever wrong or makes mistakes, making such an adjustment is personally hard for him. And since he does not understand the issues in any depth, he lacks much of the deal making ability he promised to bring to the job. He would have to portray his adjustment as a victory, somehow; an expression of his ongoing leadership in making America great again. And then work at being a real leader, not just a showman. I'm not optimistic. Can the impulsive and brash Mars in Leo the Lion rising change his spots? Or will his priority remain having his lion-colored mane combed and groomed?

Trump isn't going to dump Republicans as you'd hope that he would in time. That would be silly. Nope, he should just chalk it up as a loss, move on and allow the Democrats time to accept the reality of twenty million blue voters loosing their free healthcare in a few years with no other options available for them. I can only imagine how nasty the town halls are going to be in Democratic districts.

Probably so. But the "no other options available to them" is just what they would have had either before Obamacare, or under Trumpcare.

Trumpcare would have at least given them a heads up and a gradual transition period vs being completely blindsided when Obamacare abruptly comes to an end.

All indications are that Obamacare will not abruptly come to an end. It has been collapsing in red and purple states that did not accept medicaid funding. Trump/Ryancare, however, would have meant an "abrupt end" for many of insurance and health care, and an abrupt whopping premium increase for many older Obamacare enrollees.

Quote: I hope you're not foolish enough to believe a Democratic voter (union worker or a yuppi) is going to be willing to sacrifice trips to Cancun that were paid for with hard earned dollars that Obamacare turns into tax dollars to support those who are now entitled to free healthcare.

If they are wealthy enough to pay the higher taxes imposed by Obamacare, it is unlikely that they are Democrats.