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I'm a sceptic that the 4th Turning started in 2008
The nomination of Harris makes me a lot more pessimistic of this 4T. It feels like the establishment yet again jabbing the progressives in the stomachs, spreading the fear that the democrats will lose to Trump again this year. I again have the increasing dread that this crisis's trigger didn't really trigger real change, and our old ways will continue for longer than sustainable.

I'd agree that COVID and BLM are the key early crisis issues, but I think this crisis will eventually escalate into a more global problem with America at the centre. It does appear to me that the China tensions are only going to get worse going forward, with Xi acting more like a cowardly Hitler day after day. People think that Trump will be able to make the China relations irreparably bad before he leaves office in November, and to me it does make sense following it week by week. Although the democrats aren't really talking about it much, reading and watching conservative media, people do genuinely think that China is an existential threat to America. Trump might just make this a self fulfilling prophecy before he leaves office to "justify" his next term.

If a war does break out, I do think it will be with China, and I do think that this is much more likely than a civil war in America. Civil war just doesn't seem likely at all, at most I'd think that we'll have some more ideological fragmentation. I'm not sure what will be America's response if China were to attack the Taiwanese mainland. It probably would never be on the caliber of Pearl Harbor, but it very much could be a trigger for a war or proxy war.
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RE: I'm a sceptic that the 4th Turning started in 2008 - by RadianMay - 08-13-2020, 07:06 PM

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