07-09-2021, 06:57 PM
(This post was last modified: 07-09-2021, 07:18 PM by Eric the Green.)
(07-09-2021, 05:31 PM)Dustinw5220 Wrote:(06-30-2021, 01:35 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:(06-29-2021, 03:14 PM)Dustinw5220 Wrote:(06-18-2021, 08:56 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:(06-18-2021, 03:29 PM)Dustinw5220 Wrote: Fair enough.You're right though, that WOULD be different from other 3T decades (LOL). After the Cold War ended, I suppose there were some shades of idealism in the 1990s under Clinton (but still, hardly what you would really call progressive). Is it fair to say Generation Alpha's influence in politics (being the Prophet/Idealist generation that they'll become) will lend the early 2080s it's idealistic and progressive reputation? Plus, since people are living longer now, I'm sure at least some of us Millennials will still be around as well (Mr. Brower has brought up before that older generations living longer might help to stave off the worst aspects/trends of any turning, this could be just such an example).
Yeah, that all makes sense. So Taylor was a Whig I take it (if he was, he was DEFINITELY bad news then)?
Right, and Woodrow Wilson was another example of an idealist during a 3T, although he was not so idealistic in some ways. But this indicates that the early 2080s, in which Uranus will line up with Jupiter and Saturn in Aquarius with Neptune opposing in Leo, could see some breakthroughs like we saw after WWI and after the Cold War. Major economic policy changes too.
Taylor ran as a Whig, but probably only because the Whigs chose him (like the Republicans chose Ike before the Democrats could get him). There was not much difference between the parties then, but the Republicans took over the Whig mantle when the Whigs collapsed due to riffs over slavery.
You're right, Woodrow Wilson was also an idealist (albeit from the Progressive Artist/Adaptive generation) and probably one of the better 3T leaders we've had. It really is ironic that the 2080s will be so idealistic for a 3T, because now I'm suddenly thinking of the 1970s, which (as we both know) was very cynical compared to other 2T decades (LOL). Is there any chance us old age Millennials will be willing to work together with midlife Gen Alphers (providing we can get over some of our typical midlife/elderhood hubris as a Hero/Civic generation) in our next 3T?
I take it Uranus lined up with Jupiter and Saturn in Aquarius with Neptune opposing in Leo during the 1920s and 1990s (or after the end of WWI and the Cold War) too?
That makes sense, I actually DID look up Taylor a bit more, and while he was no liberal/progressive by any means, it certainly doesn't sound like he was anywhere near as bad as the core Whig Party. Hey, I know you said before that the mood shift occurred in 1834 because that was the year that the resistance against the Abolitionist Movement started, but do you think there was a specific moment in 1834 when the Awakening ended and the 3T began?
I hope Millennials will be better at relating to the new Alphawave prophets than the GIs were with the Boomers. Tech issues could be a point of contention. But I think the relationship between the old heroes and the new prophets will be better in the next 2T and 3T coming up.
Similar but not identical planetary alignments happened in the period after WWI (around 1918-1920) and in 1989/the early 1990s period. In the Cold War ending period (circa early 1990s) Uranus and Neptune were in conjunction, rather than opposition, with Saturn also joining them in 1989-1990, and Jupiter opposed to them then. These aspects were especially tight when the Berlin Wall fell, as I predicted it would. In the 1918-1920 period after WWI, Uranus was finishing up the opposition to Neptune that was exact around 1908-1910. They were in the same signs in the 1918 era as they will be in 2080-82. Saturn aligned with Neptune in 1918 just as it did in 1989-1990.
I don't have anything more specific to say right now about 1834.
I hope they are too. Yeah, I would like to believe that we won't be quite as content to just sit back and collect our "entitlements" and retreat from public life in the next 3T the way the G.I.'s did in the last one. If there's enough of us and we could get enough mobilization going, we might be able to stop civic and institutional life from entirely decaying in the next 3T (on the flip side, old Prophets living longer could in theory also help keep the inner world from fully decaying in a 1T). If mass shootings are indeed still an issue in the 2070s, you can bet that those of us that are left are gonna want to finish the 60 year mission we started in the 2010s and end gun violence in America once and for all! Yes, perhaps we'll get an opportunity that not many other Hero/Civic generations have gotten so far, the chance to reaffirm our heroism (and dare I say glory) and accomplish some more good late in life (and right on the cusp of the 50th anniversary of the climax of our current 4T), but still I think the only way it happens is if we learn to overcome (at least SOME of) our hubris and learn to relate and work together with Alphawave Prophets. As Mr. Brower pointed out, since older generations are now living longer, we're likely to see all four archetypes in adulthood and/or in power in all four turnings from here on out (though obviously in a VERY different order depending on the turning), and that in itself might lessen the severity of each turning and make the next saeculum more organized and stable. The combination of old age Millennials, elderhood Gen Zers, midlife Alphawavers, and young adult Gen Beta (or Gen B or whatever the new Nomads end up calling themselves) may just help usher in the best 3T decade we've had so far (in the 2080s).
It is fascinating how WW1 and end of the Cold War had similar yet different conjunctions, and that it will happen again in the middle of the next 3T (in the late 2070s-early 2080s), do you know if the Civil War saeculum ever had a similar conjunction?
Yes, a very significant one, though probably not one familiar to most high school students, as I myself had never heard of most of the associated events until I studied European history in 1973. It happened a bit further back in the civil war/romantic saeculum; in fact S&H date the American 2T and the Gilded Generation of that saeculum from that conjunction date (both within a year of it, I think). 1821 was the date of the previous Uranus-Neptune conjunction, as they happen in about a 171-72-year cycle. Leading up to this conjunction, in 1815, the Congress of Vienna brought peace after the French Revolution and Napoleonic Wars, and was a forerunner of the League of Nations after WWI and the end of the Cold War era. Like that recent era around 1993, many new nations emerged in the 1821 era, largely thanks to the big revolution in Latin America that unfolded after the king of Spain was temporarily deposed in 1820 by a revolutionary coup. Portugal and Brazil were affected too. We Americans know about the Monroe Doctrine, but are less familiar with the Congress of Vienna, which sought not only to bring a balance of power that prevented war, but to restore monarchies wherever possible in order to turn back the clock on the Revolution. So they restored the Iberian kings and also suppressed revolutions in Italy in 1821, but the British navy prevented the Vienna Powers from restoring the colonies in Latin America. The big uprising in Greece was another matter, and a big mess that eventually led to World War One, during the next opposition, starting with the Bosnian Crisis of 1908, because of the century-long decay of Turkey, the sick man of Europe, which ruled most of the Middle East and Balkans. But Greece eventually won its independence after about 6 years of the bloody revolutionary war with Turkey that broke out in 1821, right during the conjunction. This was eventually achieved through an Alliance of Britain, France and Russia, the same countries that were allies against the center in the world wars to come.
1821 was also the height of romantic art and poetry, and Beethoven's 9th Symphony climaxed classical music and opened romanticism in that field in 1823-24. It was also a key dispensation of religion, one of the series every 600 years that corresponds to the birth of new religions and key religious figures. So out of this Uranus-Neptune conjunction of 1821 we can trace the new age movement and the New Thought religions of today, thanks to their relationship to the doctrinaire but pioneering Mary Baker Eddy of Christian Science, who was born in 1821 with that conjunction on her Ascendant. Also born that year was the founder of the Bahai Faith, the first attempt at a truly new-age revealed universal religion, and of Joseph Smith's vision that led to the founding of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. The revival of Unitarianism in America is also part of this period, and is also a universalist religion, and the founders of Marxism were also born in this era.
In the USA, the most significant event was probably the Missouri Compromise, which settled for now the emerging sectional conflict between free and slave states. By the way Jupiter and Saturn were also in conjunction in that year 1821.