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Religion, Secularism and Homosexuality
#1
(06-13-2016, 01:50 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: The fact is that we read those 14 points during the Bush-Cheney administration, and many of us thought then that we were on the verge of fascism because so many of them applied to the USA. And especially the last point, which put Bush in office.

Beware of preparing to fight the last war. In my opinion the majority worldview in the US is now some form of secularism and Christianity is now  a minority religion.  I don't see fascism in the USA, but I am am concerned about a tyranny of the majority ( the secularist majority).
 … whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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#2
(06-13-2016, 12:36 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 01:50 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: The fact is that we read those 14 points during the Bush-Cheney administration, and many of us thought then that we were on the verge of fascism because so many of them applied to the USA. And especially the last point, which put Bush in office.

Beware of preparing to fight the last war. In my opinion the majority worldview in the US is now some form of secularism and Christianity is now  a minority religion.  I don't see fascism in the USA, but I am am concerned about a tyranny of the majority ( the secularist majority).

And I am more concerned about the Christian majority. It is they and not secularists who threaten freedom of religion.

Again, I just seem to have a keen grasp of the obvious. It is my only virtue, perhaps. And it's also obvious (as demonstrated here) how many people cannot grasp the obvious.

8.Religion and Government are Intertwined
Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies or actions.

As in Karl Rove's famous strategy: just get the religious right's support, and that will get us elected. Worked in 2004.
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
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#3
(06-13-2016, 12:59 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 12:36 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 01:50 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: The fact is that we read those 14 points during the Bush-Cheney administration, and many of us thought then that we were on the verge of fascism because so many of them applied to the USA. And especially the last point, which put Bush in office.

Beware of preparing to fight the last war. In my opinion the majority worldview in the US is now some form of secularism and Christianity is now  a minority religion.  I don't see fascism in the USA, but I am am concerned about a tyranny of the majority ( the secularist majority).

And I am more concerned about the Christian majority. It is they and not secularists who threaten freedom of religion.

Again, I just seem to have a keen grasp of the obvious. It is my only virtue, perhaps. And it's also obvious (as demonstrated here) how many people cannot grasp the obvious.
This is where we have a different perception about the current situation. In my opinion, Christianity is now in the minority and not a threat . The secularist are the real majority and a potential threat. The secularists can practice their dogma in same manner as religions.
 … whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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#4
(06-13-2016, 01:05 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 12:59 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 12:36 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 01:50 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: The fact is that we read those 14 points during the Bush-Cheney administration, and many of us thought then that we were on the verge of fascism because so many of them applied to the USA. And especially the last point, which put Bush in office.

Beware of preparing to fight the last war. In my opinion the majority worldview in the US is now some form of secularism and Christianity is now  a minority religion.  I don't see fascism in the USA, but I am am concerned about a tyranny of the majority ( the secularist majority).

And I am more concerned about the Christian majority. It is they and not secularists who threaten freedom of religion.

Again, I just seem to have a keen grasp of the obvious. It is my only virtue, perhaps. And it's also obvious (as demonstrated here) how many people cannot grasp the obvious.
This is where we have a different perception about the current situation. In my opinion, Christianity is now in the minority and not a threat . The secularist are the real majority and a potential threat. The secularists can practice their dogma in same manner as religions.

And that is where I explained to you before. Don't conceive a threat where none exists. Others have different worldviews than your own, which permit behavior that you oppose. That is not a threat, nor does it mean they are imposing their religion on you. Get used to it. Gays exist and they have monogamous relationships. They always have and always will. Get over your revulsion against people who are different. Revulsion against people who are different caused a massacre in which 50 people died this week. 

Truly, it's time to question worldviews that put people down. Where is the threat? Obviously, worldviews that brand people who are different as wrong, is a threat to everyone. It could directly result in your death, thanks also to our lax gun laws. I wonder how you can continue to hold on to your dislike or disapproval of people who are different, in the face of the obvious deadly results of that sort of view.

Respect gays, and uphold their rights!
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
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#5
Secularism = the constitution. Freedom of religion. Equal rights to all regardless of religion or lack thereof.

"Biblical" Christian world view = misinterpretation of the Bible. Put downs of people of other religions, saying Christ is "the way." Restrictions on people who violate the norms of the Bible, AS interpreted only by the mis-labelled "Biblical" Christians. Support for worldviews that foster hate and murder.
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
Reply
#6
(06-13-2016, 01:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Secularism = the constitution. Freedom of religion. Equal rights to all regardless of religion or lack thereof.

"Biblical" Christian world view = misinterpretation of the Bible. Put downs of people of other religions, saying Christ is "the way." Restrictions on people who violate the norms of the Bible, AS interpreted only by the mis-labelled "Biblical" Christians. Support for worldviews that foster hate and murder.

In spite of your assertions, the USA is now primarily secular. What I claim as my worldview, you put down to misinterpretation of the Bible. I clearly disagree with you , but have the right ( so far) to my interpretation. My worldview does not foster hate and murder.
It take a few more years to see which of us is proved to be correct, based on actual outcomes.
We remain at stalemate
 … whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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#7
(06-13-2016, 07:29 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 01:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Secularism = the constitution. Freedom of religion. Equal rights to all regardless of religion or lack thereof.

"Biblical" Christian world view = misinterpretation of the Bible. Put downs of people of other religions, saying Christ is "the way." Restrictions on people who violate the norms of the Bible, AS interpreted only by the mis-labelled "Biblical" Christians. Support for worldviews that foster hate and murder.

In spite of your assertions, the USA is now primarily secular. What I claim as my worldview, you put down to misinterpretation of the Bible. I clearly disagree with you , but have the right ( so far) to my interpretation. My worldview does not foster hate and murder.
It take a few more years to see which of us is proved to be correct, based on actual outcomes.
We remain at stalemate

I have already proved the falsehood of your world view. You are unable to defend it.

Do you support full rights for gays/LGBT people, or not?

Do you deny that the shooter did not?
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
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#8
I mean, really?

75% of Americans identify with a Christian religion
Christian identification is down from 80% in 2008
5% of Americans identify with a non-Christian religion, little changed

http://www.gallup.com/poll/187955/percen...-high.aspx

Secularity

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secularity

Secularity (adjective form secular,[1] from Latin saecularis meaning "worldly" or "temporal") is the state of being separate from religion, or of not being exclusively allied with or against any particular religion.
For instance, one can regard eating and bathing as examples of secular activities, because there may not be anything inherently religious about them. Nevertheless, some religious traditions see both eating and bathing as sacraments, therefore making them religious activities within those world views. Saying a prayer derived from religious text or doctrine, worshipping through the context of a religion, and attending a religious school are examples of religious (non-secular) activities.
A related term, "secularism", involves the principle that government institutions and their representatives should remain separate from religious institutions, their beliefs, and their dignitaries. Most businesses and corporations, and some governments, operate on secular lines.


Simple Definition of secular
  • : not spiritual : of or relating to the physical world and not the spiritual world
  • : not religious
  • : of, relating to, or controlled by the government rather than by the church

Source: Merriam-Webster's Learner's Dictionary


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/secular

Full Definition of secular

  1. 1a :  of or relating to the worldly or temporal <secular concerns> 
  2. b :  not overtly or specifically religious <secular music>
  3. c :  not ecclesiastical or <secular courts> <secular landowners>
  4. 2:  not bound by monastic vows or rules; specifically :  of, relating to, or forming clergy not belonging to a religious order or congregation <a secular priest>
  5. 3a :  occurring once in an age or a century 
  6. b :  existing or continuing through ages or centuries 
  7. c :  of or relating to a long term of indefinite duration <secular inflation>
Interestingly, this forum is about the saeculum, which is the same as definition #3a here.
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
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#9
(06-13-2016, 01:17 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 01:05 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 12:59 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 12:36 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 01:50 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: The fact is that we read those 14 points during the Bush-Cheney administration, and many of us thought then that we were on the verge of fascism because so many of them applied to the USA. And especially the last point, which put Bush in office.

Beware of preparing to fight the last war. In my opinion the majority worldview in the US is now some form of secularism and Christianity is now  a minority religion.  I don't see fascism in the USA, but I am am concerned about a tyranny of the majority ( the secularist majority).

And I am more concerned about the Christian majority. It is they and not secularists who threaten freedom of religion.

Again, I just seem to have a keen grasp of the obvious. It is my only virtue, perhaps. And it's also obvious (as demonstrated here) how many people cannot grasp the obvious.
This is where we have a different perception about the current situation. In my opinion, Christianity is now in the minority and not a threat . The secularist are the real majority and a potential threat. The secularists can practice their dogma in same manner as religions.

And that is where I explained to you before. Don't conceive a threat where none exists. Others have different worldviews than your own, which permit behavior that you oppose. That is not a threat, nor does it mean they are imposing their religion on you. Get used to it. Gays exist and they have monogamous relationships. They always have and always will. Get over your revulsion against people who are different. Revulsion against people who are different caused a massacre in which 50 people died this week. 

Truly, it's time to question worldviews that put people down. Where is the threat? Obviously, worldviews that brand people who are different as wrong, is a threat to everyone. It could directly result in your death, thanks also to our lax gun laws. I wonder how you can continue to hold on to your dislike or disapproval of people who are different, in the face of the obvious deadly results of that sort of view.

Respect gays, and uphold their rights!

I respect all people who are created in the image of God.  So I reject your term of 'dislike'. There are some behaviors that I consider contrary to what I understand Christianity to be. 
I fully realize that those with a Biblical worldview are clearly now in the minority. I do have to accept the fact that the secular majority will do whatever they choose.( I do not have to approve).
The massacre should be condemned by all. 
It is the secular majority in general that I am concerned about( not the gays). It appears to me that the secularists operate with religious zeal and I do not expect religious liberty to survive for the Christian minority.

It appears that neither us is likely to change their views of the world.
 … whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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#10
(06-13-2016, 07:35 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 07:29 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 01:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Secularism = the constitution. Freedom of religion. Equal rights to all regardless of religion or lack thereof.

"Biblical" Christian world view = misinterpretation of the Bible. Put downs of people of other religions, saying Christ is "the way." Restrictions on people who violate the norms of the Bible, AS interpreted only by the mis-labelled "Biblical" Christians. Support for worldviews that foster hate and murder.

In spite of your assertions, the USA is now primarily secular. What I claim as my worldview, you put down to misinterpretation of the Bible. I clearly disagree with you , but have the right ( so far) to my interpretation. My worldview does not foster hate and murder.
It take a few more years to see which of us is proved to be correct, based on actual outcomes.
We remain at stalemate

I have already proved the falsehood of your world view. You are unable to defend it.

Do you support full rights for gays/LGBT people, or not?

Do you deny that the shooter did not?

You can make all the assertions you want. I will stand behind my worldview and I expect you to stand behind yours. 
I do not think that the behavior of gays/LGBT is condoned by the Bible. I also don't agree with killing unborn babies.
So, on the political front I will try to vote for those who are more in line with Christian views. In the future, I may not have anyone to vote for. 

The shooter had no respect for people and committed an evil act. It does appear that this may have been an Islamic terrorists attack. 

It is one thing to not approve of certain behavior, and it is quite another to hate or murder other people. In my view of Christianity , there is no room for hate, much less for murder.


Quote:Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. ( 1 John 3:15, ESV)
 … whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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#11
(06-13-2016, 08:16 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 07:35 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 07:29 PM)radind Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 01:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Secularism = the constitution. Freedom of religion. Equal rights to all regardless of religion or lack thereof.

"Biblical" Christian world view = misinterpretation of the Bible. Put downs of people of other religions, saying Christ is "the way." Restrictions on people who violate the norms of the Bible, AS interpreted only by the mis-labelled "Biblical" Christians. Support for worldviews that foster hate and murder.

In spite of your assertions, the USA is now primarily secular. What I claim as my worldview, you put down to misinterpretation of the Bible. I clearly disagree with you , but have the right ( so far) to my interpretation. My worldview does not foster hate and murder.
It take a few more years to see which of us is proved to be correct, based on actual outcomes.
We remain at stalemate

I have already proved the falsehood of your world view. You are unable to defend it.

Do you support full rights for gays/LGBT people, or not?

Do you deny that the shooter did not?

You can make all the assertions you want. I will stand behind my worldview and I expect you to stand behind yours. 

Your worldview may work fine for you, but for the less stable, it conditions hate and murder. You stand behind your worldview, but you have no valid or rational defense for it.

Quote:I do not think that the behavior of gays/LGBT is condoned by the Bible. I also don't agree with killing unborn babies.

You don't support gay rights. That attitude conditions homophobia and assaults on gays among some people. The Bible is not the constitution. Fetuses are not necessarily babies. Christians don't get to repeal the constitution, or to interpret it. That's up to the congress and the courts.



Quote:So, on the political front I will try to vote for those who are more in line with Christian views. In the future, I may not have anyone to vote for. 

Liberals also vote for those who are more in line with Christian views. Just not your version of Christian.

Quote:The shooter had no respect for people and committed an evil act. It does appear that this may have been an Islamic terrorists attack. 

Not, it does NOT so appear. At most the shooter was influenced by what he read and how he was brought up.

Respect gay people. 

Quote:It is one thing to not approve of certain behavior, and it is quite another to hate or murder other people. In my view of Christianity , there is no room for hate, much less for murder.


Quote:Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. ( 1 John 3:15, ESV)

[/quote]

You say you don't hate gay people, but you don't want them to have the same rights as others. You are repelled by their behavior simply because it's different from yours. The shooter was also repelled by their behavior. As if kissing someone is wrong.
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
Reply
#12
(06-13-2016, 07:45 PM)radind Wrote: I respect all people who are created in the image of God.  So I reject your term of 'dislike'. There are some behaviors that I consider contrary to what I understand Christianity to be. 
I fully realize that those with a Biblical worldview are clearly now in the minority. I do have to accept the fact that the secular majority will do whatever they choose.( I do not have to approve).


The massacre should be condemned by all. 
It is the secular majority in general that I am concerned about( not the gays). It appears to me that the secularists operate with religious zeal and I do not expect religious liberty to survive for the Christian minority.

It appears that neither us is likely to change their views of the world.

How do you expect secularists to take away religious liberty from the Christian minority, (besides the strange ways you mentioned before that I blew out of the water?)
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
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#13
(06-13-2016, 12:36 PM)radind Wrote: Beware of preparing to fight the last war

Armageddon? Are you saying that secularism's rise, and the defense of human rights against Christian claims that discrimination against gays should be allowed, will bring it on?
"I close my eyes, and I can see a better day" -- Justin Bieber

Keep the spirit alive;
Eric M
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#14
It is rather interesting to me that some christians pick out gays being supposed abominations yet they do not always follow what else is considered an abomination in the bible. YOU are probably considered one and will therefore burn for an eternity according to that evil book.

[/url]
[url=http://distractify.com/news/2016/06/13/twitter-homophobe-take-down]http://distractify.com/news/2016/06/13/twitter-homophobe-take-down
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






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#15
The bible is twisted to suit people's agendas all the time. It used to be used to justify slavery. Now it is used to oppress gays. You cannot go round picking and choosing what parts suit your agenda then ignore other parts you probably have done which the bible also states is an abomination. You better PRAY the bible lies and heaven is a fantasy because if not you are going to hell if you do any of the things it says is an abomination. Look to my link for reference. You can hate them all you like because the bible is against them....but look to your actions first. Never mind what they are doing and especially do not prevent them from having the equality you already enjoy. I am sure you would be pissed if you went through what they have and continue to go through. But who cares right? As long as your rights are valued and put before anyone elses. Hate them all you like but you should not get preferential rights over another who is different from you.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






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#16
(06-14-2016, 12:49 AM)taramarie Wrote: The bible is twisted to suit people's agendas all the time. It used to be used to justify slavery. Now it is used to oppress gays. You cannot go round picking and choosing what parts suit your agenda then ignore other parts you probably have done which the bible also states is an abomination. You better PRAY the bible lies and heaven is a fantasy because if not you are going to hell if you do any of the things it says is an abomination. Look to my link for reference. You can hate them all you like because the bible is against them....but look to your actions first. Never mind what they are doing and especially do not prevent them from having the equality you already enjoy. I am sure you would be pissed if you went through what they have and continue to go through. But who cares right? As long as your rights are valued and put before anyone elses. Hate them all you like but you should not get preferential rights over another who is different from you.

As a moral code the Bible creates problems. Much of the text proves to be rigid rules of ritual behavior and dietary (kashrut) rules that few people have the ability to follow, and that have little value as a moral code. To be sure, Orthodox Jews can be wonderful people -- but for acting upon conscience, and not for rejecting pork and shellfish or meals that consist of meat and dairy.

Nothing in the Bible says anything about child abuse, slavery, narcotics, or drunk driving (addendum: being evil or undesirable).
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


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#17
(06-14-2016, 02:51 AM)pbrower2a Wrote:
(06-14-2016, 12:49 AM)taramarie Wrote: The bible is twisted to suit people's agendas all the time. It used to be used to justify slavery. Now it is used to oppress gays. You cannot go round picking and choosing what parts suit your agenda then ignore other parts you probably have done which the bible also states is an abomination. You better PRAY the bible lies and heaven is a fantasy because if not you are going to hell if you do any of the things it says is an abomination. Look to my link for reference. You can hate them all you like because the bible is against them....but look to your actions first. Never mind what they are doing and especially do not prevent them from having the equality you already enjoy. I am sure you would be pissed if you went through what they have and continue to go through. But who cares right? As long as your rights are valued and put before anyone elses. Hate them all you like but you should not get preferential rights over another who is different from you.

As a moral code the Bible creates problems. Much of the text proves to be rigid rules of ritual behavior and dietary (kashrut) rules that few people have the ability to follow, and that have little value as a moral code. To be sure, Orthodox Jews can be wonderful people -- but for acting upon conscience, and not for rejecting pork and shellfish or meals that consist of meat and dairy.

Nothing in the Bible says anything about child abuse, slavery, narcotics, or drunk driving.
HA!

https://www.openbible.info/topics/slavery
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






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#18
Exodus 21:16 ESV

Whoever steals a man and sells him, and anyone found in possession of him, shall be put to death.

I can live with that.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


Reply
#19
(06-14-2016, 04:02 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: Exodus 21:16 ESV

Whoever steals a man and sells him, and anyone found in possession of him, shall be put to death.

I can live with that.

You do realize i just proved you were wrong that slavery is not within the bible. This proves it is as well as the historical fact that people used it to justify slavery.

For those too lazy to click on the link here is the proof that it is mentioned unlike what pbrower said..

Galatians 5:1 ESV / 568 helpful votes

For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore, and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery.
Leviticus 25:44-46 ESV / 476 helpful votes

As for your male and female slaves whom you may have: you may buy male and female slaves from among the nations that are around you. You may also buy from among the strangers who sojourn with you and their clans that are with you, who have been born in your land, and they may be your property. You may bequeath them to your sons after you to inherit as a possession forever. You may make slaves of them, but over your brothers the people of Israel you shall not rule, one over another ruthlessly.
Colossians 4:1 ESV / 384 helpful votes

Masters, treat your slaves justly and fairly, knowing that you also have a Master in heaven.
Exodus 21:16 ESV / 375 helpful votes

“Whoever steals a man and sells him, and anyone found in possession of him, shall be put to death.
Ephesians 6:5 ESV / 369 helpful votes

Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling, with a sincere heart, as you would Christ,
Exodus 21:20-21 ESV / 303 helpful votes

“When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod and the slave dies under his hand, he shall be avenged. But if the slave survives a day or two, he is not to be avenged, for the slave is his money.
Galatians 3:28 ESV / 197 helpful votes

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Titus 2:9-10 ESV / 149 helpful votes

Slaves are to be submissive to their own masters in everything; they are to be well-pleasing, not argumentative, not pilfering, but showing all good faith, so that in everything they may adorn the doctrine of God our Savior.
1 Peter 2:18 ESV / 131 helpful votes

Servants, be subject to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the unjust.
Luke 4:18 ESV / 111 helpful votes

“The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim liberty to the captives and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty those who are oppressed,
Proverbs 22:16 ESV / 110 helpful votes

Whoever oppresses the poor to increase his own wealth, or gives to the rich, will only come to poverty.
Exodus 21:26-27 ESV / 96 helpful votes

“When a man strikes the eye of his slave, male or female, and destroys it, he shall let the slave go free because of his eye. If he knocks out the tooth of his slave, male or female, he shall let the slave go free because of his tooth.
Deuteronomy 23:15 ESV / 90 helpful votes

“You shall not give up to his master a slave who has escaped from his master to you.
Exodus 21:1-36 ESV / 90 helpful votes

“Now these are the rules that you shall set before them. When you buy a Hebrew slave, he shall serve six years, and in the seventh he shall go out free, for nothing. If he comes in single, he shall go out single; if he comes in married, then his wife shall go out with him. If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the wife and her children shall be her master's, and he shall go out alone. But if the slave plainly says, ‘I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free,’ ...
1 Corinthians 7:21 ESV / 72 helpful votes

Were you a slave when called? Do not be concerned about it. (But if you can gain your freedom, avail yourself of the opportunity.)
Philemon 1:16 ESV / 69 helpful votes

No longer as a slave but more than a slave, as a beloved brother—especially to me, but how much more to you, both in the flesh and in the Lord.
Deuteronomy 23:15-16 ESV / 61 helpful votes

“You shall not give up to his master a slave who has escaped from his master to you. He shall dwell with you, in your midst, in the place that he shall choose within one of your towns, wherever it suits him. You shall not wrong him.
Deuteronomy 24:7 ESV / 59 helpful votes

“If a man is found stealing one of his brothers of the people of Israel, and if he treats him as a slave or sells him, then that thief shall die. So you shall purge the evil from your midst.
Ephesians 6:8-10 ESV / 51 helpful votes

Knowing that whatever good anyone does, this he will receive back from the Lord, whether he is a slave or free. Masters, do the same to them, and stop your threatening, knowing that he who is both their Master and yours is in heaven, and that there is no partiality with him. Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of his might.
Colossians 3:22 ESV / 44 helpful votes

Slaves, obey in everything those who are your earthly masters, not by way of eye-service, as people-pleasers, but with sincerity of heart, fearing the Lord.
Proverbs 14:31 ESV / 44 helpful votes

Whoever oppresses a poor man insults his Maker, but he who is generous to the needy honors him.
Leviticus 25:39 ESV / 44 helpful votes

“If your brother becomes poor beside you and sells himself to you, you shall not make him serve as a slave:
Romans 6:16 ESV / 43 helpful votes

Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness?
1 Timothy 6:1-2 ESV / 41 helpful votes

Let all who are under a yoke as slaves regard their own masters as worthy of all honor, so that the name of God and the teaching may not be reviled. Those who have believing masters must not be disrespectful on the ground that they are brothers; rather they must serve all the better since those who benefit by their good service are believers and beloved. Teach and urge these things.
Isaiah 61:1-11 ESV / 40 helpful votes

The Spirit of the Lord God is upon me, because the Lord has anointed me to bring good news to the poor; he has sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to those who are bound; to proclaim the year of the Lord's favor, and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all who mourn; to grant to those who mourn in Zion— to give them a beautiful headdress instead of ashes, the oil of gladness instead of mourning, the garment of praise instead of a faint spirit; that they may be called oaks of righteousness, the planting of the Lord, that he may be glorified. They shall build up the ancient ruins; they shall raise up the former devastations; they shall repair the ruined cities, the devastations of many generations. Strangers shall stand and tend your flocks; foreigners shall be your plowmen and vinedressers; ...
Leviticus 22:11 ESV / 40 helpful votes

But if a priest buys a slave as his property for money, the slave may eat of it, and anyone born in his house may eat of his food.
Leviticus 19:20 ESV / 40 helpful votes

“If a man lies sexually with a woman who is a slave, assigned to another man and not yet ransomed or given her freedom, a distinction shall be made. They shall not be put to death, because she was not free;
1 Timothy 5:18 ESV / 32 helpful votes

For the Scripture says, “You shall not muzzle an ox when it treads out the grain,” and, “The laborer deserves his wages.”
Amos 8:6 ESV / 31 helpful votes

That we may buy the poor for silver and the needy for a pair of sandals and sell the chaff of the wheat?”
Jeremiah 34:8-9 ESV / 30 helpful votes

The word that came to Jeremiah from the Lord, after King Zedekiah had made a covenant with all the people in Jerusalem to make a proclamation of liberty to them, that everyone should set free his Hebrew slaves, male and female, so that no one should enslave a Jew, his brother.
Isaiah 14:2 ESV / 28 helpful votes

And the peoples will take them and bring them to their place, and the house of Israel will possess them in the Lord's land as male and female slaves. They will take captive those who were their captors, and rule over those who oppressed them.
Mark 10:42-45 ESV / 26 helpful votes

And Jesus called them to him and said to them, “You know that those who are considered rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their great ones exercise authority over them. But it shall not be so among you. But whoever would be great among you must be your servant, and whoever would be first among you must be slave of all. For even the Son of Man came not to be served but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
Acts 6:1-3 ESV / 25 helpful votes

Now in these days when the disciples were increasing in number, a complaint by the Hellenists arose against the Hebrews because their widows were being neglected in the daily distribution. And the twelve summoned the full number of the disciples and said, “It is not right that we should give up preaching the word of God to serve tables. Therefore, brothers, pick out from among you seven men of good repute, full of the Spirit and of wisdom, whom we will appoint to this duty.
Leviticus 25:10 ESV / 25 helpful votes

And you shall consecrate the fiftieth year, and proclaim liberty throughout the land to all its inhabitants. It shall be a jubilee for you, when each of you shall return to his property and each of you shall return to his clan.
Ezra 9:9 ESV / 20 helpful votes

For we are slaves. Yet our God has not forsaken us in our slavery, but has extended to us his steadfast love before the kings of Persia, to grant us some reviving to set up the house of our God, to repair its ruins, and to give us protection in Judea and Jerusalem.
1 Samuel 4:9 ESV / 19 helpful votes

Take courage, and be men, O Philistines, lest you become slaves to the Hebrews as they have been to you; be men and fight.”
Joel 3:2-3 ESV / 18 helpful votes

I will gather all the nations and bring them down to the Valley of Jehoshaphat. And I will enter into judgment with them there, on behalf of my people and my heritage Israel, because they have scattered them among the nations and have divided up my land, and have cast lots for my people, and have traded a boy for a prostitute, and have sold a girl for wine and have drunk it.
Isaiah 14:3-8 ESV / 16 helpful votes

When the Lord has given you rest from your pain and turmoil and the hard service with which you were made to serve, you will take up this taunt against the king of Babylon: “How the oppressor has ceased, the insolent fury ceased! The Lord has broken the staff of the wicked, the scepter of rulers, that struck the peoples in wrath with unceasing blows, that ruled the nations in anger with unrelenting persecution. The whole earth is at rest and quiet; they break forth into singing. ...
Isaiah 14:1-3 ESV / 14 helpful votes

For the Lord will have compassion on Jacob and will again choose Israel, and will set them in their own land, and sojourners will join them and will attach themselves to the house of Jacob. And the peoples will take them and bring them to their place, and the house of Israel will possess them in the Lord's land as male and female slaves. They will take captive those who were their captors, and rule over those who oppressed them. When the Lord has given you rest from your pain and turmoil and the hard service with which you were made to serve,
Judges 1:30 ESV / 10 helpful votes

Zebulun did not drive out the inhabitants of Kitron, or the inhabitants of Nahalol, so the Canaanites lived among them, but became subject to forced labor.
James 5:4 ESV / 8 helpful votes

Behold, the wages of the laborers who mowed your fields, which you kept back by fraud, are crying out against you, and the cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of hosts.
2 Kings 4:1 ESV / 7 helpful votes

Now the wife of one of the sons of the prophets cried to Elisha, “Your servant my husband is dead, and you know that your servant feared the Lord, but the creditor has come to take my two children to be his slaves.”
1 Samuel 17:55-58 ESV / 6 helpful votes

As soon as Saul saw David go out against the Philistine, he said to Abner, the commander of the army, “Abner, whose son is this youth?” And Abner said, “As your soul lives, O king, I do not know.” And the king said, “Inquire whose son the boy is.” And as soon as David returned from the striking down of the Philistine, Abner took him, and brought him before Saul with the head of the Philistine in his hand. And Saul said to him, “Whose son are you, young man?” And David answered, “I am the son of your servant Jesse the Bethlehemite.”
Revelation 13:16 ESV / 5 helpful votes

Also it causes all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or the forehead,
1 Samuel 30:11-15 ESV / 5 helpful votes

They found an Egyptian in the open country and brought him to David. And they gave him bread and he ate. They gave him water to drink, and they gave him a piece of a cake of figs and two clusters of raisins. And when he had eaten, his spirit revived, for he had not eaten bread or drunk water for three days and three nights. And David said to him, “To whom do you belong? And where are you from?” He said, “I am a young man of Egypt, servant to an Amalekite, and my master left me behind because I fell sick three days ago. We had made a raid against the Negeb of the Cherethites and against that which belongs to Judah and against the Negeb of Caleb, and we burned Ziklag with fire.” And David said to him, “Will you take me down to this band?” And he said, “Swear to me by God that you will not kill me or deliver me into the hands of my master, and I will take you down to this band.”
John 13:1-38 ESV / 3 helpful votes

Now before the Feast of the Passover, when Jesus knew that his hour had come to depart out of this world to the Father, having loved his own who were in the world, he loved them to the end. During supper, when the devil had already put it into the heart of Judas Iscariot, Simon's son, to betray him, Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he had come from God and was going back to God, rose from supper. He laid aside his outer garments, and taking a towel, tied it around his waist. Then he poured water into a basin and began to wash the disciples' feet and to wipe them with the towel that was wrapped around him. ...
Matthew 20:28 ESV / 3 helpful votes

Even as the Son of Man came not to be served but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”
2 Chronicles 8:8 ESV / 3 helpful votes

From their descendants who were left after them in the land, whom the people of Israel had not destroyed—these Solomon drafted as forced labor, and so they are to this day.
Deuteronomy 28:68 ESV / 3 helpful votes

And the Lord will bring you back in ships to Egypt, a journey that I promised that you should never make again; and there you shall offer yourselves for sale to your enemies as male and female slaves, but there will be no buyer.”
Deuteronomy 28:33 ESV / 3 helpful votes

A nation that you have not known shall eat up the fruit of your ground and of all your labors, and you shall be only oppressed and crushed continually,
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






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#20
(06-14-2016, 12:02 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:
(06-13-2016, 12:36 PM)radind Wrote: Beware of preparing to fight the last war

Armageddon? Are you saying that secularism's rise, and the defense of human rights against Christian claims that discrimination against gays should be allowed, will bring it on?

I don't know what you mean by 'Armageddon?'.
By the last war , I mean that you write  about concern for  the Christian majority  when there is no longer a Christian majority. There is a Christian minority with a secularist majority. 
My concern is that the secularist majority will not tolerate  Christians values.
I am for religious liberty and respect for all.
 … whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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