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What's going on with you, part II...
#61
(08-25-2016, 12:54 AM)taramarie Wrote: I quit my job today. The boss is horrible and i refuse to be treated that way any longer. She did not listen so i am out. Onto bigger and better things I say. I will sorely miss the elderly though. I have 3 interviews going. One in massage, one in avon and one is a client i am doing a design for. Two i am seeing tomorrow. I also have decided to start a year course on getting my grad diploma in teaching art to high school level students. I will be starting next year. It will put my bachelor degree to use and it will also teach others what i am passionate about and keep me in tip top form with my art. Then i can return to the studio and see if they will hire me once i have gotten even better at what i do. I already have a student anyway so why not? :Smile have a load of people wanting designs of all sorts. Adverts, logos, tattoo designs etc and i am an art teacher already lol. I am proud of myself for not putting up with rubbish and staying true to who i am. I am an artist and always will be! Cool

Good luck!
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#62
Portfolio gets a boost today. Big Grin 



Yahoo Finance Wrote:Altria (MO) Rewards Shareholders with 8% Hike in Dividend

[Image: zacks1-106x27_152730.gif]
Zacks Equity Research
August 26, 2016
Altria Group, Inc.’s MO board of directors recently announced an 8% hike in its quarterly dividend to 61 cents per share. The new dividend will be paid on Oct 11 to shareholders on record as of Sep 15, 2016. The annualized dividend now amounts to $2.44 per share with a dividend yield of 3.7%, based on Altria’s closing price of $66.33 as of Aug 19, 2016. Last year, the company increased its dividend by 8.7%.
The cigarette maker regularly returns value to shareholders and since the spin-off of Philip Morris International Inc. PM, in 2008, has increased dividend every year. Notably, the company has raised its dividend 50 times in 47 years. Also, the company has a dividend payout ratio target of around 80% of adjusted earnings per share.  
Altria is not the only tobacco company that engages in shareholder friendly moves as many of its peers to have been rewarding investors with attractive yields. While Altria and peer Reynolds American, Inc. RAI pay dividends that yield more than 3.6%, Philip Morris has a dividend yield of 4.07%. Vector Group Limited VGR, a smaller American cigarette company that owns the Pyramid and Eagle 20's brands, has a striking dividend yield of 7.25%.
ALTRIA GROUP Price and EPS Surprise

Yes!   Invest in value stawks and get the rewards. Cool
---Value Added Cool
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#63
More on the tobacco front.  The 2016 crop cycle is in full swing.   Cool 

[Image: garden.jpg?t=1472176906]

The garden


The cure room

[Image: DSCF0013.jpg?t=1472176964]


Tobacco powder 2015-2016

[Image: DSCF0009.jpg?t=1472177024]



Snus

[Image: DSCF0011.jpg?t=1472177078]

The dates are wrong because Rags is too lazy to reset the camera clock. Big Grin
---Value Added Cool
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#64
Smile 
Shake Rattle and Roll.  

http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/03/us/oklahom...index.html

Oklahoma, the new earthquake capital of the US. That sucker lasted 15 seconds where I live.

---Value Added Cool
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#65
(09-06-2016, 03:38 AM)taramarie Wrote: So...i am now an animation/filmmaker student at the University of Canterbury. I will specialize in that now. I will get 2 or 3 diplomas in that. Up-scaling my skills each year. Then finally i will move over to the fine arts department and earn my Bachelor degree in Film. Learning to be a director of film. So I will in total have about 2 or 3 diplomas in animation. My current Bachelor degree in Multimedia Design and a Bachelor Degree in Fine Art specializing in Film. Yep I have been accepted. I am tickled pink atm!

Good luck!!! Big Grin
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#66
(09-29-2016, 11:00 PM)taramarie Wrote: Well after many many many years I have finally snapped and told my mother how i really feel after she called me a bitch for just calmly telling her to stop stressing over a tiny thing. She does this all the time and stresses me out. She does it to control me. Yes she plays mind games. I have finally told her how i feel and it felt good to get that off my chest. However i had to do the full thing through fb as she does not listen, explodes, name calls and dismisses me. Here is my full message.

"Apparently according to my mother i am a "b*tch" because I calmly told her to calm down and i will wash my socks tomorrow as she was not happy that i went outside with my socks on. So what! Mum, if we are to live under the same roof I have to tell you this right now. I do not need your freaking out over the slightest thing then not talking to me for several days while you bang and slam things. I will not walk around egg shells with you. I do need you to also stop calling me names. It is abusive and gone on too long. Address me as an adult should please and stop freaking out over the slightest things. They are socks. I can wash them if you do not want to. This has to end. I have seen other mother/daughter relationships and how great they get along and i wish we had that. I will not be controlled through your temper/stress and name calling any longer. And do not call it rubbish because that is how I feel and have felt for many years. If you consider it rubbish you do not care about how i feel. It just pushes us away further and further deteriorates ties. if you ignore me for this you are not winning anything. Doing so is just avoiding, hurting our relationship further and is childish tbh. I am over it."

The silence kills and so it felt great to finally have the spine to stand up to her as an ill relationship is so toxic and crushing. I am over it guys. I have lived with this and grown up with it my whole life and her menopause has just made things worse. After many years i stood up to her and now we shall see what happens next. She cannot throw me out as i stay to feed us both. She cannot survive without my help.

Your mom REALLY needs mental help.
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#67
(09-29-2016, 11:00 PM)taramarie Wrote: Well after many many many years I have finally snapped and told my mother how i really feel after she called me a bitch for just calmly telling her to stop stressing over a tiny thing. She does this all the time and stresses me out. She does it to control me. Yes she plays mind games. I have finally told her how i feel and it felt good to get that off my chest. However i had to do the full thing through fb as she does not listen, explodes, name calls and dismisses me. Here is my full message.

"Apparently according to my mother i am a "b*tch" because I calmly told her to calm down and i will wash my socks tomorrow as she was not happy that i went outside with my socks on. So what! Mum, if we are to live under the same roof I have to tell you this right now. I do not need your freaking out over the slightest thing then not talking to me for several days while you bang and slam things. I will not walk around egg shells with you. I do need you to also stop calling me names. It is abusive and gone on too long. Address me as an adult should please and stop freaking out over the slightest things. They are socks. I can wash them if you do not want to. This has to end. I have seen other mother/daughter relationships and how great they get along and i wish we had that. I will not be controlled through your temper/stress and name calling any longer. And do not call it rubbish because that is how I feel and have felt for many years. If you consider it rubbish you do not care about how i feel. It just pushes us away further and further deteriorates ties. if you ignore me for this you are not winning anything. Doing so is just avoiding, hurting our relationship further and is childish tbh. I am over it."

The silence kills and so it felt great to finally have the spine to stand up to her as an ill relationship is so toxic and crushing. I am over it guys. I have lived with this and grown up with it my whole life and her menopause has just made things worse. After many years i stood up to her and now we shall see what happens next. She cannot throw me out as i stay to feed us both. She cannot survive without my help.

Your mother needs help, and I don't mean domestic help.  I've seen other tales of her irresponsibility. To enjoy adult freedom one must accept some adult responsibility for behavior and finances. Does she have a chemical problem?

Few people can fully satisfy the dreams of their parents. All that one can legitimately expect of offspring is honorable lives.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


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#68
(09-30-2016, 03:37 PM)taramarie Wrote: I often wonder if sometimes I am playing the adult and my mother the child. To some degree we are. I have learned earlier on what an adult should be like by watching my mothers many mistakes. I aim not to be like that.

You need to get her some help, if necessary in a rehab center. She has problems, and she can well mess you up if you keep her around without her making some changes that make her a trustworthy adult. She can keep you from having a satisfying love life. As someone with a perverse mate with the maiden name Asperger that allowed no divorce and no cheating I can see a big gap in your life if you can't get her to drastically change her ways or get out of your life. Asperger's syndrome, I assure you, is tougher to kick than alcohol, drugs, or abusive relationships. As far as that goes, you may need some guidance yourself so that you can get some freedom.

You will have to ask whether the house you live in is a home or is a jail for you. It may be a tough thing to say, but some assets are not worth the costs of keeping them. So a house in which you are a veritable prison in which you take care of a child in adult form may be not as desirable as a tiny apartment for which you pay exorbitant rent. Life is often a question of having freedom and having property that owns you. You may have to make clear that a tiny apartment for which you must pay exorbitant rent can make life far simpler for you than having to take care of her because your mother has never grown up. Know that if you go to a tiny, exorbitantly-priced apartment, that when you do she gets to watch you give away or sell off the treasures that she cherishes... No, not my stamp collection! No, not my awards for ballet! No, not my precious china and artwork! No, not that fine furniture! No, not my music collection!

Tough luck to her. She needs to make some tough, rational choices.

If you have any success in your field, then you will be an attractive mate for someone capable of contributing along with you for paying a mortgage. But note well: your mate will have even more problems with your mother than you have. That mate will not want your mother around. There are in-laws who can get along with each other, but I can't imagine any in-law getting along with her.

I have no idea what her age is, but many people now in their late 50s to their early 70s have chosen to maintain childlike roles long after such is appropriate. Such was monstrously cruel to children (one contributor to many messed-up lives of Generation X in America) and it is now monstrously cruel to adults who are old enough to have real children -- the children whom one expects to develop in the presence of competent adult role models. But if she is a bad parent, she will be little less competent as a grandparent.

Once one has children, one must cease being a child oneself. Sure, one can watch a Disney or Miyazki cartoon epic and imagine yourself a child again for an hour-and-a-half or so... but that is as far as it goes. Children need a genuine adult in a house. As a substitute teacher I have seen the consequences of a child in a family in which there is no semblance of an adult except for age. It is ugly. 

Above all, get the creditors to take away her credit cards. Credit cards are for adults == not for children.

I hope that I have not said too much.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


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#69
(09-30-2016, 10:31 PM)taramarie Wrote:
(09-30-2016, 09:41 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: "If you have any success in your field, then you will be an attractive mate for someone capable of contributing along with you for paying a mortgage. But note well: your mate will have even more problems with your mother than you have. That mate will not want your mother around. There are in-laws who can get along with each other, but I can't imagine any in-law getting along with her."
 True. My mother did not even want to talk to my bf at the time...till he saved my life one time. Then suddenly she started to warm up to him. He was a patient man luckily...well not luckily because it had to end due to this situation. Oh well.

He saved your life but your mother drove her away with her childishness. This is beginning to sound like a dangerous drama. This can end in tragedy.

Quote:
Quote:"I have no idea what her age is, but many people now in their late 50s to their early 70s have chosen to maintain childlike roles long after such is appropriate. Such was monstrously cruel to children (one contributor to many messed-up lives of Generation X in America) and it is now monstrously cruel to adults who are old enough to have real children -- the children whom one expects to develop in the presence of competent adult role models. But if she is a bad parent, she will be little less competent as a grandparent."
She was born in 1957. She is 58 going on 59 in December this year. Well, I am not an Xer but it has messed my life up but I will go back to school and specialize in something. It won't keep me down. Our fights tend to make it harder to deal with it as i have to live under the same roof. But there is always art and meditation. As for grandparent I do not plan on having children which is just as well. It is a deterrent for anyone thinking of having me as a gf when they learn of the situation and I have learned to accept that as ok.


Art and meditation are nice. Companionship is even richer. Romantic love is richer. Someone who truly loves you will be find it easy to deal with your art and meditation. Your mother? I wouldn't want to be involved.


Quote:
Quote:Once one has children, one must cease being a child oneself. Sure, one can watch a Disney or Miyazki cartoon epic and imagine yourself a child again for an hour-and-a-half or so... but that is as far as it goes. Children need a genuine adult in a house. As a substitute teacher I have seen the consequences of a child in a family in which there is no semblance of an adult except for age. It is ugly.
I wholeheartedly agree. What do you teach?


Anything third-grade or higher. In a rural area, specialization is a risky proposition.  I just can't relate easily to very small children. That could be Asperger's syndrome at work; I just don't like loud, sustained sound.



Quote:
Quote:  "Above all, get the creditors to take away her credit cards. Credit cards are for adults == not for children." I got her to cut up her cards but they gave her more. I go out with her whenever she goes shopping to inspect if she is using them again as I have paid a few hundred off them myself (and now i apparently am in debt with WINZ even though they heard the situation. So i have to pay them the cash i gave her..)
So stupid, I worked for that money. I cashed in my holiday pay so i could stop them ringing her bugging her to pay up.


Can you get her to declare bankruptcy? Or would that force you to give up the house?  I am no expert on bankruptcy in America, and I have no idea how bankruptcy works in New Zealand. You may want to get some conservatorship over her. That means no credit cards. That means that you have much more control over her. If she is a big spender and lacks the means to meet her dreams, then you need to emancipate yourself from the financial drain that she has imposed upon you.

Has she ever thought that you might have been able to do something enjoyable with her with that holiday pay if she hadn't stuck you with her bills?

She needs to be taught to be a more pleasant person -- which means that she will have to do some real good for people.  She needs to learn to set some priorities.

Get her to do something -- like raise a garden. Have her get some job, even if it is as a retail clerk, restaurant worker, or domestic servant, so that she can associate her efforts with buying at the least her food.

I have heard of a type in America in my studies of genealogy. The fourth or later daughter of an English aristocratic family has no significant role in life but has been brainwashed to believe certain things about herself -- things that she cannot sustain. She has nothing but her pretentious airs and a few heirlooms. She ends up marrying someone 'ill-born' and her family rejects her. She and her husband emigrate to America, and she takes her airs and some portable heirlooms (the non-cash part of the dowry) with her. One of those airs is ordering people, often her grandchildren, about as if servants.

She dies. The grandchildren have a bonfire into which they cast her aristocratic heirlooms, around which they dance a mock-Indian war-whoop. I have discovered the same story on both sides of my family. This fourth daughter who marries an unwelcome commoner (fourth sons of English aristocrats in a culture of primogeniture generally have little to offer) is a nightmare of a grandmother.

In The Wizard of Oz, that unpleasant woman becomes a "wicked witch". 





Witches are easier to understand than a sociological phenomenon. Like that aristocratic grandmother who has been stranded in a hardscrabble world in which her aristocratic airs and heirlooms are useless and detested, she is not missed. That was largely a nineteenth-century phenomenon in America.  She has her expectations, and others have their own needs. L. Frank Baum found a way to transform a once-commonplace reality in the American middle class into something people could better understand beyond his time. It is a stroke of literary genius that became a great vignette in one of the most beloved movies of all time.


Quote:"I hope that I have not said too much."
No it is totally fine. I have grown to accept all of this and shoulder the burden as it is in my character to help others and make wrongs right again.[/quote]


Maybe she knows subconsciously that if she ever has grandchildren, they will perform a mock-Maori celebration of her demise. "Ding, dong, the witch is dead", indeed!

If she messes up her lungs and heart on cancerweed  or her liver on booze (both expensive habits), then maybe you can outlast her and have a gap that you can fill with a suitable spouse. Sixty (my case) isn't really old (except perhaps for being out of touch with mass culture and with spending habits of young adults) so long as one has as body consistent with rigorous activity. Mass culture and trendy consumerism are overrated.

If she is using her credit cards for food, then she has a problem. She's spending on something. Trying to impress a much-younger boyfriend?

But if one has a cirrhotic liver, sixty is old. If one has emphysema, sixty is old. If one has been a druggie throughout one's life one probably does not reach sixty. I have known alcoholics, and one pattern that I have seen in the  alcoholics that I have known is that they never grow up.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


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#70
(09-30-2016, 03:17 PM)taramarie Wrote: I have known that since I was a teenager. She is reckless, has a violent temper and when she does not get her own way entirely she throws a fit in order to control. She has always been that way. As you can see it is over the simplest things. I am apparently not allowed to walk around outside in socks. I just simply told her if you do not want them in the wash leave them. I will clean them tomorrow. No big deal. She just kept bitching and i told her calm down. That was when she said i wish you would stop being a bitch. I told her i wish you would stop freaking out over the slightest things and controlling every aspect of my life. This is the price I pay to stay under her roof to feed her as she cannot support herself. FML. Regarding trying to satisfy her dream I do try and i wonder why i bother sometimes. I never seem to make her happy and the choke-hold continues. It is like walking round eggshells to make her happy and proud of me that I am achieving what she wanted to do (she wanted to be an artist) as well as my own dream too. I do not know if she has a chemical problem. It is a mission to get her to the doctors in the first place. She is even more stubborn than Eric. Her way or the highway and her way is set in stone. To be honest she scares me. It took a lot of courage for me to finally stand up to her as i usually just do as I am told. I went into my room afterwards and decided to take up meditation. She will not infect me anymore.

If you are on Reddit, there is a board there called /r/RaisedByNarcissists I think you should subscribe to. Lots of posters there with situations like yours.
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#71
(09-30-2016, 05:03 PM)taramarie Wrote: The outcome would be she would have to rely on her credit cards to eat. She cannot afford food as she is in so much debt. She relies on my money for food. She has a caveat on the house so the more she puts on the cards the less chance she has of being able to pay off her debt and they will take her house away from her. No i stay because i care about my mother.

You NEED to cut her off, Tara. I think at this point you are just enabling her behavior, she seems like one of those people who will have to hit rock bottom before she gets better. It may seem cruel but it is the only way she is going to change. I know given your personality type that doing that will be very hard for you to do, but you need to.
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#72
I was at my sister's wedding this weekend, she's a '76 cohort Xer marrying a '68 cohort Xer. Very pretty small-scale wedding on the shore of Big Cormorant Lake at the groom's uncle's home The only bad part was the mosquitoes!
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#73
(10-03-2016, 08:00 AM)Odin Wrote:
(09-30-2016, 05:03 PM)taramarie Wrote: The outcome would be she would have to rely on her credit cards to eat. She cannot afford food as she is in so much debt. She relies on my money for food. She has a caveat on the house so the more she puts on the cards the less chance she has of being able to pay off her debt and they will take her house away from her. No i stay because i care about my mother.

You NEED to cut her off, Tara. I think at this point you are just enabling her behavior, she seems like one of those people who will have to hit rock bottom before she gets better. It may seem cruel but it is the only way she is going to change. I know given your personality type that doing that will be very hard for you to do, but you need to.

Take the credit cards. If she is using credit cards for food, then she has been using money on other stuff. Get control of her finances.

Buy her food amd cleaning stuff but nothing else (OK, commuting costs to get to work). Make sure that the food is basic stuff -- the sort typical for people on welfare. Maybe put her on a vegetarian diet, which will be less expensive. I don't know if generic brands are available in New Zealand as they are in America. They are not as reliable in quality as the name-brands; I have gotten some cr@ppy stuff as generic merchandise and not bought the same item again. She needs to live like the pauper that she is for a few months. You may need to cut back on shared indulgences, like premium television. Bored? Get out a board game.

Can one learn new stuff in one's late 50s? Sure. It will be tough for her, but she needs to take some adult responsibilities, like budgeting. But when she does that she will be much more competent, and likely more happy. She apparently has some job, and New Zealand is rich enough that nobody working full time should go hungry. New Zealand does not have the sick economy of America in which owners act like plantation owners and managers act like a Soviet-style nomenklatura.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


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#74
I just got a book, Loving Someone with Asperger's Syndrome. Anyone who gets hooked on me (I have some virtues -- I am trustworthy with assets, vehicles, and especially the welfare of the helpless) needs to know what to expect. If it took a therapist thirty minutes to get a diagnosis, it won;t take long to find something creepy about me. I might as well expose it quickly.

If getting off drugs and alcohol is tough, getting off Asperger's Syndrome is simply impossible. I have much explaining to do, and now that I know what has me (one does not have Asperger's -- it has you!) in thrall I can explain it well. Expect weird responses to stimuli. I know what to expect of others, and others might as well know what to expect of me. Not having a clue, even if one is otherwise competent, and drawing the wrong conclusions is not dishonesty.

I have something to offer in a relationship. I am 'high-functioning' enough that I might be able to hold onto some job. I could probably be a good stepfather even with my evident limitations. I put a high value on learning, and I have a good work ethic even if I have a spotty work history and have underachieved for my intelligence and education. I do office politics as ineptly as anyone, and I handle depersonalizing stress badly. That is Asperger's. Had I known about it I might have done everything differently. Who knows what I might have done?

But she -- and any children -- need to know what they are getting. Can I love? Probably; love is a virtue, and if one practices any virtue one gets its mark. Will I pose difficulties? Who doesn't? At the least I am not a reckless spender, I am not greedy and materialistic, I can offer a wholesome (if archaic) culture, I know what to judge and what to let slide, and I don't have chemical dependencies. I have shown loyalty to people who have left me in financial and emotional ruin (not their choice -- their circumstances and demises), and I would just as soon show loyalties to people who don't do such.

Bored, broke, and lonely -- it sounds like the title of a bad country music song. Bach is more to my liking.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


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#75
(10-03-2016, 02:39 PM)taramarie Wrote:
(10-03-2016, 08:00 AM)Odin Wrote:
(09-30-2016, 05:03 PM)taramarie Wrote: The outcome would be she would have to rely on her credit cards to eat. She cannot afford food as she is in so much debt. She relies on my money for food. She has a caveat on the house so the more she puts on the cards the less chance she has of being able to pay off her debt and they will take her house away from her. No i stay because i care about my mother.

You NEED to cut her off, Tara. I think at this point you are just enabling her behavior, she seems like one of those people who will have to hit rock bottom before she gets better. It may seem cruel but it is the only way she is going to change. I know given your personality type that doing that will be very hard for you to do, but you need to.

She will starve and end up homeless if i leave.

Like I said, her hitting rock bottom is the ONLY way she is going to change. you two have a codependency issue you MUST break no matter how painful it feels to "leaver her to the wolves", you need to think about YOU, not her.
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#76
Now you are just rationalizing your codependency, Tara.
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#77
Post #1111!

A couple weeks ago my brother and I took a trip to "906 Country" (the Upper Peninsula of Michigan) and paid a visit to Lake Superior. One thing I noticed as I stepped into the water (it was still warm enough for that) was the paucity of life forms there. This is very different from seashores worldwide, and even lakes in southern lower Michigan. Is the water too cold? No. There are much colder shores, and those (even around Antarctica) are rich in life. Fresh water? Nope. Small lakes in Michigan have plenty of small fish, mollusks, crustaceans, and of course water plants. Sure, there are no cnidarians, echinoderms, ctenophores, or some other sea-life phyla, but there is a rich ecosystem, probably having migrated from the Mississippi Basin when Lake Michigan was connected to the Mississippi River.

There just hasn't been enough time for evolution to take its course in Lake Superior. Lake Superior has emerged from the Ice Age only 8000 or so years ago, and has never been connected to the seas except through some difficult rapids. It has never been connected to the Mississippi River except by canals.

Evolution has not had time to create a rich variety of aquatic life in Lake Superior. But if God created the living things of the Earth, then why would He so neglect Lake Superior? Bingo! Evolution is real. It hasn't had the same opportunities everywhere.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


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#78
(10-07-2016, 02:32 PM)taramarie Wrote:
(10-07-2016, 11:35 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: Post #1111!

A couple weeks ago my brother and I took a trip to "906 Country" (the Upper Peninsula of Michigan) and paid a visit to Lake Superior. One thing I noticed as I stepped into the water (it was still warm enough for that) was the paucity of life forms there. This is very different from seashores worldwide, and even lakes in southern lower Michigan. Is the water too cold? No. There are much colder shores, and those (even around Antarctica) are rich in life. Fresh water? Nope. Small lakes in Michigan have plenty of small fish, mollusks, crustaceans, and of course water plants. Sure, there are no cnidarians, echinoderms, ctenophores, or some other sea-life phyla, but there is a rich ecosystem, probably having migrated from the Mississippi Basin when Lake Michigan was connected to the Mississippi River.  

There just hasn't been enough time for evolution to take its course in Lake Superior. Lake Superior has emerged from the Ice Age only 8000 or so years ago, and has never been connected to the seas except through some difficult rapids. It has never been connected to the Mississippi River except by canals.

Evolution has not had time to create a rich variety of aquatic life in Lake Superior. But if God created the living things of the Earth, then why would He so neglect Lake Superior?  Bingo! Evolution is real. It hasn't had the same opportunities everywhere.
I cannot believe that in this day and age we actually have to debate with people if evolution is real or not. We are such a primitive and new species. It is rather embarrassing.

...and I am using an ecological argument. Do you want to bet that these people who deny evolution cannot name five phyla of animal life?
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


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#79
(10-07-2016, 11:35 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: Post #1111!

A couple weeks ago my brother and I took a trip to "906 Country" (the Upper Peninsula of Michigan) and paid a visit to Lake Superior. One thing I noticed as I stepped into the water (it was still warm enough for that) was the paucity of life forms there. This is very different from seashores worldwide, and even lakes in southern lower Michigan. Is the water too cold? No. There are much colder shores, and those (even around Antarctica) are rich in life. Fresh water? Nope. Small lakes in Michigan have plenty of small fish, mollusks, crustaceans, and of course water plants. Sure, there are no cnidarians, echinoderms, ctenophores, or some other sea-life phyla, but there is a rich ecosystem, probably having migrated from the Mississippi Basin when Lake Michigan was connected to the Mississippi River.  

There just hasn't been enough time for evolution to take its course in Lake Superior. Lake Superior has emerged from the Ice Age only 8000 or so years ago, and has never been connected to the seas except through some difficult rapids. It has never been connected to the Mississippi River except by canals.

Evolution has not had time to create a rich variety of aquatic life in Lake Superior. But if God created the living things of the Earth, then why would He so neglect Lake Superior?  Bingo! Evolution is real. It hasn't had the same opportunities everywhere.

Because of that lack of life of you go to the shore of the lake when the wind is very calm you can see quite deeply into the water because it is so clear.
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My father is apparently dying. He's not taking his nourishment.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


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