Presidential election, 2016

[Eric the Green]

(01-02-2017, 06:47 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 06:10 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 10:56 AM)Danilynn Wrote: I have fairly good insurance, it was better before the ACA, both in cost to me and cost to my employer and coverage.

I'd probably not have the level of care I do now under single payer.

My issues with medical coverage and getting my health sorted out have more to do with there are 3 autoimmune diseases at hand that must be dealt cohesively. The problem, I have had is getting the docs to work together, each of the three falls under a different specialist. Which is why in less than 3 weeks I am heading to a doctor in a bigger city that deals with autoimmune disorders, and doesn't feel they should be treated individually. But works on the them all as the issue they are, autoimmune disorders that should be put into remission and balanced equally so that they can all be in harmony and the patient can have relief.

I'm going to pay dearly for this, this group of doctors has excused themselves from the insurance industry they neither accept or file it. They will give you forms to do it yourself, but they have no idea how much insurance will reimburse.  I am now fine with this set-up. I have seen how much the ACA has influenced care and insurance willingness to cover treatment and doctors.

I'm finally on Medicare, and I have literally unlimited coverage for almost everything.  I can't get cosmetic surgery to improve my looks, but I can for reconstructive issues.  In any case, I have a massive $166.00 annual copay, and the rest is covered , either by Medicare directly of through my Medigap plan.  It's hard to beat that.  If it was up to me, I would just change the Medicare law to drop the eligibility age from 65 to 0.

Show a better plan in the US, unless it's the VA which is also single payer.

You should be thanking us instead of attacking us and burning bridges. Right now, you are an election or two away from loosing the bulk of the taxpayers and businesses associated with the support of your system.

The appeal of your ideology is startling, but explainable in a country that has less interest in understanding facts and ideas than other countries. Slaveholders and hillbillies from the nation-wide Bible Belt still have much sway.

[Warren Dew]

(01-02-2017, 06:10 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 10:56 AM)Danilynn Wrote: I have fairly good insurance, it was better before the ACA, both in cost to me and cost to my employer and coverage.

I'd probably not have the level of care I do now under single payer.

My issues with medical coverage and getting my health sorted out have more to do with there are 3 autoimmune diseases at hand that must be dealt cohesively. The problem, I have had is getting the docs to work together, each of the three falls under a different specialist. Which is why in less than 3 weeks I am heading to a doctor in a bigger city that deals with autoimmune disorders, and doesn't feel they should be treated individually. But works on the them all as the issue they are, autoimmune disorders that should be put into remission and balanced equally so that they can all be in harmony and the patient can have relief.

I'm going to pay dearly for this, this group of doctors has excused themselves from the insurance industry they neither accept or file it. They will give you forms to do it yourself, but they have no idea how much insurance will reimburse.  I am now fine with this set-up. I have seen how much the ACA has influenced care and insurance willingness to cover treatment and doctors.

I'm finally on Medicare, and I have literally unlimited coverage for almost everything.  I can't get cosmetic surgery to improve my looks, but I can for reconstructive issues.  In any case, I have a massive $166.00 annual copay, and the rest is covered , either by Medicare directly of through my Medigap plan.  It's hard to beat that.  If it was up to me, I would just change the Medicare law to drop the eligibility age from 65 to 0.

Show a better plan in the US, unless it's the VA which is also single payer.

Medicare is very good with respect to giving you what you ask for.  That works well for people who understand what medicines and procedures work and what doesn't.  It is not so good for people who don't understand health and medicine so much; my mother, for example, is the type who wants the doctor to prescribe something, anything, and she at one point was on half a dozen different medicines mostly to counteract each others' side effects, each of which had other detrimental side effects.

Medicare is also extremely expensive, not to the patient, but to the taxpayer.  This is one of the two major reasons why, by international standards, the US has exceptionally expensive health care, the other being that drugs are more expensive here.

The VA is terrible.  The difference is that with VA coverage, you have to go to government run hospitals.  With Medicare, the government pays, but you get to go to private doctors.  Every veteran I know would prefer vouchers for private insurance.

[Classic-Xer]

(01-02-2017, 06:38 PM)Warren Dew Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 06:03 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-01-2017, 07:46 PM)Warren Dew Wrote:

(01-01-2017, 01:33 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(12-31-2016, 12:14 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: In this case, though, no one would have been hurt, if the administration had merely kept the policy of requiring proof of health insurance.  In fact, with Obamacare, they wouldn't even had to require proof of health insurance, since that was verified through tax law.

Instead, they used excessive regulatory enforcement to force people into employee status and take away peoples' control over their own lives, because the progressive ideal is to require everyone to live the way the government thinks they should, rather than the way they personally would prefer.

What insurance were you unable to use as a 'proof of insurance'?

You need to reread what I actually wrote.  I bolded the most relevant parts to simplify it for you.

In other words, you chose to fly naked, and got dinged?  Or am I missing something.

You're missing something.  Maybe I should have said, go back and read what I wrote, slowly enough to comprehend it.

Your not going to be able convince him that individuals have rights. Unfortunately, he's going to have to learn it the hard way.

[Danilynn]

I have a frame of reference for single payer and private insurance. As a veteran, I have used the VA, 6 month wait times for a specialist?! that is crap, utter bollocks as a friend of mine would say.

My insurance 4 years ago was covered entirely by my employer per month, and that covered my whole family, now since the full inception of the ACA, no family allowed on the insurance and my bi-weekly payments for insurance are around 150 every check, my employer pays much more. But the deductible is still better than anything available via ACA.

***still trying to figure out from one post if I'm the hillbilly or the slaveholder*** nice slurs by the way. try replacing those with slurs toward any other ethnic group and still see if they are socially acceptable, if not perhaps try not slinging slurs at southerners and Caucasians living in the south. neither was very nice, nor was it warranted.

[Classic-Xer]

(01-02-2017, 06:52 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 06:47 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 06:10 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 10:56 AM)Danilynn Wrote: I have fairly good insurance, it was better before the ACA, both in cost to me and cost to my employer and coverage.

I'd probably not have the level of care I do now under single payer.

My issues with medical coverage and getting my health sorted out have more to do with there are 3 autoimmune diseases at hand that must be dealt cohesively. The problem, I have had is getting the docs to work together, each of the three falls under a different specialist. Which is why in less than 3 weeks I am heading to a doctor in a bigger city that deals with autoimmune disorders, and doesn't feel they should be treated individually. But works on the them all as the issue they are, autoimmune disorders that should be put into remission and balanced equally so that they can all be in harmony and the patient can have relief.

I'm going to pay dearly for this, this group of doctors has excused themselves from the insurance industry they neither accept or file it. They will give you forms to do it yourself, but they have no idea how much insurance will reimburse.  I am now fine with this set-up. I have seen how much the ACA has influenced care and insurance willingness to cover treatment and doctors.

I'm finally on Medicare, and I have literally unlimited coverage for almost everything.  I can't get cosmetic surgery to improve my looks, but I can for reconstructive issues.  In any case, I have a massive $166.00 annual copay, and the rest is covered , either by Medicare directly of through my Medigap plan.  It's hard to beat that.  If it was up to me, I would just change the Medicare law to drop the eligibility age from 65 to 0.

Show a better plan in the US, unless it's the VA which is also single payer.

You should be thanking us instead of attacking us and burning bridges. Right now, you are an election or two away from loosing the bulk of the taxpayers and businesses associated with the support of your system.

The appeal of your ideology is startling, but explainable in a country that has less interest in understanding facts and ideas than other countries. Slaveholders and hillbillies from the nation-wide Bible Belt still have much sway.

Slavery no longer exists. Slavery only exists in the minds of blues and in the minds of blue recruiters like yourself today.

[Danilynn]

It's been nearly 2 centuries since Gettysburg and Vicksburg. Let it go. move the &^&%% on already. there are no slaves, nor slaveholders in America.

[Warren Dew]

(01-02-2017, 07:26 PM)Danilynn Wrote: ***still trying to figure out from one post if I'm the hillbilly or the slaveholder*** nice slurs by the way. try replacing those with slurs toward any other ethnic group and still see if they are socially acceptable, if not perhaps try not slinging slurs at southerners and Caucasians living in the south. neither was very nice, nor was it warranted.

This is why I just laugh when people like Bob accuse me of using "vile stereotypes" when I criticize progressives.  Yet he's fine with the outright slurs - as long as it's his side that is using them.

[Eric the Green]

(01-02-2017, 07:29 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 06:52 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 06:47 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 06:10 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 10:56 AM)Danilynn Wrote: I have fairly good insurance, it was better before the ACA, both in cost to me and cost to my employer and coverage.

I'd probably not have the level of care I do now under single payer.

My issues with medical coverage and getting my health sorted out have more to do with there are 3 autoimmune diseases at hand that must be dealt cohesively. The problem, I have had is getting the docs to work together, each of the three falls under a different specialist. Which is why in less than 3 weeks I am heading to a doctor in a bigger city that deals with autoimmune disorders, and doesn't feel they should be treated individually. But works on the them all as the issue they are, autoimmune disorders that should be put into remission and balanced equally so that they can all be in harmony and the patient can have relief.

I'm going to pay dearly for this, this group of doctors has excused themselves from the insurance industry they neither accept or file it. They will give you forms to do it yourself, but they have no idea how much insurance will reimburse.  I am now fine with this set-up. I have seen how much the ACA has influenced care and insurance willingness to cover treatment and doctors.

I'm finally on Medicare, and I have literally unlimited coverage for almost everything.  I can't get cosmetic surgery to improve my looks, but I can for reconstructive issues.  In any case, I have a massive $166.00 annual copay, and the rest is covered , either by Medicare directly of through my Medigap plan.  It's hard to beat that.  If it was up to me, I would just change the Medicare law to drop the eligibility age from 65 to 0.

Show a better plan in the US, unless it's the VA which is also single payer.

You should be thanking us instead of attacking us and burning bridges. Right now, you are an election or two away from loosing the bulk of the taxpayers and businesses associated with the support of your system.

The appeal of your ideology is startling, but explainable in a country that has less interest in understanding facts and ideas than other countries. Slaveholders and hillbillies from the nation-wide Bible Belt still have much sway.

Slavery no longer exists. Slavery only exists in the minds of blues and in the minds of blue recruiters like yourself today.

I beg to differ. Slavery defacto existed until the 1960s. Since then, today we still have racial profiling, the largest prison population in the world (with inmates available for work), filled with mostly non-whites, unarmed young black people killed by cops for no reason, staggering wealth inequality by race, which means wage slavery (a problem for people of all races due to the low wages and ridiculous jobs most people have today, especially young people). And there's a few who are actually slaves today too. And people who vote Republican in order to keep the established order going, in which these things are kept going. And we know where the Republican votes come from, predominantly. Sorry for harsh words; I'm not feeling too happy about it.

But thanks for calling me a blue recruiter. I fondly hope..... but not too expectantly.......

[Warren Dew]

(01-02-2017, 06:37 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(12-31-2016, 06:50 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: Great job mouthing progressive propaganda.  If people on the NHS liberpool care pathway didn't starve to death, it was only because they died of dehydration first.  In fact, hospitals never spent more than 10% of their money on emergency rooms, and I was happy to pay what effectively amounted to a small tax on my health insurance to subsidize them.  As for the NHS doing well, only in ratings that highly value "equity in outcome" - which is code for "a system where everyone dies at 50 is better than one where everyone has a 50/50 chance of dying at 50 or surviving to 70.  Me, I'd rather have the 50% chance of surviving to 70.

I can't locate the 2015 ratings, but I do have the WHO's ratings based on 2016.  Note the source is Canada, and they are trying to improve from their rating of 30.  The US is rated 37, just ahead of Slovenia and Cuba.  The UK, with their "failing system" is rated 18.  As is often the case, the French and Italians are at the top.  If you want more detail, here is the 2015 WHO World Health Statistics.  Start on page 90 (Section 4) and 114 (Section 6) to save some time.

Yup.  The WHO rating system is exactly the one I was thinking of that thinks a system where everyone dies at 50 is better than one where only half die at 50 and the other half survive longer.  WHO ratings on this are garbage.

[Eric the Green]

(01-02-2017, 07:34 PM)Danilynn Wrote: It's been nearly 2 centuries since Gettysburg and Vicksburg. Let it go. move the &^&%% on already. there are no slaves, nor slaveholders in America.

Maybe, but it's not been 2 centuries. Sharecroppers and blacks imprisoned for no reason and used for slave labor and terror lynchings predominated in the South until the 1960s, and today blacks and whites are still segregated there in many ways and live in an unequal society.

The world of 1935 had changed very little from the world of 1860 in Dixie. And the world of 1935 still resonates today.
http://www.ourmockingbird.com/

As Joan Rivers might have said, can we talk? We need to talk, says Bryan...
https://www.ted.com/talks/bryan_stevenso..._injustice

who says "I don't think we're free in America"
https://theintercept.com/2017/01/02/i-do...stevenson/

Aiming to confront and reclaim that history, the Equal Justice Initiative, led by civil rights attorney and author Bryan Stevenson, launched its “Lynching in America” initiative, a years-long effort to compile the most comprehensive record of racial terror lynchings between 1877 and 1950. The project includes a detailed report of more than 4,000 lynchings in 12 states in the South, including 800 that were previously unreported, as well as plans for a museum in Montgomery, and an effort to erect markers in the places where lynchings took place.

That the effort has so often met the resistance of local officials is, to Stevenson, just another sign of how urgently this public conversation is needed, as is an honest assessment of the ways in which the racism of the past endures today. Earlier this year, vandals once again shot up a sign marking the site in Mississippi where in 1955 Emmett Till’s brutalized body was found. In December, President Obama signed a reauthorization of the Emmett Till Act, which directs the DOJ and FBI to continue the investigation of cold civil rights-era hate crimes.

To Stevenson and those fighting to promote greater awareness of the nation’s racial history, this is hardly about history alone. Since the November election, the Southern Poverty Law Center has documented 1,094 hate incidents across the country. But as manifestations of the country’s persistent racism have multiplied, so have attempts to discount it. Shortly after the election, The Intercept spoke with Stevenson about America’s failure to come to terms with its racist past — and therefore its present......

[Classic-Xer]

(01-02-2017, 07:25 PM)taramarie Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 06:34 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 03:44 AM)taramarie Wrote:

(01-01-2017, 09:57 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(12-31-2016, 05:42 PM)taramarie Wrote: She is unable to work due to her condition and she has a son who has a mental disability. She is extremely poor and has a mystery ailment that needs a specialist to study what is wrong. Apparently she cannot afford it. Sir, my mother has overspent and on top of it put a caveat on the house. My situation is that i have to help pay off her debt so it is wise to get an understanding of my very individual circumstance which my mother put me in. It has nothing to do with our system and everything to do with my mothers individual greed. Sorry, but you seem to be covering yourself over with already preconceived ideas ad closing the door without knowing the full picture with regards to me. Ehem....perspective.

I knew about your situation with your mother. You've told us a lot about yourself including the situation with your mother. You've told us a lot about your country as well. I get the picture, so to speak. You given me enough of the picture to form some opinions and make some decisions. I'm a Republican voter. I've been told that Republican voters are very very rare in your part of the world.

Given you know of my particular situation judging my country on my situation is a poor judgement. Judge by what goes on for the majority, not just by my situation. Your comment, "Lady, based on what you've told me about yourself, I've got everything you dream about/talk about having some day. You're going to have a hard time convincing someone like me that your system of preference (government controlled) is better than the system that we prefer (individually controlled)." Tells me you are comparing my situation to your own individual situation. A silly comparison given we are both living different lives with a different past. If you were talking about the crap that goes on with the govt you may have a leg to stand on. But as you said, "Lady, based on what you've told me about yourself, I've got everything you dream about/talk about having some day.  You instead are comparing our lives. If you know of my situation it is silly to compare us. It is wiser to look at the wider human condition in both countries or preferably, state by state compared to NZ perhaps. Not by two people in two countries. You are not getting a wide picture that way. One thing you are right about is that Republican voters are not a thing here. Good that you are listening.

Who has a broader view, the person who knows the Republicans, the Democrats and the Progressives or the person who only knows two of the three? I've been comparing more than just our lives. Its silly of you to come back at me the way you just came back at me. You must not have been thinking. You must have been just going with your emotions.

Nope. I am basing what I say purely on what you said to me. "Lady, based on what you've told me about yourself, I've got everything you dream about/talk about having some day." Those are your words. YOU personalized it. The words YOU, YOURSELF and ME are personalized words. It is a comparison of your life and mine. Given you did not say that was a misinterpretation by me in that one comment to me that is what I have to go by.

You, your life, your situation with your mother, your experiences, your feelings expressed about America, your feelings about Republicans in general, your relationship with your government and its single payer healthcare system are all personal. How am I able to respond without getting personal with you, so to speak? You're trying to turn this into something more personal that it is. I've got/accomplished everything that you dream about/talk about having including health insurance without government assistance or a single payer healthcare system. Is that personal or a truthful response that you may or may not have been able to handle emotionally?

[Eric the Green]

(01-02-2017, 07:36 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: This is why I just laugh when people like Bob accuse me of using "vile stereotypes" when I criticize progressives.  Yet he's fine with the outright slurs - as long as it's his side that is using them.

Well, Warren, not always; give Bob credit where it's due. He just accused me, a "blue recruiter" according to Classic Xer (thanks again Classic for the compliment) of using a "vile stereotype" too, and when I admitted he probably wouldn't listen to me, he said "I ignore facts."

Lots to laugh about in all this though, I agree

[Classic-Xer]

(01-02-2017, 08:34 PM)taramarie Wrote: Btw Classic I express my feelings about Democrats too and it is not all peachy keen. When I see fault I vocalize no matter which side.

You've been fair.

[Bob Butler 54]

(01-02-2017, 07:36 PM)Warren Dew Wrote: This is why I just laugh when people like Bob accuse me of using "vile stereotypes" when I criticize progressives.  Yet he's fine with the outright slurs - as long as it's his side that is using them.

I quietly report foul language to the webmaster, both sides, but generally don't mention when I have done so. That would only provoke another round of flame. I consider foul language to be a different problem than straw manning and vile stereotyping. Foul language is the webmaster's problem.

Hey, progressives do need criticism. I don't know if you've noticed that I'm with the conservatives regarding rule of law, cutting down on regulations, and the 2nd Amendment. However, too many folk on both sides assume the other side has absurd motivations laced heavily with malice, stupidity, evil, greed or the like. As long as folks on both sides wallow in contorted thinking that gives those that disagree no credit or respect, any conversation is going nowhere.

Recently, I've been asking if folks can respect a desire to work towards Article 25 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. If it can be respected, how would one work towards it while not being unfair to any one group or another. If it can't be respected, why not? Crickets. No response. Instead, the discussion is about this and that poster's style of post. Why is person A's approach foul, while person B is doing fine? I'd as soon we get away from that sort of stuff, but it doesn't feel likely.

[The Wonkette]

(01-02-2017, 07:34 PM)Danilynn Wrote: It's been nearly 2 centuries since Gettysburg and Vicksburg. Let it go. move the &^&%% on already. there are no slaves, nor slaveholders in America.

It's only been a tad over 150 years, but who's counting?

[The Wonkette]

(01-02-2017, 07:36 PM)Warren Dew Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 07:26 PM)Danilynn Wrote: ***still trying to figure out from one post if I'm the hillbilly or the slaveholder*** nice slurs by the way. try replacing those with slurs toward any other ethnic group and still see if they are socially acceptable, if not perhaps try not slinging slurs at southerners and Caucasians living in the south. neither was very nice, nor was it warranted.

This is why I just laugh when people like Bob accuse me of using "vile stereotypes" when I criticize progressives.  Yet he's fine with the outright slurs - as long as it's his side that is using them.

That slur was posted by Eric the Green, not Bob Butler.

[Bob Butler 54]

(01-03-2017, 12:26 PM)The Wonkette Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 07:36 PM)Warren Dew Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 07:26 PM)Danilynn Wrote: ***still trying to figure out from one post if I'm the hillbilly or the slaveholder*** nice slurs by the way. try replacing those with slurs toward any other ethnic group and still see if they are socially acceptable, if not perhaps try not slinging slurs at southerners and Caucasians living in the south. neither was very nice, nor was it warranted.

This is why I just laugh when people like Bob accuse me of using "vile stereotypes" when I criticize progressives.  Yet he's fine with the outright slurs - as long as it's his side that is using them.

That slur was posted by Eric the Green, not Bob Butler.

Oh, I use the phrase often enough, and I've used it towards Warren.  I try not to use it simply when progressives are criticized, though.  It is a phase I use when someone badly twists and maligns the motivations and logic of an opponent.  I don't agree with every policy position of every progressive, and see us as quite worthy of criticism at times.  There is a problem though when we are perceived of as evil, insane, stupid or such like.  It is easy and appropriate to disagree with policies of those with different political inclinations, but it is a problem when someone thinks anyone who disagrees with them must have mental or emotional faults that renders them incompatible with polite society.  I can acknowledge and respect many of Warren's policy criticisms, but his understandings of the motivations of progressives seem absurd and loaded with malice.  Progressives are often equally ready to malign conservatives.  We are all too busy misconstruing each other's motivations to understand each other's motivations.

[Eric the Green]

(01-03-2017, 12:25 PM)The Wonkette Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 07:34 PM)Danilynn Wrote: It's been nearly 2 centuries since Gettysburg and Vicksburg. Let it go. move the &^&%% on already. there are no slaves, nor slaveholders in America.

It's only been a tad over 150 years, but who's counting?

As I pointed out on another thread, it's been far less than 150 years. Slaves just became serfs, working for the same owners; that is when they were not actually imprisoned for no reason and then made to work as prisoners, or thousands lynched for looking at a white man the wrong way as Emmit Till was. Bitter fruit indeed.

And is slavery really a thing of the past, when we have people of all races and ages working for too little while the CEOs rake in the dough? I don't think so; it's called wage slavery, and people of color are always still most likely to be confined to these jobs and to have much less wealth than whites. And what about racial profiling by police, shootings of unarmed young black people, and innocent people put away in prison by prosecutors who refuse to admit their mistakes? Again, most of the victims of these prosecutors are people of color, but by no means all of them. And the USA has more people in prison than any country; not only innocent people, but people locked away for drug dealing and such; again, disproportionately people of color. That's slavery, or worse. And segregation has returned, with black people often confined to specific poor neighborhoods and schools, especially in the South.

No, with all of that, we can say for sure that the USA has NOT come to terms with slavery; past OR present. And rural folks who vote Republican have no sense at all of the complicity of their ancestors or of themselves in all of this. Sorry for the "slur," but these people are acting the part. It's not all their fault, since all they are exposed to for information are Rush Limbaugh and Shawn Hannity and their local preachers; none of whom give them ANY information or show any concern for this issue; quite the opposite: they harp constantly on how people of color are lazy and steal their tax money for welfare programs, and that therefore they should vote for more tax and spending cuts. But, on the other hand, all people are still responsible for learning the truth, and seeking it out. And in this 2016 election, it's very clear that, on the contrary, people more-fully closed their eyes to these truths, and started us on a path backwards to the past.

I would say, to the extent that Americans, ALL of us, do not adequately come to terms with our slave-holding past and our unequal and unjust present, we are in that sense still "slaveholders." And voting Republican, as the vast majority of rural folks do these days out of habit and ideology, is the most frequent way (though not the only way) of NOT coming to terms with it. But it's not ONLY a matter of voting, but of reconciling ourselves to the truth, and taking some kind of action. And not belittling the problem, or saying it was solved 150 years ago. Democrats, moderates and liberals too.

We need to talk about injustice!
http://www.ted.com/talks/bryan_stevenson..._injustice

Bryan Stephenson is one of the most admirable and courageous heroes of our time. I respect him a lot for all he says and does. People like him deserve to be listened to.

[pbrower2a]

(01-03-2017, 12:26 PM)The Wonkette Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 07:36 PM)Warren Dew Wrote:

(01-02-2017, 07:26 PM)Danilynn Wrote: ***still trying to figure out from one post if I'm the hillbilly or the slaveholder*** nice slurs by the way. try replacing those with slurs toward any other ethnic group and still see if they are socially acceptable, if not perhaps try not slinging slurs at southerners and Caucasians living in the south. neither was very nice, nor was it warranted.

This is why I just laugh when people like Bob accuse me of using "vile stereotypes" when I criticize progressives.  Yet he's fine with the outright slurs - as long as it's his side that is using them.

That slur was posted by Eric the Green, not Bob Butler.

If anything we liberals need to break the habit, should we have it, of calling people "hicks", "hayseeds", "rednecks", "peckerwoods", and "hillbillies" for having a culture different from ours. We liberals may need their votes to make America good again, which is the most that we can ever hope to do after what looks as appealing as a four-year prison term to me.

I wish I had dual citizenship.

But just as I would not push Johann Sebastian Bach, a part of my culture, upon black people (even if his music is poignant and rhythmically-powerful), neither would I push his music in Appalachia. Multiculturalism, if it is to have meaning, must include respect for the home-spun culture of Appalachia and the Ozarks as well as of white cultural elites and middle-class minorities.

[Eric the Green]

Still with her: