Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Donald Trump: America's Berlusconi?
Odin,

I lied, it's in Origins after all.  Shows what I get for talking about the contents of books I haven't gotten round to reading yet.  Rolleyes

And I think it is still early to complain about Trump's competence, he hasn't even been sworn in yet.  Boorishness, general temperament, sure, but job performance?  Premature.
Reply
Tara,

Why did you feel the need to reply on Dan's behalf at all?
Reply
(01-12-2017, 10:28 AM)SomeGuy Wrote: Yeah, cable news in general (Fox, CNN, MSNBC, etc.) is pretty terrible in general.  Of course, I really don't watch it because I don't own a television.  Reading became my pastime of choice at a young age, and that is how I prefer to receive information.  My only quibble now with reading the news is that it necessarily comes through the filter of the author's perceptions and biases, and I have simply lost trust in journalism as a profession.

Berlusconi is at least a decent comparison.  These incessant "Trump is Hitler, no, Trump is Mussolini... He's Hitlerini! memes going around are the worst sort of garbage.

Cable news, only?  Nawwww, all MSM is just awful.   Here's a perfect video ...





Ah yes, the 1980's they were all just so fine, man. Cool
---Value Added Cool
Reply
Like I said, Rags, not only do I not own a television, I rarely watch videos on the Internet, either.

And the '80s were lame!
Reply
(01-14-2017, 10:40 PM)Odin Wrote:
(01-14-2017, 08:57 PM)radind Wrote: The comparison of Trump to Hitler and Mussolini is way overdone. I think that a better analogy would be Andrew Jackson.

Jackson was competent, the same cannot be said of Trump.

-- yes after almost 200 yrs that is how the majority of ppl consider him. During his time he was very controversial-- & to this day many lndians will not handle $20 bills. 

The Founding Fathers implemented the Electoral College to keep ppl like Andrew Jackson out of the WH, btw. So it has actually been irrelevant since the 1820s
Heart  Bernie/Tulsi 2020    Heart
Reply
(01-14-2017, 11:36 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Like I said, Rags, not only do I not own a television, I rarely watch videos on the Internet, either.

And the '80s were lame!

1.  I own a TeeVee, but it's my puter monitor. I watch youtube stuff 'cause there's no commercials.

2. The '80's.  I do have to disagree.  They were the home of some of the best music, ever. Big Grin
---Value Added Cool
Reply
(01-14-2017, 10:47 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Tara,

Why did you feel the need to reply on Dan's behalf at all?

Thought I was helping. It was the only iffy thing I saw. I looked at the other comments and saw nothing else questionable.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply
I agree with rags. Great music. Too bad I was too young to enjoy it back then.
1984 Apollonian Civic
ISFP - The Artist.






Reply
(01-14-2017, 10:40 PM)Odin Wrote:
(01-14-2017, 08:57 PM)radind Wrote: The comparison of Trump to Hitler and Mussolini is way overdone. I think that a better analogy would be Andrew Jackson.

Jackson was competent, the same cannot be said of Trump.

Trump is very competent at getting his way.  And anyway, he's got great people to take care of things.  Really great people.
Reply
(01-14-2017, 10:26 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: It just happened again!  Look, I appreciate the free ride I am apparently getting in your head, but this has been silly for a while.

Trump <fill in the blank>:

A.) Hitler
B.) Mussolini
C.) Andrew Jackson
D.) Berlusconi
E.) None of the above.

Whaddya think?

I prefer 'similar to'. None of these guys is really a perfect fit, though Berlusconi has the edge.  He's a modern, media derived narcissist; so is Trump.  You can argue political positions, but I don't really see that being nearly as important.  Neither was/is in it to create great change to his respective country.  They both seem to be primarily into self aggrandizement and wealth accumulation.  Anything policy related is almost accidental.
Intelligence is not knowledge and knowledge is not wisdom, but they all play well together.
Reply
(01-14-2017, 10:38 PM)Odin Wrote:
(01-14-2017, 05:08 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Seriously, Trump as Berlusconi, yay or nay?

I dunno, Silvio seemed more competent than Trump, but I'm not Italian. Also, Berlusconi wasn't a tool of a foreign power.

Berlusconi liked to trot-out his latest conquest, and having her less than fully dressed was a plus.  Not exactly a leadership trait, and one he shares with The Donald. A short story from the Globe and Mail.

I agree on the 'foreign power' comment, though it's hard to know if he thought of the Germans as 'foreign'.
Intelligence is not knowledge and knowledge is not wisdom, but they all play well together.
Reply
(01-15-2017, 12:53 AM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:
(01-14-2017, 11:36 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Like I said, Rags, not only do I not own a television, I rarely watch videos on the Internet, either.

And the '80s were lame!

1.  I own a TeeVee, but it's my puter monitor. I watch youtube stuff 'cause there's no commercials.

2. The '80's.  I do have to disagree.  They were the home of some of the best music, ever. Big Grin

What YouTube are you watching?  I get commercials all the time!
Reply
(01-15-2017, 10:30 AM)David Horn Wrote:
(01-14-2017, 10:26 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: It just happened again!  Look, I appreciate the free ride I am apparently getting in your head, but this has been silly for a while.

Trump <fill in the blank>:

A.) Hitler
B.) Mussolini
C.) Andrew Jackson
D.) Berlusconi
E.) None of the above.

Whaddya think?

I prefer 'similar to'. None of these guys is really a perfect fit, though Berlusconi has the edge.  He's a modern, media derived narcissist; so is Trump.  You can argue political positions, but I don't really see that being nearly as important.  Neither was/is in it to create great change to his respective country.  They both seem to be primarily into self aggrandizement and wealth accumulation.  Anything policy related is almost accidental.

Check the symbol again, Dave.  It's not an equals sign.  And I dunno, Trump has been banging on for mercantilist trade policies and against illegal immigration since the '80s.  That would be a big change.  Tax cuts for the rich, admittedly, not so much.
Reply
(01-15-2017, 10:39 AM)David Horn Wrote:
(01-14-2017, 10:38 PM)Odin Wrote:
(01-14-2017, 05:08 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: Seriously, Trump as Berlusconi, yay or nay?

I dunno, Silvio seemed more competent than Trump, but I'm not Italian. Also, Berlusconi wasn't a tool of a foreign power.

Berlusconi liked to trot-out his latest conquest, and having her less than fully dressed was a plus.  Not exactly a leadership trait, and one he shares with The Donald. A short story from the Globe and Mail.

I agree on the 'foreign power' comment, though it's hard to know if he thought of the Germans as 'foreign'.

Outside of the ERASMUS set, Europeans ALWAYS think of each other as foreigners.  They've hated each other long before the average man on the street had a real chance to hate Muslims, Africans, or whatever.  They might pretend otherwise these days, but you never have to scratch real deep for the truth to out.
Reply
If you want to talk about fornication, then there are JFK and Bill Clinton. But aside from that, those two were fine leaders.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


Reply
(01-15-2017, 02:36 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: If you want to talk about fornication, then there are JFK and Bill  Clinton. But aside from that, those two were fine leaders.

FDR, too.  Now Hitler, on the other hand, was a man of quite abstemious habits.

I am not sure that personal vices are a good proxy for political leadership (or lack thereof).
Reply
(01-15-2017, 01:42 AM)gabrielle Wrote: Trump is very competent at getting his way.  

So is a whiny child.  The similarities are striking.

gabrielle Wrote:And anyway, he's got great people to take care of things.  Really great people.

Who?
Intelligence is not knowledge and knowledge is not wisdom, but they all play well together.
Reply
(01-15-2017, 01:12 PM)SomeGuy Wrote:
(01-15-2017, 10:30 AM)David Horn Wrote:
(01-14-2017, 10:26 PM)SomeGuy Wrote: It just happened again!  Look, I appreciate the free ride I am apparently getting in your head, but this has been silly for a while.

Trump <fill in the blank>:

A.) Hitler
B.) Mussolini
C.) Andrew Jackson
D.) Berlusconi
E.) None of the above.

Whaddya think?

I prefer 'similar to'. None of these guys is really a perfect fit, though Berlusconi has the edge.  He's a modern, media derived narcissist; so is Trump.  You can argue political positions, but I don't really see that being nearly as important.  Neither was/is in it to create great change to his respective country.  They both seem to be primarily into self aggrandizement and wealth accumulation.  Anything policy related is almost accidental.

Check the symbol again, Dave.  It's not an equals sign.  And I dunno, Trump has been banging on for mercantilist trade policies and against illegal immigration since the '80s.  That would be a big change.  Tax cuts for the rich, admittedly, not so much.

For the comments in BOLD: Already noted as you can see.  On the rest, Trump is an enigma.  He says what sells today.  That's not exactly a reliable marker
Intelligence is not knowledge and knowledge is not wisdom, but they all play well together.
Reply
Quote:For the comments in BOLD: Already noted as you can see.

Ah, I see where you were going with that now.  My apologies.
Quote:On the rest, Trump is an enigma.  He says what sells today.  That's not exactly a reliable marker

Not necessarily indicative of anything, other than a knack for retail politics.  I am reminded of a comment made by one Clare Booth Luce to speak of FDR:

Quote:"Every great leader had his typical gesture.  Hitler the upraised arm, Churchill the V sign.  Roosevelt?"  She licked her index finger and raised it to the wind.

Again, not saying the one is all that similar to the other, just that most of the complaints here could just as easily be (and, at the time, in certain circles, were) made of both.
Reply
OK --

Juan Peron
Roberto d'Aubuissson
Ferdinand Marcos
Rafael Trujillo
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist  but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.


Reply


Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  [split] Prominent Republicans call for Donald Trump to drop out of the nomination Bronsin 27 9,390 10-18-2016, 01:36 PM
Last Post: Webmaster

Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)