If The Russians Engineered a Trump Victory

[Eric the Green]

(06-28-2017, 11:56 AM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:

(06-28-2017, 02:22 AM)Galen Wrote:

(06-27-2017, 06:55 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote: And now a distraction on the other side.   The Republicans said today, "Medicare needs to be cut' cause there's deadbeats on it.
Nope, lots of   working poor need it, cause salaries ain't what they used to be.   The GOP is living in the past, man.

There is still that small matter of 20 trillion debt and over 150 trillion in unfunded liabilities to be dealt with.  Remember Gary North's pie chart of federal spending.  Entitlement spending will decrease in real terms no matter who is running the show.  Same for defense spending.

The debt/deficit can be relieved somewhat with.

1. Cut MIC spending by 60%
2. fix SS by popping the cap.
3. Have a top income tax bracket for those with over $1,000,000.
4. Fix drug patent laws such that pay to delay [competition] is forbidden.
5. A law where medical providers must provide their costs for service. I do not know how much a one night hospital stay will run. Also, each medical code needs to be deciphered , translated into English and a price for them as well.
6. If the above isn't enough then have a VAT to pay off the balance.

Yes, not too many things are free. However, I categorize health care as a public good since the ability to pay happens to be a lot of times less than the price of the goods and services. That is also why natural monopolies need regulations. No ideology has all of the answers.

Unfunded liabilities.  Yes, most of these are pension related. These should be modified such that new entrants get a 401K, which must be funded yearly. The actual deficient part should be adjusted such that the payouts are based on yearly catch payments cojoined with converting the existing employees' pension to a 401K. The payouts would be reduced say on age.
Of course nobody will like Rags' pension reform idea.  However, the fact remains, lots of public pensions are defacto bankrupt.
[That is to say, the amount owed is much greater than what can be paid.  As for SS, ideally, popping the cap and if that doesn't get there, I'm OK with means testing the thing. Medicare, well let's just combine all other health programs into Medicare. Next, see the stuff numbered above. The main problem in the US wrt healthcare is that it's overpriced. If there are regulations that prop up prices, they should go. An example is the prohibition on selling health insurance across state lines. Ideally folks would just buy health insurance for extra stuff that Medicare does not provide. The prohibition of access to drugs sold in Canada, India, etc. also needs to go.

Good ideas, Mr. Rags. Who knows, maybe with some of them we can prevent an American Ragnarok

[Galen]

(06-28-2017, 06:55 AM)Odin Wrote:

(06-27-2017, 03:47 AM)Galen Wrote: Project Veritas strikes again and shows us how useless the MSM is.  More to the point even CNN knows there is no evidence backing up their Russia narrative.

You're a fucking moron if you believe anything put put by James O'Keefe.

Why is this?  The video is pretty clear and he does leave the context of the conversation in the video which is very important.  Here is another CNN personality saying much the same thing.  Judging from how little evidence has shown up in other places, including Congress, it looks like Veritas is getting is right.





Odin, it is pretty clear what this guy is saying as well.

[Odin]

(06-28-2017, 11:56 AM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:

(06-28-2017, 02:22 AM)Galen Wrote:

(06-27-2017, 06:55 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote: And now a distraction on the other side.   The Republicans said today, "Medicare needs to be cut' cause there's deadbeats on it.
Nope, lots of   working poor need it, cause salaries ain't what they used to be.   The GOP is living in the past, man.

There is still that small matter of 20 trillion debt and over 150 trillion in unfunded liabilities to be dealt with.  Remember Gary North's pie chart of federal spending.  Entitlement spending will decrease in real terms no matter who is running the show.  Same for defense spending.

The debt/deficit can be relieved somewhat with.

1. Cut MIC spending by 60%
2. fix SS by popping the cap.
3. Have a top income tax bracket for those with over $1,000,000.
4. Fix drug patent laws such that pay to delay [competition] is forbidden.
5. A law where medical providers must provide their costs for service. I do not know how much a one night hospital stay will run. Also, each medical code needs to be deciphered , translated into English and a price for them as well.
6. If the above isn't enough then have a VAT to pay off the balance.

Yes, not too many things are free. However, I categorize health care as a public good since the ability to pay happens to be a lot of times less than the price of the goods and services. That is also why natural monopolies need regulations. No ideology has all of the answers.

Unfunded liabilities.  Yes, most of these are pension related. These should be modified such that new entrants get a 401K, which must be funded yearly. The actual deficient part should be adjusted such that the payouts are based on yearly catch payments cojoined with converting the existing employees' pension to a 401K. The payouts would be reduced say on age.
Of course nobody will like Rags' pension reform idea.  However, the fact remains, lots of public pensions are defacto bankrupt.
[That is to say, the amount owed is much greater than what can be paid.  As for SS, ideally, popping the cap and if that doesn't get there, I'm OK with means testing the thing. Medicare, well let's just combine all other health programs into Medicare. Next, see the stuff numbered above. The main problem in the US wrt healthcare is that it's overpriced. If there are regulations that prop up prices, they should go. An example is the prohibition on selling health insurance across state lines. Ideally folks would just buy health insurance for extra stuff that Medicare does not provide. The prohibition of access to drugs sold in Canada, India, etc. also needs to go.

I agree with all of this except for means-testing SS. The reason SS is so popular and has become the political "third rail" is exactly because it isn't means-tested, so it can't be spun as "welfare".

One issue that needs to be talked about that I think both inflates healthcare costs and causes people to knee-jerkingly oppose universal healthcare is that people do not want to admit that there is only so much time and money to go around and that doctors and hospitals have to make priorities. If you dare bring this up people start screaming psychotically about "OMG GOVERNMENT RATIONING!!!" and "DEATH PANELS RUN BY GOVERNMENT BUREAUCRATS!!!".

[Odin]

(06-29-2017, 03:27 AM)Galen Wrote:

(06-28-2017, 06:55 AM)Odin Wrote:

(06-27-2017, 03:47 AM)Galen Wrote: Project Veritas strikes again and shows us how useless the MSM is.  More to the point even CNN knows there is no evidence backing up their Russia narrative.

You're a fucking moron if you believe anything put put by James O'Keefe.

Why is this?  The video is pretty clear and he does leave the context of the conversation in the video which is very important.  Here is another CNN personality saying much the same thing.  Judging from how little evidence has shown up in other places, including Congress, it looks like Veritas is getting is right.

Odin, it is pretty clear what this guy is saying as well.

Right, and I'm sure you believe O'Keefe was telling the truth about ACORN, too.

You're a complete tool.

[Odin]

CNN shines in 'Russian Connection' special.

I think I found the real reason for the current wave of anti-CNN propaganda by the Trumpers.

[Odin]

Also, Van Jones is a progressive activist mostly concerned about domestic issues and he was saying that in his opinion the media circus around the Russia investigation was distracting from other issues. Project Veritas took his statement out of context to make it look like he was saying the investigation itself was BS.

[pbrower2a]

(06-29-2017, 07:51 AM)Odin Wrote: Also, Van Jones is a progressive activist mostly concerned about domestic issues and he was saying that in his opinion the media circus around the Russia investigation was distracting from other issues. Project Veritas took his statement out of context to make it look like he was saying the investigation itself was BS.

Media that suck up to President Trump remind me of the "Corpo" newspapers in Sinclair Lewis' It Can't Happen Here.  It has happened here, and Donald Trump is "Buzz Windrip".

[Eric the Green]

(06-29-2017, 06:34 AM)Odin Wrote: I agree with all of this except for means-testing SS. The reason SS is so popular and has become the political "third rail" is exactly because it isn't means-tested, so it can't be spun as "welfare".

I agree with that.

[David Horn]

(06-28-2017, 02:22 AM)Galen Wrote:

(06-27-2017, 06:55 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote: And now a distraction on the other side.   The Republicans said today, "Medicare needs to be cut' cause there's deadbeats on it.
Nope, lots of   working poor need it, cause salaries ain't what they used to be.   The GOP is living in the past, man.

There is still that small matter of 20 trillion debt and over 150 trillion in unfunded liabilities to be dealt with.  Remember Gary North's pie chart of federal spending.  Entitlement spending will decrease in real terms no matter who is running the show.  Same for defense spending.

I guess you assume that tax revenue will be either non-existent or stagnant at the very least.

[David Horn]

(06-29-2017, 06:34 AM)Odin Wrote: One issue that needs to be talked about that I think both inflates healthcare costs and causes people to knee-jerkingly oppose universal healthcare is that people do not want to admit that there is only so much time and money to go around and that doctors and hospitals have to make priorities. If you dare bring this up people start screaming psychotically about "OMG GOVERNMENT RATIONING!!!" and "DEATH PANELS RUN BY GOVERNMENT BUREAUCRATS!!!".

Of course, other countries with universal care seem to have little to no difficulty with this.  They also get much better results from their systems at dramatically less cost.

[Ragnarök_62]

(06-29-2017, 03:26 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(06-28-2017, 02:22 AM)Galen Wrote:

(06-27-2017, 06:55 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote: And now a distraction on the other side.   The Republicans said today, "Medicare needs to be cut' cause there's deadbeats on it.
Nope, lots of   working poor need it, cause salaries ain't what they used to be.   The GOP is living in the past, man.

There is still that small matter of 20 trillion debt and over 150 trillion in unfunded liabilities to be dealt with.  Remember Gary North's pie chart of federal spending.  Entitlement spending will decrease in real terms no matter who is running the show.  Same for defense spending.

I guess you assume that tax revenue will be either non-existent or stagnant at the very least.

No. It's my herd the cats allowance.  Like the prior post alludes to, the stakeholders are
1. Pensioners.
2. Current employees + union if present.
3. Tax payers.
4. Current bondholders.

You add in that said cats will all have to take some sort of haircut. So, see how hard it is to actually implement something that does not kick the can down the road and thus makes the problem worse at such point. I also assume the probability for a cat fight is quite high. One can think of the cost difference/allowance shall be virtual cat mint to keep the aforementioned cat fight half way sane. by virtual cat mint, I mean reducing the hair cut in exchange for the stakeholder accepting the total package.

[Odin]

WSJ: GOP Operative Sought Clinton Emails From Hackers, Implied a Connection to Flynn

Quote:WASHINGTON—Before the 2016 presidential election, a longtime Republican opposition researcher mounted an independent campaign to obtain emails he believed were stolen from Hillary Clinton’s private server, likely by Russian hackers.

In conversations with members of his circle and with others he tried to recruit to help him, the GOP operative, Peter W. Smith, implied he was working with retired Lt. Gen. Mike Flynn, at the time a senior adviser to then-candidate Donald Trump.

“He said, ‘I’m talking to Michael Flynn about this—if you find anything, can you let me know?’” said Eric York, a computer-security expert from Atlanta who searched hacker forums on Mr. Smith’s behalf for people who might have access to the emails.

Emails written by Mr. Smith and one of his associates show that his small group considered Mr. Flynn and his consulting company, Flynn Intel Group, to be allies in their quest.

What role, if any, Mr. Flynn may have played in Mr. Smith’s project is unclear. In an interview with The Wall Street Journal, Mr. Smith said he knew Mr. Flynn, but he never stated that Mr. Flynn was involved.

Mr. Flynn didn’t respond to requests for comment.

A Trump campaign official said that Mr. Smith didn’t work for the campaign, and that if Mr. Flynn coordinated with him in any way, it would have been in his capacity as a private individual. The White House declined to comment.

Special Counsel Robert Mueller is investigating Russian attempts to sway the U.S. election and whether there was collusion between Russians and the Trump campaign. President Trump has denied any collusion and called the investigation a “witch hunt.” The Russian government has denied it interfered in the election.

Mr. Smith died at age 81 on May 14, which was about 10 days after the Journal interviewed him. His account of the email search is believed to be his only public comment on it.

The operation Mr. Smith described is consistent with information that has been examined by U.S. investigators probing Russian interference in the elections.

Those investigators have examined reports from intelligence agencies that describe Russian hackers discussing how to obtain emails from Mrs. Clinton’s server and then transmit them to Mr. Flynn via an intermediary, according to U.S. officials with knowledge of the intelligence.

It isn’t clear who that intermediary might have been or whether Mr. Smith’s operation was the one allegedly under discussion by the Russian hackers. The reports were compiled during the same period when Mr. Smith’s group was operating, according to the officials.

Mr. Smith said he worked independently and wasn’t part of the Trump campaign.

His project began over Labor Day weekend 2016 when Mr. Smith, a private-equity executive from Chicago active in Republican politics, said he assembled a group of technology experts, lawyers and a Russian-speaking investigator based in Europe to acquire emails the group theorized might have been stolen from the private server Mrs. Clinton used as secretary of state.

Mr. Smith’s focus was some 33,000 emails Mrs. Clinton said were deleted because they were deemed personal. Mr. Smith said he believed that the emails might have been obtained by hackers and that they actually concerned official matters Mrs. Clinton wanted to conceal—two notions for which he offered no evidence. Mrs. Clinton gave the State Department tens of thousands of emails related to official business.

Former Federal Bureau of Investigation Director James Comey said in July 2016 there was no evidence the private server had been hacked but held out the possibility it could have been.

In the interview with the Journal, Mr. Smith said he and his colleagues found five groups of hackers who claimed to possess Mrs. Clinton’s deleted emails, including two groups he determined were Russians.

“We knew the people who had these were probably around the Russian government,” Mr. Smith said.

U.S. intelligence agencies have accused the Russians of stealing emails from the Democratic National Committee and Mrs. Clinton’s campaign chairman, John Podesta, and providing them to WikiLeaks last summer as part of a multifaceted operation to interfere with the election and help Mr. Trump’s campaign. Mr. Trump on July 27 publicly encouraged Russia to go further and find the Clinton “emails that are missing.” Asked about that on Monday, White House press secretary Sean Spicer said Mr. Trump was joking.

Mr. Smith said after vetting batches of emails offered to him by hacker groups last fall, he couldn’t be sure enough of their authenticity to leak them himself. “We told all the groups to give them to WikiLeaks,” he said. WikiLeaks has never published those emails or claimed to have them.

Mr. Smith and one of his associates said they had a line of communication with Mr. Flynn and his consulting company.

In one Smith email reviewed by the Journal, intended to entice outside experts to join his work, he offered to make introductions to Mr. Flynn’s son, Michael G. Flynn, who worked as chief of staff in his father’s company. Mr. Smith’s email mentioned the son among a small number of other people he said were helping.

Michael G. Flynn didn’t respond to a request for comment.

In another recruiting email seen by the Journal, Jonathan Safron, a law student Mr. Smith described as a close colleague, included links to the websites and LinkedIn profiles of people purportedly working with the Smith team. At the top of the list was the name and website of Flynn Intel, which Mr. Flynn set up after his 2014 firing as director of the Defense Intelligence Agency.

Mr. Safron declined to comment on his email or Mr. Smith’s project.

In phone conversations, Mr. Smith told a computer expert he was in direct contact with Mr. Flynn and his son, according to this expert. The person said an anti-Clinton research document prepared by Mr. Smith’s group identified the younger Mr. Flynn as someone associated with the effort. The expert said that based on his conversations with Mr. Smith, he understood the elder Mr. Flynn to be coordinating with Mr. Smith’s group in his capacity as a Trump campaign adviser.

The senior Mr. Flynn was fired as national-security adviser in February after misleading administration officials about his conversations with the Russian ambassador concerning sanctions. Those conversations put Mr. Flynn under scrutiny by the FBI and then the special counsel, according to U.S. officials.

Mr. Smith said in the interview he supported Mr. Flynn’s efforts during the presidential transition to establish relations with Russian officials.

Mr. Smith said he never intended to pay for any emails found by hackers.

He said he understood the risk in publishing the emails himself. If, under public scrutiny, they proved not to be genuine, “people would say we made them up,” he said, and the whole project would be dismissed as a Republican hit job on the Clinton campaign. In the early 1990s, Mr. Smith helped publicize Arkansas state troopers’ claims that then-Gov. Bill Clinton had enlisted them to arrange trysts with women, an unproven allegation denied by the Clinton White House.

Mr. Smith’s views on Russian hacking were complex. While he said he believed Russians were likely among those who tried to steal Mrs. Clinton’s emails, he dismissed intelligence agencies’ conclusion that the Russia’s government meddled in the election to discredit Mrs. Clinton and to help Mr. Trump.

Mr. Smith was himself once a hacking victim. Emails he wrote about the 2015 contest to fill former House Speaker John Boehner’s seat were stolen from the Illinois Republican Party and then made public, in a campaign U.S. intelligence officials attributed to Russian actors. Mr. Smith didn’t dispute that Russia might have been to blame. He said he was unconcerned about his messages being exposed.

[Odin]

Van Jones: O'Keefe Video Is a Hoax.

Straight from the horse's mouth. You've been played, Galen. You are a complete and utter sucker.

[David Horn]

(06-29-2017, 06:23 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:

(06-29-2017, 03:26 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(06-28-2017, 02:22 AM)Galen Wrote:

(06-27-2017, 06:55 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote: And now a distraction on the other side.   The Republicans said today, "Medicare needs to be cut' cause there's deadbeats on it.
Nope, lots of   working poor need it, cause salaries ain't what they used to be.   The GOP is living in the past, man.

There is still that small matter of 20 trillion debt and over 150 trillion in unfunded liabilities to be dealt with.  Remember Gary North's pie chart of federal spending.  Entitlement spending will decrease in real terms no matter who is running the show.  Same for defense spending.

I guess you assume that tax revenue will be either non-existent or stagnant at the very least.

No. It's my herd the cats allowance.  Like the prior post alludes to, the stakeholders are
1. Pensioners.
2. Current employees + union if present.
3. Tax payers.
4. Current bondholders.

You add in that said cats will all have to take some sort of haircut. So, see how hard it is to actually implement something that does not kick the can down the road and thus makes the problem worse at such point. I also assume the probability for a cat fight is quite high. One can think of the cost difference/allowance shall be virtual cat mint to keep the aforementioned cat fight half way sane. by virtual cat mint, I mean reducing the hair cut in exchange for the stakeholder  accepting the total package.

Benjamin Franklin had something to say about that: "Either we hang together or surely we will hang separately."  This is the great success of the every-man-should-carry-his-own-water message the right has ingrained in the American psyche.  We're all cats now.

[Galen]

(06-30-2017, 07:47 AM)Odin Wrote: Van Jones: O'Keefe Video Is a Hoax.

Straight from the horse's mouth. You've been played, Galen. You are a complete and utter sucker.

Statement after the video was released versus a video of him giving a direct answer to a direct question.  The video has more credibility.  I find it ironic to have a statement about selective editing coming from CNN given their history of selective editing.

[Odin]

(06-30-2017, 02:59 PM)Galen Wrote:

(06-30-2017, 07:47 AM)Odin Wrote: Van Jones: O'Keefe Video Is a Hoax.

Straight from the horse's mouth. You've been played, Galen. You are a complete and utter sucker.

Statement after the video was released versus a video of him giving a direct answer to a direct question.  The video has more credibility.  I find it ironic to have a statement about selective editing coming from CNN given their history of selective editing.

Jesus fucking Christ, this is Sandy Hook Truther level "logic", here. You are a god-damned nutcase.

[Odin]

Matt Tait: The Time I Got Recruited to Collude with the Russians

[Galen]

(07-01-2017, 08:55 AM)Odin Wrote:

(06-30-2017, 02:59 PM)Galen Wrote:

(06-30-2017, 07:47 AM)Odin Wrote: Van Jones: O'Keefe Video Is a Hoax.

Straight from the horse's mouth. You've been played, Galen. You are a complete and utter sucker.

Statement after the video was released versus a video of him giving a direct answer to a direct question.  The video has more credibility.  I find it ironic to have a statement about selective editing coming from CNN given their history of selective editing.

Jesus fucking Christ, this is Sandy Hook Truther level "logic", here. You are a god-damned nutcase.

Interesting because that is how I regard you.

[Odin]

(07-01-2017, 09:33 PM)Galen Wrote: Interesting because that is how I regard you.

I'm not the one who clearly has some underlying pathological trust issues.

[pbrower2a]

“To understand the scale of the hacking attempts against election systems in the 2016 presidential election, consider South Carolina,” the Wall Street Journal reports.

“On Election Day alone, there were nearly 150,000 attempts to penetrate the state’s voter-registration system, according to a post-election report by the South Carolina State Election Commission.”

“And South Carolina wasn’t even a competitive state. If hackers were that persistent against a state that President Donald Trump won comfortably, with 54.9% of the vote, it suggests they may have targeted political swing states even more.”

https://politicalwire.com/2017/07/16/sou...n-hacking/

We may have not had a free and fair election for president, Senate seats, and the House in 2016.