Election 2018

[Eric the Green]

(11-07-2018, 01:42 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 01:22 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: As soon as possible -- could anyone get a generational distribution of persons in high political office?

I don't see a bunch of geezers being defeated to be replaced by younger pols (X and Millennial) -- yet.

The problem here is one of long duration.  The Dems have most of the same leaders today they had 20 years ago.  The GOP is trending that way too.  The only fix for that would be a massive election wave based on age rather than philosophy.  It's possible, but not anytime soon.

Unfortunately, as 2018 demonstrated again, young people 1) don't vote and 2) get older and then vote conservative.

[Eric the Green]

(11-06-2018, 10:25 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Well, at the least, President Trump has not consolidated dictatorial power. He has no ability to pull a self coup. Governorships have heavily turned D.

As far as I could tell, governorships only saw a small Democratic gain. Florida was a big loss. I need to check again though. 

Without Democratic governors and state houses, Republican extreme gerrymandering continues.

[Marypoza]

(11-07-2018, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 11:34 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: Yep.  The see saw has half flipped.  Neither party has enough reins to go crazy, excepting if the Supreme Court is stacked and gets the right cases to set some bad precedent.

Even then, the court is not likely to kill the political process, and righteous anger can trigger an all Blue election at some point in the future.  All Blue will equal a larger SCOTUS with a liberal tilt, and a reset on everything Trump, and any successors, have done to that time.  


At that point, we might just as well agree to separate or start the Constitutional process over from the convention onward.  The creaky system will be broken ... no fix will be possible.  I doubt I live long enough to see it, but I think it's in the cards.

-- it's possible this is how this 4T will play out. We have too many badass type weapons & WMDs to survive an all out civil war. A  cold civil war punctuated by the occasional skirmish between the authorities & & various resistance groups culminating in not just an all Blue election election, but a true blue election with more ppl like those 100 women who just got elected into Congress, ppl who will enact real change, so you can definitely tell that a 1T is on the way

[Eric the Green]

(11-07-2018, 02:13 PM)Marypoza Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 11:34 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: Yep.  The see saw has half flipped.  Neither party has enough reins to go crazy, excepting if the Supreme Court is stacked and gets the right cases to set some bad precedent.

Even then, the court is not likely to kill the political process, and righteous anger can trigger an all Blue election at some point in the future.  All Blue will equal a larger SCOTUS with a liberal tilt, and a reset on everything Trump, and any successors, have done to that time.  


At that point, we might just as well agree to separate or start the Constitutional process over from the convention onward.  The creaky system will be broken ... no fix will be possible.  I doubt I live long enough to see it, but I think it's in the cards.

-- it's possible this is how this 4T will play out. We have too many badass type weapons & WMDs to survive an all out civil war. A  cold civil war punctuated by the occasional skirmish between the authorities & & various resistance groups culminating in not just an all Blue election election, but a true blue election with more ppl like those 100 women who just got elected into Congress, ppl who will enact real change, so you can definitely tell that a 1T is on the way

There was talk of a Calexit. I certainly would approve, but California voters although majority Democratic are not very adventurous; they can be bought on propositions sometimes, as was the case this year. Cautious voters would have to be very fed up to vote to leave the union, which is illegal in any event unless congress approves. I suspect that might be the case in other blue states.

If red state voters can tolerate what Trump has done so far, and vote to oust senators because they voted against an unfit creep rapist reactionary for the supreme court, I wonder what if anything could ever sway red voters to vote blue and vote for "real change." 

We have to realize just HOW backward and fascist a country we live in. It likely does not change anymore, and they can't be persuaded to vote for leftist candidates like Sanders or Tulsi, whether male or female. Not in our lifetimes, or in those of our generation's offspring at least. What a sorry lot we are. Truly pathetic. That's why opposition to any Democrat is foolhardy. A corrupt, moderate, corporate Democrat is the best we can ever hope for to get elected.

[Marypoza]

(11-07-2018, 02:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:13 PM)Marypoza Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 11:34 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: Yep.  The see saw has half flipped.  Neither party has enough reins to go crazy, excepting if the Supreme Court is stacked and gets the right cases to set some bad precedent.

Even then, the court is not likely to kill the political process, and righteous anger can trigger an all Blue election at some point in the future.  All Blue will equal a larger SCOTUS with a liberal tilt, and a reset on everything Trump, and any successors, have done to that time.  


At that point, we might just as well agree to separate or start the Constitutional process over from the convention onward.  The creaky system will be broken ... no fix will be possible.  I doubt I live long enough to see it, but I think it's in the cards.

-- it's possible this is how this 4T will play out. We have too many badass type weapons & WMDs to survive an all out civil war. A  cold civil war punctuated by the occasional skirmish between the authorities & & various resistance groups culminating in not just an all Blue election election, but a true blue election with more ppl like those 100 women who just got elected into Congress, ppl who will enact real change, so you can definitely tell that a 1T is on the way

There was talk of a Calexit. I certainly would approve, but California voters although majority Democratic are not very adventurous; they can be bought on propositions sometimes, as was the case this year. Cautious voters would have to be very fed up to vote to leave the union, which is illegal in any event unless congress approves. I suspect that might be the case in other blue states.

If red state voters can tolerate what Trump has done so far, and vote to oust senators because they voted against an unfit creep rapist reactionary for the supreme court, I wonder what if anything could ever sway red voters to vote blue and vote for "real change." 

We have to realize just HOW backward and fascist a country we live in. It likely does not change anymore, and they can't be persuaded to vote for leftist candidates like Sanders or Tulsi, whether male or female. Not in our lifetimes, or in those of our generation's offspring at least. What a sorry lot we are. Truly pathetic. That's why opposition to any Democrat is foolhardy. A corrupt, moderate, corporate Democrat is the best we can ever hope for to get elected.

-- yeah Eric, & that's how we get corrupt leaders like Ms Nancy who won't change jackshit. Oh wait, your state spewed her corrupt ass up, didn't it?

[pbrower2a]

(11-07-2018, 02:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:13 PM)Marypoza Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 11:34 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: Yep.  The see saw has half flipped.  Neither party has enough reins to go crazy, excepting if the Supreme Court is stacked and gets the right cases to set some bad precedent.

Even then, the court is not likely to kill the political process, and righteous anger can trigger an all Blue election at some point in the future.  All Blue will equal a larger SCOTUS with a liberal tilt, and a reset on everything Trump, and any successors, have done to that time.  


At that point, we might just as well agree to separate or start the Constitutional process over from the convention onward.  The creaky system will be broken ... no fix will be possible.  I doubt I live long enough to see it, but I think it's in the cards.

-- it's possible this is how this 4T will play out. We have too many badass type weapons & WMDs to survive an all out civil war. A  cold civil war punctuated by the occasional skirmish between the authorities & & various resistance groups culminating in not just an all Blue election election, but a true blue election with more ppl like those 100 women who just got elected into Congress, ppl who will enact real change, so you can definitely tell that a 1T is on the way

There was talk of a Calexit. I certainly would approve, but California voters although majority Democratic are not very adventurous; they can be bought on propositions sometimes, as was the case this year. Cautious voters would have to be very fed up to vote to leave the union, which is illegal in any event unless congress approves. I suspect that might be the case in other blue states.

If red state voters can tolerate what Trump has done so far, and vote to oust senators because they voted against an unfit creep rapist reactionary for the supreme court, I wonder what if anything could ever sway red voters to vote blue and vote for "real change." 

We have to realize just HOW backward and fascist a country we live in. It likely does not change anymore, and they can't be persuaded to vote for leftist candidates like Sanders or Tulsi, whether male or female. Not in our lifetimes, or in those of our generation's offspring at least. What a sorry lot we are. Truly pathetic. That's why opposition to any Democrat is foolhardy. A corrupt, moderate, corporate Democrat is the best we can ever hope for to get elected.

I'm guessing that people who believe an account of some people barely out of the hunter-gatherer stage of economic and technological development as the accurate description of the origin of the Universe (roughly six days a little more than 6000 years ago) and claiming lifespans as high as 969 years for Methuselah (for which there is no other record) voted heavily for Trump's stooges.

I'm tempted to tell them to wallow in their superstition and psuedoscience, except that helpless children are involved.

[Eric the Green]

(11-07-2018, 02:38 PM)Marypoza Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:13 PM)Marypoza Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 11:34 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: Yep.  The see saw has half flipped.  Neither party has enough reins to go crazy, excepting if the Supreme Court is stacked and gets the right cases to set some bad precedent.

Even then, the court is not likely to kill the political process, and righteous anger can trigger an all Blue election at some point in the future.  All Blue will equal a larger SCOTUS with a liberal tilt, and a reset on everything Trump, and any successors, have done to that time.  


At that point, we might just as well agree to separate or start the Constitutional process over from the convention onward.  The creaky system will be broken ... no fix will be possible.  I doubt I live long enough to see it, but I think it's in the cards.

-- it's possible this is how this 4T will play out. We have too many badass type weapons & WMDs to survive an all out civil war. A  cold civil war punctuated by the occasional skirmish between the authorities & & various resistance groups culminating in not just an all Blue election election, but a true blue election with more ppl like those 100 women who just got elected into Congress, ppl who will enact real change, so you can definitely tell that a 1T is on the way

There was talk of a Calexit. I certainly would approve, but California voters although majority Democratic are not very adventurous; they can be bought on propositions sometimes, as was the case this year. Cautious voters would have to be very fed up to vote to leave the union, which is illegal in any event unless congress approves. I suspect that might be the case in other blue states.

If red state voters can tolerate what Trump has done so far, and vote to oust senators because they voted against an unfit creep rapist reactionary for the supreme court, I wonder what if anything could ever sway red voters to vote blue and vote for "real change." 

We have to realize just HOW backward and fascist a country we live in. It likely does not change anymore, and they can't be persuaded to vote for leftist candidates like Sanders or Tulsi, whether male or female. Not in our lifetimes, or in those of our generation's offspring at least. What a sorry lot we are. Truly pathetic. That's why opposition to any Democrat is foolhardy. A corrupt, moderate, corporate Democrat is the best we can ever hope for to get elected.

-- yeah Eric, & that's how we get corrupt leaders like Ms Nancy who won't change jackshit. Oh wait, your state spewed her corrupt ass up, didn't it?

That's how we got them. The people voted for them. Don't blame the people who realize just how backward the USA really is. Get your head out of the clouds. This is the USA. I wish it were better, you know that. But it ain't.

We don't know yet if Pelosi will lead the new congress. But she gets 90% of the vote or no opposition in her own SF district. There aren't many more progressive places than SF in the USA. And it won't do any good for Democrats just to choose a younger leader who is less effective and less liberal than Pelosi. And Pelosi was VERY effective when she had a House majority in 2009, passing good health care reform, a carbon tax and other progressive legislation, only to have it watered down by red state Democrats. Remember that too.

[Eric the Green]

(11-07-2018, 02:13 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 10:25 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: Well, at the least, President Trump has not consolidated dictatorial power. He has no ability to pull a self coup. Governorships have heavily turned D.

As far as I could tell, governorships only saw a small Democratic gain. Florida was a big loss. I need to check again though. 

Without Democratic governors and state houses, Republican extreme gerrymandering continues.

Wisconsin threw out Walker by a narrow margin, so that's one good thing. Ohio stayed red in its governor's mansion though, by 4%. I don't know when sanity will dawn in Ohio. But the three rust belt states that put Trump in the White House now have Democratic governors, and so does Kansas, a flip in a deep red state. Nevada went blue too. Georgia looks like it's going to stay in the claws of Trump corruption for sometime to come, and so does Texas. 

It's better, but scarely "heavily D." It's 27-23 R for now, with two of those R victories still not nailed down. And some of those R governors are moderates in blue states like MA, MD and VT.

The Democrats flipped about 350 state legislature seats so far, below average for a midterm. Democrats had lost 900 since Obama was elected. Six chambers flipped, and others got more purple. Supermajorities increased in a few places. Much more left to change. Republican legislatures and governors have done a great deal to purge voter rolls of ethnic groups they don't like, erect obstacles to their voting, and gerrymandered their districts to deprive them of representation.

[Classic-Xer]

(11-07-2018, 02:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:13 PM)Marypoza Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 11:34 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: Yep.  The see saw has half flipped.  Neither party has enough reins to go crazy, excepting if the Supreme Court is stacked and gets the right cases to set some bad precedent.

Even then, the court is not likely to kill the political process, and righteous anger can trigger an all Blue election at some point in the future.  All Blue will equal a larger SCOTUS with a liberal tilt, and a reset on everything Trump, and any successors, have done to that time.  


At that point, we might just as well agree to separate or start the Constitutional process over from the convention onward.  The creaky system will be broken ... no fix will be possible.  I doubt I live long enough to see it, but I think it's in the cards.

-- it's possible this is how this 4T will play out. We have too many badass type weapons & WMDs to survive an all out civil war. A  cold civil war punctuated by the occasional skirmish between the authorities & & various resistance groups culminating in not just an all Blue election election, but a true blue election with more ppl like those 100 women who just got elected into Congress, ppl who will enact real change, so you can definitely tell that a 1T is on the way

There was talk of a Calexit. I certainly would approve, but California voters although majority Democratic are not very adventurous; they can be bought on propositions sometimes, as was the case this year. Cautious voters would have to be very fed up to vote to leave the union, which is illegal in any event unless congress approves. I suspect that might be the case in other blue states.

If red state voters can tolerate what Trump has done so far, and vote to oust senators because they voted against an unfit creep rapist reactionary for the supreme court, I wonder what if anything could ever sway red voters to vote blue and vote for "real change." 

We have to realize just HOW backward and fascist a country we live in. It likely does not change anymore, and they can't be persuaded to vote for leftist candidates like Sanders or Tulsi, whether male or female. Not in our lifetimes, or in those of our generation's offspring at least. What a sorry lot we are. Truly pathetic. That's why opposition to any Democrat is foolhardy. A corrupt, moderate, corporate Democrat is the best we can ever hope for to get elected.

Hey, the liberal blues in Minnesota seem to be able to tolerate racist a black male who seems to have a REAL ON GOING issue with roughing up and mistreating women. I guess it must be OK as long as their skin tone is the right skin tone and their liberal views are the same and so forth. I dunno, I guess Keith Ellison should stick with Islamic women who are used to being treated like shit. You should send him an email and advise him to do that before he fucks up again and finds himself being removed from office. Yeah, he is REAL RACIST FASCIST PIG THAT CLUELESS BLUES SEEM TO NEED IN ORDER TO REMAIN IN OFFICE. I can't wait to meet my worthless blue Senator, Ann Klobuchar some day and call her a hypocrite to her face. Some day you have to realize just how much advanced, how much more free, how much more financially independent and how much more forward moving the rest of the United States is becoming.

Like I've said, you're issues aren't our issues and we'll be more than happy to stick you with all of them. The more you speak, the more I think bulldozing that wall that separates you from Mexico and the thousands/millions of poor fuckers Honduras sounds like a good idea. Dude, Trump's mean but I'd be a helluva lot meaner and much more cunning than Trump has been with you guys. You see, Trump is still interested and still trying to keep all of America together. Me, I wouldn't be all that interested in the idea of keeping all of America together. I'd be satisfied with keeping the bulk it together and sacrificing a portion of it for the greater good and the future survival of America. You see, I view the liberal blues the same way as the liberal blues view unwanted fetuses. As far as I'm concerned, the far left wore out it's welcome here a long time age and I view it as living on borrowed time and living off borrowed money. So, if you're lucky, you'll die before the progressive era of tax/borrow/print and spend comes to an ugly end.

[Classic-Xer]

(11-07-2018, 02:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:13 PM)Marypoza Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 11:34 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: Yep.  The see saw has half flipped.  Neither party has enough reins to go crazy, excepting if the Supreme Court is stacked and gets the right cases to set some bad precedent.

Even then, the court is not likely to kill the political process, and righteous anger can trigger an all Blue election at some point in the future.  All Blue will equal a larger SCOTUS with a liberal tilt, and a reset on everything Trump, and any successors, have done to that time.  


At that point, we might just as well agree to separate or start the Constitutional process over from the convention onward.  The creaky system will be broken ... no fix will be possible.  I doubt I live long enough to see it, but I think it's in the cards.

-- it's possible this is how this 4T will play out. We have too many badass type weapons & WMDs to survive an all out civil war. A  cold civil war punctuated by the occasional skirmish between the authorities & & various resistance groups culminating in not just an all Blue election election, but a true blue election with more ppl like those 100 women who just got elected into Congress, ppl who will enact real change, so you can definitely tell that a 1T is on the way

There was talk of a Calexit. I certainly would approve, but California voters although majority Democratic are not very adventurous; they can be bought on propositions sometimes, as was the case this year. Cautious voters would have to be very fed up to vote to leave the union, which is illegal in any event unless congress approves. I suspect that might be the case in other blue states.

If red state voters can tolerate what Trump has done so far, and vote to oust senators because they voted against an unfit creep rapist reactionary for the supreme court, I wonder what if anything could ever sway red voters to vote blue and vote for "real change." 

We have to realize just HOW backward and fascist a country we live in. It likely does not change anymore, and they can't be persuaded to vote for leftist candidates like Sanders or Tulsi, whether male or female. Not in our lifetimes, or in those of our generation's offspring at least. What a sorry lot we are. Truly pathetic. That's why opposition to any Democrat is foolhardy. A corrupt, moderate, corporate Democrat is the best we can ever hope for to get elected.

You need more foolish and dumb voters. Red America can help you out with that by simply passing a few laws or by simply cutting off some liberal funding.

[pbrower2a]

(11-07-2018, 09:56 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: Hey, the liberal blues in Minnesota  seem to be able to tolerate racist a black male who seems to have a REAL ON GOING issue with roughing up and mistreating women. I guess it must be OK as long as their skin tone is the right skin tone and their liberal  views are the same and so forth. ... I can't wait to meet my worthless blue Senator, Ann Klobuchar some day and call her a hypocrite to her face. Some day you have to realize just how much advanced, how much more free, how much more financially independent and how much more forward moving the rest of the United States is becoming.

Your 'worthless blue Senator Ann Klobuchar' is an obvious candidate to replace Donald Trump and start undoing the damage... quite possibly with Democratic majorities in both Houses. Only eleven Democrats will be up for re-election in 2020, and only two are from states that voted for President Donald Trump. I have every reason to believe that Doug Jones will go down to defeat if he seeks re-election because he is in deep-Red Alabama. The other is Gary Peters, who is from Michigan, which has shown itself hostile to the President. 2020 looks like a reverse-wave election for 2014.

Donald Trump acts as if the President has dictatorial powers and no accountability as (he thought) was true of Barack Obama. That is exactly what one might think if one does not know what the Presidency is. It is not a dictatorship. Someone with a fine legal mind like Barack Obama knows the powers and the limits and stays within the lines. Donald Trump is a bull in a china shop.

With a President acting much like a despot, our freedom can only be compromised. The  corruption of the Trump regime can only cause deterioration in economic freedom. He has done other, really bad stuff like mocking the handicapped, attacking the news media, and getting cozy with dictators. He gave the Master Class huge tax cuts and then stuck us with tariffs -- basically sales taxes on imports. For good reason America has gone away from tariffs.

Donald Trump is a Marxist stereotype of a capitalist. That is an ugly caricature.
 

Quote:Like I've said, you're issues aren't our issues and we'll be more than happy to stick you with all of them. The more you (Eric the Green) speak(s), the more I think bulldozing that wall that separates you from Mexico and the thousands/millions of poor fuckers Honduras sounds like a good idea. Dude, Trump's mean but I'd be a helluva lot meaner and much more cunning than Trump has been with you guys. You see, Trump is still interested and still trying to keep all of America together. Me, I wouldn't be all that interested in the idea of keeping all of America together. I'd be satisfied with keeping the bulk it together and sacrificing a portion of it for the greater good and the future survival of America. You see, I view the liberal blues the same way as the liberal blues view unwanted fetuses. As far as I'm concerned, the far left wore out it's welcome here a long time age and I view it as living on borrowed time and living off borrowed money. So, if you're lucky, you'll die before the progressive era of tax/borrow/print and spend comes to an ugly end.

I would love to replace our meth fiends with people escaping violence in Honduras related to drug activity that our addicts have funded. Those people are fleeing violence that drug money funds.

I do not consider meanness much of an asset in a leader unless perhaps a prison warden. A leader who acts harshly much of the time is rarely a good leader. Good leaders look for solutions that do not humiliate or abuse people.

So you don't want to keep America together? I would settle for citizenship in the Republic of Michigan  over subjection in an America that increasingly reflects Donald Trump and his despotic style.

[gabrielle]

(11-07-2018, 03:26 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: I wish I could have more faith in people in "Red" America... but at this point I see enablers of the most crooked, crazy, and corrupt political actors possible. That's politics, and it is true that politics alone can rarely solve anything.

Quote:Eric the Green

Horrible election. older whites vote, young people don't. Red states and counties in the vast heartland only vote for their guns, lower taxes and regulations, and religious dogmas.

My own state's voters ousted Democrat Senator McCaskill for the Republican Hawley, it is true.  But---

Missouri voted to legalize medical marijuana.
Missouri voted to increase the minimum wage to $12 an hour by 2023.
And they voted in favor of Clean Missouri (Amendment 1), a proposal which would attempt to resolve the state's gerrymandering problems by putting the drawing of districts in the hands of a professional state demographer, selected by bipartisan state leaders. All records about redistricting, including legislators’ e-mails, would become publicly available documents.  Amendment 1 also includes a ban on lobbyist gifts to lawmakers and a reduction on campaign contribution limits.

Go figure.

[Eric the Green]

Well congratulations on that, at least. Missouri is still held and run by Republicans; maybe that amendment will loosen their grip a bit. Sometimes as long as they can vote for immigrant bashing, guns and right-wing judges etc. at the national level, some Republicans can vote to increase wages and liberalize marijuana laws.

[Eric the Green]

(11-07-2018, 09:56 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:13 PM)Marypoza Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 11:34 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: Yep.  The see saw has half flipped.  Neither party has enough reins to go crazy, excepting if the Supreme Court is stacked and gets the right cases to set some bad precedent.

Even then, the court is not likely to kill the political process, and righteous anger can trigger an all Blue election at some point in the future.  All Blue will equal a larger SCOTUS with a liberal tilt, and a reset on everything Trump, and any successors, have done to that time.  


At that point, we might just as well agree to separate or start the Constitutional process over from the convention onward.  The creaky system will be broken ... no fix will be possible.  I doubt I live long enough to see it, but I think it's in the cards.

-- it's possible this is how this 4T will play out. We have too many badass type weapons & WMDs to survive an all out civil war. A  cold civil war punctuated by the occasional skirmish between the authorities & & various resistance groups culminating in not just an all Blue election election, but a true blue election with more ppl like those 100 women who just got elected into Congress, ppl who will enact real change, so you can definitely tell that a 1T is on the way

There was talk of a Calexit. I certainly would approve, but California voters although majority Democratic are not very adventurous; they can be bought on propositions sometimes, as was the case this year. Cautious voters would have to be very fed up to vote to leave the union, which is illegal in any event unless congress approves. I suspect that might be the case in other blue states.

If red state voters can tolerate what Trump has done so far, and vote to oust senators because they voted against an unfit creep rapist reactionary for the supreme court, I wonder what if anything could ever sway red voters to vote blue and vote for "real change." 

We have to realize just HOW backward and fascist a country we live in. It likely does not change anymore, and they can't be persuaded to vote for leftist candidates like Sanders or Tulsi, whether male or female. Not in our lifetimes, or in those of our generation's offspring at least. What a sorry lot we are. Truly pathetic. That's why opposition to any Democrat is foolhardy. A corrupt, moderate, corporate Democrat is the best we can ever hope for to get elected.

Hey, the liberal blues in Minnesota  seem to be able to tolerate racist a black male who seems to have a REAL ON GOING issue with roughing up and mistreating women. I guess it must be OK as long as their skin tone is the right skin tone and their liberal  views are the same and so forth. I dunno, I guess Keith Ellison should stick with Islamic women who are used to being treated like shit. You should send him an email and advise him to do that before he fucks up again and finds himself being removed from office. Yeah, he is REAL RACIST FASCIST PIG THAT CLUELESS BLUES SEEM TO NEED IN ORDER TO REMAIN IN OFFICE. I can't wait to meet my worthless blue Senator, Ann Klobuchar some day and call her a hypocrite to her face. Some day you have to realize just how much advanced, how much more free, how much more financially independent and how much more forward moving the rest of the United States is becoming.

Like I've said, you're issues aren't our issues and we'll be more than happy to stick you with all of them. The more you speak, the more I think bulldozing that wall that separates you from Mexico and the thousands/millions of poor fuckers Honduras sounds like a good idea. Dude, Trump's mean but I'd be a helluva lot meaner and much more cunning than Trump has been with you guys. You see, Trump is still interested and still trying to keep all of America together. Me, I wouldn't be all that interested in the idea of keeping all of America together. I'd be satisfied with keeping the bulk it together and sacrificing a portion of it for the greater good and the future survival of America. You see, I view the liberal blues the same way as the liberal blues view unwanted fetuses. As far as I'm concerned, the far left wore out it's welcome here a long time ago and I view it as living on borrowed time and living off borrowed money. So, if you're lucky, you'll die before the progressive era of tax/borrow/print and spend comes to an ugly end.

Ha ha. It is quite clear to anyone with a brain that the reds are the ones with the borrow and spend policies, and it's you reds who cut off legitimate government spending to reduce the impact of the great recession back in 2011 and replace it with the only stimulus you guys couldn't touch; the federal reserve print money schemes.

Bulldozing the wall is just fine with me, and putting up a wall around red America would be fine with me as well. More latinos just makes our state even more blue. I just think things will have to get pretty drastic for people to actually support dividing up America, but this is a 4T and anything can happen in the next 10 years. The ride will be bumpy; that much is sure.

As for Keith Ellison, you Republicans get all your sex offenders put on the supreme court and stuff anyway, and Republicans in southern CA don't care if their right-wing militarist representative is under indictment for campaign spending fraud, so I'm not too unhappy if Minnesotans returned the favor. And apparently the Minnesota state government flipped back to blue, so I'm happy you are stuck with them as well. You still live in a blue state, so keep that in mind when you consider what you want to do with California.

[pbrower2a]

(11-07-2018, 09:56 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: There was talk of a Calexit. I certainly would approve, but California voters although majority Democratic are not very adventurous; they can be bought on propositions sometimes, as was the case this year. Cautious voters would have to be very fed up to vote to leave the union, which is illegal in any event unless congress approves. I suspect that might be the case in other blue states.

If red state voters can tolerate what Trump has done so far, and vote to oust senators because they voted against an unfit creep rapist reactionary for the supreme court, I wonder what if anything could ever sway red voters to vote blue and vote for "real change." 

We have to realize just HOW backward and fascist a country we live in. It likely does not change anymore, and they can't be persuaded to vote for leftist candidates like Sanders or Tulsi, whether male or female. Not in our lifetimes, or in those of our generation's offspring at least. What a sorry lot we are. Truly pathetic. That's why opposition to any Democrat is foolhardy. A corrupt, moderate, corporate Democrat is the best we can ever hope for to get elected.

Hey, the liberal blues in Minnesota  seem to be able to tolerate racist a black male who seems to have a REAL ON GOING issue with roughing up and mistreating women. I guess it must be OK as long as their skin tone is the right skin tone and their liberal  views are the same and so forth. (redacted to remove offensive material) I can't wait to meet my worthless blue Senator, Ann Klobuchar some day and call her a hypocrite to her face. Some day you have to realize just how much advanced, how much more free, how much more financially independent and how much more forward moving the rest of the United States is becoming.

Leave that to the criminal justice system. As for Klobuchar, she could be the next President. I think she is very open about her agenda, and it will be a wholesome contrast to Trump.

Your dream is to make Americans more helpless against economic elites who can exploit and abuse people at will. The Right -wing dream is to intensify the concentration of economic and bureaucratic power while perhaps reducing other people to debt-bondage that is just a step above slavery. But it isn't slavery so a certain reading of the Constitution allegedly allows it.

Quote:Like I've said, you're issues aren't our issues and we'll be more than happy to stick you with all of them. The more you speak, the more I think bulldozing that wall that separates you from Mexico and the thousands/millions of poor (profanity deleted) Honduras sounds like a good idea. Dude, Trump's mean but I'd be a helluva lot meaner and much more cunning than Trump has been with you guys. You see, Trump is still interested and still trying to keep all of America together. Me, I wouldn't be all that interested in the idea of keeping all of America together. I'd be satisfied with keeping the bulk it together and sacrificing a portion of it for the greater good and the future survival of America. You see, I view the liberal blues the same way as the liberal blues view unwanted fetuses. As far as I'm concerned, the far left wore out it's welcome here a long time age and I view it as living on borrowed time and living off borrowed money. So, if you're lucky, you'll die before the progressive era of tax/borrow/print and spend comes to an ugly end.

I'll take refugees from drug-fueled violence (actually drug money supplied by American addicts) over our meth-sodden American scum any day. The Hispanic heritage in America is well-entrenched here, and it is largely positive. If you have children, then let me give my regard to your half-Hispanic grandchildren who will not like what you have to say. I don't know whether Hispanics more assimilate into the Anglo population or assimilate Anglos into theirs -- does it matter? It's a collection of rich cultures.

Breaking up America between 'red' regions and 'blue' regions is going to be nasty, just as in Yugoslavia. There are very 'blue' regions in Texas, including Dallas, Austin, Houston, San Antonio, and El Paso. A division of America into rural and urban areas due to politics makes little economic sense. Blue America needs Red America for food, and Red America needs culture from Blue America (such as Hollywood and New York City). A city like Chicago could not exist except for the rich farm product from the central US that flows through its port.

What you say about liberals sounds almost like a call for culling... sounds familiar and scary.

[gabrielle]

(11-08-2018, 01:56 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: Well congratulations on that, at least. Missouri is still held and run by Republicans; maybe that amendment will loosen their grip a bit. Sometimes as long as they can vote for immigrant bashing, guns and right-wing judges etc. at the national level, some Republicans can vote to increase wages and liberalize marijuana laws.

I don't understand why Missourians vote in favor of these liberal initiatives and then vote for people who will do everything they can to block them.  In a past election they voted against Right to Work, which was supported by the governor (now ex-governor) they voted in.  

I certainly see a lot of racism here, which came out particularly after Ferguson.  And the Kavanaugh hearings got some people very riled up, they see Kavanaugh as a martyr and I can only assume they believe that Dr. Blasey-Ford and all the others were lying.  And many of them like their guns, yes.

[Eric the Green]

(11-08-2018, 09:29 AM)pbrower2a Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 09:56 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 02:22 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: There was talk of a Calexit. I certainly would approve, but California voters although majority Democratic are not very adventurous; they can be bought on propositions sometimes, as was the case this year. Cautious voters would have to be very fed up to vote to leave the union, which is illegal in any event unless congress approves. I suspect that might be the case in other blue states.

If red state voters can tolerate what Trump has done so far, and vote to oust senators because they voted against an unfit creep rapist reactionary for the supreme court, I wonder what if anything could ever sway red voters to vote blue and vote for "real change." 

We have to realize just HOW backward and fascist a country we live in. It likely does not change anymore, and they can't be persuaded to vote for leftist candidates like Sanders or Tulsi, whether male or female. Not in our lifetimes, or in those of our generation's offspring at least. What a sorry lot we are. Truly pathetic. That's why opposition to any Democrat is foolhardy. A corrupt, moderate, corporate Democrat is the best we can ever hope for to get elected.

Hey, the liberal blues in Minnesota  seem to be able to tolerate racist a black male who seems to have a REAL ON GOING issue with roughing up and mistreating women. I guess it must be OK as long as their skin tone is the right skin tone and their liberal  views are the same and so forth. (redacted to remove offensive material) I can't wait to meet my worthless blue Senator, Ann Klobuchar some day and call her a hypocrite to her face. Some day you have to realize just how much advanced, how much more free, how much more financially independent and how much more forward moving the rest of the United States is becoming.

Leave that to the criminal justice system. As for Klobuchar, she could be the next President. I think she is very open about her agenda, and it will be a wholesome contrast to Trump.

Your dream is to make Americans more helpless against economic elites who can exploit and abuse people at will. The Right -wing dream is to intensify the concentration of economic and bureaucratic power while perhaps reducing other people to debt-bondage that is just a step above slavery. But it isn't slavery so a certain reading of the Constitution allegedly allows it.

I agree. That's the right-wing wet dream. It's also apparently true that red voters don't often know what they are voting for, or don't take their real interests into account when choosing candidates. They are moved by their prejudices to vote Republican, and yet sometimes vote for liberal measures if they can, as Gabrielle pointed out.

I think you might give my astrological system a look and some credibility. Empirical evidence counts. The system has worked. And it only indicates and points toward what we can know intuitively about candidates anyway. Amy Klobuchar does not have the points to win. Democrats need to get behind Landrieu, McAuliffe or Brown and quit flirting with local favorites or candidates who may be progressive enough but can't communicate and inspire. Only skilled candidates have ever been elected president of the USA. They must be the kind of candidate who can appeal to American voters as potential presidents.

Quote:

Quote:Like I've said, you're issues aren't our issues and we'll be more than happy to stick you with all of them. The more you speak, the more I think bulldozing that wall that separates you from Mexico and the thousands/millions of poor (profanity deleted) Honduras sounds like a good idea. Dude, Trump's mean but I'd be a helluva lot meaner and much more cunning than Trump has been with you guys. You see, Trump is still interested and still trying to keep all of America together. Me, I wouldn't be all that interested in the idea of keeping all of America together. I'd be satisfied with keeping the bulk it together and sacrificing a portion of it for the greater good and the future survival of America. You see, I view the liberal blues the same way as the liberal blues view unwanted fetuses. As far as I'm concerned, the far left wore out it's welcome here a long time age and I view it as living on borrowed time and living off borrowed money. So, if you're lucky, you'll die before the progressive era of tax/borrow/print and spend comes to an ugly end.

I'll take refugees from drug-fueled violence (actually drug money supplied by American addicts) over our meth-sodden American scum any day. The Hispanic heritage in America is well-entrenched here, and it is largely positive. If you have children, then let me give my regard to your half-Hispanic grandchildren who will not like what you have to say. I don't know whether Hispanics more assimilate into the Anglo population or assimilate Anglos into theirs -- does it matter? It's a collection of rich cultures.

Breaking up America between 'red' regions and 'blue' regions is going to be nasty, just as in Yugoslavia. There are very 'blue' regions in Texas, including Dallas, Austin, Houston, San Antonio, and El Paso. A division of America into rural and urban areas due to politics makes little economic sense. Blue America needs Red America for food, and Red America needs culture from Blue America (such as Hollywood and New York City). A city like Chicago could not exist except for the rich farm product from the central US that flows through its port.

What you say about liberals sounds almost like a call for culling... sounds familiar and scary.

Mr. Classic Xer seems like a cruel and demented person.

[David Horn]

(11-07-2018, 02:13 PM)Marypoza Wrote:

(11-07-2018, 01:38 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(11-06-2018, 11:34 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: Yep.  The see saw has half flipped.  Neither party has enough reins to go crazy, excepting if the Supreme Court is stacked and gets the right cases to set some bad precedent.

Even then, the court is not likely to kill the political process, and righteous anger can trigger an all Blue election at some point in the future.  All Blue will equal a larger SCOTUS with a liberal tilt, and a reset on everything Trump, and any successors, have done to that time.  

At that point, we might just as well agree to separate or start the Constitutional process over from the convention onward.  The creaky system will be broken ... no fix will be possible.  I doubt I live long enough to see it, but I think it's in the cards.

-- it's possible this is how this 4T will play out. We have too many badass type weapons & WMDs to survive an all out civil war. A  cold civil war punctuated by the occasional skirmish between the authorities & & various resistance groups culminating in not just an all Blue election election, but a true blue election with more ppl like those 100 women who just got elected into Congress, ppl who will enact real change, so you can definitely tell that a 1T is on the way

Demographics aren't there yet and won't be for at least 20 years … probably longer.  This is not a 4T fix -- not this 4T at least.  Live to see 2045, and you may get to see this as a 2T event.  If not then, it will have to marinate until the next 4T, if the cycle even exists by then.

[Tim Randal Walker]

I apologize in advance because I recall neither title nor author.....

Awhile back I came across a book in the public library which discussed regionalization in the USA. One point the book made was that some regions are much more socially conservative than others.

Radical social change came out of the (Blue version of) Boom Awakening. But if the voters in a region are socially conservative, I can see them sacrificing their economic interests in an attempt to hold back social change. Result-a cold (so far) civil war while economic elites take advantage of the situation.

This sort of conflict-social conservatism versus social change-may be a feature of a Dyonisus cycle. This may be less so for an Apollo cycle, given the focus on worldly, outer directed issues. For example, due to its economic focus (New Deal) the last 4T gave people reason to unite across the Red/Blue divide.

[Tim Randal Walker]

One conceivable possibility is that the USA may decentralize. We might see state lines redrawn. We could see semi-autonomy on a local scale, such as charter cities.

The catch is that Boomers-as part of a deal-may see their visions realized only in particular regions, or locally.