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(07-05-2016, 11:38 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: (06-30-2016, 03:14 PM)Cynic Hero Wrote: Hillary's willful negligence got and ambassador and several marines killed. The scandal is right up there with Watergate but the pro-clinton media is trying to cover it up.
Only if you believe that the President or Secretary of State can micro-manage every move that an ambassador takes.
I'd rather SecState be doing diplomacy rather than handling security myself. It's the Republican playbook with Clintons, though. If there is anything that might vaguely resemble a scandal, you make noise.
That this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom, and that government of the people, by the people, for the people shall not perish from the earth.
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(07-13-2016, 11:40 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: When people making huge incomes off sweetheart deals with the federal, state, and local governments; people making easy money as landowners and landlords while living off low-touch investments; executives being paid very well for treating subordinates badly; and shysters operating legitimized rackets (licit loansharking) go down -- that's when the economy works for workers instead of working for everyone but working people. But beware: that is an America in which our cities resemble Berlin in the summer of 1945.
While I won't disagree that things could get real ugly, I don't know that even Occupy and Black Lives Matter together could match the bomb carrying capacity of the Eighth Air Force.
That this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom, and that government of the people, by the people, for the people shall not perish from the earth.
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There is a tradition that former presidents stay away from Washington DC to leave room for their successor to take sole possession of the reigns of power. Naturally, assuming we do get the first female president, it looks like this tradition is going to be ignored. Obama has announced he intends to stay in the city until his younger daughter graduates from high school. And, of course, everyone is waiting to see what Clinton 42 does with the East Wing. First Ladies generally do anything they want with the East Wing. I'm not sure I'd let Clinton 42 have that much free reign.
What do you do with an ex-president? Is retaliation fair play? Do unto others as they have done unto you? Send 42 to Congress to improve health care? Name 44 to be Secretary of State?
Nah... Females are too insecure to allow powerful males near their center of power. 
That this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom, and that government of the people, by the people, for the people shall not perish from the earth.
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(07-13-2016, 02:35 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: (07-13-2016, 11:40 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: When people making huge incomes off sweetheart deals with the federal, state, and local governments; people making easy money as landowners and landlords while living off low-touch investments; executives being paid very well for treating subordinates badly; and shysters operating legitimized rackets (licit loansharking) go down -- that's when the economy works for workers instead of working for everyone but working people. But beware: that is an America in which our cities resemble Berlin in the summer of 1945.
While I won't disagree that things could get real ugly, I don't know that even Occupy and Black Lives Matter together could match the bomb carrying capacity of the Eighth Air Force.
Could. Another possibility is something like the French Revolution. Is the Millennial Generation as hostile to entrenched elites? Will it have a choice to be otherwise?
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.
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(07-13-2016, 09:25 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: (07-13-2016, 02:35 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: (07-13-2016, 11:40 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: When people making huge incomes off sweetheart deals with the federal, state, and local governments; people making easy money as landowners and landlords while living off low-touch investments; executives being paid very well for treating subordinates badly; and shysters operating legitimized rackets (licit loansharking) go down -- that's when the economy works for workers instead of working for everyone but working people. But beware: that is an America in which our cities resemble Berlin in the summer of 1945.
While I won't disagree that things could get real ugly, I don't know that even Occupy and Black Lives Matter together could match the bomb carrying capacity of the Eighth Air Force.
Could. Another possibility is something like the French Revolution. Is the Millennial Generation as hostile to entrenched elites? Will it have a choice to be otherwise?
I'm not sure about that. The Eighth and their companion units dropped a lot of bombs.
I also think that before the Millenials (and don't count out the other generations contributing) mount a full scale revolution, the ballot box will produce at least one truly radical president. If FDR's efforts hadn't worked I suspect there would have been a Communist insurrection.
Right now there is a lot of denial of the violence. A lot of willful disbelief. The shooters are described as lone nuts, troubled to insane, not a single courageous man of conviction among them. Playwright paints 'ammosexual' with a broad brush, and he is not entirely unrepresentative of how folks think about those who are turning to violence. Those using violence are sick and disturbed rather than seeing a sick and disturbed culture than needs to be changed. The notion that the People could use force to change the culture is sneered at. Thus, I feel safe in saying the spiral of violence hasn't really gotten underway, not when you compare it with the Berlin 45 photo above. I do take Berlin 1945 and Atlanta 1864 as examples of how bad things have to get before people will consider letting go of their world views, or might surrender to superior force and go along with the progressives, still thinking blacks ought to be slaves or that Hitler should have found a way to complete his plans.
Think about how we are talking past each other, not hearing what each other are saying, not comprehending the perspective that makes other believe so intensely the opposite of one's own opinion. What does it take to make someone with strong values change their mind about pushing their politics and world views? See Berlin 1945 or Atlanta 1864.
I really hope that some elected progressive president gets a Congress that can be worked with before we start comparing bomb tonnage with the Eighth. There seems to be time yet. The rejection of terror as a domestic political tool was very strong after OKC and again after September 11th. That could change. Right now, after a cop kills a black, or after a black kills a cop, the dominant message is "This has to stop." If the spiral was escalating, the dominant response would be to get a bunch of people together and kill enough of those other guys that they will be forced to back down. That's how a true spiral works. That's what it takes for a true 4T crisis transformation to resolve. Thus, I don't think the spiral is really cooking up yet.
We've had a few T4T posters talk about violence. Not many. I see it as possible. I don't see it as desirable. I don't think folks ought to get enthusiastic about a all out violent 4T crisis until they have some clue about what they are fighting for. Yes, we need to check the power of the elites. What does one want to do to check the power of the elites? I'd be tempted to start by never voting for anyone to takes corporate campaign financing, repeal Citizens United, and go on from there. Bernie had a fine agenda as well.
But before one tears down, before one starts thinking like the Eighth Air Force, one might want some real idea of what should be rebuilt on top of the ruins.
That this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom, and that government of the people, by the people, for the people shall not perish from the earth.
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07-13-2016, 11:14 PM
(This post was last modified: 07-13-2016, 11:16 PM by Eric the Green.)
Talking on the "in the stars" thread in answer to naf's question there, I have speculated about who Trump will choose as his veep candidate. I also think that which one Trump chooses, could influence which one Hillary Clinton chooses.
Trump can go for the safe, boring, neo-liberal and social-conservative choice that satisfies the until-now dominant right-wing of the party. That's Mr. Pence, who seems the odds on favorite.
But Gingrich and Christie are actively seeking the nod, and Lt. Gen. Flynn is being vetted. If he chooses one of them, that could be seen as at-least slightly boosting his appeal as a supposed "change agent."
Thus, Hillary would need to respond accordingly. If Trump goes to the right and picks the boring guy, then Hillary can safely do the same and go for the self-admittedly boring centrist Mr. Kaine. But if Trump chooses the fiery maverick Gingrich or Christie, or even the registered Democrat Flynn who's smart on foreign policy, then Hillary will have to burnish her credentials as a change agent and the inheritor of the Sanders Revolution, and choose Senator Warren; she is also someone who can match Gingrich or Christie in debates and on the stump.
The latter choice will also depend on who is available to run in a special election to replace Warren as MA senator. Ms. Coakley will not do; maybe Duvall Patrick would work.
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(07-13-2016, 10:40 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: (07-13-2016, 09:25 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: (07-13-2016, 02:35 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: (07-13-2016, 11:40 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: When people making huge incomes off sweetheart deals with the federal, state, and local governments; people making easy money as landowners and landlords while living off low-touch investments; executives being paid very well for treating subordinates badly; and shysters operating legitimized rackets (licit loansharking) go down -- that's when the economy works for workers instead of working for everyone but working people. But beware: that is an America in which our cities resemble Berlin in the summer of 1945.
While I won't disagree that things could get real ugly, I don't know that even Occupy and Black Lives Matter together could match the bomb carrying capacity of the Eighth Air Force.
Could. Another possibility is something like the French Revolution. Is the Millennial Generation as hostile to entrenched elites? Will it have a choice to be otherwise?
I'm not sure about that. The Eighth and their companion units dropped a lot of bombs.
On the two most evil of Evil Empires that ever existed. I doubt that we will ever get that bad.
Quote:I also think that before the Millenials (and don't count out the other generations contributing) mount a full scale revolution, the ballot box will produce at least one truly radical president. If FDR's efforts hadn't worked I suspect there would have been a Communist insurrection.
This time the only possible "radical" President that the ballot box could get us is Donald Trump. He will prove Radical Right if elected.
FDR saved America, and we may yet get an FDR-like leader.
Quote:Right now there is a lot of denial of the violence. A lot of willful disbelief. The shooters are described as lone nuts, troubled to insane, not a single courageous man of conviction among them. Playwright paints 'ammosexual' with a broad brush, and he is not entirely unrepresentative of how folks think about those who are turning to violence. Those using violence are sick and disturbed rather than seeing a sick and disturbed culture than needs to be changed. The notion that the People could use force to change the culture is sneered at. Thus, I feel safe in saying the spiral of violence hasn't really gotten underway, not when you compare it with the Berlin 45 photo above. I do take Berlin 1945 and Atlanta 1864 as examples of how bad things have to get before people will consider letting go of their world views, or might surrender to superior force and go along with the progressives, still thinking blacks ought to be slaves or that Hitler should have found a way to complete his plans.
We the American people are very much in denial about the unsustainability of our economic and political realities. Can we have this much inequality both of opportunity and result and get away with it? How long can we put up with economic leadership and political life subservient to such economic leadership intensifying the harshness of inequality?
People obsessed with violence as a solution are themselves sick. yes, that goes to the intended apex of power that some Americans seem to want. Donald Trump endorses political violence if it serves his political ends.
If we are fortunate we will have some revolution of the type that swept central and Balkan Europe in 1989 and 1990. Government by lobbyist, an inchoate form of tyranny, must go if we are to have a democracy. Maybe we will need the questionable solution of inflation to trivialize so much personal debt. Other countries (and America in the past) had the wisdom to make college inexpensive so that people not only had but saw the opportunity. So if we have plenty of well-educated people working on assembly lines -- well, that's how we get some really-good shop stewards.
Quote:Think about how we are talking past each other, not hearing what each other are saying, not comprehending the perspective that makes other believe so intensely the opposite of one's own opinion. What does it take to make someone with strong values change their mind about pushing their politics and world views? See Berlin 1945 or Atlanta 1864.
Some things really will have to go past us. So it is with ethnic and religious bigotry. Are you surprised when I laugh at people who push creationism or such pseudo-intellectual garbage as Afrocentrism or the junk history of David Barton? Some people believe stuff that is undeniably wrong. So if you have four cats in a house and call the dog in that house a cat, how many cats do you have? Four. No matter how vehemently you insist that the dog is a cat it is still not a cat.
Quote:I really hope that some elected progressive president gets a Congress that can be worked with before we start comparing bomb tonnage with the Eighth. There seems to be time yet. The rejection of terror as a domestic political tool was very strong after OKC and again after September 11th. That could change. Right now, after a cop kills a black, or after a black kills a cop, the dominant message is "This has to stop." If the spiral was escalating, the dominant response would be to get a bunch of people together and kill enough of those other guys that they will be forced to back down. That's how a true spiral works. That's what it takes for a true 4T crisis transformation to resolve. Thus, I don't think the spiral is really cooking up yet.
Do black lives matter? They must, lest America be debased. There was a time when black lives did not matter except in an accounting of assets of slave masters. But it is still a very bad idea to treat the police with anything other than deference -- and better yet, do nothing that will get one in trouble with the law. I can say that just as well of white dopers as of black 'thugs'. Remember -- without law and order, civil liberties, elections, and human rights are mere cant. As for Black Lives Matters -- when the Nazis or Klan confront them, they will be the first to want the cops in.
Quote:We've had a few T4T posters talk about violence. Not many. I see it as possible. I don't see it as desirable. I don't think folks ought to get enthusiastic about a all out violent 4T crisis until they have some clue about what they are fighting for. Yes, we need to check the power of the elites. What does one want to do to check the power of the elites? I'd be tempted to start by never voting for anyone to takes corporate campaign financing, repeal Citizens United, and go on from there. Bernie had a fine agenda as well.
I see political violence as an anathema. But when it happens, historical realities before the violence erupts usually suggest inevitability after the fact, much of that inevitability either outright cruelty, revenge-seeking, malign neglectfulness, or even the attitude "do unto others before they can do unto you".
Bernie Sanders still has a fine agenda. But does that agenda need him? Not really. It can stand on its own if someone else adopts it.
Quote:But before one tears down, before one starts thinking like the Eighth Air Force, one might want some real idea of what should be rebuilt on top of the ruins.
Considering the great destruction of such cities as Cleveland and Detroit without a war, and entirely due to economic collapse...
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.
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One pollster, Morning Consult, has polled all fifty states and Dee Cee and gotten prospective margins for Trump and Clinton. Unfortunately for this model it says nothing about Johnson, who will shape this race significantly.
In an allusion to a pop song of the 1950s...
"Don't know much their methodology
don't know much about their history
they sure give us strange geometry..."
WY: Trump +34
WV: Trump +28
AK: Trump +21
AL: Trump +19
LA: Trump +18
MS: Trump +18
TN: Trump +16
KY: Trump +14
OK: Trump +14
SD: Trump +14
NE: Trump +12
UT: Trump +12
AR: Trump +11
ID: Trump +11
KS: Trump +11
SC: Trump +10
MO: Trump +9
MT: Trump +9
ND: Trump +9
AZ: Trump +8
IN: Trump +8
TX: Trump +5
NC: Trump +3
ME: Trump +2
OH: Trump +1
IA: Tie
PA: Tie
FL: Clinton +1
NH: Clinton +1
GA: Clinton +1
WI: Clinton +2
MI: Clinton +3
NM: Clinton +3
NV: Clinton +4
CT: Clinton +5
DE: Clinton +5
VA: Clinton +5
CO: Clinton +8
OR: Clinton +9
MN: Clinton +10
NJ: Clinton +10
RI: Clinton +12
IL: Clinton +13
WA: Clinton +14
VT: Clinton +16
MA: Clinton +17
NY: Clinton +17
MD: Clinton +18
CA: Clinton +19
HI: Clinton +19
DC: Clinton +46
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.
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(07-13-2016, 10:40 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: (07-13-2016, 09:25 PM)pbrower2a Wrote: (07-13-2016, 02:35 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote: (07-13-2016, 11:40 AM)pbrower2a Wrote: When people making huge incomes off sweetheart deals with the federal, state, and local governments; people making easy money as landowners and landlords while living off low-touch investments; executives being paid very well for treating subordinates badly; and shysters operating legitimized rackets (licit loansharking) go down -- that's when the economy works for workers instead of working for everyone but working people. But beware: that is an America in which our cities resemble Berlin in the summer of 1945.
While I won't disagree that things could get real ugly, I don't know that even Occupy and Black Lives Matter together could match the bomb carrying capacity of the Eighth Air Force.
Could. Another possibility is something like the French Revolution. Is the Millennial Generation as hostile to entrenched elites? Will it have a choice to be otherwise?
I'm not sure about that. The Eighth and their companion units dropped a lot of bombs.
![[Image: Berlin45.jpg]](http://www.polyticks.com/photo/Berlin45.jpg)
I also think that before the Millenials (and don't count out the other generations contributing) mount a full scale revolution, the ballot box will produce at least one truly radical president. If FDR's efforts hadn't worked I suspect there would have been a Communist insurrection.
Right now there is a lot of denial of the violence. A lot of willful disbelief. The shooters are described as lone nuts, troubled to insane, not a single courageous man of conviction among them. Playwright paints 'ammosexual' with a broad brush, and he is not entirely unrepresentative of how folks think about those who are turning to violence. Those using violence are sick and disturbed rather than seeing a sick and disturbed culture than needs to be changed. The notion that the People could use force to change the culture is sneered at. Thus, I feel safe in saying the spiral of violence hasn't really gotten underway, not when you compare it with the Berlin 45 photo above. I do take Berlin 1945 and Atlanta 1864 as examples of how bad things have to get before people will consider letting go of their world views, or might surrender to superior force and go along with the progressives, still thinking blacks ought to be slaves or that Hitler should have found a way to complete his plans.
Think about how we are talking past each other, not hearing what each other are saying, not comprehending the perspective that makes other believe so intensely the opposite of one's own opinion. What does it take to make someone with strong values change their mind about pushing their politics and world views? See Berlin 1945 or Atlanta 1864.
I really hope that some elected progressive president gets a Congress that can be worked with before we start comparing bomb tonnage with the Eighth. There seems to be time yet. The rejection of terror as a domestic political tool was very strong after OKC and again after September 11th. That could change. Right now, after a cop kills a black, or after a black kills a cop, the dominant message is "This has to stop." If the spiral was escalating, the dominant response would be to get a bunch of people together and kill enough of those other guys that they will be forced to back down. That's how a true spiral works. That's what it takes for a true 4T crisis transformation to resolve. Thus, I don't think the spiral is really cooking up yet.
We've had a few T4T posters talk about violence. Not many. I see it as possible. I don't see it as desirable. I don't think folks ought to get enthusiastic about a all out violent 4T crisis until they have some clue about what they are fighting for. Yes, we need to check the power of the elites. What does one want to do to check the power of the elites? I'd be tempted to start by never voting for anyone to takes corporate campaign financing, repeal Citizens United, and go on from there. Bernie had a fine agenda as well.
But before one tears down, before one starts thinking like the Eighth Air Force, one might want some real idea of what should be rebuilt on top of the ruins.
Let me clarify a couple things here for you.
Ammosexuals are a sick and disturbed sub-culture in our society. They are single issue oriented on the supposed right of access to high-powered military grade guns. If you peel back the onion, a lot of them have irrational fear of government, but many just get off on having high powered weapons, period. This single issue/position blinds them to any and all other concerns. There may be a tiny segment, as with any sick and disturbed subculture, that would be insane enough to become a mass killer, but the vast majority will not. Rather, they are enablers, and they don' give a shXt if they are because of the single issue that drives them. Capche?
Taking political and legal steps to remove the access to high-powered military grade access will NOT result in your so-called spiral of violence.; it will actually reduce the potential. One problem I have with you is your implying that limiting access tot these weapons will lead to a shXtstorm and therefore we should just resign ourselves to the status quo that provides unlimited civilian access to military weapon platforms regardless of the mass shootings that will come our way.
The bigger problem I have, however, is your assumption that the real road to true resolution is to change each other's minds and come to some rational compromise. That's not how 4T's resolve; they resolve because one side wins and the other side loses - that doesn't necessarily always require the scale of violence of a WW2. But more importantly, lots of issues, whether or not part-and-parcel of a 4T, do NOT get resolved by compromise but by clear wins and loses. Why do you insist that gun restrictions are going to either have to be resolved by 100% consensus or by violent revolution? That sure seems like it would come from someone very comfortable with the status quo.
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07-15-2016, 02:20 PM
(This post was last modified: 07-15-2016, 07:49 PM by pbrower2a.)
(07-15-2016, 11:13 AM)playwrite Wrote: Let me clarify a couple things here for you.
Ammosexuals are a sick and disturbed sub-culture in our society. They are single issue oriented on the supposed right of access to high-powered military grade guns. If you peel back the onion, a lot of them have irrational fear of government, but many just get off on having high powered weapons, period. This single issue/position blinds them to any and all other concerns. There may be a tiny segment, as with any sick and disturbed subculture, that would be insane enough to become a mass killer, but the vast majority will not. Rather, they are enablers, and they don' give a shXt if they are because of the single issue that drives them. Capche?
[color]
Needless to say people with a pathological, single-minded fascination with firearms and ammunition scare the Hell out of me. Anyone who believes that personal firepower resolves all issues has a problem.
I'd be scared to have a firearm and ammo in my residence. If the crook gets it he can turn it against me, which is hardly my idea of security. [/color]
Quote: Taking political and legal steps to remove the access to high-powered military grade access will NOT result in your so-called spiral of violence.; it will actually reduce the potential. One problem I have with you is your implying that limiting access tot these weapons will lead to a shXtstorm and therefore we should just resign ourselves to the status quo that provides unlimited civilian access to military weapon platforms regardless of the mass shootings that will come our way.
Less of a firearm culture and fewer firearms means less gun violence. Does anyone really need an arsenal?
Quote:The bigger problem I have, however, is your assumption that the real road to true resolution is to change each other's minds and come to some rational compromise. That's not how 4T's resolve; they resolve because one side wins and the other side loses - that doesn't necessarily always require the scale of violence of a WW2. But more importantly, lots of issues, whether or not part-and-parcel of a 4T, do NOT get resolved by compromise but by clear wins and loses. Why do you insist that gun restrictions are going to either have to be resolved by 100% consensus or by violent revolution? That sure seems like it would come from someone very comfortable with the status quo.
[/quote]
The decisions will have to be made by people who have no use for single weapons capable of mass murder or a number of weapons suited to mass murder due to their number alone.
There's big money in firearms -- but especially when the customers have multiple arms and huge stocks of ammo. It's almost as with alcohol: the booze business would be unprofitable without the alcoholics.
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.
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![[Image: 13669052_10208707999050304_3947956537347...e=581C448B]](https://scontent.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/13669052_10208707999050304_3947956537347873600_n.jpg?oh=a7798552fd88b8e039a91cd7dbbea3ff&oe=581C448B)
The record is clear....
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07-19-2016, 03:16 PM
(This post was last modified: 07-19-2016, 03:17 PM by Eric the Green.)
(07-19-2016, 02:32 PM)X_4AD_84 Wrote: (07-19-2016, 12:04 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:
The record is clear....
Eric you are stretching it. Clearly you have not undergone good statistical training or if you did, you are not taking it to heart.
I didn't make the map.
Quote: What I would conclude from the chart would be:
1) JFK - LBJ: A continuation of the trend of the 1950s (with the exception of the early 60s minor glitch)
2) NIXON - FORD - CARTER - early Reagan: Suckiness
The map clearly shows that Carter was good and early Reagan bad; contrary to Repuglican propaganda.
Quote:3) Remainder Reagan - Bush 41 - Clinton: Roaring 20s redux
Reagan did do well for a while, apparently, after sucking big time; but of course we know that was a mirage; all the benefits went to the top. Then Bush 41 = suckiness.
Quote:4) Bush 43: The calm then the storm
5) Obama: Damage control
IOW, Bush 43 bad, Obama good. And Bush 43: more benefits only to the 1% during the "calm."
Quote:The above maps reasonably well to turnings, BTW.
So it would appear.
And to my predictions 
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http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/19/us/pol...ntion.html
Quote:Republican Convention: Trump Formally Nominated
By MICHAEL D. SHEAR and MATT FLEGENHEIMERUPDATED 9:49 PM ET
CLEVELAND — Day 2 of the Republican National Convention enters prime time, after the delegates formally nominated Donald J. Trump for president. The evening’s speakers — including the Republican leaders of the Congress — will focus on the economy. Here’s what else you should know (and some of Tuesday’s best photos):
Donald Trump is the Republican nominee for president — officially.
Mr. Trump, the New York real estate mogul and reality TV star, formally took control of the Republican Party on Tuesday as delegates to the convention here officially chose him as their nominee, ending a tumultuous, yearlong political crusade.
The State of New York cast its delegates for Mr. Trump just after 7 p.m. Tuesday, giving him the majority of delegates and crushing, once and for all, the panicked efforts of the “Never Trump” movement inside the Republican Party establishment.
Mr. Trump dispatched with ease more than a dozen establishment candidates during one of the unlikeliest and nontraditional presidential campaigns in history. And on Tuesday, as he became their standard-bearer, the party’s congressional leaders prepared to fete him in from the convention’s podium later in the evening.
Gov. Mike Pence of Indiana, the vice-presidential nominee, is scheduled to accept the party’s nod in a speech on Wednesday evening, and Mr. Trump will do the same on Thursday in a prime-time speech to the nation.
Trump advisers deny plagiarism by Melania Trump, even as the issue consumes the Republican convention.
Donald J. Trump’s top advisers closed ranks around the candidate’s wife Tuesday morning, insisting that there had been no plagiarism and attempting — without much success — to shift the day’s political conversation back to their planned convention message.
Their efforts shifted throughout the course of the day, as aides sought to explain away stark, side-by-side evidence that several passages appeared to be almost identical to passages from Michelle Obama’s 2008 convention speech.
As the Times reported this morning, Paul Manafort, Mr. Trump’s campaign manager, called it “absurd” to think that Ms. Trump had copied anyone’s work, despite stark, side-by-side evidence that several passages appeared to be almost identical to passages from Michelle Obama’s 2008 convention speech.
The response from the campaign this morning appears to have intensified the story, which dominated the cable television shows and was the talk of the convention hall. And some of that talk included former Trump campaign aides, who demanded accountability.
Can the peacemakers salve the party’s wounds?
On Tuesday, the party’s star-crossed efforts to project harmony will fall to some of its best-known leaders in Washington, including Paul D. Ryan, the House speaker from Wisconsin, whose embrace of Mr. Trump has been halting at best. Though he said as recently as Monday that Mr. Trump was not “my kind of conservative,” Mr. Ryan will take the stage to make the case that the alternative, a second Clinton administration, would be far worse.
Senator Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, the majority leader, is also expected to lend a dutiful hand, keeping Republicans’ near-universal disdain for Mrs. Clinton front and center.
Will an unlikely cast pull off its economics lesson?
The stated theme of Tuesday’s slate is “Make America Work Again” — a potential challenge of tone for speakers eager to sully Mrs. Clinton on a topic as sober as job creation, a night after blistering attacks on her foreign policy.
And as Mr. Trump seeks to present himself as a fiscal wizard of the highest order, he has assembled an eclectic cast of validating voices to attest to his business savvy. Voters will hear from Dana White, the swaggering president of the Ultimate Fighting Championship, and Natalie Gulbis, a professional golfer who once appeared on Mr. Trump’s reality show “Celebrity Apprentice.”
Will viewers get a flavor of Trump-as-Dad?
Donald Trump Jr., and his half sister, Tiffany Trump, would seem capable of carrying off a difficult task: bringing some texture to a man whose public persona can border on caricature.
It is not clear, of course, that Mr. Trump wants this.
Often in their public remarks, family members of Mr. Trump have relayed less-than-personal anecdotes, eagerly hailing his deal-making and foresight, but dwelling little on any fatherly flourishes.
Will Chris Christie be able to help himself?
Gov. Chris Christie of New Jersey wanted to be president. O.K., fine, vice president?
He’s getting a Tuesday speaking slot alongside two Arkansas officials and Ben Carson.
Now, a few days after being bypassed for a spot on Mr. Trump’s ticket — and four years after addressing the convention for Mitt Romney, in a speech that critics broadly panned as self-serving — Mr. Christie has an opportunity for at least a measure of redemption.
In an interview with CNN on Monday night, he was asked what people could expect from him on Tuesday.
“I hope to be charming,” he said, before raising an eyebrow playfully. “Charming and absolutely disarming.”
Just who isn’t speaking at the convention stands out ... a lot.
Take a look at the people who have spoken most frequently at Republican conventions since 1992, compared to whether they are scheduled to speak this year, according to the C-SPAN transcripts and the convention schedules released so far.
![[Image: promo-Artboard_2.png]](https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/2016/07/12/convention-speakers/a73d1723aa92138eb2f77ffe533d5058591fc076/promo-Artboard_2.png)
’92
’96
’00
’04
’08
’12
’16
John McCain
Mitch McConnell
Lynne Cheney
George W. Bush
Laura Bush
Bill Frist
Elizabeth Dole
Fred Brown
Mike Huckabee
Which takes us to …
Here are some of tonight’s speakers.
Dana White, U.F.C. president
Mitch McConnell, senator of Kentucky
Paul Ryan, speaker of the House
Chris Christie, governor of New Jersey
Tiffany and Donald Trump Jr., two of Donald J. Trump's children
Ben Carson, retired neurosurgeon
"We have it in our power to begin the world over again."
—Thomas Paine, Common Sense (1776)
"History doesn't repeat itself, but it often rhymes."
—Mark Twain
'98 Millennial
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I understand that the Clinton campaign is remaking some LBJ ads of 1964, like this one:
The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated Communist but instead the people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists -- Hannah Arendt.
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A split among Protestant pastors.
Quote:http://www.culturefaith.com/protestant-p...-ideology/
Protestant Pastors At Odds with Each Other Regarding Election and Issues, Based on Ideology
… "The United States has about 320,000 Protestant churches. Research indicates that about one-third of them are theologically conservative, about half are theologically moderate, and the remaining 15% are theologically liberal.”…
… "Pastors’ personal preference in the presidential race is also diametrically opposite. While 70% of the conservative pastors plan to vote for Mr. Trump, compared to 2% who will support Mrs. Clinton, the opposite is true among the moderate and liberal pastors: 52% say they will vote for Mrs. Clinton and 13% will back Mr. Trump.”…
… whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Phil 4:8 (ESV)
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It's just around the corner, people -
Who Better Than Laura Ingraham To Fly The Nazi Salute At The RNC?
![[Image: cn2i9zwvuaampos.jpg]](http://crooksandliars.com/files/images/16/07/cn2i9zwvuaampos.jpg)
Quote:![[Image: cn2x6ysvmaaxijg.jpg]](http://crooksandliars.com/files/images/16/07/cn2x6ysvmaaxijg.jpg)
That thing did actually happen. At the end of her speech, Laura Ingraham appeared flew the Nazi salute in honor of her hero, Führer Drumpf.
Getty Images posted this image, which isn't retouched or photoshopped.
This will become more common in the next few months, I predict. Along with loyalty pledges and brownshirt armies.
It CAN happen here.
My understanding is that all the luminaries on the GOP stage (except for Ted Cruz) have requested personal villas in the mountains of New Zealand (Austrian villas are so 1930s)
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07-21-2016, 01:02 PM
(This post was last modified: 07-21-2016, 01:16 PM by Eric the Green.)
America is in danger. All we have to see is enough people vote for "a change; ANY kind of change to anything will do; and Trump is fun to watch; yeah, I vote for the orange guy! And then we will see chaos and/or imposed "order" or both. Well, at least it will be entertaining. Until they come for you and me, that is.
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07-21-2016, 03:00 PM
(This post was last modified: 07-21-2016, 03:01 PM by playwrite.)
Here's what it is all about, people (and why the Trump kids are working so hard to get their dynasty into the White House) -
Trump’s tax plan would mean a $7.1 billion reward for his family — and cost taxpayers $10 trillion
Quote:It seems like Donald Trump has at least one policy idea as president that would benefit — Donald Trump.
According to an analysis by Third Way, a Washington, D.C.-based think tank, Trump’s proposed elimination of the federal estate tax would be a $7.1 billion boon for his family. Along with proposed breaks on capital gains and income taxes, Trump’s plan would benefit mostly the wealthy and add $9.5 trillion to the national debt in 10 years.
When you think of the millions and millions of suckers and rubes that will vote for this guy, it brings a whole new level to the carnival barker's "a sucker is born every minute."
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07-22-2016, 02:12 PM
(This post was last modified: 07-22-2016, 05:11 PM by linus.)
The TV is saying Kaine. I still think it could be Booker.
(Or maybe it's just because I don't want to believe that the Democrats are about to nominate the blandest ticket since Bore / [GI Joe] Lieberman. If the Democrats win [which I still think is the likeliest possibility] it will be like: hashtag WhiteHouseSoWhite.)
Of the three said to be on the short list, Booker is the only one I think that would help to energize the ticket - especially vis a vis core Obama voters - which is what I think she needs. A Kaine pick would I guess suggest they believe she needs to signal to white/suburban/independents that she'd be "safe" for the suburbs.
But, you know, if it's Booker how long before the right trolls her with a bumper sticker or something: CLINTON / BOOKHER.
And I continue to think that Julian Castro would be the boldest, most inspired pick (of all the people mentioned publicly).
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(07-22-2016, 02:12 PM)linus Wrote: The TV is saying Kaine. I still think it could be Booker.
(Or maybe it's just because I don't want to believe that the Democrats are about to nominate the blandest ticket since Bore / [GI Joe] Lieberman. If the Democrats win [which I still think is the likeliest possibility] it will be like: hashtag WhiteHouseSoWhite.)
Of the three said to be on the short list, Booker is the only one I think that would help to energize the ticket - especially vis a vis core Obama voters - which is what I think she needs. A Kaine pick would I guess suggest they believe she needs to signal to white/suburban/independents that she'd be a "safe" bet. Or something.
But, you know, if it's Booker how long before the right trolls her with the bumper sticker: CLINTON / BOOKHER.
And I continue to think that Julian Castro would be the boldest, most inspired pick (of all the people mentioned publicly).
There is a problem with picking Booker. The Governor of New Jersey would get to pick his replacement. And the Governor of New Jersey is none other than ...... Chris Christie!
Elizabeth Warren has the same problem. 
Too bad, because otherwise, I like them both.
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