Presidential election, 2016

[Bob Butler 54]

(01-06-2017, 05:39 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: What we don't need are posters playing moderator or assuming the role of therapist. You Bob or Tara are certainly not qualified for that role, as you do the same things you complain about in others. I am not qualified either, nor is anyone here. Just discuss the issues. If someone feels stereotyped, they are perfectly capable of responding and denying the label. As for someone with whom dialogue is impossible for another, there's the ignore list.

I am attracted to S&H turning theory in great part as it gives structure to how cultures and values change.  How is it that people end up fighting wars rather than finding and accepting reasonable compromise?  How is it that people from different cultures just can't understand or communicate with one another?

An important part of how crises and turnings work is the defense mechanism that protect people from considering values change.  Extreme partisans have closed minds.  They are incapable of understanding perspectives that conflict with their own.  Defense mechanisms that protect values systems include ad-homium attacks, strawman arguments, vile stereotypes, and moving conversation off issues to personal conflict.

In short, the nature of the conversations here, the amazing ability to type much while acknowledging little what the other guy is typing, is a large part of the problem.

Now, at one level, I suppose I am acting as a wannabe moderator.  I'd like more real talk, less hate.

At another level, people ought to learn how people think.  It ought to be possible to recognize when the other side is stereotyping or straw manning one's own position, when the other guy is refusing to understand what one is saying.  I assume, much of the time, when someone calls you stupid, they don't really understand what you are saying?  Much of the time they don't seem to be making an honest attempt to understand?  They almost can't.  It is traumatic to honestly reevaluate one's own values.  People will dance, shake, lie to themselves and hate rather than question what they think they know.  This is normal.  This is par for the course.  This is human.

The big step, after recognizing that the other guys aren't honoring or respecting you, is to be able to recognize the same behaviors in yourself.  It's fairly easy to see when the other guy is being irrational.  It is much harder to look into a mirror.  You are one of many who seems to avoid mirrors.

Anyway, the despicable behavior of the guys with different values is part of the problem.  So is the despicable behavior of folk with the same values.  The inability of many people to open their minds is at the core of the structure of crises.