Debate about Gun Control

[Classic-Xer]

(10-24-2017, 12:15 PM)pbrower2a Wrote:

(10-24-2017, 11:51 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(10-22-2017, 07:29 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(10-22-2017, 10:21 AM)David Horn Wrote: This is the exact problem you fail to understand.  Unless you are trained to overcome the loss of your bearings that occurs in high stress situations, they tend to grow worse rather than better.  Adrenaline is good for fight or flight, but not for rational decision making.  I had this same discussion with 'nihilist moron' on the old forum.  She wisely decided to stay away from that topic.

On what would you base your expectations, just to be clear about it?  My experience is 180 degrees counter to your belief.  Here's why.  Unless you arrive with the full expectation that a shooter will target the area, you will be surprised when the shooting starts.  The adrenaline kicks in, but you, having no training to channel that in a positive way, will get hyperactive and disoriented.  What follows at that point is hard to predict, but it's less likely to go well than badly.

FWIW, I attended the Special Forces Training Center on Okinawa during my sojourn in the Army. We were expecting to be attacked during our various training exercises, but they still came as a surprise every time.  Wisely, only the guy on point had live ammo, or some of us may have spent a lot longer on the island.

I assume Rani figured she wasn't going to convince you otherwise and she decided it wasn't worth it to continue the effort with you. Me, I don't approach you with the intent to convince of anything that you don't believe in or view as important. You're a bit to block headed/close minded to convince that their view of things or belief of things could be wrong. The next time something horrible happens, I'd suggest you pay more attention to the stories of regular folks who were able to over come the initial shock, regain their bearings and take part in heroic deeds without any official training. We see it, hear of it, are made aware of it occurring during every major crisis/accident but according to you that doesn't/can't/won't/shouldn't happen unless a person is/has been trained. I'm glad that I wasn't raised by blues or indoctrinated by blues because I wouldn't have amounted to much of anything at this point.

Yes: the infamous proof by anecdote.  Ask a combat vet about the highest risk times he or she served, and one will very likely be the first time they came under fire.  Still, some successes do occur.  So do suicides.  Here's a recent column by a conservative writer who cited that as one reason he opposes the 2nd Amendment.

I would not trust myself with a gun under such a circumstance unless the situation is completely unambiguous, like a stranger raping my daughter or granddaughter and giving me a clear shot at the offender without putting the life of an innocent person at risk. I would have more concern about the trauma that my daughter or granddaughter from watching someone die than about killing a threat to a loved one, let alone the risk that I would miss the rapist and kill or maim the innocent victim of a crime.

But that is a highly-scripted circumstance. Many scenarios that first look like self-defense that result in lethal gunfire do not involve a crime. But note well: if those result in an accidental death they are still homicide. If one is not a sociopath, one could feel very guilty of killing a loved one, a friend, or a neighbor in a gross error that is dismissed as a non-culpable homicide.

I have also heard of circumstances in which someone had a gun 'for defense', and the criminal wrested the gun away and used the gun against the failed self-defender.  



The creature above is far safer than a firearm, except perhaps to a criminal. With this dog, burglars (many of them rapists) are meat. It can read people for bad intentions, and it knows who does not belong where by scent.

I've got a big dog and I've got a gun around to back him up and protect him with. Geez, only a liberal would place more value on the life of a criminal than they do on the life of the family dog.