Presidential election, 2016

[Bob Butler 54]

(11-12-2016, 07:49 PM)taramarie Wrote:

(11-12-2016, 07:40 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(11-12-2016, 04:31 PM)taramarie Wrote: It does amaze me that the older folk on this forum are the ones who are acting like children. The older folk!

Hmm...  Would it be childish to step in at this point and ask how your policy of being nice is doing?  

I have pointed some people do not listen and it will not work on everyone. Playwrite and Eric to name two. Is it better in your opinion to smack people over the head with idealism like those two? Does that work?

Idealism might not be the ideal weapon.  If your values conflict with their values, if their way of thinking suggests that anyone with values that conflict with theirs is stupid, evil, insane or otherwise mentally incapable, using values and idealism as your weapon will only make you seem stupid, evil, insane or otherwise mentally incapable in their eyes.

Logic and fact might be a better approach, but extreme partisans are often immune to logic and fact.  You have to be very clear, firm, persistent and even then not expect them to see or hear what they don't feel like seeing or hearing.

Of late, I have been attacking the stereotypes.  If I'm accused of hating vegetables, I'll have to insist that I'm not against all vegetables, but I don't care for asparagus or broccoli, with a caveat that for some people asparagus and broccoli are fine and that I respect asparagus and broccoli eaters.  Extreme partisans often think in stereotypes.  They have simple and vile notions of how people who don't agree with them think.  When they go into childish attack mode, they often haven't really listened to or comprehended the point that you might have been making.  In their minds, they will have morphed you into one of their vile stereotypes and will be attacking the vile stereotype rather than you.  

If they are misrepresenting your values -- and they often will be, they see their stereotype of you, not you -- you might make your values clearer.  "I do not hate white people.  I hate bigots and advocate equality and respect."  Don't expect them to listen the first few hundred times you clarify your values.  Many extreme partisans are incapable of listening, can see only their vile stereotypes.  They cannot interact with real people, only with their stereotypes.

If possible, when they are attacking one of their vile stereotypes, recognize that they aren't really attacking you.  If by their nature they are incapable of understanding, acknowledging or respecting who you are and what you stand for, how much is their opinion really worth?  Approximately zero?  Zilch?  Less?  If their thinking through stereotypes is childish, is letting their childish tantrums hurt your feelings childish as well?  If they cannot defend themselves through logic, fact and ideals, if their defense mechanism is switching to 'childish' personal attacks and insults, is it possible not to be drawn down to their level?  "When they go low..."

Anyway, everyone has to find their own approach to dealing with the extreme partisans.  What works for me might not feel right for you.

But to me you do seem sensitive to attacks and criticism, and tend to throw fits in response.  You tend to get prickly and indigent easily and often.  If you want to play nice, to have serious issue related conversations, you might want to watch that tendency.  If someone is losing at the values and fact level, and wants to pivot, to move away from values and fact, they can easily prod you into exchange of personal attacks mode.  You are more than a tad sensitive.  You might consider watching that.