Debate about Gun Control

[Copperfield]

(08-15-2016, 07:20 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:

(08-01-2016, 06:23 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Michael Moore: It's not only gun laws we need, but the defeat of the right wing. We are the majority, and we want gun laws, we want our country to stop invading other countries, we want an anti violence against women act; above all, we want an adequate safety net, not more trickle-down economics.

1. I feel left out.   I want an anti any crime against Rags act.
2. US and Russia are naughty, naughty : http://www.businessinsider.com/arms-sale...sia-2014-8  Mikey needs to consider who is exporting arms, not gun laws.
3. Yeah, we sure do need to stop invading/meddling in other countries.
4. Yes to safety net, no to wars of choice.

....

Now we know how Mike got to be so biiiggg.

Indeed. One has to wonder why Moore never mentions the fact that Nobel Peace Prize winner Barry Obama (supported of course by Hillary's state department tenure) has been the most lucrative arms dealer since WWII. Perhaps it slipped his mind?

[Eric the Green]

(08-16-2016, 10:37 PM)Copperfield Wrote:

(08-15-2016, 07:20 PM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote:

(08-01-2016, 06:23 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Michael Moore: It's not only gun laws we need, but the defeat of the right wing. We are the majority, and we want gun laws, we want our country to stop invading other countries, we want an anti violence against women act; above all, we want an adequate safety net, not more trickle-down economics.

1. I feel left out.   I want an anti any crime against Rags act.
2. US and Russia are naughty, naughty : http://www.businessinsider.com/arms-sale...sia-2014-8  Mikey needs to consider who is exporting arms, not gun laws.
3. Yeah, we sure do need to stop invading/meddling in other countries.
4. Yes to safety net, no to wars of choice.

....

Now we know how Mike got to be so biiiggg.

Indeed. One has to wonder why Moore never mentions the fact that Nobel Peace Prize winner Barry Obama (supported of course by Hillary's state department tenure) has been the most lucrative arms dealer since WWII. Perhaps it slipped his mind?

I am not sure exactly what this has to do with Moore's or Obama's or Hillary's views on gun control.

America's alliances are good business for American arms makers and arms dealers. The question is then whether we should put our allies on notice that we might break our treaties with them, as Trump wants, or just stop selling arms to them. Would that reduce the arms they get? I don't know. The arms industry might just move to another country. So, that kind of arms control might be as tough as you claim gun control is. I'm not sure. Would selling fewer arms to our allies reduce the number of guns in the hands of our enemies (depending on how one defines our enemies)?

The article raises doubts in my mind right away, when it calls US arms support for the rebels in Syria as "disastrous." Most of the rest of the arm sales under Obama are to long-standing allies.

[Eric the Green]

(08-16-2016, 10:32 PM)Copperfield Wrote: Still conflating "gun deaths" with gun related homicide and violent crime I see? Once again, even the studies done by the Brady Campaign show zero correlation between firearm related homicide rates and state law. When factoring in all homicide rates, the correlation is even less.

That doesn't change the correlation with gun deaths, even if true that there's no correlation to gun murders (which it is not, necessarily; according to stats I and others have posted ad infinitum), and even if you don't think that suicides and accidents count as deaths (which of course they do). It's fair to say that stats are conflicting when restricted to homicides alone, but other firearm crimes tend to happen in states with weak laws. I question whether it's fair to say that a city like Chicago should have low gun crime because it has strict gun laws. There are other causes of crime, and guns can be gotten from outside the city or the state quite easily, in a country that has the most guns in the world by far. But overall, Illinois still has lower gun deaths than permissive states, as the chart above shows. In a state like Maryland, the gun laws are new, and it takes time for them to work.
http://www.factcheck.org/2015/10/gun-law...nd-crimes/

When it comes to massacres, America leads the world in them, and America has the most permissive military weapons possession laws. And it matters, even if massacres are a small proportion of murders. These are innocent people killed for no reason, just as are some of the victims of American drone strikes or American arms shipments.

[Eric the Green]

From http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/natio.../71003050/

Gun-related homicides were also relatively frequent in the states with the most gun violence. Nationally, there were 3.61 homicides per 100,000 people. Seven of the the 10 states with the most gun violence reported homicide rates higher than the national rate. Louisiana is one of only four states in the country where homicides accounted for a larger share of firearm deaths than suicides. In 2013, Louisiana reported nearly 10 homicides per 100,000 residents, the highest rate in the country.

Although not necessarily related, violent crime rates in the states with the most gun violence were also quite high. In fact, in seven of these states there were more than 430 violent crimes reported per 100,000 residents. Nationally, the rate was 367.9 violent crimes per 100,000 Americans.

(Other factors in gun violence and crime are also mentioned)

Copperfield is good at finding support for his views, as compared to Classic Xer for example, or even Rags. However, he is also utopian and thus often impractical. It is always a question of whether there is less or no government; that is the only idea that counts with him, as nearly as I can tell.

[Cynic Hero '86]

(08-17-2016, 03:37 AM)Eric the Green Wrote: From http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/natio.../71003050/

Gun-related homicides were also relatively frequent in the states with the most gun violence. Nationally, there were 3.61 homicides per 100,000 people. Seven of the the 10 states with the most gun violence reported homicide rates higher than the national rate. Louisiana is one of only four states in the country where homicides accounted for a larger share of firearm deaths than suicides. In 2013, Louisiana reported nearly 10 homicides per 100,000 residents, the highest rate in the country.

Although not necessarily related, violent crime rates in the states with the most gun violence were also quite high. In fact, in seven of these states there were more than 430 violent crimes reported per 100,000 residents. Nationally, the rate was 367.9 violent crimes per 100,000 Americans.

(Other factors in gun violence and crime are also mentioned)

Copperfield is good at finding support for his views, as compared to Classic Xer for example, or even Rags. However, he is also utopian and thus often impractical. It is always a question of whether there is less or no government; that is the only idea that counts with him, as nearly as I can tell.

Globalism is a late-20th century delusion and would be revealed as such as soon as the world economy undergoes it's next major correction and countries are subsequently forced to implement national-based strategies.

[Copperfield]

(08-18-2016, 03:45 PM)taramarie Wrote: This should be interesting to those who comment often on this topic. Here is the step by step legal  process on how to gain access to guns in New Zealand. How does it compare to the process in America?

Standard New Zealand firearms licence

Depends on which state you wish to compare it to. The US has local, county, state and federal firearm laws/ordinances to comply with.

If you are asking for opinions on New Zealand's firearm licensing law, it appears to be a giant pain in the ass. Important points of notice would be New Zealand's particular definition of sporting, which usually end up being amusing attempts by governments to divide up weapons into completely arbitrary groups while demonstrating a minimal knowledge of how those weapons actually operate. For instance, the following is an example of a "sporting shotgun" configuration:



This is a Russian made Saiga 12 shotgun. Now here is an image of my Saiga 12:



Note that functionally this is an identical firearm. The latter picture is closer to the original Saiga 12 configuration. It's a combat shotgun designed for the Russian military. The Russians were smart enough to recognize that by changing a few cosmetics, the shotgun would qualify as a "sporting" firearm. In the case of my Saiga 12, I imported it in a sporting configuration and after a few hours of work reconfigured it back to a more natural configuration along with a few modifications I wanted (and I assure you, it is totally compliant with US ATF regulation 922® and is now legally defined as an "American manufactured firearm"   ). Functionally these are the same shotguns. Legally they aren't.

I noticed New Zealand law also contains a regressive money grab (i.e. registration "fees"). Generally registration fees are a particular government's way of restricting a granted right to only wealthy citizens. In other words, those with more money are more likely to be able to afford the fees and wade through the red tape than are the less wealthy. Since it's your country, if you wish only wealthy individuals to own firearms that's your prerogative. Personally I think it's shitty for a government to grant rights based on wealth. But to each his or her own.

Also, of particular comical note is the provision that states:

You will have difficulty being deemed 'fit and proper' to possess or use firearms if you have: indicated an intent to use a firearm for self-defence.

Self-defense being a natural right of every human being, one has to wonder about the motivations of any political authority attempting to limit any right on the sole basis of "self-defense" especially when self-defense is one of the primary uses for any given firearm or any weapon. To a lesser degree the same goes for storage requirements which hinder self-defense opportunities. It sounds suspiciously like your government owns you and more importantly, they know they own you. If it makes you feel any better, that isn't uncommon in the world.

For what it's worth (and for example), last week my nightly sunset view was this:



Some of the last, actual wilderness left on earth. That's black bear and moose country. Both can be rather ornery this time of year if they are looking out for their young. That's why on trips to camp I always bring my .44 magnum and a box of ammo. It's in my pack *gasp* loaded and unlocked. Locking it up would sorta defeat the purpose; using it if, God forbid, I ever needed to.

[Ragnarök_62]

(08-18-2016, 09:48 PM)Copperfield Wrote:

1. Nice gun there.
2. I see a nicotine delivery device with it.   [ A stogie with matching stogie cutter. ]
3. I agree that NZ's gun laws are a bureaucratic rat's maze. Why would anyone need to jot down their employer on a firearms license?  I also agree the fees are utterly stupid.  With that said, one look at the BATF site makes NZ look sane.
4. I think Arizona has the right idea.  "If you [Federal Government" wants to enforce gun laws, have at it, but we're not gonna help.
http://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigatio...ws-n185326

[Eric the Green]

Some peoples' unwillingness to see the futility of guns, and allow peoples' bodies to bleed, is quite like some peoples' willingness to allow our ears to bleed with lousy music. The noise emitted from both is similar; the damage done is similar. This age in America has some strange characteristics. If only we could stay in the Awakening forever. Repulsiveness is allowed in other turnings. What is true-- yet repulsive to unawakened folks-- is allowed in 2Ts. In general, and allowing for exceptions and fluctuations, of course. Gimme Shelter from the other turnings!

I hereby promise not to reply to any comments on this post made by the kiwi.

Rags, you certainly deserve a dodo award for that post above.

[Eric the Green]

Celebrating that gun as though it were "nice," shows ammosexual tendencies. I'm sure there's a 3T metal song that celebrates them. Cue Rags, no doubt. I myself only remember one or two songs from my favorite pop era that celebrate guns, and they say that the shooter lost. Bobby Fuller sang "I fought the Law, and the Law won" in 1966. Then he himself died under mysterious circumstances. The next month, mass shootings began. And nothing good came of Joe of "Hey Joe" fame either, or the guy who shot his woman down by the river. Although I did choose " Do It Again " as a best song ever. Of course, Copperfield and Ragnarok don't seem too fond of guns when it's suggested some should be sent by the USA to the rebels in Syria, and I on the other hand seem to like them then. So, things can get twisted around. But one wonders, why celebrate them and lust after them by posting enticing pictures of them, if one is against using them where they are really needed? One wonders indeed.

[Odin]

(08-18-2016, 09:48 PM)Copperfield Wrote:

(08-18-2016, 03:45 PM)taramarie Wrote: This should be interesting to those who comment often on this topic. Here is the step by step legal  process on how to gain access to guns in New Zealand. How does it compare to the process in America?

Standard New Zealand firearms licence

Depends on which state you wish to compare it to. The US has local, county, state and federal firearm laws/ordinances to comply with.

If you are asking for opinions on New Zealand's firearm licensing law, it appears to be a giant pain in the ass. Important points of notice would be New Zealand's particular definition of sporting, which usually end up being amusing attempts by governments to divide up weapons into completely arbitrary groups while demonstrating a minimal knowledge of how those weapons actually operate. For instance, the following is an example of a "sporting shotgun" configuration:



This is a Russian made Saiga 12 shotgun. Now here is an image of my Saiga 12:



Note that functionally this is an identical firearm. The latter picture is closer to the original Saiga 12 configuration. It's a combat shotgun designed for the Russian military. The Russians were smart enough to recognize that by changing a few cosmetics, the shotgun would qualify as a "sporting" firearm. In the case of my Saiga 12, I imported it in a sporting configuration and after a few hours of work reconfigured it back to a more natural configuration along with a few modifications I wanted (and I assure you, it is totally compliant with US ATF regulation 922® and is now legally defined as an "American manufactured firearm"   ). Functionally these are the same shotguns. Legally they aren't.

I noticed New Zealand law also contains a regressive money grab (i.e. registration "fees"). Generally registration fees are a particular government's way of restricting a granted right to only wealthy citizens. In other words, those with more money are more likely to be able to afford the fees and wade through the red tape than are the less wealthy. Since it's your country, if you wish only wealthy individuals to own firearms that's your prerogative. Personally I think it's shitty for a government to grant rights based on wealth. But to each his or her own.

Also, of particular comical note is the provision that states:

You will have difficulty being deemed 'fit and proper' to possess or use firearms if you have: indicated an intent to use a firearm for self-defence.

Self-defense being a natural right of every human being, one has to wonder about the motivations of any political authority attempting to limit any right on the sole basis of "self-defense" especially when self-defense is one of the primary uses for any given firearm or any weapon. To a lesser degree the same goes for storage requirements which hinder self-defense opportunities. It sounds suspiciously like your government owns you and more importantly, they know they own you. If it makes you feel any better, that isn't uncommon in the world.

For what it's worth (and for example), last week my nightly sunset view was this:



Some of the last, actual wilderness left on earth. That's black bear and moose country. Both can be rather ornery this time of year if they are looking out for their young. That's why on trips to camp I always bring my .44 magnum and a box of ammo. It's in my pack *gasp* loaded and unlocked. Locking it up would sorta defeat the purpose; using it if, God forbid, I ever needed to.

Nice huge cigar you got there!

[Odin]

(08-18-2016, 03:45 PM)taramarie Wrote: This should be interesting to those who comment often on this topic. Here is the step by step legal  process on how to gain access to guns in New Zealand. How does it compare to the process in America?

Standard New Zealand firearms licence

Oh goodness, that is insane.

[Odin]

(08-19-2016, 12:42 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Celebrating that gun as though it were "nice," shows ammosexual tendencies.

So do you hate all people who collect weapons, or is it just guns?

[Odin]

(08-19-2016, 03:36 PM)taramarie Wrote: I am more of a sword person and it is due to the amazing designs they come up with.

OMG, if I wasn't broke as hell I would love to have a sword collection!

[Ragnarök_62]

Eric The Green Wrote:Celebrating that gun as though it were "nice," shows ammosexual tendencies.

That's just ridiculous.  Ascribing sex to everything makes no sense.  "Nice" means lots of stuff. Wrt Copperfield's gun, it's nice because of the engineering.  Didn't you notice the "finger notches" or whatever they're called.  Those make the gun grip better. The gun is a revolver / 6- shooter type.

Quote:I'm sure there's a 3T metal song that celebrates them. Cue Rags, no doubt.

At your service, man.  





This is one of my top 100. It's my theme song for traveling from Houston to Lake Charles for a poker junket.

Quote:I myself only remember one or two songs from my favorite pop era that celebrate guns, and they say that the shooter lost. Bobby Fuller sang "I fought the Law, and the Law won" in 1966. Then he himself died under mysterious circumstances. The next month, mass shootings began. And nothing good came of Joe of "Hey Joe" fame either, or the guy who shot his woman down by the river.

Joe?  Oh yeah,  it's coming to me now.   Joe Camel...

Quote:Although I did choose " Do It Again " as a best song ever. Of course, Copperfield and Ragnarok don't seem too fond of guns when it's suggested some should be sent by the USA to the rebels in Syria, and I on the other hand seem to like them then.

Syriaclusterfuckistan is what that place should be called. No matter what we do there, the end result is a clusterfuck.  Who, pray tell is gonna run the place if Assad gets the boot? Let's just let Russia and Iran have the place and wash our hands of something that can't be fixed.

Quote:So, things can get twisted around. But one wonders, why celebrate them and lust after them by posting enticing pictures of them, if one is against using them where they are really needed? One wonders indeed.

Uh, different ppl have different ideas "where they are really needed".

Quote:What is true-- yet repulsive to unawakened folks-- is allowed in 2Ts. In general, and allowing for exceptions and fluctuations, of course. Gimme Shelter from the other turnings!

I like all turnings except the 4T.  Give me shelter from just the 4T.  l   Nations which are in 4T's get stupid.

[Eric the Green]

(08-20-2016, 12:48 AM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote: That's just ridiculous. Ascribing sex to everything makes no sense. "Nice" means lots of stuff. Wrt Copperfield's gun, it's nice because of the engineering. Didn't you notice the "finger notches" or whatever they're called. Those make the gun grip better. The gun is a revolver / 6- shooter type.

You guys show much too much affection and admiration for that stuff. Why be interested in the grip? Planning to use one? ammosexual!

Quote:At your service, man.  

This is one of my top 100. It's my theme song for traveling from Houston to Lake Charles for a poker junket.

Not bad compared to your usual 3T stuff. As usual they don't know how to sing, but at least they aren't shouting.

Quote:Joe?  Oh yeah,  it's coming to me now.   Joe Camel...

No, Hey Joe was a standard from the core awakening, also recorded by Jimi Hendrix, The Byrds, and others.





https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hey_Joe

Quote:Syriaclusterfuckistan is what that place should be called. No matter what we do there, the end result is a clusterfuck.  Who, pray tell is gonna run the place if Assad gets the boot? Let's just let Russia and Iran have the place and wash our hands of something that can't be fixed.

Your name for Syria is correct but your policy ain't. There is a government in waiting in Syria; that's who will take charge. Iran and Syria running the place would just lead to continued resistance. Colonial imperialism doesn't out work too well these days.

Quote:Uh, different ppl have different ideas "where they are really needed".

Yeah, and as usual, some people are right about things and some aren't.

Quote:I like all turnings except the 4T.  Give me shelter from just the 4T.  l   Nations which are in 4T's get stupid.

You lose again. Parliament, The Declaration of Independence, the Constitution, The Rights of Man and Citizen, the 13th and 14th amendment, the United Nations, the New Deal and Social Security. No, 4Ts are when nations get smart. They have to get smart or cease to exist. That's pretty good motivation, usually. Need is the mother of invention. That's exciting and worthwhile to be there for, too.

3Ts are when nations get stupid. That's what happened to us culturally as well as politically in the recent 3T. It's difficult to think of a time when people were more stupid, in fact. Thus, we have a 4T. But no matter how many times I point this out, you don't get it. Comfort is not the highest value in life, but it's your value; I understand

[Ragnarök_62]

Eric The Green Wrote:You guys show much too much affection and admiration for that stuff. Why be interested in the grip? Planning to use one? ammosexual!

The use of ad-homs is just tacky.  After all they are the resort of those who have already lost the argument.

Quote:Not bad compared to your usual 3T stuff. As usual they don't know how to sing, but at least they aren't shouting.

The lyrics are better than you know who.

Quote:No, Hey Joe was a standard from the core awakening, also recorded by Jimi Hendrix, The Byrds, and others.





https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hey_Joe

I'm aware of that song. I prefer Here my Train a Comin' and Purple Haze myself.

Quote:Syriaclusterfuckistan is what that place should be called. No matter what we do there, the end result is a clusterfuck.  Who, pray tell is gonna run the place if Assad gets the boot? Let's just let Russia and Iran have the place and wash our hands of something that can't be fixed.

Quote:Your name for Syria is correct but your policy ain't. There is a government in waiting in Syria; that's who will take charge. Iran and Syria running the place would just lead to continued resistance. Colonial imperialism doesn't out work too well these days.

Colonial Imperialism doesn't work is right. That's why the US needs to just butt out.  The US has 0, nada, zip credibility in that whole region now from bombings and droneings.

I did err on the name a bit. It should be called SyrIraqiLybiaClusterFuckIstan. Uh, there can be no government in waiting because there has to be 2.  One for Sunnis and another for Shias.

Quote:Uh, different ppl have different ideas "where they are really needed".

Quote:I like all turnings except the 4T.  Give me shelter from just the 4T.  l   Nations which are in 4T's get stupid.

Quote:You lose again. Parliament, The Declaration of Independence, the Constitution, The Rights of Man and Citizen, the 13th and 14th amendment, the United Nations, the New Deal and Social Security. No, 4Ts are when nations get smart. They have to get smart or cease to exist. That's pretty good motivation, usually. Need is the mother of invention. That's exciting and worthwhile to be there for, too.

Ahem...

Eric Wrote:Some peoples' unwillingness to see the futility of guns, and allow peoples' bodies to bleed, is quite like some peoples' willingness to allow our ears to bleed with lousy music. The noise emitted from both is similar; the damage done is similar. This age in America has some strange characteristics. If only we could stay in the Awakening forever. Repulsiveness is allowed in other turnings. What is true-- yet repulsive to unawakened folks-- is allowed in 2Ts. In general, and allowing for exceptions and fluctuations, of course. Gimme Shelter from the other turnings!

You lose.  You said in another post you as well as I want shelter from 4T's. So There.

Quote: 
3Ts are when nations get stupid. That's what happened to us culturally as well as politically in the recent 3T. It's difficult to think of a time when people were more stupid, in fact. Thus, we have a 4T. But no matter how many times I point this out, you don't get it. Comfort is not the highest value in life, but it's your value; I understand

I'm glad you understand for the slogan of Tauri is "champaign wishes and caviar dreams".  3T's are for partying.

[Eric the Green]

(08-21-2016, 01:26 AM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote: The use of ad-homs is just tacky.  After all they are the resort of those who have already lost the argument.

I don't know what else can explain the fascination with guns, that would make people post such pictures, or buy such foolish and deadly arguments as gun proponents do, or hang on so tightly against any regulation. "From my dead cold hands" cries the ammosexual, as if any gun regulation is going to take Heston's shotgun away from him. Truly silly, and truly sick.

Quote:The lyrics are better than you know who.

Lyrics don't count much. But it was fine. But lyrics? Yes, better in many cases than you know who, but NOT in the case of you know what. Nothing today or during the 3T beats those.

Quote:Colonial Imperialism doesn't work is right. That's why the US needs to just butt out.  The US has 0, nada, zip credibility in that whole region now from bombings and droneings.

I did err on the name a bit. It should be called SyrIraqiLybiaClusterFuckIstan. Uh, there can be no government in waiting because there has to be 2.  One for Sunnis and another for Shias.

Colonial imperialism doesn't work; so why are you in favor of Iran and Russia colonizing Syria?

And if you agree with me that colonialism by them won't work in Syria, then what's the answer? Continued civil war there is dangerous for our country and the world. And Syria is not like those other countries at all. Each one is different ethnically, each one is different politically, and the USA was involved with each one in totally different ways. Not the same by any stretch. And anyone who thinks the Syria civil war is about Shia vs Sunni is in dupedfoolistan.

Quote:I'm glad you understand for the slogan of Tauri is "champaign wishes and caviar dreams".  3T's are for partying.

I know; I had my fun in the 3T, probably more than in the 2T, which was more challenging to get involved in. However, I don't remember saying I wanted shelter from the 4T. I want to see action! Like Pete Townshend said...





Let's see action. Let's see people. Let's be free, and see who cares! Our Lifehouse is in danger.

[Ragnarök_62]

(08-22-2016, 03:22 AM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(08-21-2016, 01:26 AM)Ragnarök_62 Wrote: The use of ad-homs is just tacky.  After all they are the resort of those who have already lost the argument.

I don't know what else can explain the fascination with guns, that would make people post such pictures, or buy such foolish and deadly arguments as gun proponents do, or hang on so tightly against any regulation. "From my dead cold hands" cries the ammosexual, as if any gun regulation is going to take Heston's shotgun away from him. Truly silly, and truly sick.



http://literarydevices.net/ad-hominem/

Quote:The lyrics are better than you know who.

Lyrics don't count much. But it was fine. But lyrics? Yes, better in many cases than you know who, but NOT in the case of you know what. Nothing today or during the 3T beats those.

Quote:Colonial Imperialism doesn't work is right. That's why the US needs to just butt out.  The US has 0, nada, zip credibility in that whole region now from bombings and droneings.

I did err on the name a bit. It should be called SyrIraqiLybiaClusterFuckIstan. Uh, there can be no government in waiting because there has to be 2.  One for Sunnis and another for Shias.

Colonial imperialism doesn't work; so why are you in favor of Iran and Russia colonizing Syria?

It's called the hot potato theory.  Just hand the hot potato off to Iran/Russia.  

And if you agree with me that colonialism by them won't work in Syria, then what's the answer? Continued civil war there is dangerous for our country and the world.

See above. If there are suckers out there that want a lost cause, just pawn it off and be done with it. The US washes its hands of a no can win situation and is better for it. Just think of it like this.  Eric agrees to underwrite a casino mark for Rags to play poker on. Rags just keeps any profits and if Rags loses, Eric is the one on the hook for it.

And Syria is not like those other countries at all. Each one is different ethnically, each one is different politically, and the USA was involved with each one in totally different ways. Not the same by any stretch. And anyone who thinks the Syria civil war is about Shia vs Sunni is in dupedfoolistan.

It is about Shia vs. Sunni.  Assad does bad stuff for the most part to Sunnis, while just ignoring Shias.

Quote:I'm glad you understand for the slogan of Tauri is "champaign wishes and caviar dreams".  3T's are for partying.

I know; I had my fun in the 3T, probably more than in the 2T, which was more challenging to get involved in. However, I don't remember saying I wanted shelter from the 4T. I want to see action! Like Pete Townshend said...





Let's see action. Let's see people. Let's be free, and see who cares! Our Lifehouse is in danger.

You're stuck, sorry.  You wrote all turnings except 2T's allow repulsiveness. You also said you want shelter from 4T's because a 4T isn't a 2T.

And.. Again, you wrote...  

Eric The Green Wrote:Some peoples' unwillingness to see the futility of guns, and allow peoples' bodies to bleed, is quite like some peoples' willingness to allow our ears to bleed with lousy music. The noise emitted from both is similar; the damage done is similar. This age in America has some strange characteristics. If only we could stay in the Awakening forever. Repulsiveness is allowed in other turnings. What is true-- yet repulsive to unawakened folks-- is allowed in 2Ts. In general, and allowing for exceptions and fluctuations, of course. Gimme Shelter from the other turnings!

[Eric the Green]

OK, yes I stand corrected. 2Ts all the way! But 4Ts are better than 3Ts, for what it's worth, because I want to see action!

[Ragnarök_62]

(08-22-2016, 06:34 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: OK, yes I stand corrected. 2Ts all the way! But 4Ts are better than 3Ts, for what it's worth, because I want to see action!

Action you want, action you shall receive.