Let's make fun of Trump, bash him, etc. while we can!

[David Horn]

(01-09-2021, 01:25 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-08-2021, 08:57 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Thanks for stepping up to be a moderator, David. Marx and Lennon would be proud.

If Dave bans me, this place will be flooded with Right Wingers. I mean, I only know a thousand of them or so.

Two comments. and I'll move along quietly:

1. I didn't volunteer for the job. It just arrived. I'll do my best to keep the place clean, once I learn how the tools work
   
2. I'm not banning anyone who has something to say.  No one gets to threaten anyone (that I won't tolerate), but being outspoken isn't a reason for anything but a spirited response from someone else.  That's the entire point of this place.
   

[David Horn]

(01-09-2021, 03:11 AM)taramarie Wrote: As Burns said... "RELEASE THE HOUNDS!" Seriously though is this place really worth it to you to place threats? Tad bit petty mate given this place isnt that significant  i advice to place that energy where it counts the most. Not in a teeny tiny forum full of mostly old men

As one of those old men, let me heartily agree.  

[Bob Butler 54]

(01-09-2021, 10:16 AM)David Horn Wrote: No one gets to threaten anyone (that I won't tolerate), but being outspoken isn't a reason for anything but a spirited response from someone else.  That's the entire point of this place.

Even Classic isn't allowed to threaten?  It is almost instinctive in him, and harmless in that he doesn't follow through.

I suppose...

[David Horn]

(01-09-2021, 10:20 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 10:16 AM)David Horn Wrote: No one gets to threaten anyone (that I won't tolerate), but being outspoken isn't a reason for anything but a spirited response from someone else.  That's the entire point of this place.

Even Classic isn't allowed to threaten?  It is almost instinctive in him, and harmless in that he doesn't follow through.

I suppose...

I've watched him issue his 'threats', which are certainly bad but harmless theater so far.  If they change in any meaningful way, I'll reconsider and act.

[pbrower2a]

(01-09-2021, 10:20 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 10:16 AM)David Horn Wrote: No one gets to threaten anyone (that I won't tolerate), but being outspoken isn't a reason for anything but a spirited response from someone else.  That's the entire point of this place.

Even Classic isn't allowed to threaten?  It is almost instinctive in him, and harmless in that he doesn't follow through.

I suppose...

His predecessor was banned on the old board for telling someone to commit suicide. Odin and I took that to the moderated, and I did so with the suggestion that he could not post until he apologized on the thread. Maybe I see things too literally for my own good (that is Asperger's syndrome for me). One never knows if one is communicating to someone severely distressed who is contemplating ending it all. I've been there.

His threats are of the sort that says "people will be angry", which is not specific enough to be excessively troublesome.  I issue my threats about global warming in that it will cause political chaos of the worst kind as people

[Bob Butler 54]

(01-09-2021, 10:36 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 10:20 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 10:16 AM)David Horn Wrote: No one gets to threaten anyone (that I won't tolerate), but being outspoken isn't a reason for anything but a spirited response from someone else.  That's the entire point of this place.

Even Classic isn't allowed to threaten?  It is almost instinctive in him, and harmless in that he doesn't follow through.

I suppose...

I've watched him issue his 'threats', which are certainly bad but harmless theater so far.  If they change in any meaningful way, I'll reconsider and act.

The other policy question is moderators censoring ideas. I know John doesn't like his theories criticized, and as moderator he could in theory use moderator authority to implement censorship. Rags at least did not do that. You could post most any position as long as you could defend it against other posters.

Is there an agreement among the current moderators not to censor ideas?

[Classic-Xer]

(01-09-2021, 10:20 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 10:16 AM)David Horn Wrote: No one gets to threaten anyone (that I won't tolerate), but being outspoken isn't a reason for anything but a spirited response from someone else.  That's the entire point of this place.

Even Classic isn't allowed to threaten?  It is almost instinctive in him, and harmless in that he doesn't follow through.

I suppose...

So, would you prefer to be threatened/warned or punched in the face without being threatened/warned first?

[Classic-Xer]

(01-09-2021, 10:16 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 01:25 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-08-2021, 08:57 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Thanks for stepping up to be a moderator, David. Marx and Lennon would be proud.

If Dave bans me, this place will be flooded with Right Wingers. I mean, I only know a thousand of them or so.

Two comments. and I'll move along quietly:

1. I didn't volunteer for the job. It just arrived. I'll do my best to keep the place clean, once I learn how the tools work
   
2. I'm not banning anyone who has something to say.  No one gets to threaten anyone (that I won't tolerate), but being outspoken isn't a reason for anything but a spirited response from someone else.  That's the entire point of this place.
   

Well, I'm a big boy who can handle a lot of shit (tons of shit), who has had my life threatened several times over the years. The majority of the times my life was threatened was back in the day when their was a double standard in place with a biassed moderator enforcing it. You volunteered for the job. Fate had nothing to do with it. I know you pretty good as a person. I know you are as partisan as they come these days. I have two eyes that don't lie. This site is a small slice/ sample of America today.

The American left is powerless and no longer represented here today. So, where is MLK and how long will MLK's statue be safe from being torn down and replaced by a black fist representing black power. People better wake up here because this shit is going on and a fascist minded regime wants power these days and there's a very large American army waiting for them right now.

[Bob Butler 54]

(01-09-2021, 02:01 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: The American left is powerless and no longer represented here  today. So, where is MLK and how long will MLK's statue be safe from being torn down and replaced by a black fist representing black power. People better wake up here because this shit is going on and a fascist minded regime wants power these days and there's a very large  American army waiting for them right now.

I think BLM has put its bet on non violence and legislation. It is likely enough that with the senate going to the Democrats, their bet will pay off. It is the looters, Boogaloo Bois, Proud Boys, bad cops, Wolverine Watchmen, secret police and other who have bet on violence. I am hoping they will run into law and order. Most have withdrawn from the conflict. The capitol insurrectionists have obviously not. Hopefully the law and order will be color blind. We'll see.

[Eric the Green]

(01-09-2021, 10:36 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 10:20 AM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 10:16 AM)David Horn Wrote: No one gets to threaten anyone (that I won't tolerate), but being outspoken isn't a reason for anything but a spirited response from someone else.  That's the entire point of this place.

Even Classic isn't allowed to threaten?  It is almost instinctive in him, and harmless in that he doesn't follow through.

I suppose...

I've watched him issue his 'threats', which are certainly bad but harmless theater so far.  If they change in any meaningful way, I'll reconsider and act.

Good policy David. Classic does bear watching.

[Eric the Green]

(01-09-2021, 01:25 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-08-2021, 08:57 PM)Eric the Green Wrote:

(01-08-2021, 01:30 PM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-07-2021, 05:04 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-07-2021, 01:56 PM)David Horn Wrote: There's a lot of blather here, so I'll stick to just the final thought.  If you're leaving, where are you going?  Saying you're leaving with part of Minnesota is a joke.  It would never fly with most Minnesotans.  If you're going elsewhere, make sure it's open to the idea.  You might have a real shot with Idaho.

If you plan to fight, where will you make your stand?  Alabama?  Mississippi? Oklahoma?  Feel free to leave with all three -- no fight required.

I gave you rock solid evidence of law breaking that you ignored and others downplayed by viewing it as trivial or a minor infraction. You're all guilty of going along with breaking the law. If we have to fight, we would be fighting all over the country in many ways largely uncoordinated. I'm letting you know this because I expect that you will come hard at them which will open a can of worms because that will trigger the entire American right. I can guarantee this, you will disappear from this earth before The US Constitution in its entirety disappears from this earth. You people hate our freedom and that has become very clear to me over the years. As I've mentioned before, I don't rely on Sean Hannity for my opinion and information related to you or  the Left. I have two eyes and the ability to read and comprehend and a willingness to directly communicate with before its to late.

What law breaking?  The only law-breaking I've seen recently was an attack on the US Capitol, not by Antifa as the alt-media implies, but by white nationalists -- many well known and well photographed by everyone with a camera.  Are you OK with that action?

And I can't see a less Constitutional group than the alt-right, who see it as 2nd Amendment and some pseudo-right reading of the rest of the Bill of Rights -- ignoring everything else.

Thanks for stepping up to be a moderator, David. Marx and Lennon would be proud.

If Dave bans me, this place will be flooded with Right Wingers. I mean, I only know a thousand of them or so.

Is this some kind of organized militia? Or a rag tag group like the Proud Boys? What are your plans? And why haven't you brought them here already?

[pbrower2a]

(01-09-2021, 02:01 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 10:16 AM)David Horn Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 01:25 AM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-08-2021, 08:57 PM)Eric the Green Wrote: Thanks for stepping up to be a moderator, David. Marx and Lennon would be proud.

If Dave bans me, this place will be flooded with Right Wingers. I mean, I only know a thousand of them or so.

Two comments. and I'll move along quietly:

1. I didn't volunteer for the job. It just arrived. I'll do my best to keep the place clean, once I learn how the tools work
   
2. I'm not banning anyone who has something to say.  No one gets to threaten anyone (that I won't tolerate), but being outspoken isn't a reason for anything but a spirited response from someone else.  That's the entire point of this place.
   

Well, I'm a big boy who can handle a lot of shit (tons of shit), who has had my life threatened several times over the years. The majority of the times my life was threatened was back in the day when their was a double standard in place with a biassed moderator enforcing it. You volunteered for the job. Fate had nothing to do with it. I know you pretty good as a person. I know you are as partisan as they come these days. I have two eyes that don't lie. This site is a small slice/ sample of America today.

You don't know what a threat is. You may think that I am a coward for it, but I have run away from plenty of fights in my time. At the least I have not had to be hospitalized for any broken bones from an altercation, and I have never been arrested for assault and battery. Two of those were gay-bashing incidents. I did not think it either possible, appropriate, or practical to try to convince a gay-basher that I am straight. 

While working on the 2010 Census I once faced four Rottweiler-sized dogs behind a door with a flimsy latch. I walked away. Four angry Rottweilers might as well be one tiger. I recognize the power, strength, agility, and voracity of dogs, and four such dogs are about as dangerous as a tiger.  I had no idea of how long the latch would hold. I am alive, and the dogs did not get what they thought was "burglar meat".

I choose my fights carefully, ensuring that I have a good chance of coming out of such a piece and avoiding legal problems. When it comes to the verbal fights... we all have our biases. We all have our convictions. You have strong convictions, and I disagree with most of yours. I have a broader idea of what is American and what isn't, but a narrower idea of pretexts for the use of force.  I also recognize that what statutory law generally aligns with a viable morality. There are exceptions, and those merit civil disobedience and advocacy efforts. 

Breaking into Congress while it is in session in an effort to disrupt a lawful proceeding is not civil disobedience. It is subversion and an unconstitutional breach of the political process. Think of it: people brought in Trump banners, one of them a US flag defaced with the name "TRUMP". Even a confederate flag entered the Capitol building. 

Say what you want about Black Lives Matters and the chimera known as Antifa, those were absent. Nothing official was to be protested.   

Quote:The American left is powerless and no longer represented here  today. So, where is MLK and how long will MLK's statue be safe from being torn down and replaced by a black fist representing black power. People better wake up here because this shit is going on and a fascist minded regime wants power these days and there's a very large  American army waiting for them right now.

The Founding Fathers were wrong about two things that were on the fringe of attention at the time: slavery and women's rights. First one gets liberty and then one seeks other things such as the abolition of slavery or the right of women to vote. The enlightened despot is a rarity; far more often the despot is a mad monster.

People in truly free countries are able to judge their leaders objectively without fear. It's the heritage of freedom that Martin Luther King was able to use in gaining freedom for people whose freedom had seemed out of reach. Let's remember that when people in central and Balkan Europe looked for a model for resistance to Commie rule they found the American struggle for civil rights. I put Martin Luther King, Jr. in the pantheon of America's Founding Fathers.

Something to remember about Martin Luther King, Jr. : he wasn't a socialist. When the KGB files were released that 'flaw' ensured that he would get no support from the Soviet system. It preferred the Black Power types -- who, I must say,  gave us much sound and fury and signified nothing in the end (Shakespeare allusion intended).

[pbrower2a]

(01-09-2021, 03:08 PM)Bob Butler 54 Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 02:01 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote: The American left is powerless and no longer represented here  today. So, where is MLK and how long will MLK's statue be safe from being torn down and replaced by a black fist representing black power. People better wake up here because this shit is going on and a fascist minded regime wants power these days and there's a very large  American army waiting for them right now.

I think BLM has put its bet on non violence and legislation.  It is likely enough that with the senate going to the Democrats, their bet will pay off.  It is the looters, Boogaloo Bois, Proud Boys, bad cops, Wolverine Watchmen, secret police and other who have bet on violence.  I am hoping they will run into law and order.  Most have withdrawn from the conflict.  The capitol insurrectionists have obviously not.  Hopefully the law and order will be color blind.  We'll see.

Black Lives Matters has a narrow objective: making police responses to black people less aggressive than they are now. It does not ask for softer treatment of overt offenders. I prefer that criminals be arrested more effectively... which creates fewer problems. The Democrats are less sympathetic to violence of any kind, and I can easily predict a crackdown on violent people. 

Cameras are more effective than cops in detecting looters, arsonists, vandals, and assaulters. Conservatives and liberals alike can say "Do the crime and do the time".

[Classic-Xer]

(01-09-2021, 05:14 PM)taramarie Wrote: That is not a cowardly act, but rather a smart one. Some people are not worth the effort, and you definitely do not take on angry dogs. Only an insecure fool would say you were a coward. Generally people who act all macho and big and tough.... making threats etc are deep inside hurt, scared and on defence from trauma and are compensating for feelings of insecurity for self defence purposes. Those people need therapy.

Was it a smart one? You learn nothing and remain pathetic and keep voting for white nights and saviors for the remainder of your life like PB. I got into a few fights with bullies in grammar school. I couple more fights in middle school with bullies from other grammar schools and another one with a couple of guys in high school who were horny and trying to team up on a best friends sister who a little to much to drink at one of our field parties.

[pbrower2a]

(01-09-2021, 06:57 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 05:14 PM)taramarie Wrote: That is not a cowardly act, but rather a smart one. Some people are not worth the effort, and you definitely do not take on angry dogs. Only an insecure fool would say you were a coward. Generally people who act all macho and big and tough.... making threats etc are deep inside hurt, scared and on defence from trauma and are compensating for feelings of insecurity for self defence purposes. Those people need therapy.

Was it a smart one? You learn nothing and remain pathetic and keep voting for white nights and saviors for the remainder of your life like PB. I got into a few fights with bullies in grammar school. I couple more fights in middle school with bullies from other grammar schools and another one with a couple of guys in high school who were horny and trying to team up on a best friends sister who a little to much to drink at one of our field parties.

Avoiding trouble is optimal. I have heard of the results of many bar-room brawls. As someone with poor ability to read non-verbal language I know enough to err on the side of caution. I don't always see someone about to snap. The typical bar-room brawl involves a fight between two drunks too liquored-up to feel much pain. Both end up in a hospital, one with a broken hand and the other with a broken jaw. Neither can remember what the fight was about. So what is it about? What insult is worth a broken hand or a broken jaw? 

"Your mother is a whore!" 

I'd rather walk away than throw a punch.   My mother wasn't a whore, and if she were -- so what?

I generally avoid bars. Exceptions that I might visit include some VFW, American Legion, Elks Club, or Knights of Columbus... where the people are reasonably predictable.  First of all, I no longer hold my liquor well; one drink is my limit. I can no longer drink as I did forty years ago, and even then it took me two hours to get through a drink at a weekend party at a college dorm. You never know what is in a strange bar. Someone might think that my blank stare is an effort to take his wife or girlfriend.  

I'll say this about the gay-bashing: it was then that I started to become a militant supporter of LGBT rights, including the right to marry and to adopt children. If I had to choose between being a homosexual and a gay-basher... that's easy. Whatever made gays seem more mainstream was going to make my life safer. It wasn't a big issue until I became a potential victim.  

In my case I have a cell phone on me, and it is an excellent method for reporting an overt crime.

[Eric the Green]

A few times in my jr. high era some bullies cornered me and threatened to fight with me, and all I did was stand there, or stay where I was in the pool, and made them look foolish or mean, and they went away.

[Bob Butler 54]

I had lots of problems in Jr High, not so much later.  By the time I picked up a little karate and king fu, it went entirely away.  Just knowing it was there gave enough confidence that if any trouble was considered it never materialized.

[Classic-Xer]

(01-09-2021, 07:08 PM)taramarie Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 06:57 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 05:14 PM)taramarie Wrote: That is not a cowardly act, but rather a smart one. Some people are not worth the effort, and you definitely do not take on angry dogs. Only an insecure fool would say you were a coward. Generally people who act all macho and big and tough.... making threats etc are deep inside hurt, scared and on defence from trauma and are compensating for feelings of insecurity for self defence purposes. Those people need therapy.

Was it a smart one? You learn nothing and remain pathetic and keep voting for white nights and saviors for the remainder of your life like PB. I got into a few fights with bullies in grammar school. I couple more fights in middle school with bullies from other grammar schools and another one with a couple of guys in high school who were horny and trying to team up on a best friends sister who a little to much to drink at one of our field parties.

You read his reasons and clearly he saw no point to fighting on both accounts. Likewise i ended up in fights but i picked them well as well as with the right tactics. You do not always have to throw punches to get your point across. I am glad that in your case you defended someone who was about to be raped. I would have beaten the snot out of that person also in that case. 

White knight is what you mean. Yes i know, it is not your strength. Just letting you know how it is spelled. I would like to know what has politics got to do with picking your battles wisely. 

Calling someone pathetic is subjective and is an interesting glimpse into your head if you think that fighting everyone including four dogs is admirable. Please, do tell more.

Does it really matter how it was spelled? You got the meaning rite. You know a lot about art, stick to art. Are you a psychology major or something who think she knows what's going on in everyone's heads? I think I'd avoid being torn apart by four vicious animals for a census that no one other than him and those on his side cares a lot about these days. I pick and choose my fights/battles too. You must have missed that while you were looking for a way to pick a senseless one with me. Please, pretty please, please lecture me more about being nice mommy. Calling a pathetic person pathetic is truthful. Do you still have a problem with that these days or are you mature enough to handle and accept that these days?

[Classic-Xer]

(01-10-2021, 12:53 AM)taramarie Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 08:48 PM)pbrower2a Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 06:57 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 05:14 PM)taramarie Wrote: That is not a cowardly act, but rather a smart one. Some people are not worth the effort, and you definitely do not take on angry dogs. Only an insecure fool would say you were a coward. Generally people who act all macho and big and tough.... making threats etc are deep inside hurt, scared and on defence from trauma and are compensating for feelings of insecurity for self defence purposes. Those people need therapy.

Was it a smart one? You learn nothing and remain pathetic and keep voting for white nights and saviors for the remainder of your life like PB. I got into a few fights with bullies in grammar school. I couple more fights in middle school with bullies from other grammar schools and another one with a couple of guys in high school who were horny and trying to team up on a best friends sister who a little to much to drink at one of our field parties.

Avoiding trouble is optimal. I have heard of the results of many bar-room brawls. As someone with poor ability to read non-verbal language I know enough to err on the side of caution. I don't always see someone about to snap. The typical bar-room brawl involves a fight between two drunks too liquored-up to feel much pain. Both end up in a hospital, one with a broken hand and the other with a broken jaw. Neither can remember what the fight was about. So what is it about? What insult is worth a broken hand or a broken jaw? 

"Your mother is a whore!" 

I'd rather walk away than throw a punch.   My mother wasn't a whore, and if she were -- so what?

I generally avoid bars. Exceptions that I might visit include some VFW, American Legion, Elks Club, or Knights of Columbus... where the people are reasonably predictable.  First of all, I no longer hold my liquor well; one drink is my limit. I can no longer drink as I did forty years ago, and even then it took me two hours to get through a drink at a weekend party at a college dorm. You never know what is in a strange bar. Someone might think that my blank stare is an effort to take his wife or girlfriend.  

I'll say this about the gay-bashing: it was then that I started to become a militant supporter of LGBT rights, including the right to marry and to adopt children. If I had to choose between being a homosexual and a gay-basher... that's easy. Whatever made gays seem more mainstream was going to make my life safer. It wasn't a big issue until I became a potential victim.  

In my case I have a cell phone on me, and it is an excellent method for reporting an overt crime.

Exactly. This shows maturity, knowledge of your own limits and intelligence unlike some neanderthals who immediately just punch, do not think case by case if its worth it or if there is any other tactic they can use and think if you dont punch you are weak. I think this is just an example of the glorification of violence in todays society which i see is going on full blast right now in your country with your retard orange loser and some of his minions.

The Neanderthal's died off thousands of years ago. The quick to the punch types are mainly on the Democratic side these days. You're making the same mistake that the Democrats here are making right now. I sure hope that you don't need them as we are busy settling our differences with them here. Yes, the evil orange boogeyman and his minions seemed to be the problem which you seem to fully agree from so far away. Do you know that we have a fascist government right now and a Constitution that gives us the authority to remove with force right now as well. Did you know that, or are you a half ass Brit who doesn't have a clue about that or much of anything else related to our country.

[Classic-Xer]

(01-10-2021, 04:05 PM)taramarie Wrote:

(01-10-2021, 02:00 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 07:08 PM)taramarie Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 06:57 PM)Classic-Xer Wrote:

(01-09-2021, 05:14 PM)taramarie Wrote: That is not a cowardly act, but rather a smart one. Some people are not worth the effort, and you definitely do not take on angry dogs. Only an insecure fool would say you were a coward. Generally people who act all macho and big and tough.... making threats etc are deep inside hurt, scared and on defence from trauma and are compensating for feelings of insecurity for self defence purposes. Those people need therapy.

Was it a smart one? You learn nothing and remain pathetic and keep voting for white nights and saviors for the remainder of your life like PB. I got into a few fights with bullies in grammar school. I couple more fights in middle school with bullies from other grammar schools and another one with a couple of guys in high school who were horny and trying to team up on a best friends sister who a little to much to drink at one of our field parties.

You read his reasons and clearly he saw no point to fighting on both accounts. Likewise i ended up in fights but i picked them well as well as with the right tactics. You do not always have to throw punches to get your point across. I am glad that in your case you defended someone who was about to be raped. I would have beaten the snot out of that person also in that case. 

White knight is what you mean. Yes i know, it is not your strength. Just letting you know how it is spelled. I would like to know what has politics got to do with picking your battles wisely. 

Calling someone pathetic is subjective and is an interesting glimpse into your head if you think that fighting everyone including four dogs is admirable. Please, do tell more.

Does it really matter how it was spelled? You got the meaning rite. You know a lot about art, stick to art. Are you a psychology major or something who think she knows what's going on in everyone's heads? I think I'd avoid being torn apart by four vicious animals for a census that no one other than him and those on his side cares a lot about these days. I pick and choose my fights/battles too. You must have missed that while you were looking for a way to pick a senseless one with me. Please, pretty please, please lecture me more about being nice mommy. Calling a pathetic person pathetic is truthful. Do you still have a problem with that these days or are you mature enough to handle and accept that these days?

Right, not rite. Yes it does matter how words are spelled, otherwise you look like an illiterate idiot. Actually i have studied psychology for years. Given how you behave you are really insecure from some trouble in your past hence why you are on defence all the time which is further displayed with your quite frankly immature post. Seek help.

Reely, all it takes is the wrong word or a misspelling for someone like you to view them as an illiterate idiot. Well, that's fucking childish and you know what I think about childish people these days. So, are you ready to grow up? You've studied psychology for years as I've been learning it first hand in the field called real life for many years. Oh, defense isn't spelled defence either. I guess you're an illiterate idiot too or a hypocrite at best. You want to play the game with me. I'll play the game with you and win it every time honey.